So So Sad

[dreadmama]

My ex just called me. He sounded drunk again. He was ranting about how hard his life is and how he tries so hard and yet everything and everyone turns against him. He said that he is so skinny now (from not eating) and that he has some spots on his skin now. The doctor told him that he has liver problems which is causing the spots.

I told him to stop drinking and he will get better... he said that he will stop drinking once things get better. He claims that he has nothing to live for in this world, and that he is trying to drink himself to death.

I didn't even mention our daughter as something to live for, because I don't want him deeply in her life! I just sat there crying.
What could I say? I can't help him anymore... I tried so hard, but he became very dangerous to me and our daughter. So I'm destined to leave someone whom I had loved so deeply to whither away and die.

It still breaks my heart, even after all he has put me through! Gotta go now... another round of tears...

[AnnMarie]

s Unfortunately, it has to come from within him. There's nothing anyone else can do for him, it's up to him now.

s

[lilmiss'mama]

I know it is hard, but AnnMarie is right. You can only do so much. My exdp has something like bi-polar disease. His is milder than bi-polar, but still effects him majorly. Every once and awhile i get a call when he's really down and saying he has nothing to live for. But, he won't take meds, get counseling, etc.... I finally had to realize that I can only do so much if he won't do something to help himself. It breaks my heart, for him, for the girls, and for me.

[fishy]

hey dread...
im sorry. you shouldnt have to deal with his emotional swings on top of everything else youre doing right now.

it is so hard to know that someone you loved so much is hurting. you are so loving and kind to feel that way. have yourself a(nother) good cry. youll feel better.

but you know you cant help him. dont feel guilty. he needs help tht you cant give him at this point.

talk to you soon.

hugs!

[maemaesmama]

Sometimes the best way you can help someone is to know when to let go of them. I was just recentley divorced from someone whom I cared for deeply. In fact it may as well have been mw posting this thread. My Timothy also called crying, drunk, desperate for help, and attention. He said the exact same things (I'm so skinny,suicide) He would pull me in, and push me away just as fast. The lack of stability was very bad for all of us. I tried to continue being strong for us all. Dreaming of how it could be if only..........he would just change his ways He did finally turn to AA when I was preg w/ our 3rd child. I thought if only he would stop drinking he would see what he is doing to himself, to us. I stayed for 2 years after he was sober. Only to find out that under all of the drunken displays was a broken person. He had to walk on his own for a time. Without me telling him where to step. This may take him his lifetime. I am no longer angry, because I have accepted him for who he is. Including his LIMITATIONS. Though I do not think the pain ever fully goes away. It does fade, and become easier to face. You are not responsible for his happiness at this level. He has to do some soul searching. The best thing you can do is raise your child without anger, and resentment towards her papa. One of the hardest lessons I have learned this far in life is to LOVE unconditionally. This dosen't mean subjecting myself & children to someone elses misery. I hope this has helped even just a little. Feel free to pm me if you have any questions. I remember always feeling so alone. I don't want you to feel that way. ~With Loving Energy~ Jess

[mocha09]

((((Dreadmama)))), I'm so sorry you are going through this. You are not alone. You are heard. It is so unfair that he is trying to make you responsible for his choices.

I can't add any more to what Jess just so beautifully expressed.

Love,

[wemoon]

My X is a drunk as well. He would pull a Dr Jeckyl and Mr Hyde routine, where when he was drunk I was a b*tch and the next day he says *sorry, you know I don't really think that*. Um, well you do, you say it everyday, and it is real.

You know, I'm not sure what changed with me. I think I grew. I can look at him and just roll my eyes and think *LOSER* in my head. My heart became very cold to him and his problems. I just threw my hands in the air and sent him on his way. I did hurt for a long time before that point, and I didn't understand why his family wasn't more important than the drinking. He drunk us broke many times and I couldn't understand why. I just stopped trying to figure it out and realized that it isn't MY problem, it is HIS problem, and I had no room for that problem in my life.

Luckily my X wouldn't call up and say stuff like he was going to kill himself etc. But if he did, you wanna know what I would say? Probably something like, *OK* click, or *you gotta do what you gotta do* click. About 99% of those that say they are going to commit suicide are just trying to get attention, and quite frankly, if my X was in the 1% to follow through....it may even be seen as a blessing in disguise. Sure I would hurt, the kids would hurt, but I wouldn't then have a lifetime of dealing with his crap and constant rollercoaster rides.

I geuss I have just figured that I have to live life for ME and not worry about how someone else is going to live thier life. I think that having a great love and respect for oneself really does wonders for situations like this. We are all smart, beautiful, wise, attractive, healthy, strong, sweet, loving women, and we can rise above the crap these men pull and find peace and solice within ourselves and our children.

Hugs to you,
Jeni

[Dar]

I've been dealing with some of the same stuff for years and years now. Rain's dad did quit drinking and he started eating better ad stuff, but he does other drugs and has been homeless for a couple years, so it's not like he's truly healthy or stable...

I think of him as Rain's dad, not as my ex-boyfriend. That 's helpful, because it gives me the right distance. Everything I dofor him, I do because he's her father, and I do think that counts for something.

One thing I did a year or two ago was compile a list of resources, organizations that are there to deal with his issues. Whe he calls feeling desperate, I give him one sentence of sympathy - "I'm sorry you're having such a hard time, it sounds really rough" - and then refer him to whatever agency seems to fit his need at the time. And that's it - "and usually he gets upset and says he doesn't need those programs and blah blah blah, but he has called and gotten into a couple over the past couple years, for a little while anyway, and it puts the responsibility back on him and creates a boundary.

Originally posted by wemoon

Luckily my X wouldn't call up and say stuff like he was going to kill himself etc. But if he did, you wanna know what I would say? Probably something like, *OK* click, or *you gotta do what you gotta do* click.

Have you ever had someone you know kill himself? Or known a person whose parent killed himself? It's a terrible legacy, no matter how much of a "parent" he was. Most people who kill themselves tried to get help, they reached out as best they could, and it's a pretty heavy burden to know that you could have saved someone's life - the life of your child's parent - and chose not to. You can get the number of a local suicide crisis line and give that to him, or if he's actively threatening suicide you can call up, call the police, and they'll go over and deal with it. There are ways to "do somehting" while staying relatively uninvolved.

An alcoholic is sick, he's not making decisions wisely or freely. Actually, I think most screwed-up people are unhappy about how things are going - it's not like they consciously chose to be fuck-ups. There are ways to set clear boundaries and still remain a compassionate person...

Dar

[fishy]

my stbx drank a lot and was very unhappy and threatened suicide many many times during our marriage. after a while, i got so freaking tired of that line. but no matter how sick of his threat (or just the situation on general) i couldnt just leave him alone to do it. i always stayed and monitored him. made sure he was actually safe, i threatened to call the police and that always snapped him out of it. in the end, part of the reason i left, was bc i could not continue to monitor the behavoir with my son there, too. as he got older, it was harder to keep him away from what was going on. the last time he did it, i did leave with my son, but i called stbx's parents for help. his brother came over so that i didnt have to do it with our son watching. shortly after that, i left, and since then, with no one to perform to, he has totally stopped that behavior.

i guess this whole long story is just to say that i agree with dar. as much as i didnt beleive that he would do it, i couldnt just walk away. i couldnt have that on my conscience. and even now, i have NO love feelings for him left, i still couldnt walk away from that. he is still my sons dad.

[comet]

That is so sad, I agree. I went through something similar last year, with stbx making many disguised suicide attempts (and nearly succeeding on one try).

I really identify with what you wrote about not saying that he could live for your daughter because you don't want him deeply in her life. For the same reason, I quit trying to make him a better father (as if!). Mainly, I quit pointing out to him what he was doing wrong, bcs I realized (in addition to the obvious that my nagging will not help) that him screwing up alone was better than screwing up in her presence.

[wemoon]

After thinking about my comments and what others had to say...I geuss I'm not sure if that is what I would do if X called up and said something like that. But I know I wouldn't let my life get all wrapped up in it. I have dealt with someone like that before, and my whole life was making sure that this person didn't actually follow through.

So, just wanted to say I have thought about it alot, and I really don't know what I would do.

[dreadmama]

Thanks everyone for hearing me grieve and responding with such understanding. I think I will compile a list of phone numbers/resources for my ex for the next time he calls... thanks.

It is hard because he doesn't really have anyone in this country (he's from England) and doesn't have a good relationship with his family or anyone back in England. He also doesn't really know about the resources available here.

The worst thing is that he refuses to let anyone help him. As soon as someone gets too close, he invents reasons why this person (agency) is out to get him and fights himself away! Believe me, I know. He needs but refuses medication. It is so sad to see the horrible affects of childhood neglect and abuse in him, so I realize how vitally important it is to protect my daughter from being around his dysfunctional lifestyle.

Yet, what about the vows of "for better or worse" and "till death do us part"? Sometimes I feel like I deserted him when it got rough and he needs my help. I know I know... he wouldn't accept my help and he needs to get to a point where he can seek help himself. But where do we draw the line of compassion? I practice gentle discipline towards my daughter, but I turn my back on my husband?

I know that I will never go back to him, nor get sucked into his negative ways. It is just so hard because he is sick, and I don't think he is purposefully trying to ruin our lives and make us miserable, he just has so many problems. I dont have anger towards him; he is also suffering. I don't know how to help him; his delusions are so strong and he is so lost...

This is so sad...

[fishy]

((((Karen)))))

i am so sorry. i know how hard it is. i know just what youre going thru. honestly, i dont know where the line is drawn. for me, it was drawn infront of my son. meaning, once his behavoir started affecting my son, i had to make the choice and my choice was protecting my ds. but it took me a LONG time to see what was going on. i spent so long trying to make stbx better. it was part of me, my crusade against the demons that haunted my stbx. it became part of my identity. but it wont happen unless HE wants it to. from what you ahve said, your ex is fighting to stay sick. at SOME level, there is a choice involved. and his choice is to stay surrounded by self pity. granted, it is easier to do that than to begin hard, scary inner work. and it is way easier to blame others than to look inward. you can care about him, and even help him (compiling the list of support group numbers) without getting back to a point where you are intertwined with him.

what i realized (and what ended my guilt) was that those marriage vows i made were made as part of a deal btwn me and stbx. by the time i was ready to leave, he had violated almost every promise he made to me and so, it wasnt ME who was breaking the deal. the deal was broken and trampled opon long before i ever thought of walking out.

you are so compassionate. you have such a good heart. but dont let him walk all over you. you have to do your best to move on and not let his moods throw you so.

you wanna get to gether this week and chat? ill PM you.
love,

[mocha09]

Fishy and Dreadmama, I am so happy that you can in real life!

[dreadmama]

Thanks Fishy! Ya Mocha, it is really nice to live so close to Fishy... imagine, someone who can relate to you... in person!

So ... my ex started his harrassment mode yesterday. I knew it was going to happen, but I didn't know it would be so soon after.

I'm handling it okay, just trying to filter all of the horrible things out and remember that he is sick and not functioning in his right mind. So far I've been able to keep my voice level, and calmly difuse his anger... wish me luck to continue it.

This is a very busy and stressful week for me both for my jewelry business as well as for school. He always starts up right before an event where I'm vending my jewelry... gives me nice calm vibes for getting into my sales pitch, NOT~ . It is like a dog sensing fear or something.

Oh well, I just gotta deal with it.

Thanks for offering both of your shoulders to cry on!

Peace,

Karen

[SingleDad]

Karen, I think it goes without saying how incredible of a woman you are. You're one of the most compassionate, loving people I know to feel the way that you do about your ex. All I can say is that you amaze me, and wish you well in what has got to be a difficult struggle for you. I'm always here if you need to chat too, I'd be honored.

[dreadmama]

Singledad, thank you for such a sweet reply!

Everyone, I can't even begin to tell you how much you all have helped me through this difficult journey. I felt so alone and all of a sudden I've found a community of people who understand what I'm going through and are always there to offer advice and support.



Peace,
kb