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Questions about making broth

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 

So, I've taken to making broth lately, and I'm loving, but I'm curious about what to do with the meat.  Some recipes I've found say to use a whole chicken to make the broth and then "discard" the meat - um, what???  But, then, the meat, especially the breast, does come out awfully chalky and gross.  I've been trying to just simmer the meat for a short amount of time so it is just cooked, then pull it off and continue to simmer just the bones, but I'm still not really psyched about how the meat turns out.  I've also tried just getting whole chickens, cutting the major parts off and saving them for cooking, then just using the meaty carcass and wings to make the broth.  I like this method much better, but there's still so much meat on that carcass.  Is it better to let it cook to smithereens in with the broth?  Or to pull it off quickly, after a short simmer? 

 

Oh, and any help on beef stock would be greatly appreciated, because I haven't turned out a good one yet, and it's so much more expensive to try that I really want to get it right.

post #2 of 18

I'm no expert & I'm definitely still in the stage of working on my technique, but I've had some successes with chicken bone broth lately.

 

I tend to alternate approaches. One week, I'll do a whole chicken (trying to add head & feet so I can get it more gelatinous... that's my problem...). I'll simmer it for about 2 hours, then pick off the meat & continue simmering the bones & skin & everything else. The meat I will later use for chicken rice soup, chili, chicken salad, etc. ... That's pretty much all it's good for & NT has a lot of recipes for chicken prepared this way.

 

The next week, we'll cook (usually poach) bone-in chicken parts or roast a whole chicken. The bones, fat, skin, cartilege, etc. I'll pop in the freezer to keep for the next time I make broth. That way we're not always just eating the shredded chicken from simmering the broth but we're not wasting anything either.

 

As for beef broth... I can't really help out there. All I'll say is roasting the meaty bones before making broth & really helped to improve the taste.

 

HTH!

post #3 of 18

I can only comment on my chicken broth. I usually just save bones or buy cuts with little meat (like backs or feet) specifically for broth.

 

The only time I include chicken meat is when I plan on making a chicken soup right afterward. You can cook it in there and then shred the chicken into the soup with the broth and new vegetables, seasonings, noodles, etc.

post #4 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZoeyZoo View Post

I can only comment on my chicken broth. I usually just save bones or buy cuts with little meat (like backs or feet) specifically for broth.

 

The only time I include chicken meat is when I plan on making a chicken soup right afterward. You can cook it in there and then shred the chicken into the soup with the broth and new vegetables, seasonings, noodles, etc.

 



We do this too.  We frequently eat chicken and save the bones (and the drippings) in the freezer until we have enough to fill a crockpot.  There's not a ton of meat on the bones, but any meat/cartilege in the broth gets picked out to feed to our dogs.

post #5 of 18

I always roast the whole bird, and that is usually part of the first meal.  Then, I pick off any remaining meat for use in other recipes (enchiladas, pot pie, soup, salad, etc.).  I put the rest of the carcass in the crock-pot to make broth.  I never, ever boil a chicken for broth with the meat still on.  I can't stand the way the meat turns out, and I don't think it makes the broth any better.  I really dislike boiled chicken.


WRT to beef broth, I often roast the bones for a couple of hours first, as it seems to help develop flavor better.  I pick any meat off the bones for other recipes, mainly shredded beef sandwiches or enchiladas.  Then I put it all in the crock-pot to make the broth.

post #6 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by gardenmommy View Post

I always roast the whole bird, and that is usually part of the first meal.  Then, I pick off any remaining meat for use in other recipes (enchiladas, pot pie, soup, salad, etc.).  I put the rest of the carcass in the crock-pot to make broth.  I never, ever boil a chicken for broth with the meat still on.  I can't stand the way the meat turns out, and I don't think it makes the broth any better.  I really dislike boiled chicken.


WRT to beef broth, I often roast the bones for a couple of hours first, as it seems to help develop flavor better.  I pick any meat off the bones for other recipes, mainly shredded beef sandwiches or enchiladas.  Then I put it all in the crock-pot to make the broth.


This! If I need broth I will roast up a chicken, save the meat and then put the bones into my pressure cooker. :) I hate the texture and taste of boiled chicken. I absolutely LOOOOOOOOVE making broth in my pressure cooker. It always get so thick and jiggly.

post #7 of 18

I like using chicken backs (sold by one local healthfood that is, sadly, right in the city center and I rarely have the time to so) but when I can't get them, I buy drumsticks at our local butcher's and plop them in whole. Makes a very nice broth and when the meat is used for a recipe in which it can be slathered in butter or coconut oil, it won't go to waste and still taste okay.

 

Good beef broth is harder to make I think. I have found that the cuts they give you for making broth, with or without bones, always taste somehwat rancid and so does the soup made from them. I am also abit suspicious that the cats won't touch the leftovers (whereas they go wild over the chicken skin from making the chicken broth). These days, I only buy oxtails and prime cuts and but a lot of balsamic vinegar and onions in, comesout much better. It's expensive that way but I do not make it this often as I did when I started getting into this whole traditional/paleo/Primal thing because I read in the PHD that they recommend it three days a week only. So I do chicken on one weekend and beef on alternate weekends and try to make about enough that we can consume some for two or three days into the week, which also keeps me from getting burnt out on this.

post #8 of 18

Now what do you do about the veggies? my mom taught me to cut them up and use them in the soup, but if you cook the broth for more than three hours, they taste awful. I still feel bad about tossing them - what do you do?

post #9 of 18

I don't waste veggies in the broth making. For one, I don't have the money to use them in broth, two, I'm not with it enough to save the ends....lol Just bones, water, and ACV. I add veggies to my soup when making the actual soup. :)
 

post #10 of 18

I don't add veggies to my broth, either, for the same reasons.  I can't afford to devote money to veggies for broth, and I tend to forget anyway.  

post #11 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tigerle View Post

Now what do you do about the veggies? my mom taught me to cut them up and use them in the soup, but if you cook the broth for more than three hours, they taste awful. I still feel bad about tossing them - what do you do?

I try to keep a bag of veggie scraps going in the freezer. I'll add whatever is on hand to the broth. The only veggies I add "fresh" are onion (if I don't have enough scraps) & parsley. Ill toss celery in the scraps bag if i know I'm not going to Use it up before it goes soft/bad. I've added kale stalks before & they've added a good flavor.
post #12 of 18
apologies right off the bat if i come across as insemsitive but just how much dothose veggies cost where you live? for atraditional mirepoix i may use a couple onions a couple carrots a chunk of celery root a sprig of parsley from the pot on my windowsil. a parsnip or parsley root if ive got them maybe a leek or two. even organic all of this is extremely cheap id say 50 c tops and thats eurocent. cheaper even if i manage to hit the farmers market jist before closing time and all of it except for fresj parsley can be boight in bulk and lasrs forever. i hate to see veggies go to waste as much as anyone but i am sure they have added at least 50 cents worth of vitamins minerals and flavour to the broth. i find its the high quality organic meaty bones which add up
(sorry nak)
post #13 of 18
Well, onions where I am are very cheap. I buy bulk organic when I can but otherwise I will buy non-organic (onions are on the "clean 15" list). Carrots & celery also relatively cheap. (Sorry I don't have number though it sounds like it is more than where you are... Non organic onions were about $.79 I think, organic was $1.29. Celery may be about $1. )

The main reason I use scraps is that I hate to waste any veggies that may still have flavor/nutrients. It may not be the "good" part for serving on the plate but I have made some delicious broths this way. Also the saving money bit is good.

To answer your original question from up thread, I toss the veggies after cooking the broth. They're usually just falling apart when the broth is done.
post #14 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tigerle View Post

apologies right off the bat if i come across as insemsitive but just how much dothose veggies cost where you live? for atraditional mirepoix i may use a couple onions a couple carrots a chunk of celery root a sprig of parsley from the pot on my windowsil. a parsnip or parsley root if ive got them maybe a leek or two. even organic all of this is extremely cheap id say 50 c tops and thats eurocent. cheaper even if i manage to hit the farmers market jist before closing time and all of it except for fresj parsley can be boight in bulk and lasrs forever. i hate to see veggies go to waste as much as anyone but i am sure they have added at least 50 cents worth of vitamins minerals and flavour to the broth. i find its the high quality organic meaty bones which add up
(sorry nak)

 

Not to be snarky in my response, but when you have a single family household of 5 (and growing) people (three of who are kids and EAT ALL THE TIME), a very tight food budget, and in an area of the country with VERY limited resources (no farmer's markets within an hour of us) that money for veggies to add to the broth add up. I make broth at least once a week, we consume it a lot. My kids beg for it. I don't feel it's worth it to invest fresh veggies just for the broth (and as I said before, I have so much else going on that saving the ends has never worked out for me). I make my broth for the nutrition and minerals from the bones. If it's for you, rock on.

post #15 of 18

Okay, now I was curious and googled local prices a bit (my DH always complains that I have no idea what things cost..I guess he's right, must pay more careful attention). I find:

500g of fresh assorted organic mirepoix veggies, one stockpot's worth (2 carrots, 1 leek, a chunk of celery root, a small bunch of parsley): 0,79.

Buying in bulk:

1 kg organic carrots. 0,99.

1 kg onions: 0,39.

1 organic celery root: 1,79.

The pot of fresh parsley I got for the windowsill when I got into that whole nutrition thing (and which I think I may have killed already, hagin forgotten to ask myinlaws to water them when I was in hospital with our youngest recently...) I remember to be 2.50.

So for 1 pots' worth, again I'd say something between 60 and 80 cents. A bit more than I thought, but still cheap enough for me to use even if they fall apart and need to be tossed. Whatever it takes to get vegetable nutrients into my DD.

 

You're in the middle of the desert, right? I guess that drives prices up, even if fuel for transport is cheap. Do you have a place where you get the bones for free or at least cheap? I find that butchers and supermarkets ask quite a bit of money for bones (a few euros for a pot's worth) which is annoying but at the farmers market again, the shepheard that sells lamb products gave me the bones for free (my DH once asked if those sheep were raised organic, pastured, no antibiotics etc) and the shepherd just laughed and said that no shepherd even bothers with the organic certification because everyone knows all sheep are raised that way anyway. Sure hope so for I made liver broth for the baby from the lamb liver, and have found that lamb stock is the best stock ever...).

post #16 of 18
Thread Starter 
Leeks are often $2 EACH at our grocery store. And din't get me started on celery root. That thing is like filet mignon of vegetables. Farmers markets here are sometimes more expensive here. There's a lot Of wealthy liberals in these parts who will pay anything for trendy local produce.
post #17 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by athenalove46 View Post

 

Not to be snarky in my response, but when you have a single family household of 5 (and growing) people (three of who are kids and EAT ALL THE TIME), a very tight food budget, and in an area of the country with VERY limited resources (no farmer's markets within an hour of us) that money for veggies to add to the broth add up. I make broth at least once a week, we consume it a lot. My kids beg for it. I don't feel it's worth it to invest fresh veggies just for the broth (and as I said before, I have so much else going on that saving the ends has never worked out for me). I make my broth for the nutrition and minerals from the bones. If it's for you, rock on.

Yes.  We have a very tight budget.  I make most everything from scratch, and while it isn't a *lot*, everything adds up.  I am feeding 7 people (8, if you count the babe within), and we simply can't afford to buy stuff to throw away.  I am not certain those veggies add a significant amount of vitamins anyway, because the broth cooks for so long.  I think it's better to buy the veggies, and either eat them raw, or lightly steam them.  My second point is that broth for me is something I make after the meat is pretty well gone from the bones.  At that point, I'm not really thinking about putting veggies in, I'm simply happy to have found another 10 minutes to use the bones constructively enough to get another meal out of them.  I'm glad that veggies are cheaper for other people, but they really add up in my grocery budget with so many people to feed.

post #18 of 18

I am very sorry that some of you have such a hard time finding affordable vegetables to feed your kids. greensad.gif

It has quite inspired me to be less wasteful myself. I have to remember that we are currently paying more for food than is really in our budget, because I am trying out so many things in our transition to healthier living (I just started this in February because DD was so constipated, but have since found out how much nutrition can do for all of us). I am currently dipping into a monetary gift my parents made us when our youngest was born with special needs, and it was clear that i could not go back to work for quite a while, with the hospital stays and surgeries and PT cathing 5 ties a day and whatnot, but i have promised DH that i will soon have everything set up so we have a new budget, a new storing system and a good balance between making everything form scratch and not spending every free minute on food preparation, shopping or research.

Today I have put on a broth almost exclusively with scraps and lamb chop leftovers, am very interested in how that one turns out. I have also tried extracting every last scrap of meat from the oxtail pieces I put on yesterday (found out that when i brown them carefully as recommended in the other current broth thread, they taste quite nice, I used to find them inedible after cooking) and have even served the veggies from the oxtail broth to eat in the soup, the way my mom taught me, but the kids wont eat them that way anyway and DH did not like them either, so that one is out. Have to try out the next one with just carrots and onions, maybe a chunk of celery, that would be the cheapest way I think. I cannot at this point imagine making broth without any veggies at all.

 

Can you educate me on what you reserve as scraps? how about carrot peel, the muddy end bits, the knobbly skin bits of the celery which hold sand..? Where do you draw the line, so the pot isn't full of dirt that you then have to painstakingly skim or strain out?

 

Edited to add that this time, even the cats liked the leftovers!

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