Very confused, angry, and have a lot of questions about my birth experience

[demeter888]

Warning: This post may be something a person using any type of hypnobabies would prefer to avoid. Or anyone wanting to hear a positive story. These are mainly the negative aspects of my birth story and my partial criticisms of hypnobabies.

I have questions that I need to get resolved because I just found out I am pregnant again and have seriously been considering a scheduled c-section and avoiding a midwife this time.  Some of you reading may not have time for all of it but please feel free to reply anyways.

I gave birth in Michigan at Henry Ford West Bloomfield in April 2011.

Mamas,please share any experiences you have had similar to any of the info below and any related insights.

 

I am sharing the parts of my birth that I find confusing in the hopes that others can weigh in. Admin, please let me know if you are going to move this thread to a different forum so I can follow it.

I had been station 0 for at least three weeks prior to delivering. I could feel the pressure on my cervix and it was uncomfortable but bearable.

 

I was 'due any day' when I did try nipple stimulation with the approval of a midwife the day before I went in to labor.

It was around noon the following day when I felt a strong cervical cramping.  I immediately dismissed the possibility of it being a contraction because:

1. It was painful.  It was equivalent to the worst menstrual cramp I'd ever experienced and concentrated in my cervical area (where the head was pressing down.  I was told that contractions usually start out slowly.  This one was the type 'they' used to describe active labor stage. Not possible. My first 'labor'? Not likely.

2. It was concentrated in my cervix.  I was told that contractions reverberate throughout the uterus and usually start in the rear.  Mine felt like a blender. 

3. I was not in any way sure what it was. I was told by both my doulas (YES, I had TWO!), that when I had a contraction, I would 'know' it. Um, wrong! 

4. I was told by several hypnobabies instructors that if I had pain it meant something was wrong.  Not only that, but the entire philosophy of hypnobabies is that it should be painless, so I went in to immediate denial that this could possibly be what a contraction is supposed to feel like.  (I have since become increasingly critical of hypnobabies due to this and other very serious flaws I believe it has).

Over the course of the next 5 hours, I had two more contractions the same way but just chalked it up to some strange pain, and by the third one I went ahead and took precautions by getting as deep in to hypnosis as I could and getting in to the bath. But they all felt painful and concentrated in the cervix and I did not time them but it was roughly 10-20 seconds each.  I had a lot of trouble being in deep hypnosis for hours upon hours when I wasn't even sure if I was having contractions or when the next one would occur and especially when it means something is wrong according to the hypnobabies "experts", but I tried.   The contraction under hypnosis and in the tub was still pretty painful.  In fact, it was the kind I imagined only during active labor. So, I got out of the tub and scowled.  I had had a really upbeat attitude throughout my pregnancy about my delivery and all of it came crashing down when my labor didn't meet hypnobabies convenient little formula,or anyone else's story I read or heard, for that matter. How much time I wasted on useless stuff that was not going to work one bit!

By this time, I already knew that I could not possibly bear them being spaced any closer together than they already were.

By the time my husband got home, I was grumpy and reclusive and in a lot of denial.  You see, hypnobabies works only with denial; you are supposed to deny anything negative or painful and avoid people who wouold even dare to share something less than positive. As a result, I threw out my olamaze training and I also missed out on the important lesson my mom had to give me about her own painful birthing experience.  

We called the midwife, I described what was going on and by that time I had had my fourth 'pain' (I was not yet calling it a contraction or BIRTH WAVE), she said I might be in early labor and not to come in, she was very confident.  Mind you, this was her telling my husband; I was too upset to even talk to her. Not more than 30 minutes later, I screamed through another (wave of pain) to my husband to 'call her back!'  This time she heard me in the background and said to come in.  My husband ran all the traffic lights to get us there.

I then started having contractions about 15 minutes apart.  And, here is when I learned something my doulas and hypnobabies had told me NOT to do:

moving around as much as possible During my contraction, and 'fighting it' actually decreased the pain by about 60%.

ALL the books I read said to relax as much as possible during difficult contractions but to remain active in early labor.  Yet another harmful bit of advice that, had i known the truth, would not have been nearly as terrified and things would not have escalated as they did.

I had to be in a wheelchair to get into the hospital and had only had 6 or so contractions up to that point over a course of about 6 or 7 hours.  When they told me I was 6cm dilated (about 30 minutes after checking in), only then, I finally accepted that I was in labor. I was absolutely certain I wanted pain medications and I had no regard at that point for anything except pain relief. I fact, that is why I had gone there; I did not believe my baby was on his way, though I was crawling around screaming in the intake wared.

And here was another very annoying thing: I had to ARGUE for about half an hour with the midwife AND my husband before she ordered an epi.  I never asked for a drug-free childbirth, only to not offer drugs unless I asked for them. For these people to argue with me about it made me feel unsupported and let me make something clear: that is really no better than telling someone they need pain relief drugs when they don't feel like they do.  I did not ask for a natural birth. I asked to not be offered something; arguing with me is rather the opposite of what I want during times like that! Grrr!

I got my epi probably around 7-8cm and told I could push within an hour or so after that.  The epi did reduce the pain almost entirely but by this time I was so disappointed and nervous that my birth didn't go the way hypnobabies said it would that I had a whole other set of concerns.  Primarily, I did not feel like pushing, but when I did push per the doulas instruction, ,the baby's heart rate dropped and stayed down for several minutes.  So they told me to stop pushing, and kind of farted around not sure what to do, so by the time I really DID feel like pushing sort of, which was a few hours later, I was told NOT to push until the midwife got a 2nd opinion.  And most of you know who that 2nd opinion is coming from.  I wss threatened with a c-section a few times, but my midwife 'fought' for me, I guess.

Let me cut to the chase: I pushed intermittently for 5 very long hours before they suddenly decided I needed an 'emergency' epesiotomy because the baby's heart rate was still staying low for too long after pushing.  I was in labor about 24 hours from the first contraction.  I had even at one point said I would prefer a C-section to an epesiotomy in my birth plan, but later retracted that because I wasn't sure.  Now I wonder...but I am sure experiences and opinions might vary.

I could feel them stitching me up afterwards, and whinced through every stitch.  By the time I pushed out the placenta, it was just pure exhaustion and horror, and yes, it took effort and I won't even talk about my lady bits because that's another therapy session.  The menstrual cramping of my uterus shrinking afterwards was so painful I was in tears by the time I was given any pain medication.

There is an important part of this I am leaving out because I consider it somehow exclusive from this story: I gave my son life, and he gave me life, and he is the most wonderful miracle I have ever had the joy and privilege of knowing.  His apgars were 9/9 due to his not crying long enough (which is good!). He took to my nipple with gusto, Etc.  I have shared his story many times before, but sharing the rest of this is just too overwhelming to switch up my emotions to him.

No, my son is now almost 2 and I have been too angry to even talk about my disappointment.  But, now that I am pregnant again I have to.  I need to resolve things and find care soon.

Basically, I might be in the wrong place to ask this, but I would like to know if anyone has had a similar experience or is glad they scheduled a c-section. 

One tip I have is that people should ask their own mothers about their birthing experiences.  My mom had me completely natural and said she would have done an epi in a heartbeat of she had known how painful it would be!  Is it possible that we both just have extremely low pain threshholds? That would explain a lot.

I probably have lost any hope in doing a natural birth but I think for most people (on this website, at least) it does seem to be the best option.  What went wrong in my case, why were my contractions so odd?

Please share any experiences you have had similar to any of the above and any related insights.

[oliversmommy329]

I'm really sorry your birth did not go the way you expected. I'm glad you got a beautiful baby in the end but I know it can be really hard when things go not go to plan.

I had a very different birth experience but my Hypnobabies experience was much the same. When it came down to the day of and contractions started I convinced myself that I was not in labor at all because it was painful. Once my water broke and I realized what was happening I shut Hypnobabies off.It did nothing for me and I found the voice on yhe tracks grating. It also alleviated the pain quite a bit to move around during contractions. I really believe now it just wasn't for me.

After my son's birth I truly felt I had done a disservice to myself by not allowing myself to prepare for the pain of labor. I also did not prepare for how different it would be than the birth I imagined. For my next birth I may use Hypnobabies again but only for the relaxation techniques that were helpful to me during pregnancy. I will definitely use it in conjunction with other pain coping techniques.

Now that you know what labor was like for you why not gear your preparation towards that experience instead of opting for a planned cesarean? You have done this before. Second babies are often easier and faster. You can do it again. I see no shame in getting an epidural if you need one. Why not prepare yourself for that type of birth?

I agree with looking to your family for an idea of how birth will be. My mother had an emergency c-section with me due to placental abruption. She had elective cesareans with my siblings. However both of my grandmothers had labors that were very similar to mine. It would have been nice to know.

[zapzipzee]

I am curious about this to.  I have a very similiar experience when DD was born.  She is now 2 also.  

We planned an Unassisted Birth.  I woke at 2:03am, got up to use the restroom, and with my first step my legs buckled beneath me, and my back felt like it just went out.  I could not move.  DH had to pick me up off the floor.  Finally it ended, and it was like nothing had happened until I felt the second one.  Exactly like the first.  I couldn't move.  My back felt like I was being crushed, or stabbed, or something.  I had made it to the bathroom and was on the toilet for the second.  I noticed my mucos plug was coming out, and knew then that this was labor.  I had heard toilet contractions were terrible, so just chalked the second one up to it being a toilet contraction.  Once it was over, I sat there for a few minutes. Then got up, washed my hands and decided to to back to bed.  I didn't even make it to the bed.  We were planning a waterbirth, and DH filled the very small tub for me while he started setting up the pool in the living room.  We figured with contractions starting that intense (that word doesn't even begin to describe it), the baby must be coming fast.  I sat in the tub sideways and pressed my back against the side.  It only minimally helped.

I did not do hypno babies, but researched a great deal, and everything I had read said that as long as I trusted my instincts and didn't feel observed, monitored, or watched, I could relax and have a relatively painless birthing experience.  I never once felt like something was wrong though - maybe because nothing I read or studied indicated that pain meant wrong?

DH finally got the pool up and a few inches of water in it... I moved to that.  We kept turning the water on full hot and the only thing that helped was directing scalding hot water on my back.  This put the pain at the skin level, rather than the deeper level I was feeling it during the contractions.  They were still unbearable.  At one point, DH told me to be quiet.  THAT did not go over well at all. Him sleeping on the couch, and me in terrible pain with each contraction.

I had previously made him promise not to let me go to the hospital because it hurt.  Ten hours into it, he decided he couldn't take it any longer and we drove an hour to the hospital (it was bad traffic, and he "knew" back roads - he worked for the ambulance service as a paramedic, so I trusted that he knew the back roads).  He got lost, and I finally got the GPS out and got us there within 15 minutes of using it.  The contractions were no different in the car.  Still terrible, but no worse than at home.

At check in, they missed three IV's and refused to let DH do it.  I really wish I had insisted.  He doesn't miss.  They insisted on checking me multiple times, even though I said I didn't want to be, they said they couldn't check me in without knowing where I was.  Probably an hour after arriving I finally got the epidural.  I had a contraction during it, but never felt another.  I was told I had to remain flat on my back or the epidural would not work.  I had vomitted dinner earlier that morning, and was starving.  I was told I could not eat or drink, with no explanation, and was put on continuous monotoring, and had a ultrasound forced on me (I am against them - whole nother story).  They did not believe me that I was 40 weeks 5 days.  Their ultrasound said I was barely 37 weeks and the baby was tiny.  That was the first time I was worried.  I started freaking out that something was wrong... they insisted baby looked good though.  

I guess I stopped progressing, and was told I either needed pitocin or would be having a c-section.  I agreed to the pitocin out of fear of c-section.... then they decided I needed internal monotoring to make sure the pitocin was working.  Then I was told I had a fever and needed antibiotics.  I knew not to mess around with hospital infections.... and for how many times they'd checked me, I didn't want to risk it.  I agreed.  At 8pm, I felt pressure.  The nurse checked me once again, removed the catheter and asked how I wanted to push.  I said I had planned to just go with what felt right.... at that time, the doctor came in, put my feet in the straps, and started poking her fingers in me.  I had a mirror, and remember thinking how thankful I was for the epidural not to be feeling that because that in itself would be extremely painful!  I pushed for 2 hours on my back before DD was born.  

Shortly after starting to push, I told them that her feet kept coming up over my ribs each time I pushed and it was very painful.  I asked to change positions.  I was ignored and told to keep my hands off my stomach.  I repeated started pushing on her feet with my hands during every contraction because it was so painful.  The doctor decided that meant she was stuck and made DH push up on my back every time I pushed.  I repeatedly asked to change positions, and the doctor acted like I hadn't said a word.  She just told me not to push on my stomach with my hands.  Finally she started crowning, and I felt tearing.  I stopped pushing and told the doctor it was hurting at the front.  She said yes, and to keep pushing, and kept sticking her fingers in there at the sides of DD's head.  Never once did she try to support the tissue to keep me from tearing.

I had asked that the cord not be cut until the placenta was delivered, and if something was wrong with the baby, for it not to be cut until it had stopped pulsating.  DD was placed on my chest, covered in the roughest blankets ever and rubbed raw by the nurse.  She was screaming and I just kept trying to comfort her while the nurse continued to rub her with this awful scratchy blanket.  Suddenly the doctor stood, said the cord had stopped, clamped it and asked DH if he was cutting.  He said no, thinking he was to cut after the placenta was out.  she wacked away at the cord.

I felt all the stitches too.  The  doctor insisted I wasn't feeling them, but I was.  DD was given apgars of 9 and 9.  They weighed her and were all shocked that she was 8lbs 7oz and 21" long.  They were all so sure she was going to be tiny like the ultrasound had said.  

Family came in and held her, then were told they had to leave since it was so late (midnight).  She was given a bath (I did want this, so she wasn't handled with gloves on, I felt skin contact was more important), by a NICU person, in room.  I didn't get to watch, as it had been too long since my bladder had emptied, and I was forced to the bathroom.  Then she was taken to the NICU for her first round of antibotics.  I said I wanted to wait until we'd had a chance to nurse, but they said she'd be fine and they couldn't wait.  When she finally came back, we were moved to post partum, someone brought me a dried up sandwich.  DH ate it because every time I looked at it I wanted to puke.  I had asked for cream of wheat, with no salt, and some OJ.  DD slept, and I couldn't get her to nurse.  DH was suddenly very sick (the nurse had a bad cold and he probably got it from the stress), and decided to go home to sleep.  A nurse came in and told me I was trying to get DD to nurse all wrong (After two years breastfeeding, I now know I was doing it right, she was wrong).  We were still unsuccessful.  She pushed on my stomach, which was incredibly painful, telling me it was to make sure my uterus was contracting.  She told me DD had to stay in the bassinet for the night.  I wanted so badly to hold and cuddle my new baby, and here I wasn't allowed to.  I felt very much alone.

I was "checked" on several times throughtout the next four hours, every time I fell asleep.  A new OB came in around 8, and told me that I hadn't had a fever (it was a side effect from the epidural) and was releasing me if I wanted to go home, but the pediatrician on call would have to release DD.  I called DH and told him to make sure the infant seat was installed, and to bring me clothes as I was being released.  He said his parents were coming up and he'd just get there when they did.  This made me feel very alone also.

Several times nurses came in and did things to DD, and I was bombarded with other nurses asking me questions.  Her heel was repeatedly sliced open, without me there to comfort her.  She had this bag to catch urine, that kept filling with bowel movements.  It tore open her poor sensitive skin.  She still slept, except when the bag was changed or heel sliced.  I still couldn't get her to nurse.  During the hearing test, she started gagging, I just picked her up and rolled her to her tummy in my hand and she was fine.  A nurse happend to be coming in at the time, took her from me and started suctioning her.  She drew blood.  I was so angry and helpless.  No one would ask my permission before they did anything.  They just did it and ignored me.  

Finally the pedatrician came in said she wasn't releasing DD until her blood cultures came in.  I told her we would bring her back for her antibotic treatmetns, and she would let us.  She then acted like maybe if I okayed the Vit. K injection.  I said there wasn't any reason.  then she insisted that DD was extremely bruised up and really needed it.  I said she could have the oral version.  The ped said it doesn't work, she needs the injection, indicating we could go home if I allowed it.  After it was given, I asked the next nurse in if she thought DD was bruised up and she said not at all.  By then I was livid and just wanted to get away from these people.  DH didn't get there until 1pm with his parents.They had gone shopping on their way up!  That night, I told  the nurses I wasn't staying one more night, I couldn't go three nights with no sleep, so we were moved to Pediatrics.  Pediatrics was much better.  We weren't distrubed... but I guess you're not allowed to walk baby outside of your room....  A lactation consultant came in the following morning because I had asked for a pump and syringe to feed DD with because I still hadn't gotten her to nurse, and my nipples were killing me.  She checked DD's suck and said it was really powerful.  She helped me get a proper latch and gave me some nursing shields to use while she nursed.

Finally at 11am DD's blood cultures came back clear, but for some reason the pediatrician would release her until she'd had the fourth round of antibotics, so we had to stay until 1 when those were finished.

The guy who put us in the car wasn't happy we hadn't had the carseat install inspected (It was installed correctly, carseat safety is a big deal to me) and incorrectly told us how to "lock" the carseat into it's base.

Finally home, I laid with DD on my chest and slept.  My mom came and stayed that weekend because DH wanted to go to a football game with his dad.  That irritated me, because he had to work the following for days before he'd be home for anything besides sleeping.

This is the first time I've been able to write/talk about her birth without becoming so angry/frustrated/disappointed that I haven't cried.  I hope this helps you some.  It is terribly hard.

This has made me stronger.  I do not let anyone push me into anything I dont want anymore.  I used to be a very "go with the flow" person.  MIL is very controlling and manipulative, and it has helped me to realize that and I'm making efforts to put a stop to that... she and DH are having a hard time with me not letting her push me around.  He sides with his mother on everything, so it causes alot of fights with DH and I.

I'm 24 weeks pregnant.  I'm doing hypno babies.  I dont think it will work with contractions like I had with DD... but it may allow me to tune out any negativity and stay home.  I will not go to the hospital unless one of us is dieing, and I'm hoping it will allow me to atleast appear calm, so no one will suggest the hospital.  We have a midwife because I had a virus in early pregnancy that could have been bad for the baby.  I'm not sure if I'll keep her.  I want to UC.  My mom was at DD's birth, and saw everything, but didn't think it was her place to say anyting to the doctor, so she didn't.  She had 7hr, easy, natural, births with both my sister and I in the 80's.  She wasn't supportive of UC with DD, but is this time.  DH wants the midwife.  I'm measuring way ahead and she suspects twins, so we'll see what happens.

I encourage you to find a provider you like and trust, and remember why you wanted a birth with a midwife in the first place.  Be true to yourself... dont just have a c-section to avoid how you were treated....

[Alenushka]

Well, I would not jump into C-section until you explore other alternatives. For examaple, show up int he hospital early and get an epidural while you are still in not too mcuh pain.

I did it with my second child and I had an awesome experience.

[tinifry]

I don't really have a similar experience but I was drawn to your story since I'm pregnant with my second baby too and decided to do hypnobirthing this time - only to read to book and discover it was totally NOT for me. My first labor was long, painful and stressful and I knew right away no matter how relaxed I get this time my contractions are still gonna hurt like hell. Also, all of the things that got me through the first labor seemed to be dismissed in hypnobirthing like moving around (laying down was extremely painful for me during labor ) and distractions. I had a natural birth with my daughter at the hospital despite a lot of struggling with the nurses, etc. I did Bradley but I don't think it really helped that much, in fact most of the women in my class ended up getting epidurals (like 80%).

I really believe it boils down to motivation. I wanted a natural birth no matter what and during my labor the thought of asking for pain meds never even crossed my mind. Of course I did get to a point where I told myself if they gave me a c-section, I would be glad! And I had been terrified of the thought of getting a c-section. My advice to you is to do what works for you, but do your research! Know what can possibly go wrong with a c-section and how it can affect the baby, etc. This way you won't have any regrets if things don't turn out ideally. If you decide that's what you feel most comfortable with then it may be the right thing to do. Of course, I also believe that every birth is different and this one might end up being much easier/faster for you, so keep that in mind also. 

If you do decide to try to do it naturally again I would suggest the book Active Birth by Janet Balaskas. It encourages moving during labor and is pretty much the opposite of hypnobirthing but it really worked for me. Also the book Birthing from Within, which helps you to prepare yourself mentally for labor pain and recover from past birth trauma. Whatever you choose, I think you should spend time reading birth stories and talking to other moms and try to recover from any lingering feelings/regrets from your last birth. 

[demeter888]

Hi Oliversmommy,

Thanks for your reply and thoughts.  I think we both know that there is probably no easy way for most of us to bring life in to the world, despite what some might have us believe. I am surprised women who have already given birth before actually buy into hypnobirthing at all for the 2nd baby; I can never do that now but I do see a point in having a more positive outlook about my options (thank you).  It feels good to be heard.

I am pretty nervous this time around.  After what the birth process did to my body, I need to really find more people who have scheduled c-sections (not emergency ones) to understand the pros and cons of it.  I do not want to be insensitive towards those who had c-sections and found it as bad as what I had to go through or worse, as I am sure they are out there (like my SIL).

The main consideration with that is not wanting to keep my husband off work to help me while I recover.  We would have to get his parents here to help me and that would kill me.

I too used the hypnobabies to relieve severe hemorrhoid pain both before and after delivery, and it worked like a charm.  Didn't work at all for my contractions, tho!  I am still very angry about it, feel I was duped, and will never try to cope through anything again by ignoring important information from people even tho it might not be pleasant.

[Sudonk]

I’m so sorry you had such a traumatic and difficult first birth.  It sounds like you did an absolutely amazing job handling an experience that was very different than you expected, and that takes courage and strength.  My hat is off to you.  I hope that you are able to address your fears and concerns and find a way to approach your next birth in a manner that is perfect for you.

I had a very challenging first birth and went on to have two wonderful births, after learning different childbirth hypnosis programs.  Because of my experiences with different programs, I would like to address some of what you were taught about birth and ask a few questions for clarification.  First of all, what program did you learn, and did you have a complete set of the official materials for that program?  Because you call it Hypnobabies, but what you’re saying you learned from it is almost all the exact opposite of what Hypnobabies teaches, so I have a feeling you were either using a different program or were given incomplete or incorrect materials by someone.  The main thing that stands out to me is the same problem I had with my first birth using childbirth hypnosis – being discouraged to move.  That was the problem I had using HypnoBirthing for my first birth. I developed extremely challenging complications during my first birth specifically because I had been taught in HypnoBirthing that if I relaxed “enough” I would be comfortable and my birth would go smoothly.  During my birth, I found I could remain comfortable only curled up in bed with my eyes closed, but I needed to move to bring my baby down.  Staying in bed is what led to the complications.  I wound up putting my baby and myself at risk because of my inability to move as my body needed.  After my birth, my HypnoBirthing instructor had the gall to asked me what I thought I had done wrong with my relaxation to “cause” my complications. (Grrrr)  She wasn’t being mean, she just honestly had no comprehension of the role movement plays in so many births.

With my second pregnancy, I chose to learn Hypnobabies specifically because it was the only program I could find that teaches the importance of following the body’s instincts and moving freely while using self-hypnosis.  My favorite part of it was the Eyes Open Childbirth Hypnosis skill which taught me to go deeply into hypnosis, get all those great feel-good hormones flowing, and them go into a state that allowed me to stay relaxed and in hypnosis and move freely.   That is really the backbone of Hypnobabies, and is the reason it makes a difference in so many women’s births.  Since you clearly didn’t learn that, it makes me think that you either learned a different class entirely, or were given incomplete materials and supported by people who were passing themselves off as Hypnobabies doulas, but didn’t actually have any training or understanding of the program.  I can’t imagine an actual Hypnobabies instructor or doula discouraging movement, when the skill that allows movement is such an important part of the program.  Then there is also the different philosophy you mentioned about learning that birth “should be painless”.  I don’t doubt that you were taught that, because I learned the same thing during my HypnoBirthing class.  The instructor was very clear about that, and made it clear that since I had a difficult birth I must have done something “wrong”.  But that is not what Hypnobabies teaches at all, which again makes me think you were given another program or someone else’s altered version of the materials.  Hypnobabies is very clear in the materials that it does not guarantee a painless birth.  It teaches that birth doesn’t need to be inherently painful and the combination of good birth information and self-hypnosis skills can make it easier and more comfortable in many circumstances. 

As you discovered, movement is GREAT for birth.  If you decide to have a vaginal birth, I want you to know that it is possible to have a far better birth the second time around.  Your first experience doesn’t guarantee you a similar second experience.  My second and third births were wildly better, thanks to my ability to trust my body and my instincts as I moved easily.  I also encourage you to read books like Active Birth (which is on the Hypnobabies “recommended reading” list, so clearly movement isn’t discouraged as your doulas said) and find out ways that movement and following your instincts can make it easier to work with your body.  It sounds like your body does a wonderful job of birthing, and I hope you find the preparation and support you need to have a great birth in whatever way is right for you.

[demeter888]

Hi Zipzapzee,

"I could relax and have a relatively painless birthing experience"

That is a great attitude.  In hypnobirthing it's more like should.  I read every word of your post, and you strike me as an incredibly strong and intelligent woman.  I have read my post and yours a few times and it's therapeutic.  It makes me wish I could have been your advocate at the hospital, and very angry on your behalf.  You had so many things go wrong that I now look back on and am so grateful for not having had to deal with. Possibly because I planned a hospital birth and researched the hospital's reputation very very carefully and was luck to have it close by, the staff was very respectful of our wishes once my son was born, such as allowing me to bathe him the first tume and not cutting the cord until I birthed the placenta.   I definitely feel that women who come in after unsuccessfully trying to have a home birth and women like myself who had a hypnobabies birth plan posted outside their hospital room are met with hostility by many in the medical profession.  My questions about moving during labor were also completely ignored.  I kind of got myself in to that pickle by asking that staff not share distressing information with me (unless I asked).  Human beings can be very stupid.  And, that is when my doula (whom I do not recommend) was supposed to go to bat for me.  I finally kept asking the same question until one of the OB's snapped at me.  Nobody said anything back to her about her tone.  It was one of the reasons I had originally considered a home birth in the first place.  

To this day, I am still searching for answers about those horrible contractions.

I totally related to your experiences with DH in so many ways, but if he had gone to a game I would have (I deleted that last part due to its graphic violence).  I really hope you have a good support system in your friends and other family members, to keep you strong when he and/or your MIL don't give you the support and attention you deserve.  For my DH to take anyone's side but mine is by definition not a husband to me.  He knows I simply won't tolerate it.  But then, I come from an abused background and am a fighter, rarely laid back;it has its own pitfalls.  Do feel free to PM me any time and thank you for relating your story.

[fruitfulmomma]

Not sure I have much to offer you, but having birthed 6 times (plus laboring with a late 1st trimester loss) it makes me that you were told...

4. I was told by several hypnobabies instructors that if I had pain it meant something was wrong.

And, here is when I learned something my doulas and hypnobabies had told me NOT to do:

moving around as much as possible During my contraction, and 'fighting it' actually decreased the pain by about 60%.

Birth is painful. It just is. Yes, there may be some women who can have easy births, but that doesn't mean if you don't that there was something wrong - with you or your baby or your labor - or that you did something wrong or didn't believe enough/have enough faith or whatever.

I went through Bradley classes with my oldest and they were good prep but that whole laying down and relaxing away the pain doesn't work for me. I have to be active in labor. Janet Balaskas wrote Active Birth. It is an older title, but a good one.

I am thinking of a story I read in Spiritually Midwifery, I believe, about Ina May and her sister talking about their births. If I can find it I will try to come back and post it for you.

[demeter888]

Sudonk,

"Because you call it Hypnobabies, but what you’re saying you learned from it is almost all the exact opposite of what Hypnobabies teaches, so I have a feeling you were either using a different program or were given incomplete or incorrect materials by someone. "

I purchased the complete set in 2011 off the hypnobabies website and ready every piece of the literature twice and followed every course as recommended.  I also hired a doula who took the hypnobabies doula training course and participated in several of my sessions along with my husband.

If you believe something is 'wrong' with you physically, hypnobabies and deep hypnosis while moving simply stops working because you lose faith in it.  It was either I was wrong or the program was wrog, and I think it was the program.  I blame hypnobabies for making me afraid because I was told by hypnobabies how my birthing waves are supposed to feel, had me convinced that they were going to feel OK, and then they didn't.  When you don't feel the way you have allowed somebody else to convince you are supposed to feel, it feels 'wrong', alarming, scary, etc.  And I have heard countless people who said that hypnobabies didn't work for them get told that it's because something was 'wrong'.  Unless you care to debate this, I don't feel like citing references.

If you have not yet encountered that mentality, please do a bit more research. It might not come directly from hypnobabies, but it was something they nonetheless shoujld hav e prepared me for or warned me about and didn't.

Pain is much scarier when you are convinced you are supposed to feel any and that it's wrong to.

"My favorite part of it was the Eyes Open Childbirth Hypnosis skill which taught me to go deeply into hypnosis, get all those great feel-good hormones flowing, and them go into a state that allowed me to stay relaxed and in hypnosis and move freely.   That is really the backbone of Hypnobabies, and is the reason it makes a difference in so many women’s births.  Since you clearly didn’t learn that,"

You have gall to say that, too.  I really think you need to stop assuming what I did and did not learn.  I learned The eye open technique and practicfed it quite a bit.  It did not work.  The premise is flawed.  If you are already  in a state of fear, going in to hynosis will not necessarily work. Especially when you are beginning to have serious doubts about a program that told you something to believe that you simply can't because it's wrong.  There IS going to be pain sometimes, period.  The premise of it is deeply flawed.  It did not prepare me for what I experienced and it was supposed to.

[fergie830]

I'm really so sorry you had a difficult experience.  Have you considered speaking with a therapist about your experience?  I know this can help many women who have had a challenging birth prepare to give birth again. 

When I took Hypnobabies class, I remember them saying the very first week that Hypnobabies does not promise a pain-free birth.  They said that many factors can affect a women's experience, but that practicing and using the techniques during the birth has led many women to experience an easier and more comfortable birth, sometimes pain free. 

I'm also confused about what you said about not moving around.  In class we learned about "CENTER" switch which allows moms to move as much as they want. I have heard similar complaints though about different hypnosis for birth programs. 

My experience with Hypnobabies has been really positive and I'm very sorry yours wasn't. The good news is you've already had a vaginal birth, which is so awesome because second births are often much shorter and easier!  I hope that is the case for you!!

[demeter888]

I have been getting messages that my posts are on hold, and I can't do anything about it but wait. So I am going to post this last post until I see some more  moderation efforts have been made in this thread.

I want to clarify some things about hypnoabies because I didn't explain it clearly.

There was no class I attended like others may have; just online exchanges with instructors and followers and the course I bought to listen to and read.  They sold it to me that way.  If a class is required then they shouldn't have sold it to me as a home course. But they wanted my money.  They are an industry just like any other who is profit dirven and all the good intentions surrounding it doesn't change that.

Every story I ever read about a person having no luck with hypnobabies took away a clear impression that if you experience things radically different from what your hypnosis is telling you to feel, something is potentially wrong in your body or you are doing something wrong.  I did not expect a pain free experience, but hoped for tools I could use for whatever came.  Hypnobabies had me expecting warm fuzzies because I was new to childbirth and that's what they told me I would feel.  Once I doubted that basic idea, it was hard to focus on the rest of it.  Those tools were useless to me and in fact created more panic because of the aforementioned issue with believing something is wrong if you don't feel XYZ.  I don't believe this kind of hypnosis works for me and many others and many of us are too pressured or embarrassed (or SOME people imply we didn't actually study!) to come out and say it.

There is no way I would ever condone a woman not preparing for something hypnobabies did not tell her to feel, and hypnobabies prevents that from being an option because they discourage you from even considering other methods of preparation for birth in conjunction with hypnobabies.  They want to assume all responsibility for my psychological wellbeing and yet failed from jumpstreet wyhen my brain and body dared to disagree with their interpretation of a birth wave. That is why I put responsibility on them for what happened and regret my choice to use it at all.

On movement, I read many books about laboring, many of the ones recommended here included. None of them said to fight a contraction; they all said to try to relax your body during the contraction or brace yourself. The only movement mentioned is when you don't have a contraction and to move when NOLT in a contraction.  That was not when I needed to be moving.  I needed to phsycially squirm in order to reduce the intensity of my contraction.  It might have slowed things down a bit, but, GOOD!  Nobody told me how to reduce the power of a contraction; anyone who has super fast intense labors can see how unfortunate that all the teachings tend to leave them out (and consider them lucky to boot).

For these above reasons and a few others, I think Hypnobabies is an absolutist, exclusive,and excluding method that I highly suspect does more harm than good in enough cases that it warranted my speaking about it in a public forum.  And I have done enough homework to have that opinion and how many babies I have given birth to doesn't make a difference. All it took was one. 

[eabbmom]

Being in a birthing frame of mind that tells you that if you feel pain something is wrong is dangerous And scary if pain happens. I can see how thiscould cause anxiety and feeling loss of control way too early in birth and how confusing it must have felt and feeling that you were doing wrong. What helped me the most with my birth trauma was seeing a birth story listener. I met with Pam England. She also does phone sessions. She has helped me see what I want for my next birth, love myself if it happens differently all without the judgment that exists in the birth world. I recommend seeing if she can guide you to a decision you will be satisfied with. Much love on your journey.

[fruitfulmomma]

The only movement mentioned is when you don't have a contraction and to move when NOLT in a contraction.  That was not when I needed to be moving.  I needed to phsycially squirm in order to reduce the intensity of my contraction. 

Weird. Not sure if you read Active Birth, it has been a long time so I might be remembering it wrong cause I don't remember anything like that, but yeah the only time I need to move during labor is during the contraction. Movement is the only thing that makes them bearable. I hated the tub in my room in my last birth (1st planned hospital birth) because it was far too thin to be moving about. Between contractions I rest.

[IdentityCrisisMama]

Hi, Mama 

I am a moderator and I approved a bunch of your posts. Post from new members get held for moderation for spam prevention, which is usually not a big deal but a big bummer if you want to have an active conversation and are feeling open about talking about your birth. I'll try to validate your posts quickly. 

I also waited until I was pregnant again to really think about my first birth - so long that my old midwives were retired. I can relate to wanting more understanding now that you're pregnant with your second baby. I hope you find some more information about your birth, especially your unusual contractions. 

[demeter888]

Originally Posted by Alenushka 

Well, I would not jump into C-section until you explore other alternatives. For examaple, show up int he hospital early and get an epidural while you are still in not too mcuh pain.

I did it with my second child and I had an awesome experience.

Hi, I actually would have done that if I had known I was in labor and that those pains would just keep comijng, but I am glad it worked for you and will see if it's an option this time around.

[demeter888]

I'm 24 weeks pregnant.  I'm doing hypno babies.  I dont think it will work with contractions like I had with DD... but it may allow me to tune out any negativity and stay home.  I will not go to the hospital unless one of us is dieing, and I'm hoping it will allow me to atleast appear calm, so no one will suggest the hospital.  We have a midwife because I had a virus in early pregnancy that could have been bad for the baby.  I'm not sure if I'll keep her.  I want to UC.  My mom was at DD's birth, and saw everything, but didn't think it was her place to say anyting to the doctor, so she didn't.  She had 7hr, easy, natural, births with both my sister and I in the 80's.  She wasn't supportive of UC with DD, but is this time.  DH wants the midwife.  I'm measuring way ahead and she suspects twins, so we'll see what happens.

I encourage you to find a provider you like and trust, and remember why you wanted a birth with a midwife in the first place.  Be true to yourself... dont just have a c-section to avoid how you were treated....

Hi again,

I just wanted to say that you and I have a very good chance of experiencing things completely different from what we did the first go round.  Since you are already aware of the possibilities and will thereofre have a different approach to Hypnobabies than a first-timer would, you have a much higher chance of success.  And if that doesn't work, please read the active birth book like I have been meaning to do.  I am actually considering after sharing my story and hearing everyone else's the possibility of using music and dance to get thru contractions and embrace the pain if it comes.  However if they are like last time that's going out the window.

Can I make one suggestion, tho?  Find a team that works in a hospital you can tolerate and will be accepting of you if you come in during active labor and is aware of and supports your home birth choice.  Or, hire a doula who has a lot of in hospital experience that can go to bat for you in a hospital where they know the nurses and docs, in the event that you DO go to the hospital and have her been on call.  Like I said, if you have these two tools and a different hospital planned in advance, you can at least get your foot in the door with much less prejudice against you hopefully.  You aren't going to need it anyways, but it might make you feel better if it's in place just in case.  

[demeter888]

I went through Bradley classes with my oldest and they were good prep but that whole laying down and relaxing away the pain doesn't work for me. I have to be active in labor. Janet Balaskas wrote Active Birth. It is an older title, but a good one.

I am thinking of a story I read in Spiritually Midwifery, I believe, about Ina May and her sister talking about their births. If I can find it I will try to come back and post it for you.

I don't believe I did read active birth once I started honing on hypnobabies I avoided books like this (thanks again to them!), but I will this time around and thank you and sudonk for the remider.  I did read an Ina May book with tons of birthing stories but never finished it.  I just didn't find it believable because it seemed to only filter the relatively positive stories from what I read.  I think at this point I just want the tools and will go directly for the active labor book!

And, yes, I'll plan for an epidural if needed.  Or something.  I don't know.  But thank you.

[demeter888]

Originally Posted by fergie830 

I'm really so sorry you had a difficult experience.  Have you considered speaking with a therapist about your experience?  I know this can help many women who have had a challenging birth prepare to give birth again. 

When I took Hypnobabies class, I remember them saying the very first week that Hypnobabies does not promise a pain-free birth.  They said that many factors can affect a women's experience, but that practicing and using the techniques during the birth has led many women to experience an easier and more comfortable birth, sometimes pain free. 

I'm also confused about what you said about not moving around.  In class we learned about "CENTER" switch which allows moms to move as much as they want. I have heard similar complaints though about different hypnosis for birth programs. 

My experience with Hypnobabies has been really positive and I'm very sorry yours wasn't. The good news is you've already had a vaginal birth, which is so awesome because second births are often much shorter and easier!  I hope that is the case for you!!

Hi Fergie,  I already feel better having shared my story and getting so much response back!  

As for the hypnobabies thing, yes, I seem to recall them talking about a no pain free guarantee.  Then, I spent hour after hour after hour programming myself to not expect pain and avoiding tools to deal with pain because that is how they programmed me.  And then I experienced dreadful pain: scary.  And then I reflected back on what others like myself are told, and then I formed my opinion.

Please do read my wording carefully because it seems to confuse people: nobody recommended moving around during an intense contraction, nor was it ever suggested I do so.  In fact, I vaguely recall that the actual cd I used for active labor didn't even use center switch, merely suggesting it's not expected or needed because of hypnosis. It is implied several times that this is for things like car rides and when communication is necessary.  But read their birth plan; they clearly want communication kept to a minimum.  In fact, "center switch" is one reason I originally preferred this course over others.

I am glad you had a positive experience with your choice and I know it works for some.  

[demeter888]

Originally Posted by eabbmom 

Being in a birthing frame of mind that tells you that if you feel pain something is wrong is dangerous And scary if pain happens. I can see how thiscould cause anxiety and feeling loss of control way too early in birth and how confusing it must have felt and feeling that you were doing wrong. What helped me the most with my birth trauma was seeing a birth story listener. I met with Pam England. She also does phone sessions. She has helped me see what I want for my next birth, love myself if it happens differently all without the judgment that exists in the birth world. I recommend seeing if she can guide you to a decision you will be satisfied with. Much love on your journey.

Hi Mama,

I have considered something like this, but I am only not doing it because I feel absolutely no need to be told I was not wrong.  I don't feel I did anything wrong, I don't feel like a victim as much as I might come off that way; especially after reading other's stories.  I feel like my birth was just very difficult and at the end of it I was blessed with an little angel (well, a breast monger angel LOL).  I feel I prepared the best I could.  I feel I did my best. I don't feel angry at any one specific person really, just very disappointed that after hiring a doula who had given birth to ten kids naturally and another who was willing to learn hypnobabies and dedicating a lot of time and money, I feel like something should have prepared me for what did happen and instead I led myself astray with the denial method that I feel the program I ultimately chose has perpetuated.  Now I know better, and now that I have shared it I feel better, and I hope others will not feel afraid because of it because my intention is to ultimately find something positive and not just go on ranting.

Thanks for your kind words.