Giftedness, ADHD or both? - Page 4

[LynnS6]

In terms of "wait and see" -- are the ADHD symptoms causing her issues at school and at home? If not, then I think wait and see is reasonable. You can read up on ADHD and on ways to help kids with ADHD with self-regulation (it's often a problem not only for attention, but also for emotions and behavior). You can subtly work on those skills. If/when her issues become too much to handle for school or she's getting out of control at home (huge tantrums, not able to be calmed, rigid defiance are all things I've seen in ADHD kids, and I'm sure there are more), then you can think about outside behavioral therapy and/or meds. What you want to prevent is her feeling really bad about herself because she simply can't function in the situations where she's expected to function. But for now, it sounds like she's doing OK.

[Louisw]

What do labels mean?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wv49RFo1ckQ&feature=player_embedded
 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPgqLWrqeFk&feature=related

Labels often mean your child is being targeted and will become a victim UNLESS you stop it.

Edited by Louisw - 8/31/12 at 8:09pm

[catnip]

Oh gods I HATE that video.

You know what? I'd much rather be 'labeled' ADHD than called stupid, lazy, unmotivated, absentminded, and weak willed.
 

I'd rather understand why some things are harder for me than hate myself because I can't sit still to do a 3 minute timed math test.

I'd rather have access to the coping strategies that other people with the same challenges that I face figured out before me.

ADHD is NOT a 'bogus mental disorder'. Most people do not forget to eat for 2 days because they are hyperfocused on a project. Adults don't generally have incontinence episodes because they have tuned out body signals. People don't generally need to resort to elaborate coping strategies in order to enjoy sex because otherwise, it is too boring. Most adults don't need a restraining hand on their shoulder to keep them from absentmindedly wandering out into traffic. Most people can sit still through a television program or a movie. Most of you can probably keep a holiday gift a secret for a few weeks. And most moms hear their kid before the 7th time they've been interrupted from a book.

Your maligned 'label' has given me access to all sorts of insight into how to live with my differences. ADHD isn't an entirely bad thing. As the secondary label that the child reveals shows, people with ADHD are often innovators. They are capable of going outside the lines, seeing both the big picture and the little details, thinking outside the box. So many brilliant, creative people are different like that.

I'm very anti-ADHD drug, but I am very pro-diagnosis, because knowing what your challenges are are essential to not being blindsided by them. I may never be suited to certain jobs, but I am brilliant at the things that I can do.

[melissa17s]

I have looked up good info on for my twice exceptional child at this site http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/twice_exceptional.htm  If you want specific site for adhd, look to Chadd.org and there is also a good magazine with a site http://www.additudemag.com/

I found the videos posted very misleading and not helpful; the second one seem as close as you can get to propaganda. 

[Louisw]

Originally Posted by catnip 

ADHD is NOT a 'bogus mental disorder'.

ADHD is a syndrome it is not a medical diagnosis.

IMO ADHD can be MANY things among them

o A bogus Label  signifying nothing more than a kid difficult to deal with

o A physical problem or problems, often the result of vaccine damage.

o Something as simple as diet issues such as sugar and chemicals in food.

o MANY other things

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-P6_FwpVo_s&feature=related

.

[Triniity]

Hi,

update: I had this looong discussion with the psychologist from the "Giftedness Advise Thingie" (I don't know how to translate that

It was very helpful, and very interesting. He said, that the tests in combination with DD1 behaviour sounds very much like giftedness plus her behaviour sounds perfectly normal for someone "underchallenged". He advised us to see the school psychologist for our area and have her put in the giftedness program (which is a special day once a week)  - even though we cannot really "test" her  - due to the visual problems.

We'll see the ophthamologist in a couple of weeks, and I'll write an email before to make sure I won't forget the questions.

@tigerle: Thank you for the book advise, it is very interesting!

She is starting to get physical problems like headaches and bellypain, plus she is wetting the bed every night. We will see the best child psychologist ever next week (my biased opinion :) ) I am worried. She is a happy little monkey most of the times, but sometimes she appears to be ... I cannot really put my finger on it. We are just in week four for god's sake!

I don't know if I over- or underschedule her. She has an activity three times a week - she has chosen all of them and wants to go to all of them. Tue swimming, thursday ballett, friday violine and sat horseriding - she wants to go, I always ask her if she wants to stay home or to go. Now she wants to learn the flute on top of that, but I think that it is becoming too much.

It is really difficult! I guess though that I should have anticipated that it will become more difficult the first couple of weeks in school, since now she is underchallenged and not allowed to do what she wants.

I really would like to have a good afterschool program, but I am such an unorganized person, I cannot really find one.

[catnip]

Originally Posted by Louisw 

ADHD is a syndrome it is not a medical diagnosis.

IMO ADHD can be MANY things among them

o A bogus Label  signifying nothing more than a kid difficult to deal with

o A physical problem or problems, often the result of vaccine damage.

o Something as simple as diet issues such as sugar and chemicals in food.

o MANY other things

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-P6_FwpVo_s&feature=related

.

So, tell me. What is your experience in dealing with ADHD?

Your "bogus label" gives access to coping strategies. How do you justify that somehow being harmful?

Yes, ADHD is overdiagnosed. That doesn't make it nonexistent.

I don't think that drugging kids into conformity is a solution to ADHD. But telling a kid who is just flat INCAPABLE of waiting for a turn to speak, sitting still and taking a test, breaking a task down into manageable steps "oh, you are just lazy, crazy, stupid, not applying yourself, not trying, willful, disobedient, bad" does not help. Period.

And I refuse to ruin my day by watching anymore of your video links. They are too long and boring anyway.

[Louisw]

Originally Posted by catnip 

So, tell me. What is your experience in dealing with ADHD?

Your "bogus label" gives access to coping strategies. How do you justify that somehow being harmful?

Yes, ADHD is overdiagnosed. That doesn't make it nonexistent.

I don't think that drugging kids into conformity is a solution to ADHD. But telling a kid who is just flat INCAPABLE of waiting for a turn to speak, sitting still and taking a test, breaking a task down into manageable steps "oh, you are just lazy, crazy, stupid, not applying yourself, not trying, willful, disobedient, bad" does not help. Period.

And I refuse to ruin my day by watching anymore of your video links. They are too long and boring anyway.

I have long been very interested in autism. ADHD is generally considered as a member of the Autism Spectrum of Diseases.  ADHD can be VERY harmful because it has been used to put about ten million totally innocent kids on deadly drugs that put kids into a trance and increase their risk of death about five fold and do NOTHING to address the causes of whatever problems, if any these kids have.

"Yes, ADHD is overdiagnosed" ADHD is NO one thing. ADHD is OFTEN "vaccine" damage; it can be MANY other things.

"But telling a kid who is just flat INCAPABLE of waiting for a turn to speak" MANY kids need PERSONAL attention; they need home school especially if they are "vaccine" damaged; this is just a FACT. We do not have the time to learn enough about health so we TRUST our doctors with our one hour babies health and they shove a needle LOADED with toxins into our newborn. We do not have enough time to teach our kids so we send them to a government "school" where more needles are shoved into them and government propaganda is passed off as "education". If our kids are not important WHAT IS?

Do you remember being so excited YOU could not wait to speak? I do. What a total thrill to live like this 24x7. What a life. WE need to learn to adapt to these lucky kids. Yes I know all the downsides.

[catnip]

Originally Posted by Louisw 

Do you remember being so excited YOU could not wait to speak? I do. What a total thrill to live like this 24x7. What a life. WE need to learn to adapt to these lucky kids. Yes I know all the downsides.

No. You don't. You don't know what it's like to get into a fight with your husband because you screwed up and impulsively talked about his personal stuff to a totally inappropriate person. Trust me, it is no bloody thrill to live with 24/7.

I was diagnosed with ADHD in 1982. I was 8. I was on Ritalin for 10 years. I've learned to live without it for the past 20. My daughter is seven. She has ADHD, but is not medicated, because, hey! We homeschool, and work around her challenges. She's never going to qualify for security clearances, or be the CEO of a bank, but she's going to be brilliant at what she does decide to do.

We're on the same page about the meds. I will move heaven and earth to avoid them for my kid. But grouping the types of challenges that I face into a set of symptoms that I share with other people helps me to predict situations that I'm going to need to prepare for. I get support from my diagnosis.

If you've been paying attention here, though, the OP lives in a country where homeschooling is not an option, so the advice of adapt and homeschool is not helpful in this situation.

[pek64]

I think that too many kids get the label of ADHD when all they are is bright, energetic, enthusiastic, and lots of other good qualities!

I, personally, chose to homeschool for a variety of reasons, one of which was my son's difficulity sitting still. I felt he would outgrow it or learn coping mechanisms. He has, a little of both. I'm not sure if it (AHDH) is truly a disorder, but I do believe it is too often used by some to control children who are just bright.

I'm not sure how this helps the OP. I guess I'm just adding one more voice questioning the need to put a label on a child. It should be done only if the *child* will benefit.

[moominmamma]

Originally Posted by Louisw 

I have long been very interested in autism. ADHD is generally considered as a member of the Autism Spectrum of Diseases. 

This is the extent of your experience with ADHD? Being interested in a disorder that sometimes co-exists with it? And no, ADHD is not "generally considered a member of the Autism Spectrum of Diseases." The syndromes can co-exist, and the symptoms can be similar, but they are completely separate diagnostic entities according to all but a few outlier researchers and therapists working in the field.

Miranda

[Louisw]

Originally Posted by moominmamma 

The syndromes can co-exist, and the symptoms can be similar, but they are completely separate diagnostic entities according to all but a few outlier researchers and therapists working in the field.

Do you understand what you have said?

Here is a common view of autism and ADHD.

http://www.retrainthebrain.com/autism.html

IMO we have to start with this FACT.

ADHD is NOT a medical diagnosis

So what is ADHD?

Is your ADHD the same as my ADHD? How do we tell?

When we label any "disease" a syndrome it means we do NOT KNOW WHAT IT IS. We do not understand how it originates. We do not understand how it develops. We do not understand its bio-chemical mechanisms. All we know are a few diagnosing symptoms.

[Louisw]

Originally Posted by catnip 

We're on the same page about the meds. I will move heaven and earth to avoid them for my kid. But grouping the types of challenges that I face into a set of symptoms that I share with other people helps me to predict situations that I'm going to need to prepare for. I get support from my diagnosis.

Well you seem to being doing well for yourself and your daughter. This is the bottom line.

God bless you both.

[Geofizz]

This thread has gone pretty far afield of the OP's questions and personal situation.  Can we stick to that?

Triniity, maybe a clean, new thread would be useful to update us on the opthomologist appointment and how the rest of her situation is progressing.  It sounds like you're headed down the right track to figure out all the factors affecting your daughter's development.

[catnip]

I realize that there is no way I am going to change the mind of those who are arguing the non-existence of ADHD, but I also hesitate to yield the field, because I know that there are likely to be people reading this thread who would find value in my perspective.

I'm going to shut up now.

If anyone would like to PM me to talk about my experiences, both with living with ADHD, and with the side effects of stimulant medications used to treat it, I would be happy to talk about it.

[Cynthia Mosher]

Originally Posted by Geofizz 

This thread has gone pretty far afield of the OP's questions and personal situation.  Can we stick to that?

I agree with this. Let's keep the discussion focused on the OP's questions and situation. If anyone wants to debate the bigger topics raised in this thread that are not of direct relation to the OP's needs that would probably be better held as separate discussions and a link to them here for reference and invite participation.