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Need Advice for 18 month old with decay

post #1 of 31
Thread Starter 

I really need advice right now. My ds is 18 months old. He has cavities in his top 4 front teeth. It looks like there may be a little starting on one of his canines. I noticed them at the beginning of January and they seem to be getting worse fast. We had a bad experience with another dentist. They wanted to do fillings, but would only do it with ds strapped to a table and me out of the room. We just saw another dentist today. The office staff and dentist were very nice and great. He said because my ds has Celiac disease he has weak enamel and we have to be extra careful with his teeth. He told me we needed to seal the molars and have root canals on the four front teeth. He would then put porcelain caps on the front teeth. This would all be done under general anesthesia. I am really confused on this advice. His cavities have grown since I first noticed them at the beginning of January, but I'm not sure about needing root canals. Why would he need a root canal this young? The other problem I have is with porcelain caps. Wouldn't these be too fragile for a toddler? Why would fillings not be enough? I want to get his teeth fixed before they get worse, but it looks like I might need a third opinion. Has anyone else experienced root canals this young?

post #2 of 31

Sounds like he needs some major restoration through nutrition, which could absolutely heal the cavities. This post was helpful on the subject: http://www.thenourishinggourmet.com/2013/01/a-success-story-remineralizing-teeth-after-bottle-rot.html

post #3 of 31
So sorry for you... you must be so stressed! I can only tell you that porcelain is very strong. I"ve had porcelain caps in my mouth for 23 years! General anesthesia sounds a little drastic-- dentists around me use laughing gas. When I was 6, I had root canals and caps put on my teeth after having had laughing gas and I don't remember it being a big deal to me. I don't remember any pain at all. Hope this helps.
post #4 of 31
The reason for the root canals is because the decay is very deep. When they restore a tooth they have to remove all the decay and a little bit of good tooth to place the restoration. You can only drill so deep before hitting the nerve of the tooth, which is why the root canal will be needed do they can drill what is needed to be drilled and with the nerves gone (aka the root canal part) the tooth won't have sensitivity from the deep restorations.

As for the caps/crowns proceilin is fragile but it is that or 100% metal and the kid will have these till at least eight years of age. So this will look much nicer.

That is a lot of work for a small child I would say go with the general vs gas. Gas will just make the kid happy not necessarily sit still.

Spry tooth paste for kids is a great intervention for home use. Contains no Flouride but does have xylitol. It's a sugar alcohol that kills the bacteria that causes decay. Also make sure you are brushing the teeth not just the kiddo. Kids don't have the dexterity till they are closer to seven or eight.

Pm me if you have more questions I can help you with. Good luck.
post #5 of 31
Forgot to answer on part... Fillings aren't enough because you really can only fill the tooth so much. It's a structure thing. Think of it like this, it a rock hits your window you can fill in the crack but if a bolder hits the window it's time for a new window. Hope that makes sense.
post #6 of 31

Thinking back to a time I had oral surgery...  they used laughing gas first before doing the general anesthesia.  From the child's perspective, it shouldn't be painful (just sore afterwards).  It will probably be more painful for you.  :(  Please keep us updated. 

post #7 of 31

hug2.gifAny updates?

 

We are dealing with decay and the possibilty of surgery, too. DS is only 14 mo, so they want to wait until he is older. In the meantime we are trying the nutrition (linked above), and I have an appt w/ a new dentist in  couple of months for a 2nd opinion.

post #8 of 31
Bentlaj11, I recently read a book called Kiss Your Dentist Goodbye (on google books for free) and the book claims that xylitol can remineralize teeth. You can get xylitol lollipops, candy, drink mix, and toothpaste. Just thought you'd like to know that...
post #9 of 31
Just noticed this thread and wanted to add my experience. We noticed my son had decay starting at around 13 months. We were offered to fix our sons teeth under general anesthesia by a ped dentist. We got told by another dentist that we could prevent further decay and wait until he was old enough to not need general anesthesia and they would fix them then. Bad idea.. The decay just continually got worse. I tried everything, I continued to breastfeed, not minding the recommendations to stop. (Which I still wouldn't change even if I had known the outcome) And we tried nutrition and supplementing and it just got worse and worse. By the time he was 20 months, we found out we had no options other than pulling the teeth because it had gotten so bad, and they were close to infection which could affect his adult teeth. They couldn't even cap them because there wasn't enough good teeth left to hold onto the caps. At 22 months our son went under general anesthesia, which we tried to avoid all along, and came out with no front teeth (all 4 were pulled) and 2 molars capped with stainless steel.

I know I tried to do everything the natural way, and I'm not saying it doesn't work for everyone. I must have been doing something wrong. He's 3 now, hasn't had any troubles since. But he's out those 4 teeth until he's 7-9 yrs old. Not a huge deal, but he will have to re-teeth when those 4 teeth come in because his gums have completely closed in. And it will take longer for them to come in.

I don't want to scare you, I just wanted to share our experience with this.

Hope all goes well and you make the decision that is right for your family smile.gif
post #10 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristmasLover View Post

Bentlaj11, I recently read a book called Kiss Your Dentist Goodbye (on google books for free) and the book claims that xylitol can remineralize teeth. You can get xylitol lollipops, candy, drink mix, and toothpaste. Just thought you'd like to know that...

Thanks! Yes, I've been doing xylitol (toothpaste, but I put it in his mouth several times/day) along with the CLO/BO and am looking into the salts (calc flour?), etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mama4life14 View Post

Just noticed this thread and wanted to add my experience. We noticed my son had decay starting at around 13 months. We were offered to fix our sons teeth under general anesthesia by a ped dentist. We got told by another dentist that we could prevent further decay and wait until he was old enough to not need general anesthesia and they would fix them then. Bad idea.. The decay just continually got worse. I tried everything, I continued to breastfeed, not minding the recommendations to stop. (Which I still wouldn't change even if I had known the outcome) And we tried nutrition and supplementing and it just got worse and worse. By the time he was 20 months, we found out we had no options other than pulling the teeth because it had gotten so bad, and they were close to infection which could affect his adult teeth. They couldn't even cap them because there wasn't enough good teeth left to hold onto the caps. At 22 months our son went under general anesthesia, which we tried to avoid all along, and came out with no front teeth (all 4 were pulled) and 2 molars capped with stainless steel.

I know I tried to do everything the natural way, and I'm not saying it doesn't work for everyone. I must have been doing something wrong. He's 3 now, hasn't had any troubles since. But he's out those 4 teeth until he's 7-9 yrs old. Not a huge deal, but he will have to re-teeth when those 4 teeth come in because his gums have completely closed in. And it will take longer for them to come in.

I don't want to scare you, I just wanted to share our experience with this.

Hope all goes well and you make the decision that is right for your family smile.gif

Thanks for sharing your story! The dentist I took him to said to wait 6 mo until all his teeth came in before he would do the surgery. He also told me to stop BF. I'm with you, I don't think that I can stop even if his teeth get worse. I don't believe the BF causes it, and he still gets most of his nutrition from BM. I know that the nutritional aspect might not stop his teeth from decaying, but it's worth a shot for now. I am getting a second opinion and a lip tie/tounge tie eval in the meantime. I glad that your DS hasn't had problems since then! Does he have a lip-tie, or did you ever figure out why he had decay?

 

OP, I hope you are doing well!

post #11 of 31

My friend's daughter had similar tooth decay, they ended up removing all of the front teeth when she was two and she just looked like she was 5 for the next few years smile.gif It was done under general anesthesia and went really well. Her molars are silver so I'm assuming they did root canals in the back as well.

post #12 of 31
Decay on the front top teeth is very frequently a result of an upper lip tie keeping food trapped against the teeth. Correcting the upper lip tie can help prevent further damage.
post #13 of 31

I have read extensively about this issue and I think that it's probably not breastfeeding that causes decay, but it is the child sleeping WHILE latched on.  However, I think it's *possible* that bfing at night causes decay just because I have seen so many posts from bfing moms who have kids with decay.  One possible solution for moms who want to keep breastfeeding at night is to go over the teeth with xylitol wipes after feeding.  Or  you could keep the xylitol toothpaste beside the bed, put a little on your finger and rub ion those front teeth after feeding (I use Spry kids' natural xylitol toothpaste and the toddler loves it).  I'm so paranoid about tooth decay that this is what I'm going to start doing...

 

Xylitol is a natural sweetener that has some pretty amazing dental benefits.  It kills the bacteria that causes tooth decay and can even remineralize teeth.  I can't believe that all dentists don't tell people to use xylitol on their kids teeth. 


Edited by ChristmasLover - 3/10/13 at 6:48am
post #14 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by bentlaj11 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristmasLover View Post

Bentlaj11, I recently read a book called Kiss Your Dentist Goodbye (on google books for free) and the book claims that xylitol can remineralize teeth. You can get xylitol lollipops, candy, drink mix, and toothpaste. Just thought you'd like to know that...

Thanks! Yes, I've been doing xylitol (toothpaste, but I put it in his mouth several times/day) along with the CLO/BO and am looking into the salts (calc flour?), etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mama4life14 View Post

Just noticed this thread and wanted to add my experience. We noticed my son had decay starting at around 13 months. We were offered to fix our sons teeth under general anesthesia by a ped dentist. We got told by another dentist that we could prevent further decay and wait until he was old enough to not need general anesthesia and they would fix them then. Bad idea.. The decay just continually got worse. I tried everything, I continued to breastfeed, not minding the recommendations to stop. (Which I still wouldn't change even if I had known the outcome) And we tried nutrition and supplementing and it just got worse and worse. By the time he was 20 months, we found out we had no options other than pulling the teeth because it had gotten so bad, and they were close to infection which could affect his adult teeth. They couldn't even cap them because there wasn't enough good teeth left to hold onto the caps. At 22 months our son went under general anesthesia, which we tried to avoid all along, and came out with no front teeth (all 4 were pulled) and 2 molars capped with stainless steel.

I know I tried to do everything the natural way, and I'm not saying it doesn't work for everyone. I must have been doing something wrong. He's 3 now, hasn't had any troubles since. But he's out those 4 teeth until he's 7-9 yrs old. Not a huge deal, but he will have to re-teeth when those 4 teeth come in because his gums have completely closed in. And it will take longer for them to come in.

I don't want to scare you, I just wanted to share our experience with this.

Hope all goes well and you make the decision that is right for your family smile.gif

Thanks for sharing your story! The dentist I took him to said to wait 6 mo until all his teeth came in before he would do the surgery. He also told me to stop BF. I'm with you, I don't think that I can stop even if his teeth get worse. I don't believe the BF causes it, and he still gets most of his nutrition from BM. I know that the nutritional aspect might not stop his teeth from decaying, but it's worth a shot for now. I am getting a second opinion and a lip tie/tounge tie eval in the meantime. I glad that your DS hasn't had problems since then! Does he have a lip-tie, or did you ever figure out why he had decay?

 

OP, I hope you are doing well!


I have a feeling that he does have a lip-tie. I never got it checked out though because it was never brought up to me before the fact. But I wish I would have known about it sooner! My son nursed all night and was probably latched on most the night. I also ate a lot of sugar, not sure if that matters too much, but it could have made my milk sweeter maybe?? We use Xylitol very frequently now and I'm also expecting another baby in May, I plan to nurse through the night in the same way, however I will use xylitol wipes or a tooth gel from very early on just so I can prevent whatever I can!
I'm so glad that I continued to breastfeed my son, I will never regret that! But I agree with the PP who said there are still precautions and stuff to consider when night nursing! Just to be safe! I think what is mostly dangerous, is mixing breast milk and food. I'm pretty sure I read on Kellymom.com that breast milk makes food bacteria develop faster. Which can cause decay. But breast milk alone can strengthen teeth. So that was one thing I used to do was make sure I brushed his teeth before I nursed. Or right after.
post #15 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mama4life14 View Post


I have a feeling that he does have a lip-tie. I never got it checked out though because it was never brought up to me before the fact. But I wish I would have known about it sooner! My son nursed all night and was probably latched on most the night. I also ate a lot of sugar, not sure if that matters too much, but it could have made my milk sweeter maybe?? We use Xylitol very frequently now and I'm also expecting another baby in May, I plan to nurse through the night in the same way, however I will use xylitol wipes or a tooth gel from very early on just so I can prevent whatever I can!
I'm so glad that I continued to breastfeed my son, I will never regret that! But I agree with the PP who said there are still precautions and stuff to consider when night nursing! Just to be safe! I think what is mostly dangerous, is mixing breast milk and food. I'm pretty sure I read on Kellymom.com that breast milk makes food bacteria develop faster. Which can cause decay. But breast milk alone can strengthen teeth. So that was one thing I used to do was make sure I brushed his teeth before I nursed. Or right after.

DS1 actually fell and busted his fernum when he was a around 11 mo., so I'm not sure if he had one.. I don't think he did. DH thinks I'm making things up with DS2 (not that he doesn't believe that he has one, but he doesn't think it's a big deal. I'll see what the oral surgery people say in May. His tounge tie isn't bad enough to have caused latch problems, but I'm worried about speech. He tries so hard to talk, but really can't form words.

 

I read a study (linked from a blog, but probably the one ref on Kellymom) about BM helping teeth, but any bit of food causing decay fast, so yeah, I know that all the nights I was in hurry and didn't brush made things bad!

 

ETA: Congrats on your new squish jumpers.gif! May's getting close!!

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristmasLover View Post

I have read extensively about this issue and I think that it's probably not breastfeeding that causes decay, but it is the child sleeping WHILE latched on.  However, I think it's *possible* that bfing at night causes decay just because I have seen so many posts from bfing moms who have kids with decay.  One possible solution for moms who want to keep breastfeeding at night is to go over the teeth with xylitol wipes after feeding.  Or  you could keep the xylitol toothpaste beside the bed, put a little on your finger and rub ion those front teeth after feeding (I use Spry kids' natural xylitol toothpaste and the toddler loves it).  I'm so paranoid about tooth decay that this is what I'm going to start doing...

 

Xylitol is a natural sweetener that has some pretty amazing dental benefits.  It kills the bacteria that causes tooth decay and can even remineralize teeth.  I can't believe that all dentists don't tell people to use xylitol on their kids teeth. 

DS2 actually nurses less (although there were some nights where he latches often) than DS1 did at night, and DS1 doesn't have decay, go figure! That's what makes me think he has weaker enamel (me not getting enough vit/min while pg), plus the lip tie.

 I have been doing spry at night (and multiple times/day) as well, although I usually wake him up when I apply it which causes him to want to nurse again duh.gif... not sure if helps much! But I'll keep trying :)

post #16 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by bentlaj11 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mama4life14 View Post


I have a feeling that he does have a lip-tie. I never got it checked out though because it was never brought up to me before the fact. But I wish I would have known about it sooner! My son nursed all night and was probably latched on most the night. I also ate a lot of sugar, not sure if that matters too much, but it could have made my milk sweeter maybe?? We use Xylitol very frequently now and I'm also expecting another baby in May, I plan to nurse through the night in the same way, however I will use xylitol wipes or a tooth gel from very early on just so I can prevent whatever I can!
I'm so glad that I continued to breastfeed my son, I will never regret that! But I agree with the PP who said there are still precautions and stuff to consider when night nursing! Just to be safe! I think what is mostly dangerous, is mixing breast milk and food. I'm pretty sure I read on Kellymom.com that breast milk makes food bacteria develop faster. Which can cause decay. But breast milk alone can strengthen teeth. So that was one thing I used to do was make sure I brushed his teeth before I nursed. Or right after.

DS1 actually fell and busted his fernum when he was a around 11 mo., so I'm not sure if he had one.. I don't think he did. DH thinks I'm making things up with DS2 (not that he doesn't believe that he has one, but he doesn't think it's a big deal. I'll see what the oral surgery people say in May. His tounge tie isn't bad enough to have caused latch problems, but I'm worried about speech. He tries so hard to talk, but really can't form words.

 

I read a study (linked from a blog, but probably the one ref on Kellymom) about BM helping teeth, but any bit of food causing decay fast, so yeah, I know that all the nights I was in hurry and didn't brush made things bad!

 

ETA: Congrats on your new squish jumpers.gif! May's getting close!!

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristmasLover View Post

I have read extensively about this issue and I think that it's probably not breastfeeding that causes decay, but it is the child sleeping WHILE latched on.  However, I think it's *possible* that bfing at night causes decay just because I have seen so many posts from bfing moms who have kids with decay.  One possible solution for moms who want to keep breastfeeding at night is to go over the teeth with xylitol wipes after feeding.  Or  you could keep the xylitol toothpaste beside the bed, put a little on your finger and rub ion those front teeth after feeding (I use Spry kids' natural xylitol toothpaste and the toddler loves it).  I'm so paranoid about tooth decay that this is what I'm going to start doing...

 

Xylitol is a natural sweetener that has some pretty amazing dental benefits.  It kills the bacteria that causes tooth decay and can even remineralize teeth.  I can't believe that all dentists don't tell people to use xylitol on their kids teeth. 

DS2 actually nurses less (although there were some nights where he latches often) than DS1 did at night, and DS1 doesn't have decay, go figure! That's what makes me think he has weaker enamel (me not getting enough vit/min while pg), plus the lip tie.

 I have been doing spry at night (and multiple times/day) as well, although I usually wake him up when I apply it which causes him to want to nurse again duh.gif... not sure if helps much! But I'll keep trying :)


Thanks for the congrats! We are super excited!!! I just wanted to add to what you said about not getting enough vitamins and minerals while pregnant! I totally think that's why my sons teeth were weak as well! I was not very good with taking my prenatals while I was pregnant with him. I thought I could just get all my nutrients from food. But I realize it wasn't a good idea and could definitely have caused his teeth to be weaker. This time round I've been taking prenatals plus extra vit D and extra DHA. And been very diligent with it. I also have been giving my son extra Vit D as well.
post #17 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mama4life14 View Post


Thanks for the congrats! We are super excited!!! I just wanted to add to what you said about not getting enough vitamins and minerals while pregnant! I totally think that's why my sons teeth were weak as well! I was not very good with taking my prenatals while I was pregnant with him. I thought I could just get all my nutrients from food. But I realize it wasn't a good idea and could definitely have caused his teeth to be weaker. This time round I've been taking prenatals plus extra vit D and extra DHA. And been very diligent with it. I also have been giving my son extra Vit D as well.

Yes, I was nursing while pg, and since I never stopped nursing I think I was already defecient. My midwife told me to double up on my prenantal, but I read about/was scared about vit A toxicity and birth defects so I didn't... I have since learned that vit A tox is something that happens with synthetic sources. i craved milk a few times, but did ot drink it regularly, and my prenatal was just a regular synthetic version. I've since switched to a whole food version, and am taking regular dairy, eggs, clo/bo. But, wish I would've done it while pg, obviously!! Hopefully we can catch up/replenish our stores, now!

post #18 of 31

My ND told me to take xylitol while pregnant, as it will help strengthen their tooth buds. Unfortunately, there's a window when the teeth are developing where it's best to take xylitol, and I don't remember what that is, but I'm sure it could have a benefit at any time.

 

I took tons of supplements while preggo, and tried to do everything right, but my kids still got a few cavities. The Dentist says that it's because they have really deep ridges on their molars, which they do. Still, their teeth are pretty good considering. DD1 (6) has 2 cavities and a few sealants, and DD2 (4) has one cavity that has yet to be filled. She had 3 molars that the Dentist said were developing cavities, and I managed to correct them by being diligent with cell salts, xylitol gum, colloidal silver, etc., and I added MI Paste, which I think really made the difference. The Dentist was amazed, because even the tooth with the obvious cavity has hardened.

 

As far as BF-ing goes, I breast fed both my kids until they self-weaned at 18 months. I find it hard to believe that BF-ing causes tooth decay. I would bet that those kids would have the same problems, or even worse if they were drinking formula. I just think it's something genetic or something perhaps lacking in utero. IDK,  it's so hard to tell. You can have 2 kids in the same family with identical habits, and one will have bad teeth, and the other will have perfect teeth. You can't just blame BF-ing IMO.

post #19 of 31

Thanks for sharing your story!! It's always nice to hear from Mom's who've BTDT! I've ordered some MI paste, and when I get out again (if I don't forget), I"m going to look for the cell salts :)

post #20 of 31
Hi ladies, I've just learned that my 16 month old DS has a lot of tooth decay, especially on his front 4 teeth. I've found this tread really interesting.

Our ped dentist is talking about the likelihood of 2 root canals under general anesethic. She is also suggesting that i coat the toothbrush llightly with adult strength fluoride toothpaste. Would anyone have an opinion or research on this? He will definitely swallow the toothpaste. She emphasised the need for it strongly. :-(
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