How to fake a vaccination record? - Page 2

[Mosaic]

Locked while I review and hand out nastygrams... C'mon, gang, you know better!

[Mosaic]

I deleted possibly half of the thread due to UAVs and/or quoting UAVs. I'm reopening the thread because this conversation has been held, successfully, on these boards several times in the past.

Saying, "The decision to lie is unethical" is ok.

Calling the POSTER unethical, selfish, cavalier, uninformed, etc. is NOT ok.

Deal with the issue, not with the poster.

[JamieCatheryn]

http://www.vaclib.org/exempt/massachusetts.htm This site has great state by state info on filing your exemption. Most day cares and schools accept exemptions the same as medical records. It's the far easier way to go. Basically you only need a letter stating your personal opposition to vaccination.

[Imakcerka]

Can I say that the decision to lie about something such as this shows a lack of good judgement and integrity?

[Mosaic]

Originally Posted by Imakcerka 

Can I say that the decision to lie about something such as this shows a lack of good judgement and integrity?

Great question, and I spent some time thinking it over. I'm going to say no, as this is still a comment about the person making the decision and not the issue/decision specifically. To a certain extent, I feel as though this is a game of mincing words, which harkens back to the old-UA days. But, honestly, maybe some extra careful word selection could help reduce the tension in vax lately!

[TabithaB]

1. I have to say that I am not a saint.  I have went and whited out the date on an old physical and used it to turn in for a 3 day Cub Scout Camp out that was to much of a pain to get in.  Scheduling and paying for a doctor visit...blah blah blah.

2. Now I don't think that I would be so bold as to forge something like that for school.  That just seems like something that could be counterproductive and could come back to haunt you later.  Not to mention losing your credibility with the staff.  You are going to be dealing with the grade school staff for years and lying to them will not be easily forgiven by them.  I prefer to be able to take the "high ground" on matters like these so I am credible and respected.

3.  I love the comment by the moderator. re "handing out nastygrams".  that is a great way of phrasing it.

[patrickthenomad]

Medical records are supposed to be private. What we do with our bodies is our business. Legislation that mandates medical anything is purely based on profits. That being said, if the system sucks, find a way to circumvent. 

[emma1325]

Originally Posted by patrickthenomad 

Medical records are supposed to be private. What we do with our bodies is our business. Legislation that mandates medical anything is purely based on profits. That being said, if the system sucks, find a way to circumvent. 

I agree.  Do what you've got to do for your children.

[LitMom]

Originally Posted by MeepyCat 

I live in MA, currently have two kids in daycare.
When the daycare asks for vax info on my kids, what they want is a letter or form signed by a practicing MD. No stamp or seal. The little booklet they gave out at the hospital as a "vaccination record" is for me, so I can keep track of what they've had, the daycares don't even want to look at it.
The daycare wants a piece of paper from a doctor, with contact info for the doctor, and a list of vaxes and significant health concerns, if any. Also, they want a new one every year.
 

 I'm not in MA, and we are caught up vax-wise, but this is my experience too. I've never been given a little booklet, actually. I can get it online though. Sometimes the camp or program will accept a health form from a dr visit "within the last 2 years," but usually they want one annually. When we go to the dr. for an annual visit, I ask for copies of the standard school/daycare health form with each kids'  info filled out and dr. signed. Then I make a dozen-ish copies and we're set for the year. 

[ladyofkris]

Hello there,  I just have to say that I was googling how to do the same thing and I came up with your thread.  If you have figured it out on your own without the advice of any of these naysayers please privately email me and let me know what you did and if it worked.  THanks.  I too have not immunized my children, but the reason I am looking is because I want to take radiology in college.  However, I have no vaccination records from when I was little therefore they would like me to get them again.  I am opposed to this since I know that I have had them already.  [e-mail]

[Taximom5]

The decision to lie to protect one's child from a high risk of harm is exactly what many Jewish parents in in the 1930's and 1940's did; they obtained fraudulent documents identifying their children as Aryan in order to protect them from harm, and sent them to live with Christian families.

Edit: some posters are accusing me of equating vaccinations with genocide. This is not the case. The Jewish parents who sent their children away to live in safety as Christians had no idea that the death camps even existed.

The death camps--the ones specifically built to annihilate the Jews, as opposed to the concentration camps and the work camps-- were not even built until 1942, and they were kept secret from the Jews, from the German, Austrian, and Polish civilians, and (of course) from the world:

from http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Holocaust/36quest2.html:
"First of all, the Nazis did not publicize the "Final Solution," nor did they ever openly speak about it. Every attempt was made to fool the victims and, thereby, prevent or minimize resistance. Thus, deportees were always told that they were going to be "resettled." They were led to believe that conditions "in the East" (where they were being sent) would be better than those in ghettos. Following arrival in certain concentration camps, the inmates were forced to write home about the wonderful conditions in their new place of residence. The Germans made every effort to ensure secrecy."

When the few who managed to escape the camps made it to safety, nobody believed them when they described what they'd seen. It wasn'tuntil 1942 that it was even admitted amongst the Nazis that extermination was the goal. From
http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007822: "The decision to annihilate the European Jews was announced at the Wannsee Conference on January 20, 1942 to key high-level Nazi Party, SS, and German state officials, whose agencies would contribute to implementing a Europe-wide “Final Solution to the Jewish Question.”

All the European Jews knew was that they and their children were in danger from not only the Nazis, but from their non-Jewish friends and neighbors, who, for the most part, eventually went along with the Nazi bullying, either because they were looking for an excuse to do so anyway, or because they were afraid of the repercussions if they didn't.

frin http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/Jews_Nazi_Germany.htm:
"In 1935, the Nuremberg Laws were passed. The Jews lost their right to be German citizens and marriage between Jews and non-Jews was forbidden. It was after this law that the violence against the Jew really openly started. Those that could pay a fine were allowed to leave the country. Many could not and many shops refused to sell food to those who remained. Medicines were also difficult to get hold of as chemists would not sell to Jews.

The campaign against the Jews stopped for a short duration during the Berlin Olympics - but once the overseas press had gone, it started up again. It reached a pre-war peak in 1938 with Krystalnacht - The Night of the Broken Glass."

Kristallnacht: http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10005201
"On November 9–10, 1938, the Nazis staged vicious pogroms—state sanctioned, anti-Jewish riots—against the Jewish community of Germany... Encouraged by the Nazi regime, the rioters burned or destroyed 267 synagogues, vandalized or looted 7,500 Jewish businesses, and killed at least 91 Jewish people. They also damaged many Jewish cemeteries, hospitals, schools, and homes as police and fire brigades stood aside. Kristallnacht was a turning point in history. The pogroms marked an intensification of Nazi anti-Jewish policy that would culminate in the Holocaust—the systematic, state-sponsored murder of Jews."

Remember, this was over 3 years BEFORE the decision to annihilate the Jews was announced to German State Officials.

Incidentally, Friday was the 74th anniversary of Kristallnacht. For some of us, this was during our parents' and grandparents' lifetime, and they were there.
Edited by Taximom5 - 11/12/12 at 9:27am

[threenorns]

absolutely i cannot agree with your idea.  

it's absolutely no hassle to get an exemption.  in ontario, i don't need to get one every year - i sent it to her teacher in her backpack, it was put into her school file, and that's the last i'm going to hear of it until she turns 12 and they start harassing her directly to get vaccinated (since she'll be of legal age to consent to her own medical treatment).  by then, however, she'll be thoroughly educated on all sides of the matter and whatever choice she makes, i'll support even if i don't agree.

but faking a medical document?  that's totally more hassle than getting the exemption, not to mention fraught with very serious legal consequences.

[WildKingdom]

Quote:

The decision to lie to protect one's child from a high risk of harm is exactly what many Jewish parents in 1940's did; they obtained fraudulent documents identifying their children as Aryan in order to protect them from harm, and sent them to live with Christian families.

Are you really equating vaccinating children with sending them to the gas chambers?

Nice.

Pulling a Godwin is always an effective argument.

[ananas]

I would highly recommend not faking a medical document...

There are exemptions. Part of making the choice not to vaccinate is educating yourself on those exemptions and how to get them.

[Mirzam]

Originally Posted by ananas 

I would highly recommend not faking a medical document...

There are exemptions. Part of making the choice not to vaccinate is educating yourself on those exemptions and how to get them.

Except if you live in WV or MS, then you really have no choice. This is not health freedom.

[Taximom5]

Originally Posted by threenorns 

absolutely i cannot agree with your idea.  


it's absolutely no hassle to get an exemption.  in ontario, i don't need to get one every year - i sent it to her teacher in her backpack, it was put into her school file, and that's the last i'm going to hear of it until she turns 12 and they start harassing her directly to get vaccinated (since she'll be of legal age to consent ).

It's VERY different in the US.

In at least 2 states, the only possible exemptions are medical ones--and many parents of vaccine-injured children are reporting that they are unable to obtain medical exemptions for siblings of vaccine-injured children, and in many cases, for the vaccine-injured children themselves!

Some states are ceasing to accept philosophical exemptions and those that accept religious exemptions are making them next to impossible to obtain.

[rnra]

Originally Posted by ladyofkris 

However, I have no vaccination records from when I was little therefore they would like me to get them again.  I am opposed to this since I know that I have had them already.  

If you know that you had them as a child, simply call your physician and ask to have titers drawn.  These are blood tests that measure your immunity.  A titer is even better proof of immunity than a shot record.

[ladyofkris]

EXACTLY !  WELL SAID....... NOTHING MORE NEEDS SAYING.

[Cynthia Mosher]

Thread closed to review reports and posts. 

If the petty accusations and insults continue you (general you) will get removed from the forum. 

[Cynthia Mosher]

I have removed several posts made to this thread and issued an infraction to one member for their inappropriate posting. While it is fine to debate opinion and thoughts it is another thing to misconstrue a statement and try to make it offensive to those reading. This disrupts the discussion and makes it more antagonistic.

Taximom, I have left your post up. Please edit to clarify your intent in your post so that nothing offensive is perceived and then let's move on with the general discussion.