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Wondering About Multiples - Page 5  

Poll Results: After reading my post, do you think I could be pregnant with multiples?

 
  • 66% (12)
    No, unless you prove it with an ultrasound
  • 16% (3)
    Possibly Twins
  • 11% (2)
    Possibly Triplets
  • 5% (1)
    Possibly Quads (just to set the husbands mind at ease - I'm not expecting you to vote in this column, but just so you coud give your honest opinion its's here!)
18 Total Votes  
post #81 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adaline'sMama View Post


Whew, I'm glad we got those bolded things cleared up.
So, let me get this straight. You havent turned to a doctor for advice since you were 18? Probably the one time in your adult life you went to a doctor? And you had one crappy doctor, and now you are basing medical knowledge on Google and the discovery channel?
Just making sure I have all the facts right.
You still havent answered my question: do you believe that there are triplets or twins? Because when the statistics are shown to you in a way that is high risk for trips, you continue to say that its a low chance that you are even pg with twins. But when you argue, you keep saying triplets and higher order multiples like you do believe there are triplets in your body. Which is it?
PS. just want to state that there are moms who have gained 60+ lbs (eating healthy) and still have ttts.


She wasn't just a crappy OB, she was a respected woman in the natural birth community, from what I understand. A midwife in an OB's profession is how it sounded to me. Someone who would prescribe herbs before antibiotics. I couldn't even get her in trouble for what she did, out of concern for the birthing community if nothing else.

 

And please don't insult my knowledge base with your strange generalization. And for your information, Google has a section called Google scholar. Check it out sometime.

 

I've answered your questions in the previous posts.

 

Define "healthy" for me, please.

post #82 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by suchende View Post

The fetal doppler you've been using has the exact same technology as an ultrasound. That's why I was so perplexed you were willing to use one but not the other. 
Right? I guess this is why it seems so odd to me that you are so, so against the ultrasound. It seems like you dont hesitate to use the technology, you just hesitate to use it in a situation where a doctor could tell you that you are being foolish for not seeking care.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaydove View Post

Careful, this is not what a grieving mother needs to hear. I personally was offended by your post up thread about how a miscarriage is caused by poor nutrition. SIDS and miscarriage happen at no fault to the mother, no matter what her nutrition was. Please watch what you say and realize that "theories" like this are best left unsaid on a forum such as this.

Thanks, Kaydove, but I'd have to take her at least somewhat seriously to care what she thinks about it.


Jess- I went through a super detailed autopsy report for my son, and his blood was tested for pesticide, bug spray, and a million other things. For most of my pregnancy, and for almost all of his 11 weeks here on earth, he was here in my home (built of wood from the land accross the street in the mid 1800's), sleeping on an organic mattress, with pretty much no pollution and very few toxins anywhere around. And FWIW, infant mortality has decreased significantly since this toxic, commercialized world began. We used to lose a lot more babies, and have a lot more infant death. Not everything has an outside cause. Some pregnancies just simply cannot be sustained. Some babies just simply cannot stay alive. Environmental toxins and chemicals and all the other things you site were much less prevelant 200-300 years ago, and infant death rates were way higher. Why do you think that is?

By the way, the number one leading causes of death in the US are heart disease and cancer. I fail to see how this is a doctor's fault.
post #83 of 103

At some point in a pregnancy with multiples, everything is stressful - strangers in the house, the babies in yous belly, fear of going into labor early, concerns about distance from a NICU, labor (regardless of whether it's early or not), the demands of caring for brand new super-tiny babies, your other kids adapting to your condition and the new babies, the list goes on and on.  While avoiding stress is undeniably good for everyone's health, you don't always get to make that choice.  Is there a church or agency in your community you would feel comfortable reaching out to for help with childcare if you need it?  I'm sure you have your teen helping, and I'm sure she's fabulous, but she would probably need significant support if, for example, you had to go on bed rest and your dh had a bad spell.

 

No one is ever really in a great situation to have twins or triplets without support.  In both the long and short term, the best way to preserve your health and your babies' health is to actively reach out for some help.  If the stress of having strangers in the house on a planned basis or calling doctors' offices to schedule an ultrasound is bad for you and your dh, imagine what the stress of having a medical emergency with one or more babies in serious distress and/or you in a critical condition with no help on hand and having to call the EMS for heliport to the nearest hospital with NICU would be like.  I'm not trying to bring this up to stress you out and trash UC.  I'm trying to suggest that with concrete information about exactly how many babies are in there and what kind of conditions or complications they are/are not facing, you will be better able to evaluate your situation identify the resources you may need to handle any difficulties that arise with minimal strain on your family.  Your ideas about the protective impacts of nutrition seem like wishful thinking on your part.  Things can go wrong in ANY pregnancy in the healthiest of mothers, and more things can go wrong in a multiple pregnancy, no matter how attentive you are to your nutrition and stress levels.

 

An ultrasound will not boil your DNA.  If it was producing that much heat, it would cause third degree burns. 

 

Gently mama, are you unwilling to seek care because you can't afford it?  Do you need help applying for Medicaid? 

post #84 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeepyCat View Post

BlessedJess, I don't know what search terms you're using. Per the CDC, the leading killer of people in the US is heart disease, followed by cancer. I haven't looked at the more detailed tables today. Dr. Mercola is the subject of complaints from the FDA and the Better Business Bureau because of unsubtantiated claims he has made about the nutritional supplements he sells.
And honey, you may NEED a miracle, but God doesn't hand out miracles just because we need them, they are not ordered for us, to meet OUR needs, but by God, to suit His. I'm a practical person, and I don't expect God to always feel that my needs and His are related. By contrast, social service organizations (like the VA) can be moved by human need and human persistence, and have legally enforceable human obligations. I would tell ANY pregnant woman with a disabled husband to make some phone calls.


I understand the VA very well, thank you. Maybe not how they handle the pregnant wives of their disabled veterans, but lets just say that getting disability for him actually made his symptoms worse and we are still trying to recover from that. It's a long and bumpy ride.

 

If you don't believe Mercola, fine. Try some other docs, try the statistical studies they actually quote.

 

You aren't in a position to tell me what miracles are to be granted to my family. His needs and our needs are one. He will provide as He sees fit, and I can trust that. I can't write a book for you about our lives or what God has already done for us. I have to go be a pregnant mommy now. Thanks for reading today, ladies, I'll see you next time....tiphat.gif

post #85 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlessedJess View Post

 

I fail to see the offense. That's like saying you were raped because an evil guy was stalking you. The because does not turn it into your fault!

 

Like I mentioned, I was partly the cause of my first miscarriage. I know how that complicates things emotionally. I learned then and there that even the coolest, most unusual, most natural birth friendly-seeming OB can be a total ... you know. I take charge of my health care from now on. They just consult and help, if I let them.

 

You're suggesting that if I had better nutrition, I wouldn't have had my miscarriage. Nutrition is something I control and choose, not rape so your analogy fails. Saying that if I had made better choices regarding my nutrition during my first pregnancy, I wouldn't have miscarried, is placing the blame on me. It may seem like I'm being overly sensitive but if I would have read that while I was miscarrying, it would have been devastating.

post #86 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaydove View Post

 

You're suggesting that if I had better nutrition, I wouldn't have had my miscarriage. Nutrition is something I control and choose, not rape so your analogy fails. Saying that if I had made better choices regarding my nutrition during my first pregnancy, I wouldn't have miscarried, is placing the blame on me. It may seem like I'm being overly sensitive but if I would have read that while I was miscarrying, it would have been devastating.

Nutrition can be sabotaged outside your control. Examples; a hushed up nuclear accident near your home (semi vally) or fracking near your water supply, or damages to your system from childhood vaccines preventing you from using your nutrition. Or someone shooting Wi-Fi through your house without you knowing it, smart meters, smog, etc. It's hard to anticipate and compensate for everything, and if your digestive system is already compromised without your knowledge you could be in for a nasty surprise. Another example, 98% of us wouldn't touch GMOs if they were labeled, which is why they are not.

 

Shall I go on?

post #87 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlessedJess View Post

Nutrition can be sabotaged outside your control. Examples; a hushed up nuclear accident near your home (semi vally) or fracking near your water supply, or damages to your system from childhood vaccines preventing you from using your nutrition. Or someone shooting Wi-Fi through your house without you knowing it, smart meters, smog, etc. It's hard to anticipate and compensate for everything, and if your digestive system is already compromised without your knowledge you could be in for a nasty surprise. Another example, 98% of us wouldn't touch GMOs if they were labeled, which is why they are not.

Shall I go on?

I think the sense that most of us are getting here is that whatever bad things happen to us, happened because of causes beyond our knowledge or control, however, since you evidently live in a sleepy little backwater with your own well and no neighbors and a utility company that still sends a guy in a truck to read the meter, you can dial into the internet and smugly assure us that YOU have no need to worry.

I'd rather you didn't go on. Your message has come through plenty clear.

I'm gonna hang over my back fence and have it out with the neighbors about whose wifi caused my cancer, and whether we should make that local restaurant with the rooftop garden admit that their tomatoes caused my miscarriage, or if it's a better bet to make the power company go back to the system where a strange man wandered through all our backyards and freaked out the dogs once a month.
post #88 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeepyCat View Post


I think the sense that most of us are getting here is that whatever bad things happen to us, happened because of causes beyond our knowledge or control, however, since you evidently live in a sleepy little backwater with your own well and no neighbors and a utility company that still sends a guy in a truck to read the meter, you can dial into the internet and smugly assure us that YOU have no need to worry.
I'd rather you didn't go on. Your message has come through plenty clear.
I'm gonna hang over my back fence and have it out with the neighbors about whose wifi caused my cancer, and whether we should make that local restaurant with the rooftop garden admit that their tomatoes caused my miscarriage, or if it's a better bet to make the power company go back to the system where a strange man wandered through all our backyards and freaked out the dogs once a month.


You don't need to be here on my thread if you disagree with my philosophy so strongly. I'm not blaming you-all for what you are going through, but I'm not going to sit here and say that I think my risks are the same as everybody else at this point. It doesn't make it a woman's fault if she gets tackled and raped and she couldn't stop it because she didn't have a gun in her purse, but a survivor might just go to some extreme lengths to ensure she will defend herself or die trying rather than go through it all again.

 

You are welcome to your opinions about whether or not your environment sabotaged your nutrition. If you don't want to live your life like a hillbilly, that's up to you. Frankly, my opinion is that the city environment is a trap and most people can't get out. Don't hate me because I'm lucky. And since that means you are probably stuck, if you want to try to mitigate it, that's up to you. If you want to accept the risks and ignore them fine, but don't come along and try to beat me down for my health theories which are not standing in judgment against you or anybody else.

 

My point is only that crap happens to people when they least expect it. It happened to me personally once. Some of us are willing to go to extremes to see that it doesn't happen again. If I think that way and feel that way it doesn't need to become your problem.  I don't see why I'm getting this attitude from some of you.

post #89 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adaline'sMama View Post


Right? I guess this is why it seems so odd to me that you are so, so against the ultrasound. It seems like you dont hesitate to use the technology, you just hesitate to use it in a situation where a doctor could tell you that you are being foolish for not seeking care.
Thanks, Kaydove, but I'd have to take her at least somewhat seriously to care what she thinks about it.
Jess- I went through a super detailed autopsy report for my son, and his blood was tested for pesticide, bug spray, and a million other things. For most of my pregnancy, and for almost all of his 11 weeks here on earth, he was here in my home (built of wood from the land accross the street in the mid 1800's), sleeping on an organic mattress, with pretty much no pollution and very few toxins anywhere around. And FWIW, infant mortality has decreased significantly since this toxic, commercialized world began. We used to lose a lot more babies, and have a lot more infant death. Not everything has an outside cause. Some pregnancies just simply cannot be sustained. Some babies just simply cannot stay alive. Environmental toxins and chemicals and all the other things you site were much less prevelant 200-300 years ago, and infant death rates were way higher. Why do you think that is?
By the way, the number one leading causes of death in the US are heart disease and cancer. I fail to see how this is a doctor's fault.

 

What? I "don't hesitate" to use a doppler? I've been pregnant 5 times and resisted getting one. This pregnancy I've used it once since I bought it and resisted getting it until very recently. I had to have other debates about this with friendly, reasonable, considerate professional people who worked with the technology and were willing to go into detail to explain why they thought it was different, while not denying the unknowns and risks of routine U/S. When the explanations made sense I stopped resisting, for the most part. I'm waiting to do my next 5 min doppler session until I'm 24 weeks, unless something weird happens, and then it will be my first compromise. I'm keeping an open mind, just not so open that my brains fall out. ;-)

 

As for your son's death.... this isn't about you, but if it was, you still don't know all there is to know. Autopsies are great tools. But most people are willing to admit that they don't know everything, even when they've turned every stone. If you know absolutely everything about what happened and still don't have a why, maybe quantum theory is where you can turn for answers. AKA pure randomness. I'm not telling you what to believe about your son. Please don't make this personal. This is about why I believe my risks are different than your random study sample of triplet pregnancies.

 

You already know the things you did reduced his odds of dying or you wouldn't have done it. Maybe it's not a 100% reduction of all risks. Maybe that's impossible to do but to say that you didn't make a difference makes you a helpless victim at the mercy of.... well... what? Do we just ignore infant mortality links to the multitude of environmental factors because it could still happen at random? Did you stop risk-reducing for your children yet? Do you not feel that you do things daily that increase their odds of health and survival?

 

Not all iatrogenic events get recorded. So there's that. We have a whole section here where people talk about not vaxing. Why? Why are only a tiny percentage of those adverse events getting recorded? And yet despite this we have many, many people recognized as dying of aitrogenic causes. What numbers would you agree with? Where do you stand on that? Because we can work with your perspective. It matters not to me if it's #1 or #3 in your mind. The essence of the point I made remains. Unless you want to tell me it's actually really rare and can back that up somehow.

post #90 of 103
Thread Starter 

I'm not here to entertain or be irritating. If you don't like my thread, don't read. Please.

post #91 of 103
You should probably change the name of this thread from "opinions wanted" to "support only."
post #92 of 103

I have to say if you don't want people offering their opinions then you shouldn't ask for them.  I also think it's incredibly irresponsible to possibly be high risk, which triplets would be, and not seek prenatal care.

post #93 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by stik View Post

At some point in a pregnancy with multiples, everything is stressful - strangers in the house, the babies in yous belly, fear of going into labor early, concerns about distance from a NICU, labor (regardless of whether it's early or not), the demands of caring for brand new super-tiny babies, your other kids adapting to your condition and the new babies, the list goes on and on.  While avoiding stress is undeniably good for everyone's health, you don't always get to make that choice.  Is there a church or agency in your community you would feel comfortable reaching out to for help with childcare if you need it?  I'm sure you have your teen helping, and I'm sure she's fabulous, but she would probably need significant support if, for example, you had to go on bed rest and your dh had a bad spell.

 

No one is ever really in a great situation to have twins or triplets without support.  In both the long and short term, the best way to preserve your health and your babies' health is to actively reach out for some help.  If the stress of having strangers in the house on a planned basis or calling doctors' offices to schedule an ultrasound is bad for you and your dh, imagine what the stress of having a medical emergency with one or more babies in serious distress and/or you in a critical condition with no help on hand and having to call the EMS for heliport to the nearest hospital with NICU would be like.  I'm not trying to bring this up to stress you out and trash UC.  I'm trying to suggest that with concrete information about exactly how many babies are in there and what kind of conditions or complications they are/are not facing, you will be better able to evaluate your situation identify the resources you may need to handle any difficulties that arise with minimal strain on your family.  Your ideas about the protective impacts of nutrition seem like wishful thinking on your part.  Things can go wrong in ANY pregnancy in the healthiest of mothers, and more things can go wrong in a multiple pregnancy, no matter how attentive you are to your nutrition and stress levels.

 

An ultrasound will not boil your DNA.  If it was producing that much heat, it would cause third degree burns. 

 

Gently mama, are you unwilling to seek care because you can't afford it?  Do you need help applying for Medicaid? 

 

Thanks for your reply. You didn't manage to raise my defenses.

 

I do wonder if we define "health" the same way, but I'm not trying to shove my opinions here on anyone else.

 

Microwave ovens produce radiation that literally stays in the food until it's cold again. It doesn't have to burn you to cause serious health problems.

 

And you see, I'm not stressing about those things that you mention. I mitigate. One thing I'm being forced to consider is mitigating my contact with the mothers of the UC board here. And it would be a real shame considering some of you might actually say something life changing for me. It's happened to me before on the internet, like when I discovered I could feel comfortable with doppler checks under certain conditions.

 

As far as financial aid. I don't yet know where it will come from if we need it but my husband has been very wise and resourceful before, assuming I don't lose him. And God's always been there for me. I do have friends and family. I don't use them unless forced to. If it was an emergency I think I would take extra measures to seek that help. But I can't make myself do it unless I know I have to. The risks to the family from intervention are real in my mind.

 

The point about nutrition is that I'm not up a creek without a paddle. Nutrition and health has been a major focus of my attention since I was a young teen, aspiring to be a medical missionary. I personally know people who cured their cancer naturally on death's doorstep. The relative that raised me for several years, in fact. It had metastasized to her liver and her colon was 100% blocked but she reversed it completely herself at home and was eventually declared cancer free. I personally cured my hypoaldosteronism (that means I got my lab work done and I personally tracked my progress) months prior to getting pregnant this time around. And during those months I gave serious attention to preventing complications of pregnancy, taking many steps others might consider radical to be assured of the best health I could achieve. (which included a partially erupted wisdom tooth extraction just for the sake of the upcoming pregnancy)  I walk a path less traveled. Maybe I'm "all wet" as they say, but I have yet to be convinced. I'm doing the best I can with the tools I have.

post #94 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honey693 View Post

I have to say if you don't want people offering their opinions then you shouldn't ask for them.  I also think it's incredibly irresponsible to possibly be high risk, which triplets would be, and not seek prenatal care.


I didn't ask for people to bash me. I asked for a couple of specific opinions.

post #95 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlessedJess View Post


I didn't ask for people to bash me. I asked for a couple of specific opinions.

And you didn't like any of them.  I'm not really sure what you expected people to say when you said you had no idea how babies you were carrying, but refused to get an u/s, despite using a doppler.

post #96 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honey693 View Post

And you didn't like any of them.  I'm not really sure what you expected people to say when you said you had no idea how babies you were carrying, but refused to get an u/s, despite using a doppler.

Please leave this thread. You are misrepresenting me. There have been a number of thoughtful posters here, and I've appreciated their input. 'Nuff said.

post #97 of 103
Quote:
  I don't see why I'm getting this attitude from some of you.

 

I'll go ahead and take a stab at this. It's because:

 

1.) you started a thread asking very clearly and explicitly for opinions.....but you've dismissed pretty much every opinion that doesn't line up exactly with what you wrote in your OP.

 

2.) you've said some incredibly insensitive and offensive things wrt child loss.

 

3.) you're spreading misinformation on a public forum. You've had now a couple of people who've ACTUALLY BEEN THROUGH THIS BEFORE and an ACTUAL DOCTOR trying to explain it to you, but you're being dismissive and argumentative with them.

 

4.) Gently-- your attitude is incredibly smug and superior. If you don't understand that, I can highlight some quotes of yours to show you what I mean.

post #98 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlessedJess View Post

Please leave this thread. You are misrepresenting me. There have been a number of thoughtful posters here, and I've appreciated their input. 'Nuff said.

How exactly am I misrepresenting you?  I am genuinely confused as to what you mean and also what you want out of this thread.  This could be a very dangerous situation for you and the baby/babies and I think even the hardcore U/Cers are concerned.  And before you ask, my last kid was a U/C so it's not like I'm super pro hospital birth for everyone.

post #99 of 103

Wow! I just finished reading this whole thread and I have to say, "Go Jess Go!" joy.gif

It sounds like you're doing great! Trusting your body and your mama intuition, feeding yourself and your babes, tracking measurements and dates, etc.

I'd be completely wary about seeking medical advice in your shoes too. I don't plan to have any medical professionals involved in my pregnancies either (unless of course something isn't right that I don't feel confident about remedying myself) including U/S.

It's sad to see so many folks unwilling to take responsibility for their lives, families, and health. Our culture has done an amazing job of instilling fear into the masses. But for those of us willing to take our lives into our own hands...Let's stick together, eh? grouphug.gif  You and your family are in my thoughts and prayers praying.gif

post #100 of 103

One minute of doppler is equal to 35 minutes of ultrasound.  So your babies would have been much better off with a quick ultrasound to check and see how many and other important factors.  But instead, you are exposing them to the equivalent of nearly three hours of ultrasound exposure and not gaining much of any knowledge besides they have beating hearts.

 

https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ie=UTF-8#hl=en&output=search&sclient=psy-ab&q=one%20minute%20of%20doppler%20is%2035%20minutes%20of%20ultrasound&oq=&gs_l=&pbx=1&fp=158101d518659935&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&biw=1241&bih=555

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