Breastfeeding Support - Page 3 « Back to Group Discussions

[Sol_y_Paz]

 mtngirl81
 

I was told oats help milk supply - you can even bake it and it is still effective so granola and not highly processed oatmeal balls and/or cookies would even count.  As does staying hydrated.  A good way to tell would be to visit a LC and have them weigh baby before a session and then after.  A pump in the beginning will not give you a completely accurate view of what is in there since a baby is much more effective at getting the milk out than a pump. But you can use the pump to increase supply in between sessions.  

Edited by Sol_y_Paz - 9/2/12 at 8:52am

[monkeyscience]

Wow, so glad the evening fussiness/cluster feeding is not just me and my baby bird! (I call him Baby Bird virtually all of the time because of the amount of time he spends opening and closing his mouth and sticking out his tongue wanting to eat!) It's making me a little nuts, and it's only been two days.

eleuthia - Can you not get a nursing cover? The one I have is pretty room, and I can see Baby Bird really well. I have had a little trouble getting him to latch with it on, but other than that, he's really fine with eating under it.

Veritas - I wouldn't panic just yet. We went through that - basically NO diapers days 3-5 or so. My milk didn't come in until about 4.5 days after delivery. I was starting to get extremely worried, especially since we had a terrible time getting him on the boob. He was quite happy once there, but would SCREAM every time we laid him in my arms to nurse, making latching really, really difficult. The only thing I would say would be to make sure you're offering the breast every 2-2.5 hours, except at night, even if she doesn't seem interested/hungry. Even if your milk isn't in, she will be getting something.

[iixivboots]

VV, how are you and Q doing? If you're doing well baby visits, when do you have a weight check? We went to a LC who did the scale trick and I was concerned about low supply and it was really helpful. Because of Lyle's "breastfeeding jaundice" I was super concerned about diapers and everything. I hope it straightens out soon and you get some good reassurance and support.

eleuthia, where did I just read about tongue training? Was it on this thread or the other one in our DDC. Could that help Calder? I love his name, by the way. There's a great series of YA mystery books, Chasing Vermeer, The Wright 3, and the Calder Game that have a cool kid named Calder in them. :)

Sol, five days! I think I might've been four, and with the jaundice that was a bad combo. :( I felt like everyone was pressuring me, asking me if it had come, when he last ate, ugh. So glad we're past all that now!
 

monkey, glad things are going better after a rough start! Although from this thread, I think I've learned that "rough start" is pretty much "normal start" and everyone has issues. Yeah the cluster feeding/fussiness seems super common! It is good to know we're all going through this together.

mtngirl, I felt the same way you do, but I have since nursed him through some times when I thought I was "empty" and I did indeed get another letdown. It's so hard to feel confident! This article about cluster feeding and some of the resources at the bottom really helped me:

http://kellymom.com/parenting/parenting-faq/fussy-evening/

as for us, we're still doing well, dealing with a fussy evening about once every other night or so. I have some concerns like no fridge/freezer stash, a little engorgement (I think, it's just some achiness after he's not fed for several hours. I really don't know. People say their boobs get "hard" and i've never felt that, I wonder if my huge ones ever would. ;) I also got some of that mother's milk tea but haven't tried it yet. Have tried eating more oatmeal. Since I'm a little achy I'm sort of scared to try the tea now. Any experienced moms, is some mild breast achiness normal? It seems like I can't sleep on my side as comfortably anymore. This started after one period of engorgement, I'm hoping it's not a sign of any problems.

I was looking at my insane nursing log (We use the Baby ESP android app) and it has a nice scheduling feature. I was trying to figure out the best time to add a pumping session. I had settled on two p.m., since that has been between feeds for several days. Guess who wanted to eat at 2 today?

[LilyTiger]

mtngirl, the LC at the hospital told me to pump after each feeding to increase supply.  But like the others have said, you may have plenty.

In other news, Piper has been cluster feeding since 10am this morning.  She is totally inconsolable if not on the boob, but she falls asleep on it and then if I move or anything wakes her, she has to go right back on.  It's exhausting.  She won't let me put her down at all.  I'm completely fried and we still have the evening cluster feeding to look forward to.  She had her doc appointment today and everything looked fine, so she's getting plenty of milk and gaining weight and so on.  My doc basically said that sometimes babies just cry.  Which of course I knew, but it's so frustrating that only one thing will satisfy her and unfortunately I'm the only one who has it.  Ugh.  DH came home and immediately questioned my diagnosis, saying that he was able to put her down in the bassinet yesterday, etc. etc.  I handed him the baby and watched as she immediately freaked out.  DH made up for it by making me a BLT and taking the baby for long enough for me to eat and type this post. 

On a funnier note, I tried manually expressing some milk after her last feeding just to make sure she was still getting something and I actually sprayed myself in the face.  I had no idea the stream could get that high.  So yes, indeed, there is still something in there. 

[lakeruby]

im typing with one hand & just now exploring these posts, wish i would have done so earlier!  we have had a rough time with the breastfeeding so far. i think we're getting the hang of it in terms of baby eating enough, but she has jaundice and has only been pooping once a day, so everyone is nervous.  i am having to wake her every 2 hoiurs and force her to feed and its been fairly traumatic!  for everyone.  she is gaining weight and having tons of wet diapers, so i know she's getting something from me, but not as much as the lc would like.     more later, and i hope to have time to respond to other posts!

[Sol_y_Paz]

We are six weeks in and still experience the hours long cluster feeds.  Sometimes even twice per day, beginning at 6 am. That is a new thing this past week, the morning cluster in addition to the evening/night cluster.  I suspect a spurt.  Lilytiger, like Piper mine also likes to sleep there and does not like being moved.  I know babies cycle in and out of light sleep and deep sleep and I try to wait until deep sleep to move him.  I also try to make sure he stays awake to finish each breast and get the hind milk to fill his tummy but that doesn't always work either.  I am trying to use different carriers/wraps.   

Edited by Sol_y_Paz - 9/2/12 at 8:51am

[Tizzy]

Here's another suggestion, I always only feed from one side at a time. I feel that this ensures baby gets hind milk and I find it really helps them space out feedings more. It takes a day or two to establish that, I'll pump a bit from the opposite side but only enough to relieve pressure until the next feeding. I realize that it's not a popular thing to do, but this is my fourth EBF baby and it has really worked well

My second baby would never take a soother or bottle because he would gag, he had a "bubble palate". I really missed the soother for when he just needed to suck for comfort. And now baby G. likes it to fall asleep with. If he falls asleep at the breast, I have to burp him well or he wakes up pretty uncomfortable 10-15min later anyway.

[Veritas Vitae]

Mtngirl, it seems to me that pumping would only help to increase your supply at this point.  Our boobies work on demand, so if there is an indication that they should produce milk, they probably will, i.e. you could pump and nurse and still have enough.  I was pumping a bit to help bring in my milk and to help pull out my inverted nipple, then I would feed Quinn from the breast when she was hungry, and follow it up with giving her some of the pumped colostrum in a little medicine dropper, just to make sure she was getting enough. 

Also, latching seems to be going better on the left breast now.  She can latch on her own about half the time now, though, like Eleuthia said, I don't mind using the shield still occasionally, because it hurts a lot less.  My milk has come in now, at about 5 days out and if I'm feeding Quinn on one breast, the other is leaking, or it just leaks at night.  This morning I woke up in a milk wet spot and Quinn woke up in a pee wet spot.  It is good that we got a waterproof bed liner.  Now we're going to need extra sheets. 

For the experienced moms, do you know how long the nipple pain lasts?  I want to cry every time Quinn latches on. It is not as bad on one breast, but the one that I use the nipple shield on is extremely sore.

[CCoello]

I was still getting terrible latch on pain 3 weeks out - so I started using a nipple shield on one side (so Armie wouldn't forget how to latch right) for 24 hours and then switched which side I used the shield on. That 24 hour vacation really gave each side time to HEAL, and now the pain is minimal to non-existent, where it had been nearly excruciating before. I had checked with an LC first to make sure the problem wasn't with his latch :)

[Sol_y_Paz]

VV have you tried lanolin after every single feeding?  Does the pain just last when she latches for a couple minutes?  Or is it consistently painful the whole feeding? For me, pain is here to stay, but that is another issue entirely - vasospasm.

[sallyrae17]

Originally Posted by Veritas Vitae 

For the experienced moms, do you know how long the nipple pain lasts?  I want to cry every time Quinn latches on. It is not as bad on one breast, but the one that I use the nipple shield on is extremely sore.

With my first, I had nipple pain for about 6 weeks before it was totally gone. Showers were like torture chambers! I'd have to shield my nipples. It got better after that, though!

[Tizzy]

I find that wiping some milk on the nipple and air drying after feeding is super soothing and helps them heal up quickly.

[eleuthia]

turns out i don't need to worry about my partner's family visiting, as they aren't going to make it here (his brother in law is traveling to see his ill father, so it's for an unfortunate reason, but i am still relieved). now i can continue to sit on the couch with my boobs out! 

i looked up suck training (actually "suck training breastfeeding" as i'm afraid of the google results otherwise) and tried it and it has really helped. we're back off the nipple shield, though i really do think that break helped my nipples since i'm a LOT less sore and generally only have some pain at the initial latch-on or if he starts to pull off. i get a little sore when we're cluster feeding (approx 8pm-midnight usually) but i will just switch to the other breast when one gets too sensitive. i'm using the earth mama angel baby nipple balm, which seems to help & is less goopy/greasy than lanolin. plus it smells chocolatey from the cocoa butter! 

for those who are also cluster feeding - do your breasts start to feel realllly empty/soft after awhile? i start to worry that he's not actually getting anything out anymore, which wouldn't worry me too much, but he sometimes goes ~4 hours between feedings once we go to bed, and i don't want him to be going too long without actually getting milk. i'm hoping my supply will start to match his "schedule" a bit more, since i'm often waking up engorged and/or leaking everywhere. 

[iixivboots]

eleuthia, totally they start to feel soft and empty after awhile. After not really believing it, I have nursed him through these where he has gotten another letdown even from "soft" breasts. That said, he had to have his first bottle in two weeks or so (of pumped milk thankfully I had a VERY small stash) last night because he refused to calm down enough to nurse long enough to get another letdown. Ugh! That kellymom link that I posted for mntngirl and the resources at the bottom talk a lot about "empty" breasts.

Glad the training helped!

lakeruby, I have so been there with the sleepy jaundiced baby who does not want to wake up every two hours to feed! Exhausting! Hope she gets it cleared out of her system soon!

[LilyTiger]

eleuthia, my boobs totally get soft and empty feeling after cluster feeding, but I can always hand express milk, so I know there's something in there.  Piper is finally up to sleeping around 3 hours between feedings at night.  Combined with the cluster feeding from earlier in the day, that leads to some pretty painfully full breasts over here.  Sigh.  I hope my body gets used to this somehow.

In other news, we're off the shield completely as of this past weekend, which has made nighttime feedings so much easier.  She just pops on.  Nipple soreness has gone down too.  I'm using the the Earth Mama Angel Baby cream too.  I agree with eleuthia that it's less greasy and sticky than lanolin and just generally easier to use.  I'm also more comfortable throwing a bit on even if I know she'll want to nurse again soon.  With the lanolin it felt weird to paste that stuff on if I knew she was going to be nursing within an hour or so.  We're finally getting to a reasonable schedule.  Piper sleeps around 3 hours at a time at night (which is sooooooo much better than the 1.5 hours she was rocking for a while there) and though she cluster feeds throughout the day, her evening crankiness and continual feeding has gone down too.  Maybe that was just a growth spurt and she grew out of it.  Dunno.  Either way, we're finally getting enough sleep (as far as I can tell.... I'm still exhausted by 8:30 pm) and she's getting enough to eat.

Tizzy, I've been feeding her off one boob at a time in order to get enough hindmilk into her.  I didn't know that method was looked down on.  Oopps.  It seems to be working well for us.  She never empties one boob fully, so we just do one side per feeding.  The other breast gets full but never engorged (except maybe sometimes at night when there's a lot of time between feedings).  Glad you've done it with multiple kids and they all turned out ok!

[Sol_y_Paz]

As far as the earth mama angel baby butter, is it so non greasy you can use it without breast pads? I don't leak so the only reason I have disposable pads is for the lanolin to protect clothes.  I haven't seen it in stores, do you have to buy it online?  I also wear thick breast pads that aren't throw away but those are for the vasospasm. 

DS stopped the out of character morning cluster feeds and it was for sure a spurt according to the scale.  

Eleuthia - mine seem soft much of the time but there is still a lot in there.  How was it with all your guests and learning how to nurse?  My experience was for awhile there it was just too much stress with everyone except a handful of people.  Now I could handle all of it without added stress but it was a lot being a ftm.

[LilyTiger]

Sol, I don't use nursing pads with the Earth Mama butter, which is another reason I really like it.  I just use regular nursing sleep bras and I haven't noticed any greasiness coming through the bra.  Lanolin was a mess.  I bought mine off Amazon, though my local grocery store (a higher end one) carries it as does the local cloth diaper shop.  So you might be able to find it in stores, but it's just as easy off Amazon.

[NewMumJoy]

Hey everyone, I've been reading along and wanting to join this thread for 2+ weeks now, but I'm just finally now getting caught up with "free" time to do so.....  Hugs to everyone who's struggling here, I hope we can all find our groove real soon!!  

William and I are having a hell of a time with our breastfeeding.  We started off nicely at the hospital (according to everyone's observations).... he was immediately rooting on DH's chest in the operating room after my c-section, and we got him onto my breast in recovery about an hour later.  During my 2 night pp stay, I had him on the breast(s) for 15-20 minutes every 2 hours, and although it was challenging for him to get a good "deep" latch on my very large nipples, he at least seemed to be "sucking" contentedly on a regular basis - and was producing wet and poopy diapers.  He lost 9 oz by the time we were discharged, and everyone said we were doing just fine.  By Day 3 (now at home) our public health nurse/LC paid me a routine home visit and determined that William had lost more weight (-3.5 more oz I think) and was concerned about him becoming dehydrated, judging from the reddish urate spots on his wet diapers.  So she instructed me to get out the bottles, pick up some formula, and start pumping to bring in my milk supply asap.  I couldn't believe it - after everything else not going as planned, now my breastfeeding relationship was about to take a nosedive.....

And so began the round-the-clock cycle of  A: pumping an average of 30 mins to express as much milk as possible - then topping up the bottle w/formula (to total 3oz)    B: trying to get him on the breast w/a good latch until we were both in tears (my too big nipples - about the size of my thumbtip - were way to large to fit in his tiny mouth unless he was screaming....which were then painfully chewed up and bleeding.)    C: feeding him the bottle and then handing him off to someone else so that I could   D: pump again for the next feeding and  E: sterilize the pump and bottles......  I'm sure you ladies understand how little time was leftover for things like sleep or anything else!  I feel like I'm being robbed of the precious "positive" bonding time that I so badly want to spend w/my LO, but this "cycle" has taken over everything!

Inevitably, after 2+ weeks and trying different routines w/o success (breast first, bottle first, tubing/syringes, SNS, nipple shields, etc.) William now definitely prefers the bottle and hates the breast.  He can now open wide enough to fit my nipple in his mouth, but starts screaming after a minute.  It kills me to think that he now has such a negative association w/my breast which was meant to provide him nourishment and comfort!!  AND, since he can longer "latch" for any amount of time, I've had to resort to the pacifier to quell his sucking needs in between feedings.  We use it A LOT (since I'm always tied up) which is especially frustrating knowing that I could be missing his "cluster feeding" cues/needs.

My milk did finally come in by Day 5+ and I'm taking fenugreek and blessed thistle to keep supply up.  I can now pump about 3 oz combined in about 30 minutes, which still needs improvement  - but at least I'm mostly able to go w/o formula now.  And we still keep trying the breast during each feeding and also in between during "calm" periods, hoping to eventually regain a positive experience to build on.  I'm SO worried that we'll end up exclusively pumping for the next year...... Currently I can keep up w/the routine, but I don't know how sustainable it'll be over the months to come (like when I need to leave the house for more than an hour)....  ughhh!!!!

[Sol_y_Paz]

I am so sorry to hear of the troubles everyone, glad there is a support thread place to share.

DS lost 10 ounces after 48 hours and milk didn't come in until three days later so he did continue to lose.  Since we didnt have issues like some others have had I was not told to supplement but what I was told to watch/record was the amount of wet and dirty diapers, also the amount of feedings and the times of feedings.  He didn't gain his birth weight back until the very end of week 2, or until week 3, not sure which one.  But now at 6 weeks he has gained about 3 pounds since regaining his birth weight.  Hope maybe this helps someone who also has a slow gainer at the beginning. 

Edited by Sol_y_Paz - 8/31/12 at 8:27pm

[eleuthia]

Originally Posted by Sol_y_Paz  

Eleuthia - mine seem soft much of the time but there is still a lot in there.  How was it with all your guests and learning how to nurse?  My experience was for awhile there it was just too much stress with everyone except a handful of people.  Now I could handle all of it without added stress but it was a lot being a ftm.

The guests we ended up having were just my family - mom & youngest sister and then 2 other sisters, and honestly they were extremely helpful and I probably would've given up if my sister Erin hadn't been there for the toughest evenings. I really wish every new mom could be surrounded by supportive women like that (or have them nearby, anyway). If my partner's family had made it here, it would be a different story, since there's not the same comfort level with basically sitting around with my boobs out all day! If they'd been here early on, I would've been really stressed out. I'm sorry you had to deal with that... but glad you made it through! 

NewMumJoy, that sounds so incredibly frustrating! I'm glad you're able to feed him your breastmilk, and I know you're sacrificing a lot to make that happen. And you're doing a great job!  It's understandable to feel upset that it's not how you'd imagined, though. I have definitely read stories of babies who eventually came to the breast after weeks/months of refusal, so I don't think you should give up hope, though I also know some mamas who successfully exclusively pumped and their babies are now happy/healthy preschoolers (and the mamas are still sane). 

AFM, well, I can't go more than a few days without another breastfeeding challenge... this time, it's a plugged duct. I'm doing everything I can to get rid of it, including massaging it with a, uh, "personal massager" as recommended by a friend. And I'll be trying to wake up every couple hours to feed him instead of sleeping blissfully through 4-5 hours and waking up engorged.