I'm not anti-vax, I'm pro-research!

[eeem]

This is a great blog, from moms (and dads) who have done their research.

http://thinkingmomsrevolution.com/how-i-gave-my-son-autism/

[Mirzam]

Originally Posted by eeem 

This is a great blog, from moms (and dads) who have done their research.

http://thinkingmomsrevolution.com/how-i-gave-my-son-autism/

I just read this blog also, and thought it was excellent. It demonstrates how autism is caused by multi-factors, with vaccination being one. 

[prosciencemum]

I think it's tragic that mothers are beating themselves up thinking their children's autism was preventable when all the research suggests it's just the way they are. That's what I think.  

And I really dislike the "thinking moms revolution" blog which claims to be about research but actually isn't in my opinion.

[Mirzam]

Originally Posted by prosciencemum 

I think it's tragic that mothers are beating themselves up thinking their children's autism was preventable when all the research suggests it's just the way they are. That's what I think.  

And I really dislike the "thinking moms revolution" blog which claims to be about research but actually isn't in my opinion.

I dislike how people dismiss parents that they know that their child's autism was indeed preventable and they have spent thousands of hours researching the subject in order to help their children. How can it possibly be "just the way they are" when 1 in 88 12 year olds are on the spectrum when 30 years ago it was 1 in 10,000. Oh, I know, better diagnosis (not). We are facing a generation of young people who will need care into adulthood, it is a huge tragedy.

[serenbat]

Quote:

I think it's tragic that mothers are beating themselves up thinking their children's autism was preventable when all the research suggests it's just the way they are. That's what I think.  

I think this is just absurd!  You must know something the rest of us don't know- what is the real cause?

Last I checked we (including Dr.s) don't know the real cause, yet they do know the numbers are clearly up and it's not just better understanding going on!!

In a society that can't find fault with basically anything, of course nothing a parent allows can be a cause, can it? We hold parents, dr.s, medical community (including vacs & drugs) at a no fault for most every ill- with very few exceptions. For example, we do say (only sometimes) that alcohol during pregnancy can have a negative effect but we really can't add too much more- we are a blameless society as a whole. Life is so much easier if you can't look within.

[Rrrrrachel]

Originally Posted by prosciencemum 

I think it's tragic that mothers are beating themselves up thinking their children's autism was preventable when all the research suggests it's just the way they are. That's what I think.  

And I really dislike the "thinking moms revolution" blog which claims to be about research but actually isn't in my opinion.

I whole heartedly agree. I don't think the rest of this is worth comment.

[Marnica]

I just think it's funny...... responses are totally predictable as usual. 

[Mirzam]

Originally Posted by Marnica 

I just think it's funny...... responses are totally predictable as usual. 

Yes they are. 

[fruitfulmomma]

I think it's tragic that mothers are beating themselves up thinking their children's autism was preventable when all the research suggests it's just the way they are.

oh, I thought that the newest research showed that having the flu while pregnant was one possible cause and therefore momma needs her flu shot?

[Rrrrrachel]

That's extremely preliminary research. I do think mothers should get a flu shot, but not to prevent autism.

I personally think autism starts in utero and is primarily genetic. I do think its possible that moms can do things while pregnant that can trigger autism, but with so little research on what those things are, if anything, all we can do is the best we can. NONE of us are perfect. I think it's a tragedy when a mother blames herself and feels guilt for the rest of her life over something like this.

[Dakotacakes]

When I see titles like this I cringe.  The insinuation being of course that if you vaccinate you clearly didn't research.  When in reality, with blogs like these the research they are doing is all research within an echo-chamber.  They are automatically discounting things from the CDC the WHO and medical journals because their "research" says otherwise.  And discussing the hours spent researching something doesn't really tell me anything unless I know the sources.  If you spend 500 hours research vaccines on mercola or whale of course you are going to come up with not vaccinating.  But I wouldn't say you have researched the issue either.

Too often, individuals are starting from a perspective and then proclaiming to have researched it and that is why they have the perspective.  When in reality the only research they have done is in an echo chamber.

I see danger in so many people becoming cemented in the idea that vaccines are causing autism and then researching that aspect.  because time spent on that is time not spent trying to find other causes and is shortchanging the autism epidemic.  REcently they held congressional hearings on autism, at first i was optimistic, but in reality it wasn't congressional hearings on autism at all, all they looked at was vaccination.

[Mirzam]

Originally Posted by Dakotacakes 

When I see titles like this I cringe.  The insinuation being of course that if you vaccinate you clearly didn't research.  When in reality, with blogs like these the research they are doing is all research within an echo-chamber.  They are automatically discounting things from the CDC the WHO and medical journals because their "research" says otherwise.  And discussing the hours spent researching something doesn't really tell me anything unless I know the sources.  If you spend 500 hours research vaccines on mercola or whale of course you are going to come up with not vaccinating.  But I wouldn't say you have researched the issue either.

Too often, individuals are starting from a perspective and then proclaiming to have researched it and that is why they have the perspective.  When in reality the only research they have done is in an echo chamber.

I see danger in so many people becoming cemented in the idea that vaccines are causing autism and then researching that aspect.  because time spent on that is time not spent trying to find other causes and is shortchanging the autism epidemic.  REcently they held congressional hearings on autism, at first i was optimistic, but in reality it wasn't congressional hearings on autism at all, all they looked at was vaccination.

Actually they didn't just discuss vaccines, Dennis Kucinich mentioned polution from coal fired plants, but it was only a small part of the hearing. Vaccination is autism's elephant in the living room, so it is not surprising that this was the main focus of the hearing. However, if you read the article linked in the OP, you will see that the author mentions other factors such as ultrasounds, HFCS, pain killers during pregnancy, Pitocin, C-sec, antibiotics, acetaminophen and fluoride which combined with vaccines led her son's autism. 

There actually isn't any research being done on vaccines and autism, one of the resasons being they have dismissed it. Most of the reserach as far as I know is looking at genetics, which so far has yeilded bupkiss. Also, there is no way pharma of the goverment are going to fund a vaccinated vs unvaccinated study when the outcome could be extremely difficult for them.

Edited by Mirzam - 2/20/13 at 11:49am

[Rrrrrachel]

There has been loads of research on various components of vaccines and autism.

[Mirzam]

And pretty much all of it was junk.

[Rrrrrachel]

And I'm not sure what you mean by bupkis in terms of genetics and autism. It's true they haven't found the actual genetic component yet, but there has absolutely been promising research and discoveries in that area.

[Dakotacakes]

Originally Posted by Mirzam 

Actually they didn't just discuss vaccines, Dennis Kucinich mentioned polution from coal fired plants, but it was only a small part of the hearing. Vaccination is autism's elephant in the living room, so it is not surprising that this was the main focus of the hearing. However, if you read the article linked in the OP, you will see that the author mentions other factors such as ultrasounds, HFCS, pain killers during pregnancy, Pitocin, C-sec, antibiotics, acetaminophen and fluoride which combined with vaccines led her son's autism. 

There actually isn't any research being done on vaccines and autism, one of the resasons being they have dismissed it. Most of the reserach as far as I know is looking at genetics, which so far has yeilded bubkiss. Also, there is no way pharma of the goverment are going to fund a vaccinated vs unvaccinated study when the outcome could be extremely difficult for them.

I did read the entire blog post.  None of it is actually based on research however, it is google search "links" that are from as well.  This is what I am talking about.  What research is present about this blog post?  I can't find anything regarding actual research that indicates any of those things are related to autism.  Here is the research she links to in the post:

Ultrasound- this resesarch came from ICPA which appears to be a Chiropractic Trade organization. 

Coke/high fructose corn syrup- this lead me to facebook and a warning message about the facebook page I was opening so I didn't open it.  I don't consider facebook postings research either.

Lortab- there is no research she presents about this just her intuition

Pitocin- this went back to the same article from ICPA again I beleive a trade organization for Chiropractic not an autism research organization.

Antibiotics/Augmentin.  This is my favorite.  The actual link takes you to PRWEB which is a website to bring PR to your cause.  IT is a press release for an article "published" in Medical hypotheses journal in 2005 linking augmentin to autism.  The problem is that until 2010 medical hypotheses was an elsevier journal whose goal was "to publish unconventional ideas without the filter of peer review" the editor just decided what to publish.  In 2010 they were given a new editor and began peer review after some articles denying the link between HIV and AIDS. 

Vaccines- this lead me to a blog entitled adventures in autism

Acetimenophen lead me to the Ultimate Autism guide which had no sourcing or citing for the claims.

Flouride- I am actually not going to touch this one, the links I got didn't discuss autism but more just rants about flouridation of water in general.

Reading blogs, and pseudoscience journals that promote aids denialism, and Trade organizations for Chiropractic may be beneficial, but I don't consider conclusions drawn from those sources to be well researched.  It appears this individual is "anti-vaccine" amont some other anti's and has set off to "research" that position within an echochamber of like minded individuals.

[serenbat]

Quote:

I think it's a tragedy when a mother blames herself and feels guilt for the rest of her life over something like this.

so in your mind because we don't know a cause, it's no one's fault? is this correct?

as in, if it is genetic and you pass it on, you are not at fault - is this also correct?

unlike the thalidomide babies, if it was more obvious I'm sure there would be more outcry, by thalidomide did take years to get off the market

[Mirzam]

Originally Posted by Rrrrrachel 
 
And I'm not sure what you mean by bupkis in terms of genetics and autism. It's true they haven't found the actual genetic component yet, but there has absolutely been promising research and discoveries in that area.

Right there is no autism gene. 

As for the non science looking into genetics, the identical twin studes show autism has an environmental, ie external cause. To demonstrate autism has a soley genetic [internal] cause, it must be shown that autism occurs where no environmental causes apply, and that has never been done. Like most other human medical conditions, autism is caused by environmental factors. Some are more susceptible than others, as is the case with every condition.

[Mirzam]

Finally, which I forgot to add, there is no such thing as a genetic epidemic and we have an epidemic of autism. 

[Rrrrrachel]

Serenbat it's correct that I don't think it's anyone's fault when a child gets autism, and I think it's thoroughly pointless to frame it in those terms to begin with.