toothfairy2be, yep DH and I are done freezing samples. About time to get our quarterly charge for keeping them frozen until we get enough money to do IVF. Insurance covers a hefty portion, but we have to pay our RE upfront for procedures. Likely next summer when I have two months off from teaching to go through all the procedures.
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October Infertility "One" Thread - Page 3post #41 of 17210/8/12 at 6:08pmpost #42 of 17210/9/12 at 12:43pm
Milk - So sorry to hear. I can't begin to understand how you are feeling right now. :(
Lindz - Congrats on making it through the announcement. How awkward. And does co-worker know you are trying? You would think she wouldn't have asked you to do it. Anyway... good job!
ProudFamilyGuy - I, for one, would love to hear how a guy feels about all of this. My DH is more of the silent type.
Toothfairy - enjoy the Caribbean! And hopefully you'll be all relaxed when you come back.
Lila - You are lucky insurance will cover even some of your costs. If IUI's don't work for us, there is no other option. We would never in a million years be able to afford IVF. I hope you have enough saved soon!
AFM - I haven't been in here since the October thread was started! Sorry to be MIA for a little bit there. This cycle I went in for day 13 u/s and had one good size egg ready and one medium. We waited an extra day before IUI to give that second one a chance to develop. I did IUI on CD15. I was told things looked good and I had the thickest lining they've seen from me in months. So again I sit here waiting. I am hopeful but nowhere near as hopeful as last month. That one kicked my a**. But still... here's hoping.post #43 of 17210/9/12 at 1:48pm
Hi, yes, still here! I've been crazy busy with births, we went out of town, then I got the stomach flu. So here I am. Sorry, It'll just be an update.
Cait - I cannot believe how soon it seems you would be starting IVF!
Brichole - I remember you too.
Ok, so, RE appointment was a week ago now.
1) We will be doing the RPL blood work. Insurance should cover it without putting up a fuss (according to RE's billing dept). I just need to schedule it. I said something like "I know most early losses are probably chromosomal abnormalities..." to which I was shocked to hear "No. Not at your age they aren't. You aren't even 30." So, if something is up the bloodwork should flag it and everything they are testing for is treatable.
2) He really wants to do a Laproscopy. Which I never really even considered for myself, and seems a little invasive. I guess I was just in shock. But, I have never heard of any one here or otherwise whose RE wanted to do one and they ended up doing it for no reason. I do have symptoms of endometriosis. Primarily pelvic pain. Then there is the taking years to get pregnant and when I do it ends early thing. I need to call insurance to check then call the RE's billing to see how much this would cost us. DH is a little unsure about it.
3) My problems could just all be hormonal. That on my own I make enough to eventually release an egg, but maybe not a great egg, and that on my own my progesterone isn't enough. Which could explain early losses. He said this is something that Clomid and oral drugs don't really fix even though they get you to ovulate. And again, possible endo as another explanation why I haven't gotten pregnant with Clomid and IUIs. So, we do the RPL pannel and the Lap and if they are both clear and no other treatment is necessary, we go to injectables where my hormones can be closely monitored to insure we are getting the right levels to make a great egg and use progesterone during my LP. But, we aren't going to do this without knowing if anything else is going on.
Endo ladies, Cait, Sourire (if you still hang around here) anyone else? Your opinions on my getting a Lap?post #44 of 17210/9/12 at 3:57pmpost #45 of 17210/9/12 at 5:10pm
Thanks Deborah. I'm not really concerned about the actual procedure or recovery, I guess I'm concerned about the cost (which I should actually find out so I know how much to worry) and that he won't find anything and that the whole thing will have been for nothing.post #46 of 17210/9/12 at 5:48pmThread Starter
Sila- I agree with Deborah that as far as recovery it really isn't a big deal. For me anyway, I do know a few people who had a tougher time. I took it easy for 4 days and then went right back to work (on and off my feet all day). Cost wise my old deductible was 500, my new insurance is 250 so hopefully cost wise it wont be too bad. I agree that it isn't often they go in and look with a LAP and don't find something. What are you feeling as far as pelvic pain? Any cramps with your periods, pain during sex? Were you ever treated just with progesterone? It seems like a lot before your bloodwork comes back. I think I hesitate to say yes go for it only because I had so many endo symptoms it just seemed silly not to just do it, find it, get rid of it. I worry too what you are worried about... what if they go in and find nothing. I guess see what your bloodwork says. Are they testing your antibody levels? Endo certainly effects progesterone levels and would explain a lot as far as the RPL so in that case I would say yeah if it answers your questions then do it. How often do endo and PCOS coexist? Whatever you decide I am happy to answer whatever questions as it gets closer, there is a lot they don't tell you that you will want to know before the LAP (just pre/post surgery stuff). I am glad they will cover all your blood work so hopefully they will have answers and you can get your take home baby ASAP.post #47 of 17210/9/12 at 7:32pm
Cait - That's what I'm thinking, that it shouldn't cost more than a couple hundred $'s out of pocket. But if we go in and don't find anything, then insurance will most likely be less willing to pay their full amount :( As far as my symptoms, I started noticing them about 18 months ago. My pelvic pain isn't unlike AF cramping, but isn't the same either. Just a dull aching pain. I pretty much have it all of the time (not only around ovulation or before AF arrives). It's seems to be the worst after I ovulate actually, from about 5dpo until AF arrives. I had asked my gyn and even mentioned it to RE before but he didn't mention that it was a symptom until now. I used to think my periods weren't that bad, but starting a year ago yes, the cramping has gotten really bad (and not only pelvic, terrible back cramps wth are those!?). I usually have too much pain during sex, certainly not enough to keep me from enjoying it, but I definitely have noticeable pain right after sex. I have never used progesterone, and my progesterone blood work has been during medicated cycles, so we don't know what it is on my own. But again, we aren't going to waste time putting me on progesterone for months if something else is going on. I am pretty sure certain antibodies are part of the blood panel. I have actually never been formally diagnosed with PCOS. My blood work turns out fine, though my ovaries have a lot of little follicles but nothing is ever growing. I obviously have symptoms. It could all just be hormone related in another way I guess like my RE said. I'll be sure to get all of the details if the lap is something we decide on doing. The whole scheduling it thing seems like a nightmare in itself thanks to my messed up body. They like to schedule these things in advance and at a certain time in your cycle you know, but who knows how many weeks/months it could be until I ovulate and get AF again. I'll probably have to go in for a u/s and see if I'm close to ovulating and we wait, or nothing is going on in there and we can try to squeeze me and and just do it, or induce AF so we're on a new cycle. Ugh. Thanks for responding and educating me!post #48 of 17210/10/12 at 6:03amMilk - I'm a bit late but I wanted to say that I'm so sorry for your loss. I can't even imagine the pain you must be feeling after going through this many miscarriages. Life really isn't fair.
Sila - I just wanted to add that recovery is much easier if they don't find anything because they don't make as many incisions and obviously you don't have the internal healing. I agree that the recovery part isn't a big deal but I personal did not enjoy general anesthesia and I don't plan to have anymore Laps even if my endo comes back because of that. It sounds like your RE is really committed to figuring out what is going on and that is great. It's so much easier when you have answers! Based on the pain you've described it sounds like there might be some endo in there which can cause implantation failure or early miscarriage.
AFM - AF is due today but there is no sign yet. I think my acupuncture & Chinese herbs may be prolonging my LP a bit... I'm at 12dpo and I've never made it this far without progesterone... But each day my LP is longer is a day my IVF is delayed! And it's hard to call this a successful LP since I've been spotting plenty of brown sludge since ovulation day. I had exactly 6 days this cycle with no bleeding or spotting.post #49 of 17210/10/12 at 6:46am
Sila - I've had endo and had a lap to take care of it. I was probably to young to remember or really understand what all the doctor was explaining. I was about 21. I had my first daughter when I was 19 (BCPs don't always work!) and began having endo symptoms shortly after the recovery from birth. The lap was totally fine and my insurance paid for all of it. How I understand it, or maybe it's how your office bills it, a lap doesn't fall under infertility if you are having endo symptoms. Sometimes I wonder if that's what I need to have again but my RE doesn't seem to think so...post #50 of 17210/10/12 at 12:34pm
Sourire - I remember your crazy general anesthesia experience. I don't like it either. Yes, my RE is very proactive! Totally opposite of you guys who had to basically demand a lap or whose Dr's brushed off possible endo. I have a totally normal LP, but with the chinese herbs it has extended it even longer before so you may be right. I hope she comes soon so you can get started!
Planegreen - Thanks. Are you having symptoms again? How long ago was your lap? It seems to me if you have been trying for a while and it's been awhile since you lap, it could have returned and that could be part of your trouble.
AFM - So I just found out that my insurance has to pre-review my lap and deem if it is medically necessary. No matter what, not because it could possibly fall under IF. SO annoying. I mean if my Dr is wanting me to get it done don't you think he already decided it is necessary? I need to schedule it within the next 2 months since we have already met our deductable. Apparently this pre-review process isn't supposed to take long...post #51 of 17210/10/12 at 3:57pmThread Starter
Sila: I've never heard of a pre-review. I don't think you'll have any difficulty getting approval with your symptoms. I'm glad you are seeing a doctor that is working in your best interest. When do you go for the blood panel?
Sourire: I totally forgot about how horrible your anesthesia experience was. What are they using on you for egg retrieval? Figures that now AF waits and takes her sweet time to show up when you need her to. You are doing estrogen priming right? Did you start injections yet? Was this cycle unmedicated?
planegreen: If you really think that the endo is back than I think it would be okay to push for a new laproscopy but if you are thinking of IVF regardless and you've already had one I wouldn't waste the time/money.
AFM- Went to the new RE consult today and discussed IVF. They didn't give me a ton of info on my exact cycle but I did get that I'll be on BCPs for 3 weeks and then Lupron for a week before stimulation. I think it is considered a Long lupron or agonist protocol but I'm not sure. The BCPs sound like just a precaution that I don't get pregnant and expose it to the Lupron (which happened to a friend of mine). I asked him a lot of questions including why they wouldn't do estrogen priming to improve egg quality and he said with a history of endo and nothing to show that my response would be poor (esp seeing good response from clomid and injectables) that he wouldn't want to risk flaring up the endo/inflammation with added estrogen. I don't get my AMH tested until CD3 (10/28) so things may change based on that but I think it is probably fine. I had a lot of ethical questions too that I can't say I'm 100% comfortable still but I don't know that I will ever be 100% comfortable so we are just continuing to be prayerful and trusting in the process.
Also, we need some damn graduates. What the heck...post #52 of 17210/10/12 at 5:21pmtoothfairy - the standard procedure for egg retrieval at my clinic is local anesthesia, so it shouldn't be as bad as general. I'm still not looking forward to it though. I'll try to ask them to go easy on the anesthesia since I'm more scared of anesthesia than of the pain!
This cycle was totally unmedicated except for the Chinese herbs. AF never showed today (but I had some cramps so I'm sure tomorrow will be CD1), so I officially had a 12-day LP. It's crazy because I've been trying for YEARS to lengthen my LP, I've tried so many things and nothing ever worked (except progesterone)! And now I've finally given up and moved on to IVF and something worked! It used to be 8-9 days long, since my lap it's been 10-11 days long, and this month I made it to 12 days for the first time ever which falls in the definition of a normal length.
Once AF shows, I will have no meds until CD21 then I will be taking estrogen pills (Estrace) until the end of my cycle. After that I start Follistim and Menopur around CD3 of the following cycle. Toothfairy it's interesting what your doctor said about estrogen causing endo to flare up. I'm not convinced my protocol is the best one for me but I've decided to just trust my doctor and see what happens. Trusting doctors is not something that comes naturally to me! I figure the worst that can happen would be OHSS which would not be fun but it's a risk no matter what protocol I'm on. And if for some reason I don't have any embryos to transfer then this cycle wouldn't even count as one of my 3 free tries so all I've lost are a few months.post #53 of 17210/10/12 at 6:26pmThread Starter
Sourire- that is amazing that the chinese herbs made such a difference. I guess that means your egg quality is improving so that is perfect in time to start an IVF cycle! Looks like I will be about 2 weeks behind you. It seems all doctors have a different philosophy as far as estrogen priming. Since endo effects egg quality it makes sense to improve it with estrogen but at the same time then your risk the inflammation from endo flare ups so it is a double edged sword. The are just testing my AMH on my next CD1 so I we will have a clearer picture on what to expect for egg quality at that time. Looking forward to following your cycle.post #54 of 17210/10/12 at 9:30pmpost #55 of 17210/11/12 at 6:02amThread Starterpost #56 of 17210/11/12 at 5:02pm
AF is JUST now showing up (a week late!!!) and so I'm calling in the AM to set up my base line US and BW for either Monday or Tuesday. Then i have to go see my General Practitioner for a follow up appointment on Wednesday. I just hope that this works quick. I don't think my emotions can handle another negative pregnancy test. I've added it up and i think i've spent a little over $1500 in pregnancy tests over the past 10 years and only 7 or 8 of them were actually positive tests (yes i got a LITTLE obsessed once i did get positives because i was afraid it wasn't real). I can't keep spending $10-15 or more a month in tests just to keep getting negatives. I know that doesn't sound like much, but that's money i could be spending on food for my family or gas for my car. ANYWAYS, i hope that I'm able to get some good news from the doctor's office next week when i go in for my blood work.
Thinking FERTILE thoughts for all of you ladies!!!!post #57 of 17210/11/12 at 5:55pm
Sila - Not many symptoms. Occassionally I have that ripping feeling when I stand up but it's not anywhere near like it was when I had endo. My lap was about 8 years and one DD ago. I sometmies wonder if because I got it after my first pregnancy, did I get it after my second? I hope your pre-review does go quickly.
Toothfairy - IVF is not an option for us because of finances. So if the drugs and IUI don't work, we are done. Sad to think about that... I agree we need some graduates.
Sourire - I'm glad those chinese herbs worked for you. You sound happy with the path you are taking.
brichole - Reading your signature, I see that our kids are sort of the same age and we are both trying for #3. Go us!
AFM, I had some cramping today on the lower right. It felt like it was lower than where my ovary is so that was kind of weird. I even felt a little on the left after that too. Maybe implantation? I sure wish but....... sigh...... you all know what I mean about that. Hope you are having a great Thursday!post #58 of 17210/11/12 at 6:16pm
Planegreen-yes she knows! She's super sweet and has pcos and had to go through fertility treatments too. When our students found out one of my students said "You should have a baby too!" Out of the mouths of babes huh?
The hubs and I have such a busy few weeks coming up. I think he will be out of town when I am ovulating again. Sigh.
Thinking fertile thoughts ladies! At least it's almost Friday! :)post #59 of 17210/12/12 at 5:03pm
Cait - Going into to get my blood taken on Monday. It will probably take around 2 weeks for the results. I guess this stuff is a little more detailed. I don't know that much about IVF protocol but it sounds good to me! I really really hope this works for you.
Sourire - So AF showed up? So only about a month until your actual cycle?!
Brichole - All these late AF's with no BFPs. Not fair. Lady, WHY ARE YOU NOT BUYING INTERNET CHEAPIE TESTS?!?! $10-15 is like 50 tests. Please don't tell me you are testing THAT much ;) Ok sorry, I hope you get good news next week? Are you starting your Femara this week then?
Planegreen - I hope that cramping is a good sign! I cramp my whole LP no matter what :(
Lindz - I hope your egg somehow waits until your husband is home!
AFM - Ok, so the insurance thing doesn't seem to be a huge deal. Going into the lab on Mon. for my RPL panel, then the RE on Tues. for an u/s to see when we should schedule the lap. Of course if kind of seems like my body might want to ovulate soon. We'll see if that happens before Tues. I'm surprisingly not really even thinking about trying this month. I guess I want to see what these tests show.
I agree. Can we get a graduate around here??? Everyone is leaving to the IVF thread it feels like...by the way I totally understand if you guys don't update on both threads. It's easy to lurk :)post #60 of 17210/13/12 at 8:49am
Sila...I'll never be over to IVF, unless I win the lottery! LOL! I have a friend that spent everything she had on IVF, it didn't work multiple times. Then a year later a miracle. On her own. IVF scares me. The price scares me.
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