"Vaccination" does NOT confer Herd Immunity

[Louisw]

"Vaccination" does NOT confer Herd Immunity

“The original basis for herd immunity had nothing to do with vaccines.  When sufficiently high numbers of people contracted the wild form of the disease and secured lifelong natural immunity, statisticians observed a protective effect in the community as described above.   Policymakers eager to promote vaccines sought ammunition to increase vaccine uptake.  Researchers assumed that vaccine-induced immunity would operate in the same manner as natural immunity and presumed that vaccines therefore would also create herd immunity.”       Louise Kuo Habakus

“The problem is that there is in fact such a thing as natural herd immunity. But what's they've done is they've taken this natural phenomenon and assume that vaccines will work the same way. However, they do not, and the science clearly shows that there's a big difference between naturally arising herd immunity and vaccine-induced herd immunity.”    Doctor Joseph Mercola MD

"The original concept of herd immunity is that when a population experiences the natural disease… natural immunity would be achieved – a robust, qualitatively superior natural herd immunity within the population, which would then protect other people from getting the disease in other age groups. It's the way infectious diseases work… Vaccines do not confer the same type of immunity that natural exposure to the disease does."   Barbara Loe Fisher, President of the National Vaccine Information Center (NVIC)

"Vaccination" does NOT confer Herd Immunity. Herd immunity is conferred once many of the people develop "natural immunity" by contacting the disease NATURALLY. Incidentally "vaccination" does not confer individual immunity either. Immunity both personal and herd is a NATURAL process and can only be achieved by contacting a disease NATURALLY.

Herd Immunity is to be a CRITICAL Issue

IMO we should take the time to understand this important soon to be critical issue.

The bottom line is DEADLY FORCED VACCINATION is coming if we accept it. Herd immunity will be used as the argument. Take one for the gipper!

Two Important facts about forced vaccination.

1) Baxter labs put live H5N1 viruses in millions of doses of their "Seasonal Flu Vaccine". Baxter Labs has suffered NO consequences for this terrorist act which was clearly intended to start the long awaited H5N1 Political Pandemic. By pure luck (God if you will) this poison only killed ferrets and not the humans it was intended for.

2) The only practical way to spread the deadly H5N1 virus is by the NEEDLE.

Dr. Mercola and Barbara Loe Fisher - Herd Immunity

[MichelleZB]

Yeah, the basic idea of vaccines is that they don't confer the same excellent kind of immunity you'd get from getting and surviving the disease. But the hope is that it'll make people immune enough, for enough time, that it'll prevent the spread of the disease. Immunity from a vaccine is usually weaker than surviving the disease.

For instance, the original cowpox vaccine conferred what they thought was an average of 10 years of immunity from smallpox. If you actually got smallpox and survived, sure, your face would be ruined, but you'd be immune for life, and so would the living remainder of your whole village. That's why diseases sort of came in waves, because a generation of survivors would become immune, but there were always new cohorts of young, non-immune children who would eventually all get the diseases again, re-setting the cycle.

So... what's your point?

[Louisw]

Originally Posted by MichelleZB 

But the hope is that it'll make people immune enough, for enough time, that it'll prevent the spread of the disease. Immunity from a vaccine is usually weaker than surviving the disease.

IMO this is a false hope.

Pathogens do not usually cause disease. Weak immune systems and environmental conditions usually cause disease. "Vaccination" weakens immune systems.

For example we all run into the wild polio virus sooner or later. 95% or more of us ASYMPTOMATICALLY contact, fight, defeat the wild polio virus and acquire long term immunity to the wild polio virus.

"Polio Vaccination" has introduced NEW polio virus and OTHER viruses into our kids. Almost all cases of polio are being caused by these artificial polio viruses. An artificial polio virus is associated with autism. The "polio vaccine" has introduced the cancer causing SV-40 virus into over 100 million and counting poor souls who would have NEVER known it except for the "wonderful" polio "vaccine".

What a mess "polio vaccination" has created.

http://vaxtruth.org/2012/03/the-polio-vaccine-part-1-2/

[Taximom5]

Merck used to state proudly on their website that one single MMR shot conferred lifetime immunity to 95% of those who received the shot.

When a vaccine safety group sent a letter to Merck, asking why 2 shots were required for 100%, when there weren't even any studies showing that the remaining 5% DID develop immunity from the second shot, their letter went unanswered.

But Merck immediately pulled that info from their website.

The thing is, the pharmaceutical industry has lied repeatedly about safety and efficacy of vaccines, and of all kinds of drugs that they have effectively marketed as being "necessary," to the point where the average senior citizen takes 28.5 prescriptions per year. 1 in 4 children take a prescription medication for a chronic condition, with an ever-increasing number being given drugs for ADD, ADHD, depression, and especialy bipolar disorder, which many psychiatrists are now claiming is what children have rather than ADD.

Exactly how much are you willing to swallow when it comes to in industry whose bottom line is profit, not health, and who has proven time and again that they are willing to lie, and risk people's health for profit?

[Mirzam]

True immunity vs vaccine immunity. 

For instance, the original cowpox conferred what they thought was an average of 10 years of immunity from smallpox. If you actually got smallpox and survived, sure, your face would be ruined, but you'd be immune for life, and so would the living remainder of your whole village. That's why diseases sort of came in waves, because a generation of survivors would become immune, but there were always new cohorts of young, non-immune children who would eventually all get the diseases again, re-setting the cycle.

Do you realize the Jenner's whole vaccine premise was based on an old wives tale that milkmaids who contracted cowpox, a completely different disease, were protected from smallpox when vets at this time knew this to be totally untrue. Don't you think Jenner should have at least conducted a survey amongst dairy farmers to actually see if their was any truth of this? Well he didn't. Vets (called cow doctors) knew this old wives tale was garbage. Do you really believe that a vaccine, made of cow pus or putrid sores from a horse's heel could prevent smallpox? The Leicester experiment shows quite clearly that the vaccine did not prevent smallpox, but it did kill.

In the words of Dr Beddow Baily, stated in 1935: 

“It would seem to be impossible for a rational mind to conceive that a filthy virus derived from a smallpox corpse, the ulcerated udder of a cow, or the running sores of a sick horse’s heels, and cultivated in scabbed festers on a calf’s abdomen could fail to have disastrous effects when inoculated into the human body.”

Smallpox Vaccine: Origins of Vaccine Madness

[MichelleZB]

Originally Posted by Mirzam 

Do you realize the Jenner's whole vaccine premise was based on an old wives tale that milkmaids who contracted cowpox, a completely different disease, were protected from smallpox when vets at this time knew this to be totally untrue. Don't you think Jenner should have at least conducted a survey amongst dairy farmers to actually see if their was any truth of this? Well he didn't. Vets (called cow doctors) knew this old wives tale was garbage. Do you really believe that a vaccine, made of cow pus or putrid sores from a horse's heel could prevent smallpox? The Leicester experiment shows quite clearly that the vaccine did not prevent smallpox, but it did kill.

This just... isn't true. It's not like we have to go back in time and ask random cow farmers their opinion (like they'd know anyway). We've studied the DNA of both diseases by now and know it to be true. The structure of the virusesare similar enough that surviving cowpox will give you some immunity against smallpox. And it doesn't matter what some doctor said in 1935 about it, either, because we have more current information.

[Louisw]

Originally Posted by Taximom5 

Exactly how much are you willing to swallow when it comes to in industry whose bottom line is profit, not health, and who has proven time and again that they are willing to lie, and risk people's health for profit?

I just heard the average family pays about 2200 bucks to shoot up a single kid to "the schedule". Lets see multiply that by 10 or 30 million kids and you are talking real money; of course not as much as war which is also killing and harming our kids.

No forced "vaccination" and NO "draft".

[Louisw]

Originally Posted by MichelleZB 

This just... isn't true. It's not like we have to go back in time and ask random cow farmers their opinion (like they'd know anyway). We've studied the DNA of both diseases by now and know it to be true. The structure of the virusesare similar enough that surviving cowpox will give you some immunity against smallpox. And it doesn't matter what some doctor said in 1935 about it, either, because we have more current information.

I  think of the "small pox vaccine" as the first bio-weapon.

"Vaccination programs in the late 19th and early 20th century decimated the populations of many countries where government sponsored vaccination programs were introduced. Japan suffered 48,000 deaths from smallpox vaccination; England and Wales experienced 45,800 smallpox deaths in a population that was 97% vaccinated against smallpox. Australia and Germany combined with a total of 120,000 deaths from the very smallpox for which they had been vaccinated. European deaths amongst the vaccinated portion of the population totaled 3,000,000. Deaths from smallpox vaccination programs began to decline when a revolt against mandatory vaccination programs emerged from the chaos. Within twenty years mandatory smallpox vaccination laws in England were repealed. In 1919 the death rate from smallpox promptly plummeted to a total of 28 deaths in a population of almost 40,000,000 people. Previously, with mandatory vaccinations they had averaged over 44,000 deaths from smallpox."   Vaccination History

In 1871-2, England, with 98% of the population aged between 2 and 50 vaccinated against smallpox, it experienced its worst ever smallpox outbreak with 45,000 deaths. During the same period in Germany, with a vaccination rate of 96%, there were over 125,000 deaths from smallpox.   The Hadwen Documents

"In 1862, Anglican church missionaries Rev. John Sheepshanks and Robert Brown inoculated interior Salish Indians in B.C. with a live smallpox virus that wiped out entire native communities within a month, just prior to the settlement of this native land by gold prospectors associated with these missionaries and government officials."   Canadian Genocide by Vaccination

"By 1853, Parliament began passing laws to make the untested vaccine compulsory throughout the British Empire. Other countries of Europe followed suit. Once the economic implications of compulsory vaccinations were realized, few dared to disagree. Then, as now, the media were controlled by the vaccine manufacturers and the government, who stood to make huge money from the sale of these spurious vaccines..."  Tim O'Shea, D.C.

“In 1853 England introduced compulsory vaccination. Before this time the highest death rate from smallpox was 2000 for any two year period. However 20 years later there were 23,062 deaths in England and Wales with smallpox spreading over Europe in all the countries where vaccination was practiced on a large scale. During the same epidemic in Germany 124,948 people died of smallpox. Of the 155 persons admitted to the Smallpox Hospital in the Parish of St. James, Piccadilly, 145 had been vaccinated.”    Doctor Phillip Incao MD

[Mirzam]

Originally Posted by MichelleZB 

Originally Posted by Mirzam 

Do you realize the Jenner's whole vaccine premise was based on an old wives tale that milkmaids who contracted cowpox, a completely different disease, were protected from smallpox when vets at this time knew this to be totally untrue. Don't you think Jenner should have at least conducted a survey amongst dairy farmers to actually see if their was any truth of this? Well he didn't. Vets (called cow doctors) knew this old wives tale was garbage. Do you really believe that a vaccine, made of cow pus or putrid sores from a horse's heel could prevent smallpox? The Leicester experiment shows quite clearly that the vaccine did not prevent smallpox, but it did kill.

This just... isn't true. It's not like we have to go back in time and ask random cow farmers their opinion (like they'd know anyway). We've studied the DNA of both diseases by now and know it to be true. The structure of the virusesare similar enough that surviving cowpox will give you some immunity against smallpox. And it doesn't matter what some doctor said in 1935 about it, either, because we have more current information.

I guess you didn't read the link at the bottom of my post.

According to Charles Creighton, A Strange Chapter of Medical History, 1889:

“To a pathologist or epidemiologist, it is as truly nonsense to speak of cowpox becoming smallpox as it is legitimate nonsense to prove that a horse-chest¬nut is a chestnut horse. It was reserved for Edward Jenner to take up that surprising legend, and make it scientifically passable, despite the impatience and ridicule which his prosaic medical neighbours in the cowpox districts had met it with.”

 

Cowpox is a disease that occurs on the teats of cows only when they are in milk, it results in an ugly chancre, it is not infectious. It only occurs in female cows obviously. People who milked cows infected with orthopox vaccinia developed pustules on their hands and experienced swollen glands and general malaise. Smallpox, is not limited to the female sex or one part of the body. It is only found in humans and is highly infectious. Legitimate scientists of the time knew there was no correspondence between cowpox and smallpox.

As Creighton states: 

“The single bond connecting cowpox with smallpox was the occurrence of the word “pox” in each name; it was a case of the river in Macedon and the river in Monmouth. The jingle of the names had the effect that it often has upon credulous people, whose acquaintance with any matter is more verbal than real.”

Since 1970 we have a new "pox", monkeypox which infects humans, and is now called human monkeypox. Monkeypox looks just like smallpox and is highly infectious. The difference between monkeypox and smallpox is a difference in protein structure.

Jennifer Craig, in the article I linked in my post above, says:

As health authorities have never worried about the difference between cowpox virus and smallpox virus, why should they be concerned now? Concerned enough, that is, to say that monkeypox is not smallpox. They can’t have it both ways: saying the cowpox virus prevents smallpox but then denying that the monkeypox virus can cause smallpox.

Clinically, the diseases are the same. Even the Centers for Disease Control (CDC) on its webpage admit that the signs and symptoms of monkeypox are like those of smallpox. They go on to say that the death rate in Africa is 1-10% but the risk would be lower in the US because of better nutrition and hygiene. It is odd that they’ve never acknowledged the role of nutrition and hygiene before “” but that was when they were advocating vaccination.

Smallpox was declared eradicated, yet still infects humans today

I think it does matter what a doctor said in 1935, because he was describing the vaccine in use in the 19th century which according to you afforded immunity from smallpox for ten years. The difference now between the vaccines of the 19th century and today is, as Jennifer Craig points out, is they are no longer made from pus. "Instead they contain viruses, dead or alive, formaldehyde, phenol, mercury, aluminium and DNA bits from human and other animals."

[BeckyBird]

Wonderful job ladies! Thanks for this discussion, especially that Tenpenny video. I will be forwarding this to my niece (who will be giving birth soon). 

[emmy526]

 

The Science Behind Herd Immunity – And an Extension to GMOs?

http://gaia-health.com/gaia-blog/2012-03-12/the-science-behind-herd-immunity-and-an-extension-to-gmos/

 

There isn’t one shred of evidence behind it. It’s a fraud shrouded in Big Pharma money, not an established fact. But it sounds so good, doesn’t it? It brings up an image of civic duty. Indeed, herd immunity’s enthusiastic promoters play on the image of the poor grandma or newborn who died of a “preventable” illness. They’re brilliant at tossing around the manure of guilt.

[pers]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirzam 

“The single bond connecting cowpox with smallpox was the occurrence of the word “pox” in each name; it was a case of the river in Macedon and the river in Monmouth. The jingle of the names had the effect that it often has upon credulous people, whose acquaintance with any matter is more verbal than real.”

 

But that was over a hundred years ago. Then it may have just been a name (and the similarity of the sores on the hand to smallpox sores, and the observation that people who worked closely with cows were more likely to be spared in smallpox outbreaks), and yeah, it was a longshot, and many similar observations were dead wrong.  But even a stopped clock is right twice a day, and all that, and sometimes the crazy sounding theory turns out to be true, and now we can have a lot more evidence that this one is because we can look at the DNA and see how closely the viruses are related to each other and to other viruses we've classed together in the orthopox family.  We can also see that they are very different viruses from chickenpox.  

Would Charles Creighton have the same opinions if he'd had access to electron microscopes, DNA analysis, and the results of all the research done and knowledge acquired during the 120 past years since he wrote this?  

It's like looking at things learned about Mars from data sent back by curiosity and concluding that they must be wrong because they conflict with the opinions an astronomer made a few hundred years ago when looking through one of the early telescopes.  Even Aristotle, whose brilliance allowed him to understand that the sun was just one of many stars and only seemed larger because it was so close to us (which conflicted with the beliefs of the time), completely and totally got gravity wrong.  We simply know a lot more today as a result of centuries of building up human knowledge and scientific study.  

Also, certainly there was controversy and disagreement at the time and those who thought Jenner's ideas were nonsense, but I would like to know your source of your statement that unequivocally "vets knew this old wives tale was garbage."  If Jenner didn't conduct an actual survey, did someone else so that we can know that all vets (or even a majority of vets) thought this?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirzam 

Cowpox is a disease that occurs on the teats of cows only when they are in milk, it results in an ugly chancre, it is not infectious. It only occurs in female cows obviously. People who milked cows infected with orthopox vaccinia developed pustules on their hands and experienced swollen glands and general malaise. Smallpox, is not limited to the female sex or one part of the body. It is only found in humans and is highly infectious. Legitimate scientists of the time knew there was no correspondence between cowpox and smallpox.

 

Cowpox is not infectious?  But people who milked infected cows could be infected themselves?  There is a contradiction there.   And cowpox only occurs in female cows, but can infect the hands of anyone who milks them?  Or does it only infect the hands of women who milk them and leaves the men alone?

Actually, while cowpox and monkeypox and horespox are named for the animals in which they were first described, they are pretty much all primarily diseases of rodents, and they can all infect animals of either gender.  

I would not be surprised if at the time cowpox as a disease in cows was primarily observed on the udders of female cows. It is my personal assumption (really my personal one based on so many mentions of it on the udders of cows and hands of milkmaids, not on any research anything I have read or could back up) that while it is so often mentioned that people got it from milking cows, it is likely that human hands were also quite likely the primary means of  transmitting it from cow to cow.  Even when not infected with it, a person could get get the virus on their hands from milking a cow with a sore from it, then spread it when they moved onto the next cow without washing hands, and thus it would appear on the udders since that is where people had close contact with the cow.  Who knows, perhaps the original source of infections in cows was a human petting a cat with it or cleaning up the body of a rodent in the barn while on the way to do the milking?

Cowpox isn't even seen in cows any more (perhaps the result of improved sanitation in dairy farming and rodent control?)  The virus is still around though, and while very rare, still occasionally infects humans.  Most of the rare human infections these days are from cats, who were probably infected by rodents, but sometimes a person is infected directly by a rodent.  

Quote:

Since 1970 we have a new "pox", monkeypox which infects humans, and is now called human monkeypox. Monkeypox looks just like smallpox and is highly infectious. The difference between monkeypox and smallpox is a difference in protein structure.

Jennifer Craig, in the article I linked in my post above, says:

"As health authorities have never worried about the difference between cowpox virus and smallpox virus, why should they be concerned now? Concerned enough, that is, to say that monkeypox is not smallpox. They can’t have it both ways: saying the cowpox virus prevents smallpox but then denying that the monkeypox virus can cause smallpox.

Clinically, the diseases are the same. Even the Centers for Disease Control (CDC) on its webpage admit that the signs and symptoms of monkeypox are like those of smallpox. They go on to say that the death rate in Africa is 1-10% but the risk would be lower in the US because of better nutrition and hygiene. It is odd that they’ve never acknowledged the role of nutrition and hygiene before “” but that was when they were advocating vaccination."

Monkeypox can be passed from person to person, but not as easily as smallpox, which is why there are only hundreds of cases a year rather than thousands or millions.  There are other differences too.  However, I have read some concern that the virus may be getting better at moving from person to person, which could indeed make it a greater threat in the future.

While many of the symptoms are the same, there has not been observed a hemorrhagic for of monkeypox in humans.  The hemorhagic form of smallpox was rare, but nearly always fatal, and there have been enough cases of monkeypox in humans recorded that if it has a hemorrhagic form we'd probably have seen it by now.  

The really big difference though is that while it is possible (though often difficult) to infect other animals with smallpox virus in a lab, infections have not been found in wild animals.  Monkeypox has been observed in wild monkeys, of course, but mostly occurs in rodents.  There are also other orthopox viruses such as rabbitpox which don't infect humans at all.  

I do not understand what the author you quoted means by "can't have it both ways."  Cowpox causes cowpox, smallpox causes smallpox, and monkeypox.  They are different diseases.  However, they are closely related and share some structures that the immune system responds to so after being infected with one, the immune system will know how to react if exposed to one of the others.  How is this having it both ways?  Earlier in the page linked, the author also quote someone as saying that variola major and minor shouldn't be counted together since they were really different diseases with very different mortality rates (I think the point the author was going for was that variola major was really monkeypox, but it's not), but yet infection with minor would make a person immune to major and vice versa.  

I've been avoiding mentioning vaccines due to having (for once) noticed which forum this is in, but as a point of interest and not in advocating vaccines, I wanted to mention crossimmunity between canine distemper and measles.  Obviously these are two different diseases - dogs don't get measles, and while the distemper virus may be able to replicate briefly in people, it does not cause illness.  But the two disease are very closely related, enough so that there are a number of studies that show that vaccinating puppies with human measles vaccine provides a fair amount of protection against distemper.  One example here.  It's a similar situation to orthopox viruses where antibodies to one virus can protect against a different but closely related one.  

Monkeypox is a serious and closely related disease, and could be a serious danger if it evolves to be be more infectious between people, but it is a different disease than smallpox (as different as smallpox is to cowpox or any other orthopox virus), and currently is not a threat outside of areas that have rodents infected with it.  Since smallpox has not been seen in humans in over thirty years, and was never found in animals, it most likely is gone from everywhere but a few well protected (one would hope) freezers, for whatever reason you want to believe it went away.  

[Mirzam]

Distemper and measles are similar, as you say. However, the problem is neither of the two viruses have ever been islolated, purified and characterized* to really compare viruses. Both vaccines (and diseases) can cause the same devastating injuries, SSPE in humans and Old Dog Encephalitis in dogs. Interestingly, the incidence of neurological disorders has dramatically increased in dogs, they are now displaying autistic-like behaviors as never before. Sadly, dogs are likely to be even more over-vaccinated than children.

Old Dog Encephalitis and Demyelinating Diseases in Man

Chronic Canine Distemper Virus Encephalitis in Mature Dogs

The clinical, pathological and immunological similarities between old dog enceph- 

alitis and subacute sclerosing panencephalitis in man has been stressed by several 

investigators [ 14, 15,241

* same goes for smallpox, cowpox, monkeypox, chicken pox for that matter. (Please don't show me fake EM photos of these viruses - they are all indeterminate cell particles NOT the purified, isolated viruses. Thank you.)

Edited by Mirzam - 9/1/12 at 7:27pm

[Louisw]

Originally Posted by pers 

Also, certainly there was controversy and disagreement at the time and those who thought Jenner's ideas were nonsense, but I would like to know your source of your statement that unequivocally "vets knew this old wives tale was garbage."  If Jenner didn't conduct an actual survey, did someone else so that we can know that all vets (or even a majority of vets) thought this?

"Vaccination" has been a black art from day one. Jenner killed so many with his "vaccine experiments" he would have been thrown in prison had he not been a royal favorite. It is very likely his "vaccination" never worked at all; it did kill many millions.

Back in Jenner's time as NOW what has always sustained "vaccination" is FEAR, political power, commercial interests, medical deception and ignorance born of very persuasive propaganda..

"Vaccination programs in the late 19th and early 20th century decimated the populations of many countries where government sponsored vaccination programs were introduced.  European deaths amongst the vaccinated portion of the population totaled 3,000,000. Deaths from smallpox vaccination programs began to decline when a revolt against mandatory vaccination programs emerged from the chaos. In 1919 the death rate from smallpox promptly plummeted to a total of 28 deaths in a population of almost 40,000,000 people. Previously, with mandatory vaccinations they had averaged over 44,000 deaths from smallpox."   Vaccination History

"By 1853, Parliament began passing laws to make the untested vaccine compulsory throughout the British Empire. Other countries of Europe followed suit. Once the economic implications of compulsory vaccinations were realized, few dared to disagree. Then, as now, the media were controlled by the vaccine manufacturers and the government, who stood to make huge money from the sale of these spurious vaccines..."  Tim O'Shea, D.C

“In 1853 England introduced compulsory vaccination. Before this time the highest death rate from smallpox was 2000 for any two year period. However 20 years later there were 23,062 deaths in England and Wales with smallpox spreading over Europe in all the countries where vaccination was practiced on a large scale. During the same epidemic in Germany 124,948 people died of smallpox. Of the 155 persons admitted to the Smallpox Hospital in the Parish of St. James, Piccadilly, 145 had been vaccinated.” Doctor Phillip Incao MD

[pers]

Originally Posted by Mirzam 

Distemper and measles are similar, as you say. However, the problem is neither of the two viruses have ever been islolated, purified and characterized* to really compare viruses. Both vaccines (and diseases) can cause the same devastating injuries, SSPE in humans and Old Dog Encephalitis in dogs. Interestingly, the incidence of neurological disorders has dramatically increased in dogs, they are now displaying autistic-like behaviors as never before. Sadly, dogs are likely to be even more over-vaccinated than children.

Old Dog Encephalitis and Demyelinating Diseases in Man

Chronic Canine Distemper Virus Encephalitis in Mature Dogs

* same goes for smallpox, cowpox, monkeypox, chicken pox for that matter. (Please don't show me fake EM photos of these viruses - they are all indeterminate cell particles NOT the purified, isolated viruses. Thank you.)

I'm not sure what you mean by saying these viruses have never been isolated.  

The genomes of many strains of these diseases have been mapped.  Scientists have pieced together DNA fragments to build polio virus (a relatively simple virus) from scratch, and the potential is there to do the same with smallpox someday (scary scary scary!).  I don't know how much more compared you can get beyond being being able to compare DNA or RNA.  

[Louisw]

Originally Posted by pers 

I'm not sure what you mean by saying these viruses have never been isolated.  

The world of virus research is a dark cavern. You would think after decades and decades of producing "measles vaccines" they would have surely isolated the target of these "vaccines" But NO it has never been done.

"This is the whole process as recommended by the CDC. There is no mention of the need to have a control culture, no mention of any need to isolate the measles virus or even to see it with an electron microscope. The cells are poisoned - and an unseen measles virus is blamed - even thou' the disease the cells have is totally unlike measles. Where is the logic in this?"

http://www.fearoftheinvisible.com/how-they-find-the-measles-virus

It is all black magic as it has been from Jenners time. We believe this CDC garbage to our demise. There is NO science behind "vaccination" it is all black magic based on FEAR and AUTHORITY.

"Vaccination" is a process created under the direction of powerful families like the Rothschilds for the purpose of getting NEEDLES into our arms. Go in take your shower, take your kids with you, there is no need for a men's and women's shower you can all go together.

[Louisw]

There isn’t one shred of evidence behind it. It’s a fraud shrouded in Big Pharma money, not an established fact. But it sounds so good, doesn’t it? It brings up an image of civic duty. Indeed, herd immunity’s enthusiastic promoters play on the image of the poor grandma or newborn who died of a “preventable” illness. They’re brilliant at tossing around the manure of guilt.

We now have very STRONG evidence that in the case of pertussis, "vaccination" destroys Herd Immunity.

http://www.mothering.com/community/t/1364593/the-end-of-our-pertussis-problem
 

[threenorns]

re the cowpox/smallpox thing

why is everybody assuming that in 1935, vets were able to accurately diagnose a condition?  really, the only thing they had to go on was a presenting symptomology that included the presence of a running sore - it's not like they could analyse the virus and visually identify it.   cold sores or  herpes?  same thing - except cold sores are Type 1 and herpes is Type 2 except maybe it's not - maybe it's a vitC reaction chancre or maybe it's a mild case of chicken pox or it could be psoriasis or a skin cell carcinoma or who knows what-all else.

for all we know today, maybe many cases of cowpox WERE smallpox back then.

[Louisw]

Originally Posted by threenorns 

For all we know today, maybe many cases of cowpox WERE smallpox back then.

Yes and OFTEN MOST of the disease and death were caused by the "vaccine"

“In 1853 England introduced compulsory vaccination. Before this time the highest death rate from smallpox was 2000 for any two year period. However 20 years later there were 23,062 deaths in England and Wales with smallpox spreading over Europe in all the countries where vaccination was practiced on a large scale. During the same epidemic in Germany 124,948 people died of smallpox.” Doctor Phillip Incao MD

"Vaccination programs in the late 19th and early 20th century decimated the populations of many countries where government sponsored vaccination programs were introduced.  ... Deaths from smallpox vaccination programs began to decline when a revolt against mandatory vaccination programs emerged from the chaos. In 1919 the death rate from smallpox promptly plummeted to a total of 28 deaths in a population of almost 40,000,000 people. Previously, with mandatory vaccinations they had averaged over 44,000 deaths from smallpox."   Vaccination History

Mandatory "vaccination" is what is in store for us with the H5N1 bio-weapon which can only be easily spread by NEEDLE.

Will history repeat?