chicken pox and shingles

[pek64]

I understand that chicken pox and shingles are both caused by the same virus. I also understand that the first time you have symptoms it's called chicken pox, and there after it's called shingles. Why the name change? Do the two look different, feel different?

[shiningpearl]

Chicken pox is a whole body viral infection, pox spots can be anywhere.  A person will be actively sick.  
Shingles is a reactivation of the virus along a nerve path, it is more nerve pain but it will erupt to the skin as the body tries to get rid of the virus.  A person with shingles is not contagious except for direct contact with blisters that erupt, but it is not a whole body infection.  

A person who has had chicken pox and who still carries the virus, can help keep shingles at bay by re-exposing themselves to the virus (taking care of a child who has chicken pox) which will cause their body to produce more antibodies and help keep shingles suppressed. 

[pek64]

So chicken pox is *never* completely eliminated?

Also, my mother was exposed during childhood, but never got ill. She had 6 children who all had chicken pox, and never got ill. My son was exposed at around 20 months (my brother didn't tell me his kids had it), but never became ill. He just got one single pimple-like thing that cleared up in a couple days. I'm not sure if he's immune or not. The interesting thing is, both my mother and son have a zinc allergy.

[ma2two]

Shingles is usually much worse than chickenpox. It can be extremely painful, and sometimes cause permanent damage. That's why it's insane to have a vaccine for chickenpox, which, when used universally in children, is known to increase shingles in adults, because adults are no longer getting the natural immunity boosters they need from exposure in the community.

Many people think that the chickenpox vaccine in children will protect the children from getting shingles in the future, but it does not. The chickenpox vaccine is a live virus vaccine, and that live virus stays in the body for the lifetime, just as it would from getting natural chickenpox.

[pek64]

Question about the permanent damage caused by shingles. What kind of damage? My uncle and brother both had shingles, and neither had any lasting damage, so I don't know what might happen.

My son is now 16, and other than that early exposure, never got exposed to chicken pox. I just never knew anyone who had chicken pox and didn't know about chicken pox parties. Now I'm wondering what we should do.

Keep the info coming, please. I prefer to make decisions with as much information as possible.

[kathymuggle]

Originally Posted by pek64 

My son is now 16, and other than that early exposure, never got exposed to chicken pox. I just never knew anyone who had chicken pox and didn't know about chicken pox parties. Now I'm wondering what we should do.
 

It's messy, isn't it?

5 years ago, I would have said to expose your child to as much CP as possible and hope they get the disease.  If they did not get it by the teen years, consider vaxxing (more important for girls than boys, as CP in pregnancy can cause birth defects in a small amount of cases).

As chicken pox decreases, (Prosciencemom put out a link the other day saying it had decreased by 80%), people who had the vaccine can get shingles, and shingles is on the upswing, I wonder if the "expose them or vax if they don't get CP"  idea is the right thing to do.

It may be healthier to cross your fingers that they simply do not get CP - then you do not have to worry about shingles.  I just do not know.  I certainly would not jump to expose a child to CP at the moment or to vaccinate them - it might be wisest to see how this all plays out.

Edited by kathymuggle - 10/8/12 at 1:27pm

[rachelsmama]

Originally Posted by pek64 


My son is now 16, and other than that early exposure, never got exposed to chicken pox. I just never knew anyone who had chicken pox and didn't know about chicken pox parties. Now I'm wondering what we should do.

 I have a couple of relatives who "never" had chicken pox, despite pretty heavy-duty childhood exposure.  As adults, one has had shingles, and the other has cared for children with chickenpox without becoming ill, so it's probable that both were infected during their childhood exposures, but asymptomatic.  Like kathymuggle, I think the whole issue has become messy, but I thought it might help you to know that there are other families out there with multiple members who don't show their chickenpox.

[Mirzam]

I also have never had chicken pox despite being exposed many times as a child and an adult, all three of my kids had it. Never had shingles either. My brother, who did have chicken pox, got shingles a year or so ago.

[dakotablue]

Isn't there a blood test to check for immunity? Just a thought before making a decision.
 

[~Adorkable~]

im very torn on this one too. my first thought was not to vax my kids for this and to let them get it while still older kid age, maybe get tested and possibly vaxxed if they didn't get it before high school.

 now the more i read the more I'm worried that either way i go, folks aren't getting the natural exposure to "booster" their immunity they develop when initially infected.  and i wonder if the vax will even continue to be effective without this natal or eventually prescribed boosters?

it seems like this is one of the strange cases where i see that personal options are getting messed up be other folks all getting the vax, very frustrating. I wonder when al this vaxxing will bring th level down low enough to think that it is reasonable to hope to go a lifetime without getting it at all? right now that seems crazy to count on, since even 20% is pretty high numbers for such an infectious thing, and that getting it initially s a adult is so potentially bad.

really struggling with this one, at least i feel happy waiting, dont really worry about it for a few years, maybe we'll get more info by then

[rnra]

Originally Posted by pek64 

Question about the permanent damage caused by shingles. What kind of damage? My uncle and brother both had shingles, and neither had any lasting damage, so I don't know what might happen.

Shingles can lead to postherpectic neuralgia (a fancy way of saying nerve pain/damage after a herpes infection).  Symptoms of this include (from http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/postherpetic-neuralgia/DS00277/DSECTION=symptoms)...

• Pain. The pain associated with postherpetic neuralgia most commonly has been described as burning, sharp and jabbing, or deep and aching.
• Sensitivity to light touch. People who have postherpetic neuralgia often cannot bear even the touch of clothing on the affected skin.
• Itching and numbness. Less commonly, postherpetic neuralgia can produce an itchy feeling or numbness.
• Weakness or paralysis. In rare cases, you might also experience muscle weakness or paralysis if the nerves involved also control muscle movement.

[pek64]

Originally Posted by dakotablue 

Isn't there a blood test to check for immunity? Just a thought before making a decision.

 

I've talked with him about that, but he doesn't want to have blood drawn. He's 16 and wants to take his chances that he's immune. I don't know if I should push for the blood test. Personally, I pass out unless it's done well. I guess he's afraid of the same happening to him.

[Taximom5]

Originally Posted by pek64 

So chicken pox is *never* completely eliminated?
 

No.  The virus "hides" in one of the spinal nerves and goes dormant.  When reactivated, it doesn't leave that spinal nerve; that one nerve will be inflamed (which is horribly painful--it's like a pinched nerve, only the length of the entire nerve is inflamed, not just one point), and the skin lesions will appear ONLY along the that nerve.  The skin lesions are both itchy AND painful, which is almost unbearable.

[GracesMomNE]

I struggle with this too.  I never got chicken pox, and my parents had me vaccinated at 16 back when it was just a single dose.  I've had my titers checked (years ago) and it shows i'm not immune.  Now I have a toddler (and one on the way) who I don't want to vaccinate against chicken pox, however I worry about getting it myself if they have it.  Has anyone out there had chicken pox as a 30 or 40 something adult?  If so...how was it?

[GracesMomNE]

I struggle with this too.  I never got chicken pox, and my parents had me vaccinated at 16 back when it was just a single dose.  I've had my titers checked (years ago) and it shows i'm not immune.  Now I have a toddler (and one on the way) who I don't want to vaccinate against chicken pox, however I worry about getting it myself if they have it.  Has anyone out there had chicken pox as a 30 or 40 something adult?  If so...how was it?

[~Adorkable~]

Them getting it as an adult, thats my big worry, i have personally seen 3 friends get it after high school or later, one in her early 30s. 2 of them ended up in the ICU of the hospital, it was sooo bad, so much worse than when we were kids.  which for me (about 5) was not that big of a deal, but my sister (8) was more miserable but still ended up fine.

the lady in her 30's had it in her eyelids down her throat, in her privates she had to be sedated she was so uncomfortable and her body so stressed out.

the guy in his early 20 then got a horible secondary infection that is why he finally went in, has very veyr bad scarring and seemed to be a "more fragile" person for a long while after, i dont know what that was about, but he seem to be sickly for the next few year that i still knew him. (for all i know it was the treatment not the illness that made his immune system fragile, so im not making any conections here)

i have a 4th friend that cant seem to make the antibodies to it, so just gets it over and over and over, like 17 times now!  he reads the school paper where he lives for news of outbreaks nad quarantines himself, since he tends to get it thru work were adults with it on them from their ids touch everything and pass it to him unknowingly. he has been in the hospital about hte last 6-7 times for it, he is almost 50 now and just sick of it. I dont know if he has tried the shot, im guessing it would not work and just make him sick again, who knows. he is a very very strange and rare case.

i know some folks loose their immunity, we will probably start seeing more of that, but from what i have heard a second infection is likely a lot lighter and quicker, not like getting a full blown case for the first time as an adult

by the way, Welcome to Mothering.com!  i see you have been around for a while, nice to see you post!

[stephbrownthinks]

Googling pictures of chicken pox and shingles will help give you an idea of how they're different. For what it's worth, I had chicken pox as a kid and it was no big deal. I just remember my mom threatening to make me wear over mits if I didn't stop scratching. My dad (who was in his late 30's and never had it as a child) caught it and had a horrible time. He wasn't hospitalized, but his case was brutal compared to me and my sister's. Right now I actually have shingles. I've never had it before, and I'm 28. Its really not bad. I have a mild case. I have one small spot about the size of a $.25-$.50 piece on my ribs, and another a little smaller on my back, then single blisters/spots connecting them. It definitely is painful and uncomfortable, but it hasn't been enough to really alter my life in any way. I'm still working, and taking the kids places, and sometimes even forget about it. Its been almost a week and it's already getting better. Shingles and chicken pox can definitely be huge painful ordeals (google image shingles... you'll die), but there is also the possibility for them to be mild.

[pek64]

Thanks for the welcome!

I'm still undecided. Why do adults have such a hard time? Is it a larger body? Or a tendency to push themselves at the beginning of the illness, not knowing what they have?

[tammy123]

For some reason this vaccine seems to be controversial and you should have all the information at hand before making a decision. I personally have vaccinated all three of my girls. Not really for the chicken pox (though why not spare your child some discomfort, I had a really bad case when i was a child and it was extremely unpleasant) but for the secondary infections that can occur. These are something you may want to research before deciding. I noticed that no one mentioned them so I am curious if they are not common knowledge (shingles may be unpleasant but i prefer discomfort to death). I have given you a link you may want to check out.

http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/hl-vs/iyh-vsv/med/chickenpox-varicelle-eng.php#co

Best of luck.

[pinklucy]

I live in the UK and I was so surprised when I heard that people vaccinate against chicken pox in the U.S. In the U.K it's just considered a normal illness that pretty much everyone gets. As others have said, shingles is more nasty but affects adults and you're a lot less likely to get shingles if you've had chicken pox. I think we are meant to have chicken pox as kids. I couldn't believe the way some of the U.S websites talked about chicken pox as if it were such a terrible thing. I remember having it and it wasn't too bad. My son caught it at 13 months from his cousin and I have a picture of him grinning with chicken pox spots. It hardly affected him at all. I can't imagine even considering giving a vaccine for chicken pox, which I guess is a good thing because we don't have it here anyway!