A Saner TTC: Hunter's Moon

[dakipode]

Hello all and welcome!

The original "Sane 2ww" thread was started by zenquaker and you can find it here: original thread. This is a continuation of the "Sane 2ww" thread and we felt "A Saner TTC" was a natural evolution. We will start a new thread each new moon and name it for the upcoming full moon.

Here's the gist of the original thread: this is a space to re-conceive the 2ww as a time of waiting and contemplation. Although we don't judge those who wish to poas frequently, symptom-spot, or do chart analysis, this a space set apart from that activity. We share our thoughts about other ways to approach the 2ww and all parts of our cycles. We encourage each other to feel our feelings fully and to greet all possible outcomes with openness.

We hope you'll join us!

[dakipode]

bearandotter: I laughed at your comment "DH is from Mars". Mine is the same way. I tell him "I just want you to comfort me" and he doesn't know what to do, I literally have to give him instructions: now say this, now hold my hand, etc.

As for the magical thinking: I bought prenatals last month for that reason. This month back to my normal multi. I compared them, they pretty much have the same amount of vitamins, including double the recommended dose of folic acid, and they're much cheaper!

Margo: sorry you were disappointed this month. Symptom spotting is hard to avoid but that's why we have this thread, right? I wish you good luck on this next cycle!

Lidamama: your comment about technology also made me think of The Business of Being Born movie and how doctors started labeling pregnancy as a medical condition. Of course we want to monitor things and make sure they're progressing in a healthy way but do we really need to freak out about it? Women have been doing this since a long time before modern medicine.

To answer your question: last year I started thinking about a lot of that stuff (labor, delivery, how and where etc.) when my friend was TTC and we'd discuss it. Now I try not to think about it so much. In a silly way I feel like I would jinx myself if I did. Just like when I calculate the due date based on my ovulation and I feel like that somehow keeps me from getting pregnant. Because surely if you do these things it means you're REALLY thinking about TTC and everyone says you should not think about it in order to get a success... So that's what goes on in my crazy over analyzing mind...

GISDiva: I like your mantra. It gives me a feeling of peaceful surrender. I think it closely approximates what I try to go for during 2WW: surrender, being open to possibility and accepting the outcome.

revolting, devilish, happy2bamama, Xerxella, virgo, JustJenny: how are you ladies doing?

AFM: took my last Clomid yesterday, I didn't get any side effects from it (at least not so far). I'm feeling calm, waiting to O, let's see if it tricked my body into getting things going...

[revolting]

Dakipode - Good luck with the clomid. Hoping for you!

12dpo here, and moving to the point where I'm second guessing my desire to test right after I expect my period. I rather not know about an early loss, but since I'm pretty sure of when I ovulated, I don't know if I could not suspect even without a positive test. I know for my miscarriages, I struggled the most when I strongly suspected that I was losing the pregnancies but didn't know for sure. 

In the meantime, I've been thinking about what I want to do once I get to the "missed period" stage. In our house, we've generally called October's moon the Blood Moon (and worse yet, November's moon Dead Moon for a thread like this). I've definitely had a not-so-great feeling towards blood lately: each menstruation feels like a failure; each miscarriage came with so much blood, more blood than I've ever seen. And I really want to work past that. In the last thread, a few mamas talked positively about feeling like menstruation brings a new beginning. My partner is gone all week, so he won't be able to share with me the time when I expect my period, so I've been working especially hard to make sure I have some ways to pamper myself (wine, chocolate, and a good fantasy novel to read in the bath!) and get ready for another opportunity to try again. I've read a lot about lunaception over the last few weeks, and given my personal spiritual path and my ttc journey, I think I'd enjoy trying it. And if I'm pregnant...I don't know if this sounds totally defeated already, but I've been thinking about starting to collect the supplies for postpartum cloth, figuring that even if I miscarry, I'll have a way to pamper myself...and something to hold onto about the pregnancy (even in a kind of gross way) that I don't from my other miscarriages. I'm a Pagan and right now, Samhain (sort of like Day of the Dead) is coming...and I still haven't found a way to honor my lost babies on my beloved dead altar, because I have nothing from those pregnancies.

Anyway, one of my favorite poems that I like to read around the Hunters Moon, or Blood Moon as we call it, is The Moon from the Porch by Annie Finch:

Moon has dusks for walls,
Octobers days for a floor,
crickets for rooms, windy halls.
Only one night is her door.

When I was thirteen she found me,
spiraled into my blood like a hive.
I stood on a porch where she wound me
for the first time. My tight and alive

body flooded to find her,
to know I would not be alone
while I moved through tides that don't bind her
into womanhood like a flung stone.

With each waxing curve into fullness
I grew with her, ready, wild;
I filled myself up like her priestess;
I emptied myself like her child.

Flooding, ready, and certain,
I hid her—full, fallow, or frail—
beneath my long summer's rich curtain
which covered her face, the thin grail

that delivers me now. I am with her.
All cast shadows come home.
I stand in these shadows to kiss her;
I spin in her cool, calming storm.

Now as I move through my own beauty
and my shadow goes deeper than blood,
oh triple, oh goddess, sustain me
with your lights simple opening hood.

Maybe it's weird, but this poem brings me a lot of comfort.

Baby dust to all!

[JustJenny]

Hi everyone, just checking in :)  I'm on CD10 and recovering from the flu. Feeling much better this afternoon, with my energy returning. I've been Oing around cd16-18 so I've got a little ways to go....Good luck during Hunter's Moon everyone!

[devilish]

Dakipode: I hope clomid remains easy on you but with all the pluses that go with it.

I picked up my clomid today prepared for next cycle. I'm on CD18 and there's no sign of EWCM or any indication of ovulation. Looks like another 60 day cycle for me which means October AND November are busts for me. I'm glad I insisted on the clomid for December. Although, the current soundtrack on repeat in my head is the FD voice saying "I'm certain you'll be pregnant before you see me next." Really, asshole? REALLY?

I'm really bitchy tonight and I don't know why. IF (and that's a big IF) I didn't know any better, I'd say AF would be showing up in the next few days (but I know better).

[Xerxella]

devilish - I hate docs that say that. I'm glad the doc is on board with being more aggressive. Good luck with the Clomid, even though it'll be a while before you're on it. I wish I could say the bitchiness was gearing up to O... Maybe?

revolting - I don't think there's anything wrong with preparing for the worst. It's better to be surprised in a good way than a bad way.

justjenny - We're cycle buddies! I'm cd 9. But, there's no telling for sure when I'll ovulate.

dakipode - Congrats on finishing your last day of Clomid! You're on about the same cycle as justjenny and I. Are you cd 9 now? Are you doing any monitoring with the Clomid? For some reason I'm REALLY excited about your cycle! I have no idea why.

to everyone!

AFM - As stated above, I'm cd 9. I've been working with an RPL (Recurrent Pregnancy Loss Specialist) and she changed hospitals right before my last loss and now she's still settling in and not taking patients yet. Ugh. So, they think maybe by the end of the month or next month. I'm on the waiting list.... I think when I do get in to see her, I'll ask to be a little more aggressive with the TTC part alone. If I'm going to be losing them, I might as well get pregnant as quickly as possible to see if I can get a sticky one at some point.

[Lidamama84]

Thanks for the new thread, Dakipode! Sorry to hear you can't get your brain to stop over-analyzing. grr...that's frustrating!

Bearandotter: Sorry to hear about being sick! Yuck! What's BW? (I think that's the acronym you used...it was on the other thread)

Revolting: I loved the poem!! I think that's a great idea to start getting some PP things together. Things like cloth pads and RRL tea that you can use now during TTC and menstruation and throughout your third trimester/postpartum. It's like opening your mind to what comes after the TTC process instead of focusing on TTC :) As far as testing early goes, I have never tested until at least a week after AF is due, so I don't know if I've ever had a chemical. I think I prefer it that way. I never thought about testing earlier, I guess...and I've never taken more than one test. I guess I just assume that everything will be good. But of course, if recurring losses are happening, like in your case, it seems wise to know about it and try to find out how to fix it.

JustJenny: Sorry to hear you're sick too! I had a nasty bout of something last week too. Luckily I took a few days off to rest and took Olive Leaf extract and the combination seems to be working to get me better...slowly...

Devilish: 60 day cycle! That really sucks!! Glad your doc agreed to give you Clomid. Have you tried Vitex or Maca in the meanwhile to try to get things started?

AFM: Soo...all this talk of cycle days made me want to see what CD I'm on. CD 11, apparently. I don't see any signs of O coming soon, tho. Oh well. I'm planning on grabbing some Maca one of these days if I can ever get to the health food store after work. I always have two tired and hungry kids with me which doesn't make for a good trip to the store

Talking of the old days...my mom and grandma had lots of fertility problems. My grandma had my mom right after getting married, but couldn't conceive again. After lots of hounding the doctors for an explanation (this was the 50s), she found out that she would never have kids again. She recently shared with me that she contemplated committing suicide at that point, but then she couldn't because she had my mom and she thought to herself "who will take care of my Maria?" (though my grandpa was around and involved and everything, lol). My mom also had a lot of trouble conceiving. Without ever using BC, she only had 3 pregnancies in 25 years of marriage. The first ended in a MC, and my bro and I are 7 years apart. For me, the point is that not so long ago we had so few options to deal with IF, so it's great to see that things like Clomid, IUIs and IVF exist...on the other hand, I think they give a false security, that no matter how long you wait to have kids you are guaranteed to get them...it seems like its so hard to find a balance for timing your kids...

[devilish]

Lidamama84: My PP cycles have been weird. It alternates between 35(ish) day cycles and 55 - 60 day cycles. September was the shortest with 32 days. Irregardless of how long it is, I'm still not ovulating. I don't get a temperature shift and during the trans vaginal ultrasound (ugh) I had 52 (!!!) follicles. My regular cycle prior to my pregnancy was 32-35 days with a 15 day LP.

I did try Maca, and that was made feel really weird and nauseous the whole day. My DH, too.

Edited by devilish - 10/16/12 at 12:05pm

[JustJenny]

Lidamama-  I totally forgot about Olive leaf! That stuff is awesome. I have to make a vitamin order and I think I'll add that to the list for cold/flu care to have on hand. 

Revolting- I loved the poem and your ideas. I agree its so difficult not having something tangible to honor our lost babies. Sometimes its as if they only existed in our minds. It is really hard to share those thoughts for me and I'm glad that you mentioned them :) Dh is really good about comforting me but he never had the physical experience, you know?

Devilish- What is with Doc's doing that! Its not comforting in the slightest. In fact thank you DR. for dismissing every concern I just discussed with you....

Xerxella- I think its funny how so many of our cycles are close. I think you me, Dakipode and Lidamama are all cd 9 or 10! I hope we all get good news this cycle! We're due for some bfp's!

[coati456]

Hi, I would like to join. My husband and I have been TTC for almost a year now, so I could really benefit from a peaceful community. Sometimes I let myself get my hopes up and sometimes I don't. I'm a scientist, so I kind of like to think of every cycle as an experiment.

Right now, I'm on CD 27, should be the last day of my TWW. My temperature dropped this morning, so I think I'm out this cycle. At the moment, I feel okay about it. I have a doctor's appointment scheduled for November.
 

[beingmommy]

Hi all!  I've been trying to stay away from the TTC groups a bit lately to help me not obsess.  Heh, sort of works (but not really).

Margo, so sorry for the disappointment.  It's hard.  But glad you are ready to hope for the new cycle.  I always feel sad for a few days after a BFN and then get optimistic again.  A new cycle at least feels full of possibility.

Bearandotter, any news yet for you?  Did AF come or are you still in limbo?  

Dakipode, fingers crossed for the clomid for you! I over analyze everything too.  I am really working on doing it less but sometimes it feels like it takes as much energy to stop the obsessing as it does to obsess. 

Revolting, hugs!  I think it is wonderful that you are looking for a way to honor your lost babies.  And it's hard not to think about future losses once you've suffered losses.  I know I sort of expect to keep having losses.  I don't know any other way to think.  So preparing ahead makes sense to me too.  It's sad to think about but it also gives me comfort to know how I will handle a future loss. Helps me feel stronger.  I know how you feel about not testing to not find out but also it being hard if you don't know if you are having a regular period or an early loss. I hope you find the answer that gives you the most peace. Beautiful poem too, thanks for sharing it.

JustJenny, Glad you are feeling better.  Hope this cycle is good to you!  And there are a lot of close cycles!  I am on CD 11 today.  

Devilish, oh what an insensitive doctor!  Sorry you had to deal with that. Ug!  I am glad you have got clomid for your next cycle but sorry it looks like it might be a wait.I am hoping it comes quicker for you.  

Xerxella, sorry for the waiting list. What a drag.  But glad you have plan in your mind.  I feel that same way about wanting to get pregnant quickly if I am going to have losses.  It ends up taking up so much time going through the loss and getting your body back to normal!  I hate the feeling that if it takes forever to get pregnant that the fear of loss is so much bigger.  

Lidamama, it is strange to think of the days when we had so little information.  My mom never had an ultrasound or got to hear a heartbeat.  She just missed her period and assumed that was it from then on.  My last pregnancy ended in a missed miscarriage and we had decided to do as little testing as possible so no early ultrasounds.  I sort of wish we had now because then maybe I would have known earlier and could have avoided the entire month I thought I was pregnant (and was sick as a dog 24/7) when the baby had actually already passed away.  I think if we manage to get pregnant again I'll likely do a few early ultrasounds just to avoid that torture, although I am not happy about the extra testing.  Humph, it is a blessing and a curse, the advances we have now.

Hi coatie, glad you found us and sorry it looks like AF is on her way.  Hopefully your next cycle here will bring good things!

AFM:  On CD11.  Think I actually *might* be ovulating right now (which would be neat because we managed a BD last night - yay!).  But I am so not sure.  I guess we'll see.  Last week I was telling my DH that I could not imagine another baby in our lives.  Like I literally, with my vivid imagination, could not see it.  There was just a blankness when I thought about it.  I was wondering if it was a sign that it wasn't meant to be for us.  Then I did some work around my fears of another miscarriage and had an unexpected resurgence of grief about my loss in June.  And since then it's so vivid I can almost *feel* a baby in my arms.  So strange. I am hoping it's a good sign.

[revolting]

Originally Posted by devilish 

Dakipode: I hope clomid remains easy on you but with all the pluses that go with it.

I picked up my clomid today prepared for next cycle. I'm on CD18 and there's no sign of EWCM or any indication of ovulation. Looks like another 60 day cycle for me which means October AND November are busts for me. I'm glad I insisted on the clomid for December. Although, the current soundtrack on repeat in my head is the FD voice saying "I'm certain you'll be pregnant before you see me next." Really, asshole? REALLY?

I'm really bitchy tonight and I don't know why. IF (and that's a big IF) I didn't know any better, I'd say AF would be showing up in the next few days (but I know better).

Good for you about insisting. I hate doing that kind of stuff. Good luck!

Originally Posted by Xerxella 

AFM - As stated above, I'm cd 9. I've been working with an RPL (Recurrent Pregnancy Loss Specialist) and she changed hospitals right before my last loss and now she's still settling in and not taking patients yet. Ugh. So, they think maybe by the end of the month or next month. I'm on the waiting list.... I think when I do get in to see her, I'll ask to be a little more aggressive with the TTC part alone. If I'm going to be losing them, I might as well get pregnant as quickly as possible to see if I can get a sticky one at some point.

I hope the RPL helps. I didn't even know such a specialist existed.

Originally Posted by Lidamama84 

AFM: Soo...all this talk of cycle days made me want to see what CD I'm on. CD 11, apparently. I don't see any signs of O coming soon, tho. Oh well. I'm planning on grabbing some Maca one of these days if I can ever get to the health food store after work. I always have two tired and hungry kids with me which doesn't make for a good trip to the store

Talking of the old days...my mom and grandma had lots of fertility problems. My grandma had my mom right after getting married, but couldn't conceive again. After lots of hounding the doctors for an explanation (this was the 50s), she found out that she would never have kids again. She recently shared with me that she contemplated committing suicide at that point, but then she couldn't because she had my mom and she thought to herself "who will take care of my Maria?" (though my grandpa was around and involved and everything, lol). My mom also had a lot of trouble conceiving. Without ever using BC, she only had 3 pregnancies in 25 years of marriage. The first ended in a MC, and my bro and I are 7 years apart. For me, the point is that not so long ago we had so few options to deal with IF, so it's great to see that things like Clomid, IUIs and IVF exist...on the other hand, I think they give a false security, that no matter how long you wait to have kids you are guaranteed to get them...it seems like its so hard to find a balance for timing your kids...

My maternal grandmother was infertile. She became a mother via adoption. I know my mother had at least one miscarriage (since I know that when she was pregnant with me, we were initially triplets but she miscarried one), but I haven't talked to her much about it. She knows about a miscarriage I had as a teen, but none of the others. And...I'm in my mid-twenties and have had multiple losses. I had my first loss in my teens. I couldn't have started much earlier, and I still have gone through this. I try to stay thankful that I'm in a place where I can have my children young and more fertile, since I don't know if having kids later in life will be an option with me given how much of a journey this has been for me younger, and be grateful that I have the beautiful children I have...and also try to be okay with that maybe this will be our family, the all of it...not to give up the dream but I sometimes feel like the more losses I have, the more desperate I feel to have a third. I want to make peace with what is, before we seek out specialists or interventions, because even after all that, who knows if we'll have another baby at the end.

Originally Posted by JustJenny 

Lidamama-  I totally forgot about Olive leaf! That stuff is awesome. I have to make a vitamin order and I think I'll add that to the list for cold/flu care to have on hand. 

Revolting- I loved the poem and your ideas. I agree its so difficult not having something tangible to honor our lost babies. Sometimes its as if they only existed in our minds. It is really hard to share those thoughts for me and I'm glad that you mentioned them :) Dh is really good about comforting me but he never had the physical experience, you know?

Devilish- What is with Doc's doing that! Its not comforting in the slightest. In fact thank you DR. for dismissing every concern I just discussed with you....

Xerxella- I think its funny how so many of our cycles are close. I think you me, Dakipode and Lidamama are all cd 9 or 10! I hope we all get good news this cycle! We're due for some bfp's!

Thank you! I totally hear you on husbands not getting the experience. I think for my husband, a lot of his experience of the miscarriage was fear for me. I hemorrhaged with my first miscarriage, but I still chose to miscarry naturally the second two times. I sometimes think his memory of fear often overshadows the grief, especially since the pregnancies were still early enough to seem really abstract despite seeing the baby pass. So, we experienced it very differently.

Originally Posted by coati456 

Hi, I would like to join. My husband and I have been TTC for almost a year now, so I could really benefit from a peaceful community. Sometimes I let myself get my hopes up and sometimes I don't. I'm a scientist, so I kind of like to think of every cycle as an experiment.

Right now, I'm on CD 27, should be the last day of my TWW. My temperature dropped this morning, so I think I'm out this cycle. At the moment, I feel okay about it. I have a doctor's appointment scheduled for November.
 

Welcome. We are cycle buddies. I am 13 dpo today.

[revolting]

We must have posted at about the same time!

Originally Posted by beingmommy 

AFM:  On CD11.  Think I actually *might* be ovulating right now (which would be neat because we managed a BD last night - yay!).  But I am so not sure.  I guess we'll see.  Last week I was telling my DH that I could not imagine another baby in our lives.  Like I literally, with my vivid imagination, could not see it.  There was just a blankness when I thought about it.  I was wondering if it was a sign that it wasn't meant to be for us.  Then I did some work around my fears of another miscarriage and had an unexpected resurgence of grief about my loss in June.  And since then it's so vivid I can almost *feel* a baby in my arms.  So strange. I am hoping it's a good sign.

I think it's a good sign, that you are moving through the grief journey and healing from the miscarriage. No matter what else happens, that's important.

[Lidamama84]

Revolting: Yeah, I know it's definitely not just age that has to do with infertility and miscarriages...sorry if it came across that way...my grandma and mom were both really young (early twenties) when they went through their fertility issues. I'm curious: what's the difference between Hunters Moon and Blood Moon?

Welcome, coatie456 I hope your stay with us is short

JuestJenny: I can't believe someone else knows about Olive Leaf!!! I started researching natural antibiotics last year after a really rough year health-wise (sinus infection, double ear infection, mastitis, C difficile) and I came across it, so when I started feeling another ear infection coming on, I took it diligently...same thing last week...it really seems to work well. That's cool that you're getting a custom order vitamin...my mom has that in a powdered formula. It looks and tastes revolting, but maybe it beats the 6 or so pills I take each day. Although, some of them are just things I'm trying to finish off. I also decided to be brave tonight and start taking my Vitex again...I did pay for it after all, and maybe the constant nausea as a side effect will be better if I take it at night...or it will help me with my weight-loss

AFM: does anyone have any recommendations what to take for fatigue. Honestly, I'm so tired ALL THE TIME that I can't even picture being pregnant, which is one of the reasons I'm happy we've put off TTC till DD2 is 2. I feel like I'm preggos I'm so tired .

[bearandotter]

"Bearandotter.... COME ON DOWN!!!"

thats right ladies. A BFP for me on CD28. Cautiously hopefully that this will be a sticky bean....

In case anyone wants the secret formula: (ha ha) I think making a Drs appointment to discuss possible reasons for not conceiving (and asking for BloodWork, sorry about the funny acronym Lidamama) last week helped (my appt is booked for tomorrow), and what truly tipped my chances was going ahead and ordering the OPKs. They arrived in the mail about 4pm today, not 15 minutes before I tested and got my BFP.

Best wishes for a peaceful, sane, and successful journey to each of you. Hope to see all of you 'on the other side' soon.

[JustJenny]

bearandotter CONGRATS! See that Magical thinking does work, lol!  Wishing you a beautiful pregnancy and birth...

Welcome coati - hope you get a bfp soon!

Lidamama- I did a candida cleanse a few years ago and olive leaf was a major part of getting me healthy. I completely forgot about it until you mentioned it.  It is an amazing antiviral and antibiotic in case anyone else is interested. Super for flu season!  What about adding ginseng for energy? I love maca - its totally balanced me out and given me energy. Hopefully it'll five me a bfp, lol. I'm on my second month of it....

[revolting]

Originally Posted by bearandotter 

"Bearandotter.... COME ON DOWN!!!"

thats right ladies. A BFP for me on CD28. Cautiously hopefully that this will be a sticky bean....

In case anyone wants the secret formula: (ha ha) I think making a Drs appointment to discuss possible reasons for not conceiving (and asking for BloodWork, sorry about the funny acronym Lidamama) last week helped (my appt is booked for tomorrow), and what truly tipped my chances was going ahead and ordering the OPKs. They arrived in the mail about 4pm today, not 15 minutes before I tested and got my BFP.

Best wishes for a peaceful, sane, and successful journey to each of you. Hope to see all of you 'on the other side' soon.

Yay! I wish you a happy, healthy pregnancy!

AFM: I took a test today. I got a BFP. Initially, I wondered if the line was too faint, but I'm pretty sure it's fine after looking at other BFP pictures for this type of test.. I'm praying for a healthy pregnancy and baby this time.

Edited by revolting - 10/17/12 at 4:56am

[GISDiva]

Yaaaay!  Congratulations BearandOtter and Revolting!

Dakipode, fingers crossed on the Clomid...Hello to Coati...and a big helping of zen for everyone else too.  :)

AFM:  Trial and error has determined that it's the prenatal vitamins are making me queasy, which they didn't do the few months previous.  I'm trying not to think about why just yet..."I'll know when I know"...9 DPO...almost there...

[beingmommy]

Congrats Bearandotter and Revolting!!!  So happy for you!  Sending sticky baby vibes!

[Xerxella]

Wow!!

Congrats Bear and Revolting!!!!! I was going to give you the name of the RPL in Chicago, but I hope you don't need her!

coati - Welcome!!! I didn't want your entrance to get lost in our good news of the day.

GisDiva - The prenatals always make me queasy, so I'm no help to you there. But, good luck. Be strong. You know a test now would just confuse the issue. (Unless it won't then just go for it! )

beingmommy - Is that early for you? CD 11 would be early for me. But, yeah, for getting in a fortuitous bd session! May it be a lucky one!!!!

dakipode, justjenny, lidamama and beingmommy too - Well we're all about the same spot in our cycle. I thought that only happened in real life!

AFM - I had a nice long talk with dh last night. We talked about our losses and how I'm still feeling alot of pain. I know he hates to see me in pain, so I try not to dwell on it, but sometimes, it feel like I'm hiding that part of myself from him then, and I don't think that's good for anyone. It was a good talk. We also talked about our plans for moving ahead. I knew we were on the same page, but it was nice to get our details aligned. So, the every other day bd-ing starts tonight on cd 10. Good luck all.