The foreskin and the toilet...

[AfricanQueen99]

My son is 2.5 and yesterday was his last day in diapers. Hooray!

One of the biggest issues going on right now relates to his foreskin. The opening isn't directly on the tip, rather it's more on the top. Never been an issue - the kid pees fine. Anyway, when he's on the toilet (sitting on an insert as he's too big for a "potty") and pushing his penis down the urine literally goes all over the insert and toilet. It is impossible to push it down at an angle to go into the toilet. I'm not sure he's able to stand to pee (after all, he's two, so he's short!). He is big enough to not use an insert, but this is new and the toilet is so big that I can see the fear in his eyes about falling in.

Other ideas on positions? He *is* retractable, but I don't want to get into retracting to urinate as my only goal right now is to get to the toilet and not pee on my floor!

[mama24-7]

Out of curiousity, how do you know he's out of diapers today?  I'm on my third child & I EC'd him since 3 days old & I'm still not sure he's out of diapers.  

On peeing, I can't tell if you are asking about having him pee by himself w/o you in the room or w/ you in the room.  My ideas are for him to do w/ assistance from you.

Will he stand on the toilet seat, w/ a foot on both sides?  If he's already scared, then this may not work.

Depending on the height of your toilet, he could stand on your feet & you help him lean forward and/or hold his penis to aim it.

How about peeing in a cup?  Or in the shower?

That's all I've got.  Hope something helps.

Sus

[AfricanQueen99]

He's out of diapers because I said so...and I'm the mom. :)  Nah, it was time to use the toilet and get out of diapers so we're going cold turkey.  We said goodbye to the last diaper yesterday morning.  Sweet boy has stayed dry during naps and nighttime.  He's my little trouper!

I'm absolutely willing to assist.  Like I said, the issue is the opening on his foreskin.  Since it's on the top when he's pushing his penis down to pee it shoots straight out and not down into the toilet.  Even when I'm holding it down it's still *really* hard to get that aim right.

We ran to Target to get a different step stool for him (he stayed dry during the hour long errand - hooray!), but it's just odd for him to stand and pee.  I'll try a cup and see how it goes.  Standing on my feet might give him an extra few inches to help, too.  Thanks for the suggestions.

He can't be the only one with an opening up top, right?  What do others do?

[artekah]

Do you have a potty seat adaptor that goes on the toilet? We have this one: http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0010P5Q7Q/ref=mp_s_a_1?qid=1346988185&sr=8-1

And the pee guard is excellent for little boys. I highly recommend it! Our DS's pee goes slightly to the left (DH jokes "stage right")--of course, once he's retractable it'll be a non-issue, but yes we have to be aware of it so we can help him aim.

If you get him a potty with a pee guard like that one, and make sure he knows to point his penis down every time, I bet that would work out fine. Peeing standing up, IMO, can wait until he's a little older. Hope that helps!

ETA: For public restrooms, you can hold him under his knees facing out, and sort of bend forward and aim him at the toilet--make sure to remove pants and underwear completely, or put his feet way up high so the stream of pee doesn't hit his clothes. DH says urinals are great for this method, but if it's just you and you have to go in the ladies room, just back further away from the toilet so the arc lands in the toilet. Kind of awkward (to do as well as to explain) but it works. You may have to experiment a bit. Oh, those little boys.

[PeterBrown]

Boys figure out all that them selves, but one thing you need to know is that, he stretches his skin out, it fully may not even detach off the head until he is around 10 years old, so its an FYI the second thing you have to show him is you can pull it back just a little bit so the hole is exposed and he can aim better. but most boys can't retract at all some untill they hit puberty and, so the skin does a good job of aiming for him, but again there is no need for intervention, because he stretches it out him self, it does not just happen, thats a fact, but most doctors don't even know it because they never had one. Its a really important thing for you to know though, the gland is fused to the gland, until over time he stretches it, almost all teenage boys do this, its a weird medical secret i guess. 

[MCatLvrMom2A&X]

Odds are given time your ds will figure it out on his own but you can actually show him how to retract just enough to expose the urethra at the tip of the glans. Since he is just 2.5 you will probably have to show him as long as you are gentle it shouldnt be an issue.

My ds actually had the same issue with the foreskin being more full on the bottom than the top leading to the opening to be more toward the top and causing urine to arc up instead of down he taught himself to pull out on his foreskin, away from his body to make it aim down, but he was older than your ds when he potty trained at just shy of 4yo.

[brant31]

Does your son have some epispadias or is this limited to a foreskin shape? Often the two go hand in hand.

I agree with PeterBrown; boys who are at least partially retractable and who have hypospadias or epispadias will normally benefit from gently retracting enough to clear the meatus during micturition. As I've mentioned here before, I have mild hypospadias and it's really not a wise option for me not to retract for emiction (as an adult). I know you don't want to introduce this additional step right now, but consider it for soon from now. There's some parent information on the web if you search for "peeing upward".

Each boy needs to work with his own particular anatomy, and the range of normal is really great.

[AfricanQueen99]

Originally Posted by brant31 

Does your son have some epispadias or is this limited to a foreskin shape? Often the two go hand in hand.

No epispadias or hypospadias - when retracted everything is properly aligned.  It's honestly just his foreskin.  He's been able to retract since before turning two (no idea when he fully retracted) and shows so much penis love that I see the glans way more than I want to!

All day today we just used the toilet without an insert and had him spread his legs to balance.  He has been managing to lean forward while urinating to make sure it all goes in the bowl.  I needed to take a mental step back to realize that the insert (left over from my daughter so there isn't a "splash guard") was too small and just too difficult to maneuver for him.

Thanks for helping walk me through this.  Once we get through phase one of toilet learning and he's a master I'll introduce retracting slightly to urinate.  He's still so young that I need him to focus on one task at a time.

[dkwunder]

Had the same with my 2nd boy he was only 23 months and tried the big toilet like his 3.5 year old taller brother.

Why don't you get a big potty like the baby bjorn potty seat--my 4 year old can still use it and he is tall ( how big is your boy?) until he is tall enough to stand more controlled at the big toilet for peeing maybe til about 3 y.

Also at Home Depot they have those great regular toilet seats with a smaller insert attached with a hidden magnet inside. You just take off your regular seat and install that double duty one.It looks like a regular seat and the kids just pull out the insert. It looks good and is safe and easy. Because what if he has to go number 2? He will need to sit safely and steady on the seat. Those put on inserts are often to wobbly as well.

OH, and leave his foreskin alone! Little boys' foreskins are usually and naturally still attached. It is not to be touched til he is way, way older.It will just happen,boys know naturally what to do.

[AfricanQueen99]

Originally Posted by dkwunder 

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OH, and leave his foreskin alone! Little boys' foreskins are usually and naturally still attached. It is not to be touched til he is way, way older.It will just happen,boys know naturally what to do.

I don't touch his foreskin - he does. A lot!

He's too big for a potty seat - tried it.

[MaeBird]

Try a pee-guard.  I worked in a severe autism classroom at a middle school a couple years ago and a couple of the boys used them to sit and pee on the school toilets (with the cut in the seat).  You can make one really easily--get a 1 gallon milk jug and draw a "curved triangle" around one corner, then cut it out.  You will want to make the "sides" longer and the "base" shorter.  You will be a flat cone shape.  You or he can hold it over his penis (short side across the top) and it will curve into the toilet to direct the flow in a downward directions.  You can make it as long as you need to make sure everything goes in.  Just rinse it off after use and wash with soap and water on whatever schedule works for you (daily, etc.).

Hope that made sense!  I can try and draw a diagram or something on paint if not.  :-/
 

[JBaxter]

Lean and tuck Lean and tuck..  Potty trained 4 boys < some intact some not >   My little man is almost 4 and just started standing to pee but if he's sitting to poop I still remind him.  3 of mine hated the potty chair and inserts.  OP I was like you 2.5 we ditched all daytime diapers.

[AfricanQueen99]

Alright, just for any of you that care about the state of my kid's toilet learning escapades...

He's doing awesome.  All diapers are gone and he's been dry during naps and night.  He's an awesome, awesome kid in that he uses pride as his largest motivator.  Anyway, he just wasn't digging the insert and he's too short to stand so he sits and balances on the toilet seat, holds his penis down and happily shoots the inside of the bowl.  Foreskin aiming issues be gone!  Considering this is only day four I'm calling it a happy mama moment in time. :)

Thanks again for your help!

[artekah]

Originally Posted by AfricanQueen99 

Alright, just for any of you that care about the state of my kid's toilet learning escapades...

He's doing awesome.  All diapers are gone and he's been dry during naps and night.  He's an awesome, awesome kid in that he uses pride as his largest motivator.  Anyway, he just wasn't digging the insert and he's too short to stand so he sits and balances on the toilet seat, holds his penis down and happily shoots the inside of the bowl.  Foreskin aiming issues be gone!  Considering this is only day four I'm calling it a happy mama moment in time. :)

Thanks again for your help!

That's great! Good going little guy!

[kblackstone444]

I've heard this somewhere before, can't remember where... have the little boy sit on the toilet BACKWARDS, holding onto the seat cover and leaning towards the seat cover.  It aims things more in a downward slant, if you know what I mean.  

[PeterJ]

This is slightly off the topic, but somewhat related to guiding sons with care of the penis and foreskin.

I would agree with most everything here except the idea that "boys always know naturally what to do".  It's important to remind boys about hygiene, especially once they hit puberty and are retractable, because this is often a time when boys hygiene suffers a bit!  I speak from some very personal experience, when it would have been great to have a parent regularly tell me "son, make sure you retract, clean, rinse and replace when bathing".  It would have saved me some bother with infections etc.  As a rule, "let the boy figure it out" works great, but sometimes it's wise to step in with some guidance.