family members w/ different lifestyles - Page 2

[mumkimum]

In our family, it has helped me greatly to think about which problems with either of our parents are actually priorities for my kids/keeping our life happy and which are the weird things I should just roll my eyes about and complain to dh about later.  

I've also heaped lots of praise/thanks/compliments on both our mothers for the things I know they've found or done for the kids that have been really great or are more along the lines of what I really love most for our family.  And that has really helped in the long run - because they remember it more themselves.  And the other, questionable stuff I do disappear, and have used as a bit of teaching lesson for the kids about some of our standards ('I don't know why grandma got you these super-short shorts dd, but I think she must not have realized they'd be so small on you.  I know the longer ones are much more comfortable for tree climbing, maybe we'll pass these on to someone else, etc. . .') 

[rachelsmama]

Originally Posted by One_Girl 

It sounds like the problem may be your husband not your mom since you are mostly fine with these little things but your husband is pressuring you not to be. I would make it very clear that you are never dropping your mother from your life over things as insignificant as grapes and wet wipes and you he values your family and you enough to accept that without trying to drive a wedge between you and your mother. I am divorced and have little patience for talk against my family though so that may or may not be good advice.

The OP's husband is a parent to the child, he has a right to express his opinion about things affecting his child.  The OP isn't completely happy with the situation, and her husband isn't entirely happy with the situation, sounds like a good reason to change the situation.

[NYCVeg]

To me, the problem here is less the actual decisions--I don't think having conventional grapes once a week or getting wiped occasionally with a wet wipe will harm your son--than the fact that grandma seems to making a deliberate, concerted effort to undermine the OP's values. If the grandson was at grandma's house and he gave her the grapes or juice she had in the fridge, that wouldn't seem like a big deal to me. But going out of her way to bring the product she KNOWS mom doesn't like, when mom has the preferred product right in her home? Why on earth would anyone do this? 

I also have a mom who takes the slightest criticism as an excuse to go loco, but I still think it might be worth having a conversation. I would try not to frame it in terms of grapes or wipes or whatever. Grandma can easily dismiss each individual concern as minor. I'd be more interested in whatever underlying issues are making grandma act the way she is acting. 

[purplerose]

my mom tends to roll her eyes and comment, "it's amazing y'all survived your childhood!" yeah, bc new health/safety info never comes out these days. i try to keep all this in mind for whenever i am a grandmother.

something i have thought about...how was your mom and her mom's relationship? if your mom parented you in ways her own mother didn't agree with, she may feel you are saying she made mistakes? i raise my kids in ways my mom totally disapproves of, and if mine do the same i'm sure i will worry my kids think i was a failure...i will feel that way bc i know *why* i won't follow my mom's parenting.

it's so complicated LOL

[One_Girl]

Originally Posted by pek64 

Maybe you're confusing the mom and mother-in-law.

What does this mean? The op clearly states it is her mother she loves dearly at the beginning of the op. Maybe you should read the op.

Rachelamama: the husband is a parent with a right to express his opinion but in a later post the op talks about being willing to ignore the little things and that makes it sound like the pressure to ignore her instinct is coming from her husband. I.believe a husband or wife should love and respect their spouse enough to let go of little things that annoy them about their inlaws and not try to create conflict that makes a loved ime unhappy.

As I said though, I am divorced and value my family more than I would a spouse so I can't speak to the respect or lack thereof that should actually happen in a marriage.

[nstewart]

I think OP also mentioned that part of the issue had to due with her concerns when her DC was an infant and MIL was helping care for her DC, and that her DH is resentful that she's more forgiving (in his eyes) of her own mom than her MIL.

[pek64]

One_Girl, I think one of us is confused by the original post. What I recall is, while she said she loved her mother, it was her mother-in-law that was more supportive of her parenting choices, and the complaints were all about her mother. Maybe the OP would clear this up for us.

Whichever mother is the problem, I am concerned by the deliberate bringing of food and drink to the op's house, when what is brought is *not* what the op wants. This seems controling to me.

[pickle18]

Yes, I think it went like this...

OP's Mother:  currently the problem, OP is trying to figure out boundaries, but is also reluctant to make a fuss/upset her mother

OP's MIL:  has historically been much more supportive of OP's choices, although OP admits that when MIL was caring daily for DC, the OP would correct her on a variety of little things (and MIL would accommodate)

Basically, OP said her DH feels like she was much more critical of his mother (and more vocal about it) than she is willing to be of her own.  OP said that she was more nitpicky with MIL because DC was an infant, she felt guilty for not being there, MIL was caring for DC on a daily basis, etc. 

[One_Girl]

Originally Posted by pek64 

One_Girl, I think one of us is confused by the original post. What I recall is, while she said she loved her mother, it was her mother-in-law that was more supportive of her parenting choices, and the complaints were all about her mother. Maybe the OP would clear this up for us.
Whichever mother is the problem, I am concerned by the deliberate bringing of food and drink to the op's house, when what is brought is *not* what the op wants. This seems controling to me.

The complaints are all about her mother and some of the pressure to not let the little things go comes from her husband and that it is a big area of contention between them which is why I saw he should back off a bit and respect her relationship with her mother. I really have nooi idea what you are talking about or where the mother in law comes in at all.

If it was the op being critical of her mil I would say she should back off. I don't think what happened in the past is relevant and her dh should have taken a stand then when it mattered imo. Maybe a sit down to talk about how they will deal with little things from now on would be good.
Edited by One_Girl - 10/20/12 at 10:18am

[mammal_mama]

My main concern about all this is that I think not being able or willing to listen to other people and really hear and respect what they are saying is extremely toxic. You know, on at least one occastion, I've heard someone refer to a rape as "just a misunderstanding."

So to me, the total disregard of what a parent is saying, irregardless of whether that disregard results in severe physical or mental harm befalling the child, is just plain toxic. There's really no room for consistently ignoring the other person in a healthy relationship. Sure, we may sometimes be overwhelmed by a busy day and not pay complete attention to the story that our husband, child, or friend is telling us -- but those of us who really want to do a better job of loving the people in their lives are going to be always trying to do a better job of listening and understanding.

Someone who consistently just doesn't listen to me, doesn't love me. And they're just as likely not to listen to my child.

I should add that this is coming from someone who doesn't have a good relationship with her relatives. I do still have some contact with my mom; I take my girls to see her a few times a year, but I don't trust her to spend time alone with them. I did trust her to spend one-on-one time with dd1 several years ago; it started when dd was turning 4 and only lasted for a few months. She was saying things to dd1 to undermine my parenting, and I found out because dd1 came to me very upset about what she was saying. She also disregarded my rules about car safety, and allowed dd1 to ride on her cousin's lap in the front seat of her car one time because "it was only for a short trip."

And, yes, my own children will (and already have) undoubtedly found me deficient in many ways. I know there's no absolute guarantee that I'll have the close relationships I yearn to have with my children when they are grown, and with their spouses and children. I'm just doing my best to be a good and responsive listener now, because I suspect that Grandmas who can't listen to their adult children probably never learned to listen to them when they were children. So I'm doing my best to create relationships that just get better and stronger with time...but if I fail and end up alone, there are a whole lot of books I've never had the chance to read....

Edited by mammal_mama - 10/20/12 at 2:04pm

[LHcj2008]

OP here.  Sorry I haven't been able to reply in a while. Just to answer some questions:

Yes, the issue here is my mother, not my mother-in-law, and while I do agree that DH does get on my case from time to time about his opinion that I'm "too easy" on my mom, deep-down he has a point, and I feel like it puts me in a tough spot.  Mainly because, where my mom is concerned, I tend to feel that trying to get her to respect my ways and accommodate is pretty much pointless (it has never worked), so I've just given up over time, yet I'll complain to him, or he'll see things that he knows bugs me and wonders why I don't do something about it. As I try to explain to him, with my mom, things are not as straightforward as they are with his own mom, who is willing to bend over backwards to respect our wishes.

Someone asked about the relationship with my mom and her mom, which is a great question and a good reminder to me that I should also consider this when feeling frustrated. From the little she has told me, my grandmother, though completely invested on an emotional level in my life, apparently did not help my mom with any "stuff" when taking care of my sister and I. So, my mom often tells me that she had to pack so much to bring over to her house because grandma had nothing there for us. Material things are very important to my mom. She has told me on several occasions (out of context from the situations I am posting about) that she wants to keep things at her house and have things handy so that I don't need to feel burdened when I do bring DS over.

At her house, that's great...and I do appreciate this and where it comes from (even though, the type of person I am, I'd rather pack up all of my stuff knowing it is the stuff I am comfortable with and it is what I picked out! But that's just me). But at my house, it is irritating because I have his stuff there...so I don't see why she brings wipes, or packs her own food for him, or brings her own outfits for him to wear, other than the fact that it is, as I mentioned in a previous response, her way of making things more of HER OWN experience...doing things the way she wants so she can be happier. That is the only thing I can pinpoint as to why she does this, knowing how she is.

I would like to clarify that DH really isn't an issue here. I think the "contention" I mentioned that comes about from him getting on my case and us disagreeing about all this is that, deep-down I agree with what he's saying, but I don't know how to change things, and I get defensive because I feel stuck. Hence, why I'm posting here for suggestions.

I do think there is something to be said about not putting my mom's needs first. I do have some level of resentment towards my mom despite my love for her; it is hard to always have to accommodate her needs but not get much of it back. Yes, I am grateful she helps me, is in my son's life, but no matter what, things are and always will be on her terms and everything has to be convenient for her. As I've said, she means well, but the issue at hand is that there are things she does that makes it really difficult for me to feel that I have the authority I want over my son's wellbeing.

[LHcj2008]

Originally Posted by purplerose 

my mom tends to roll her eyes and comment, "it's amazing y'all survived your childhood!" yeah, bc new health/safety info never comes out these days. i try to keep all this in mind for whenever i am a grandmother.

I wanted to add that, the few times I have attempted to explain my line of thinking to her, for ex., why I didn't want cheap plastic toys in DS's mouth when he was a newborn, or why I don't want his mouth wiped with wipes full of chemicals, the response I've gotten is "I did this stuff with you girls and you turned out fine".

My job revolves around children with special needs. I believe there is a nature and a nurture component to everyone's future. My personal belief is that, while I can't really control the nature, I'd like t at least do what I can to make the nurture piece of my son's upbringing as safe and as ideal as I can possibly make it. I try to explain this to her too, but then she still doesn't really understand what I do for a living. Sometimes I think I sound like the teacher from a Peanuts episode to her...and I know she can't really relate to anything I say. My dad told me once something along the lines of "your mom doesn't realize that not everyone in the world isn't just like her".

[Alenushka]

Let it be. Somehow she manage to raise a child before who is good enough  to be loved and who lead green lifestyle.

She not going to be around forever and when she is gone, what will be more important to you and your child, the memories of time spent together of what wipes she used?

Lets face it, if you were seriously green, you would not have any kids period.  No among of cloth wipes or organic grapes can competent the amount of damage as far as energy consummated inflicter on the Earth by every new child.

[mammal_mama]

Originally Posted by Alenushka 

Let it be. Somehow she manage to raise a child before who is good enough  to be loved and who lead green lifestyle.

She not going to be around forever and when she is gone, what will be more important to you and your child, the memories of time spent together of what wipes she used?

Lets face it, if you were seriously green, you would not have any kids period.  No among of cloth wipes or organic grapes can competent the amount of damage as far as energy consummated inflicter on the Earth by every new child.

As far as "letting it be" -- I do agree with the OP's assessment that there probably is no point in trying to express herself to her mom. As she has already explained, her mom has never respected her way of doing things.

I do realize that many of us have grown up in environments where we weren't fully respected -- and we have still grown up to be, as you say, "good enough to be loved." I actually think each and every human being is "good enough to be loved" but this doesn't mean the OP needs to accept unacceptable behavior from her mom just because her mom is mortal.

With people who don't respect us enough to listen to us, but whom we love enough to want to keep some contact, I feel we just need to determine how much time we and/or our kids can spend around them without things becoming toxic for us or for our kids. Kind of like, you know, we need to limit our exposure to direct sunlight and tuna from polluted waters.

Because you can't talk to the sun's uv rays and get them to be less harmful, and it's pretty much the same deal with some relatives. That said, the sun gives us energy and has many wonderful qualities. We certainly couldn't live without it, and I wouldn't be alive without my mom, either. People are never all bad, and should never be dismissed as all bad. But I think there's a way to love and accept others, even those who are toxic to us, without just lying down and allowing our values to be trampled. It's basically called loving ourselves.

[pek64]

Originally Posted by Alenushka 

Let it be. Somehow she manage to raise a child before who is good enough  to be loved and who lead green lifestyle.


She not going to be around forever and when she is gone, what will be more important to you and your child, the memories of time spent together of what wipes she used?


Lets face it, if you were seriously green, you would not have any kids period.  No among of cloth wipes or organic grapes can competent the amount of damage as far as energy consummated inflicter on the Earth by every new child.

This is totally uncalled for! And way off topic!

If you're not going to offer helpful advice, don't post. Wanting her child to be unharmed by chemicals is a good thing. And has nothing to do with 'greenness'. We need members of the next generation to be dedicated to the health and well being of all and the planet. While it is possible to grow up in a household that knows nothing about 'greenness', to grow up in a wishy-washy household is less likely to care about being 'green'. In my opinion.

[Storm Bride]

OP: I've tried to respond to this thread several times, and keep deleting it. I wish you luck dealing with this. I'm afraid your post set off so many of my own triggers that it's hard for me to be clear. I will say that my grandmother didn't respect my mom's parental decisions, despite my mom reiterating them multiple times (simple things like, "I really don't like the kids drinking pop, mom - they love juice, and I can't afford it, so why not have some juice in the house for them when they come over?"). My mom maintained contact. After all, "grandparents are important", and "relationships matter more than juice vs. pop". It's her one big parenting regret. It's the one thing I truly wish she'd done differently. And, for all my grandmother's attempts to make sure we loved her most, and she was the imporant one, I greeted the news of her death (when I was 20 or 21) with "oh, good". She's been gone for well over two decades, and the only emotional I've ever managed to summon about her death is relief. Her life was tragic. Her death was a relief for everyone.

So, yeah - it's hard for me to tell how much your mom is like my grandmother...but the "mommy said no" (ie. "mommy is the one not letting you have this treat") in front of you, and then disregarding it when you're not around sounds awfully familiar. And, like others, I find the whole bringing grapes over when you have them in your fridge kind of weird.

I'm going to leave this post, just so I don't keep coming back to the thread. It's probably not very useful, as your mom may not be anything like my grandmother, but I felt the triggers go off a few times, and felt that the perspective of someone who deeply wishes that my mom had ditched that oh-so-important grandmother relationship might be valuable.

[mtiger]

I think it can be a tricky dance, between Mom and Grandma. My Mom and I came to an agreement... In MY home? My rules. In HER home? She had more leeway - especially if I wasn't there. If I was? Then it was my call. Some things were important enough for me to put my foot down. But many were not - and I was willing to give on those more often than not. It really should be a give-and-take.

[pickle18]

I agree with Storm Bride - this story definitely pressed my buttons.  And others who said her behavior is toxic.

This really seems to me to be a point where you might want to re-evaluate your relationship with your mother.  We all fall into patterns of accepting certain things about family members as adults that are no longer applicable when we have children.  It's fine for you to risk being stressed out, but it's not ok for your kid to be affected and have his/her parent disrespected, ykwim?

If she truly cannot change, I agree limiting exposure is something you may want to do.  I'm currently doing this, and it has been hard - of course, my parents are super hurt, because they really don't understand (despite years of attempts to talk to them about it).  But them not being able to understand is exactly what led to this - the refusal to recognize and alter negative patterns.  But let me tell you - it is like a breath of fresh air!!!!  AND - it makes the time we do spend together that much more valuable, special and enjoyable (or at least...less COMPLETELY frustrating!).

It is a huge shift in your relationship that occurs once you have a child.  You need a new level of respect and accommodation, and she either can or can't deal with that.
 

One last thing - I hear you saying things like "I need to remember that" etc.  I gather you've spent alot of time trying to fix things solely on your end by changing your own headspace/feelings/reactions.  It won't work.  It takes two to have a loving, healthy relationship, with give and take, and it takes two to work these things out.  You trying to learn better ways to "deal" without her working on her end is pretty hopeless.

I know the title sounds extreme, but you may want to flip through Toxic Parents - it may give you some new insights and validation.  Hugs!

[Hillary77]

I agree both with the sentiment that relationships are (most of the time) more important than being "right", and that you should be able to set some boundaries which will be respected with your Mom. Aspartame foods would definitely be worth a fight, IMO.

[Alenushka]

Imagine grandma dying tomorrow.  Meditate on it for a while. Then imagine what was important, good not good, not important.  That is something my zen teacher told me. It really clarifies things and allows one to act with compassionate boundaries.

Compromise is part of life. To only get 100 of what your want is to completely isolate your kids from any member of you family who is not like you. It has its advantages, of course