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New friend wants to take her kids out of the room when we nurse. What would you say? - Page 3

post #41 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by dalia View Post

Comparing breast feeding to sex is quite telling of how our culture sees breasts, whether we want to admit it or not. The more accurate analogy would be to imagine the OP's friend hiding under a blanket while she eats sandwiches because she didn't want her kids to see her eating sandwiches.

 

Which makes me wonder... if the friend was acting this way, while we'd obviously all find it very strange and shake our heads over this woman's issues, would she be getting the same kind of censure? Especially if we knew that the reason was that she came from a culture who had similar (if less extreme) views about the desirability of eating in public? Wouldn't we see her as something of a victim herself, rather than insulting her for her role in perpetuating the problem? I suspect that if it wasn't an issue as hot-button as nursing, we'd be seeing the inappropriateness of this sort of 'how DARE she behave in such an outrageous way' attitude more clearly.

 

And one other thought - it does seem to me that this level of outrage over breastfeeding/sex analogies is at least partly indicative of how our culture sees sex. Why else is it such a problem to draw an analogy between breastfeeding and another activity that's wonderful, pleasurable, hugely important to most of us both individually and in terms of survival of our species, and frequently a key part of relationships with our loved ones? Why should that be a poor comparison with breastfeeding?

 

Of course, some of it is because it is pretty much universally accepted that sex should remain part of the private realm, and many people do use the analogy as a way of claiming that breastfeeding should be subject to the same level of sanction in terms of privacy. But I hope I've made it very clear that I was absolutely not trying to do that with this analogy; rather, I was using it as an example of how individuals (rather than public custom) may legitimately choose to keep an important and positive part of their lives private, without it reflecting negatively on them as a whole. So why is there so much objection to this analogy? I do think that at least some of it is because of the widespread belief that there's something wrong or 'dirty' about sex, and so comparisons with breastfeeding are often assumed to be a way of saying something negative about breastfeeding. Which is a pretty sad comment on how our culture sees sex.

post #42 of 136
One thing I want to reiterate is that the OP is clearly expressing a desire to be social and have friends. Again, as a military spouse with limited options, sometimes it's necessary to find a way to get along in spite of personal convictions. Sociological implications aside, the OP's friend politely indicated that the nursing of a 3 yr old made her uncomfortable. Friend offered a solution that seems to be an acceptible way of handling the situation while still allowing the OP the nurse as her child wants. Is it worth dropping a friendship over this issue? I think not.
post #43 of 136
If I had sex as much as I breast feed some of that sex would just have to be out in the open too. Lol.
post #44 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soul-O View Post

One thing I want to reiterate is that the OP is clearly expressing a desire to be social and have friends. Again, as a military spouse with limited options, sometimes it's necessary to find a way to get along in spite of personal convictions. Sociological implications aside, the OP's friend politely indicated that the nursing of a 3 yr old made her uncomfortable. Friend offered a solution that seems to be an acceptible way of handling the situation while still allowing the OP the nurse as her child wants. Is it worth dropping a friendship over this issue? I think not.

"The mom called me when they got home to ask that in the future I give her a heads up when we are going to nurse, so she can take her boys to another room. She was trying to be super nice and apologetic about it. I offered to do a better job staying covered, which I'm admittedly not as concerned with in my house and I thought it wasn't an issue, but no, she just wants to take her 3 kids into some other room whenever my son needs to nurse, because she doesn't want them seeing "that" "until they are ready."

 

Is the "THAT" nursing or breasts????? Do we know?? The OP mentioned that her child "popped off to ask a question", which would have left her breast out in the open, exposed for everyone in the room to see. Apparently, everything was cool until the child popped off. Maybe it's not the nursing that was the problem, maybe the uncovered breast that made the mother/friend and child uncomfortable???

post #45 of 136

@Good Enough Mum I'm wondering if your "shock" at my use of a commonly used word is due to your perhaps not knowing the actual definition of the word. The word "Prude" is not an insult.

 

Here's the definition from the Merriam-Webster Dictionary

 

prude

noun \ˈprüd\

: a person who is easily shocked or offended by things that do not shock or offend other people

 

That's it. Someone who is easily shocked or offended at things that do not shock or offend other people. Do you see that as an "insult?" I don't, It simply an aptly descriptive word.

 

 

:) 

post #46 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by erinmattsmom88 View Post
 

"The mom called me when they got home to ask that in the future I give her a heads up when we are going to nurse, so she can take her boys to another room. She was trying to be super nice and apologetic about it. I offered to do a better job staying covered, which I'm admittedly not as concerned with in my house and I thought it wasn't an issue, but no, she just wants to take her 3 kids into some other room whenever my son needs to nurse, because she doesn't want them seeing "that" "until they are ready."

 

Is the "THAT" nursing or breasts????? Do we know?? The OP mentioned that her child "popped off to ask a question", which would have left her breast out in the open, exposed for everyone in the room to see. Apparently, everything was cool until the child popped off. Maybe it's not the nursing that was the problem, maybe the uncovered breast that made the mother/friend and child uncomfortable???

Given this explanation, my guess is that the OP's friend is not ready for her DSs to see breasts, but of course, we can't know for sure unless the OP returns to clarify.  

 

From a personal perspective.. I have six boys, ranging in age from almost 14 yrs old to 15 months.  Because of our housing situation (stairwell housing in Germany on a military post with other large families - 26 kids total in our stairwell), neighbor children play here frequently.  I've been blessed with wonderful neighbors who are either crunchy themselves, or supportive of AP/NFL.  However, I am careful about how & when I nurse in front of the older boys who play at our house.  I usually go to another room for a few minutes so that I can have a little privacy.  My youngest DS is a squirmy, active nurser, and he frequently pops off the breast to "talk" to me, or to look around as he's nursing.  I'm pretty sure that the boys' parents appreciate my discretion because otherwise, their tween and teenage boys would get a nice eye full on a regular basis at my house.  That said, it's important to recognize that military families trend towards the conservative, and AP-friendly folks are just not as common with the military as they are in certain parts of the US etc.  I'm not surprised that the OP's friend is uncomfortable with breast exposure, even if it's in the context of feeding a baby.  I don't like the implication that there is something wrong with this person simply because she expressed discomfort with this practice.  

post #47 of 136
As
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaggieLC View Post

@Good Enough Mum
I'm wondering if your "shock" at my use of a commonly used word is due to your perhaps not knowing the actual definition of the word. The word "Prude" is not an insult.

Here's the definition from the Merriam-Webster Dictionary


prude



noun \ˈprüd\

: a person who is easily shocked or offended by things that do not shock or offend other people

That's it. Someone who is easily shocked or offended at things that do not shock or offend other people. Do you see that as an "insult?" I don't, It simply an aptly descriptive word.




smile.gif  

If we are going to talk about other people, in my experience most other people are uncomfortable watching a mother nurse her three year old and seeing a new friends breasts. The OPs friend probably represents the majority. I know very few people who are comfortable in that situation - virtually none outside of this forum.
post #48 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by NiteNicole View Post

As
If we are going to talk about other people, in my experience most other people are uncomfortable watching a mother nurse her three year old and seeing a new friends breasts. The OPs friend probably represents the majority. I know very few people who are comfortable in that situation - virtually none outside of this forum.


I'm just calling it the way I see it. My issue is that the OP's friend asked her to change her own behavior in her own house AND the OP's friend didn't let her own children see her breastfeed her babies. That's someone who is more shocked at things that most people. No?

 

As for "the majority" I guess it depends. I live in the suburbs of a large city. Not in one of the Hipster Neighborhoods (although I work in these neighborhoods a lot) but in the burbs, which tend to be a bit more conservative than the city. I can't say any of my friends would have asked me not to nurse in front of her or her children. Most of my friends and family either nurse into toddlerhood or preschool or are at least comfortable with this practice.  No one I know (except one person, who didn't even want her son to know "what that is" in regards to breastfeeding) would be "shocked" at a toddler child breastfeeding. So, in my world, someone who is shocked by a toddler nursing is unusual.

 

PLUS, the environment in which this situation is taking place is the OP's home where breastfeeding 3 year olds is not "shocking"  to other people in that environment. Therefor, the label I supplied IS apt in her enviroment.

 

I don't get what is "shocking" about someone perhaps, maybe catching a glimpse of a lactating breast or a child at the breast. Thus, I see that attitude as unusual. It's my opinion. I'm not going to be convinced that being "shocked" by this is usual.

post #49 of 136

Has the OP ever come back and added to the discussion? It would be interesting to see what choice she made.

 

If she has no desire to do so then this is simply an academic discussion, and we're all just guessing.

 

It would be informative to see what she decided to do.

post #50 of 136

@ MaggieLC...

 

"I'm just calling it the way I see it. My issue is that the OP's friend asked her to change her own behavior in her own house AND the OP's friend didn't let her own children see her breastfeed her babies. That's someone who is more shocked at things that most people. No?"

 

How are you coming away with this from the description from the OP?

 

The OP said this...

 

"We've had them over twice, been to their house a twice, to the playground and out to eat, and they saw us nurse every time, and never said anything. Until two days ago, at my house, my son popped off to ask me a question and for that instant my boob was "out". The mom called me when they got home to ask that in the future I give her a heads up when we are going to nurse, so she can take her boys to another room. She was trying to be super nice and apologetic about it. I offered to do a better job staying covered, which I'm admittedly not as concerned with in my house and I thought it wasn't an issue, but no, she just wants to take her 3 kids into some other room whenever my son needs to nurse, because she doesn't want them seeing "that" "until they are ready."

 

Clearly, the friend was not at all asking the OP to change her behavior in her own home.

post #51 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaggieLC View Post
 

Has the OP ever come back and added to the discussion? It would be interesting to see what choice she made.

 

If she has no desire to do so then this is simply an academic discussion, and we're all just guessing.

 

It would be informative to see what she decided to do.

Yes, we are all just guessing because the friend isn't here to clarify... anything. You have made many assumptions about this friend of the OP, and you are making it sound like you know for sure her thought process. You don't. None of us do.

post #52 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaggieLC View Post
 


I'm just calling it the way I see it. My issue is that the OP's friend asked her to change her own behavior in her own house AND the OP's friend didn't let her own children see her breastfeed her babies. That's someone who is more shocked at things that most people. No?

 

As for "the majority" I guess it depends. I live in the suburbs of a large city. Not in one of the Hipster Neighborhoods (although I work in these neighborhoods a lot) but in the burbs, which tend to be a bit more conservative than the city. I can't say any of my friends would have asked me not to nurse in front of her or her children. Most of my friends and family either nurse into toddlerhood or preschool or are at least comfortable with this practice.  No one I know (except one person, who didn't even want her son to know "what that is" in regards to breastfeeding) would be "shocked" at a toddler child breastfeeding. So, in my world, someone who is shocked by a toddler nursing is unusual.

 

PLUS, the environment in which this situation is taking place is the OP's home where breastfeeding 3 year olds is not "shocking"  to other people in that environment. Therefor, the label I supplied IS apt in her enviroment.

 

I don't get what is "shocking" about someone perhaps, maybe catching a glimpse of a lactating breast or a child at the breast. Thus, I see that attitude as unusual. It's my opinion. I'm not going to be convinced that being "shocked" by this is usual.

Yep, that is YOUR opinion. And it seems it's the opinion of the OP's friend that she is not ready for her sons to see breasts yet. Or the act of nursing. We just don't know for sure. Doesn't matter though. That's how she feels. She's not a terrible person for it. She actually sounds like the complete opposite of terrible.

post #53 of 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaggieLC View Post
 

@Good Enough Mum I'm wondering if your "shock" at my use of a commonly used word is due to your perhaps not knowing the actual definition of the word. The word "Prude" is not an insult.

 

It is normally used as an insult rather than a neutral term, and I'm honestly pretty sceptical at the idea that you didn't know this perfectly well when you used it. If you really didn't know that, then consider this your heads-up that it is indeed typically considered a pejorative term and that this will thus be how people are likely to interpret it.

post #54 of 136

"I think she's acting like a self -insulated prude and honestly, her disrespectful, prudish, intolerant behavior would definitely be a deal breaker for me."

 

This statement isn't insulting? In this day and age, the word prude is a negative description of someone, and I don't think if someone were called a prude they'd shrug it off as being a neutral description of themselves. They'd most likely take offense. It's used as insult more than not. The ironic thing of the above statement is that the author claims the OP's friend is being intolerant. The author needs to take a good look in the mirror before she calls others intolerant.

post #55 of 136
The OP's friend can't help where she is regarding this issue. Like I said, she's a victim of a much larger problem. The best thing to do would be to use compassion and try to educate her.
post #56 of 136

I agree that since you were in HER home, it wasn't as big of a deal. You don't know what her personal situation is. Now if you were in your own home and she asked that you not whip out a breast to feed your child, that would be a bit much... a deal breaker.

 

I also have to agree that it is hard to find friends sometimes. I feel very isolated too, and rarely meet people with similar beliefs, etc. The fact that you get along with her otherwise, and the kids get along too...that's a good thing. Eventually, if you remain friends, you may get some insight as to why she seemed a bit uptight about the briefly exposed breast.

post #57 of 136

Like i said, low expectations is key.

 

I am sorry the OP came here to find at least some support, and instead got ridiculed herself.  It is offensive when people feel they have to 'leave the room', when you are doing something natural and beneficial like breastfeeding. Even when trying to be understanding, it is hurtful. I wish  people had been more sensitive on this thread to that feeling.

I suppose its just one more crunchy mom turned off by mdc...pity, we could do with a few more.

 

And yes, offense at the sight of a womans breast is prudish. Call it what it is, and dont make excuses about it. A prude is a prude!

However, the 11yo is a different matter.

 

Sorry OP! I hope you come back, and are able to share with us again, on different issues relating to good parenting.

post #58 of 136
Very well said, contactmaya. I hope she comes back as well. I had a friend once tell me to stop posting things about breastfeeding on Facebook because she found it "disturbing". She didn't say it a rude way, but she said it nonetheless. And she has been my friend for over thirty years! I was incredibly hurt and now I keep my distance though we still talk. I can't be myself around her, which I'm sure is how the OP is feeling about her friend.
post #59 of 136

I think it is weird that the woman claims she covered herself up when breastfeeding around her own kids. I don't buy it. I think it had more to do with the 11 year old being present when a non-family member exposed her breasts briefly while breastfeeding. Perhaps I would have said "it isn't polite to stare" if I saw my 11 year old son hanging around every time she breast fed. If it continued to happen, after several comments to my son, I would hope my friend would cover up to avoid the awkwardness, but I still wouldn't have the nerve to ask her to do so. 

 

I would be taken back and insulted by this sort of comment from a friend. It has happened to me before in a different context. It was awkward to say the least. Maybe it's because I am so NOT confrontational. 

post #60 of 136
You said she was not rude about it so I think you should respect her own feelings. Whether you decide to pursue the the friendship or not. Everyone has different views and I do not think it makes her ignorant for wanting her boys not to see your breasts . Now if she was rude and called you up and said you are disgusting and so on, than that would be a different story. I tend to be a more modest person and when my son is older I will cover up in front if him if I have another child that I am bf in the future. He is 13 months and I do not plan on stopping breast feeding anytime soon. I am doing BLW. Breast feeding is beautiful and natural and our god given right! With that said young boys have many confusing sexual thoughts and to them it may be hard to differentiate a mother feeding her child and seeing bare breasts. I know I may be persecuted for that comment lol but we have no idea what goes on in the mind of young boys... I think she is probably concerned for the older son as I would be too. I also don't think she was trying to make demands in your house that is why she said she would take them out of the room. Your feelings are valid too though and it sounds like you need a friend so maybe talk to her about how you feel. It could be god' s way of bringing two women very close:)
Edited by apeydef - 11/25/13 at 6:35pm
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