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October 2013 Chit Chat - Page 79

post #1561 of 2728

Jaimee, I'm with Sara in the setting rules and boundaries even if you have to be stern.  Making giant messes does happen, but I would not tolerate pulling things out of cabinets while someone else is looking, just for the sake of making a mess.  I know your kids are a little crazier than mine, but have you tried being more stern in setting boundaries for the younger ones?  Its a hassle and there would be a learning curve, but not letting Avalon be self sufficient because her brothers would be in her way making messes seems like it could be detrimental to Avalon learning to take care of herself.  Independence is huge for development of self care skills, and it sounds like she is not able to be as independent as she could because of her brothers. She is a VERY bright girl and is probably way more capable of taking care of things on her own than you are giving her credit for (or giving her access to).  Can you put up a gate to keep them out of the kitchen while she makes herself snacks and breakfast?  Or even while she makes ALL the kids snacks or breakfast.  My oldest is a bit older than Avalon, but DD1 is her age.  About dressing-  yes, I just sent DD1 to dress herself and she came out in a tank top and SHORT shorts, so I told her it is cold and she needs to wear long pants and at least a tshirt.  She may not always match, and she throws some interesting accessories in there (boots and skirts, tutus over jeans) but she dresses herself and its a great outlet for self expression.

 

Abra thats great that there is still a family interested in the bus.  Sound VERY hopeful, they seem serious!

post #1562 of 2728
Quote:
Originally Posted by seraf View Post

Abra, have fun at your party. I hope the financing comes through for the bus family.

Sonja, microwave on the fridge? Yikes! I can see pouring hot all over myself. I'm glad it works for y'all.

Jaimee, the bit I forgot to add, my kids are mostly related to me, we come from a long line of "life is good" type people. I think that gives me another advantage. I'm way chill and more likely to laugh about frustration than cry. My kids are phenomenally laid back, which makes it that much easier for me. I don't have a lot of projects and commitments, so it's easy for me to just be in the moment without big worries.

Our kitchen is tiny and has NO counter space, so on top of the fridge is the only space for it. We don't use it a lot, mostly for reheating things, so it isn't a big deal that it is up high:)
post #1563 of 2728
Quote:
Originally Posted by dashley111 View Post
 

Jaimee, I'm with Sara in the setting rules and boundaries even if you have to be stern.  Making giant messes does happen, but I would not tolerate pulling things out of cabinets while someone else is looking, just for the sake of making a mess.  I know your kids are a little crazier than mine, but have you tried being more stern in setting boundaries for the younger ones?  Its a hassle and there would be a learning curve, but not letting Avalon be self sufficient because her brothers would be in her way making messes seems like it could be detrimental to Avalon learning to take care of herself.  Independence is huge for development of self care skills, and it sounds like she is not able to be as independent as she could because of her brothers. She is a VERY bright girl and is probably way more capable of taking care of things on her own than you are giving her credit for (or giving her access to).  Can you put up a gate to keep them out of the kitchen while she makes herself snacks and breakfast?  Or even while she makes ALL the kids snacks or breakfast.  My oldest is a bit older than Avalon, but DD1 is her age.  About dressing-  yes, I just sent DD1 to dress herself and she came out in a tank top and SHORT shorts, so I told her it is cold and she needs to wear long pants and at least a tshirt.  She may not always match, and she throws some interesting accessories in there (boots and skirts, tutus over jeans) but she dresses herself and its a great outlet for self expression.

 

:yeah 

post #1564 of 2728

Abra, that's great about the bus!

 

Sara, I envy your "chill-ness." Just like I envy Abra's non-emotional-ness. Hehe.

 

Jaimee, I think the Midwest is getting hit with another early wave of sickness. So frustrating! Sora and I both have colds. Maybe we'll get the illness out of the way early this year? Totally wishful thinking, I'm sure... I just can't imagine being sick every other week again like last year!

 

I took Sora on a walk and we ended up outside for a good 2+ hours. Haven't done that in FOREVER, so it was great! We stopped at her BFF's house, who happened to be outside with his mom, so they played while we chatted. (Will post pictures shortly.) I also ran into the neighbors who moved across the street from us! I'm SO excited to report that they are not at all how we were afraid of them being. Omg it's the biggest weight off my shoulders... and exciting! They look to be around our age like 30, and they're expecting their first baby in January! YAY! He's a police officer too, so I feel super safe knowing we have him across the street. :) How cool is that? That pretty much made this neighborhood the best neighborhood ever... We have 7 like-minded couples with babies/toddlers in a 1 block radius in any direction from us. :thumb 

post #1565 of 2728

That is really awesome Joanie!  We have no neighbors our age, but my cousin lives down the street and me and his wife (and her son, 15 months) get together several times a week.  We also have a police officer neighbor, and his kids have robbed several local houses and regularly get arrested for stealing car parts :lol

post #1566 of 2728
Kirsten needs to win some kind of award for awesomest snap ever.
post #1567 of 2728

Um, did any of you receive a Snap from me today? Because I'm pretty sure Sora sent something and I have no idea what it was...

post #1568 of 2728
How crunchy are you quiz. An oldie but goody.

I got 177, crunchier than grape nuts.
Edited by seraf - 10/19/13 at 12:55pm
post #1569 of 2728

I'm an 88, Sara. Pretty crispy. Totally an in-between-er.

post #1570 of 2728
I got 139.
post #1571 of 2728
Lol. Of course, I plugged in my crunchiest births and such. When I put in different answers for my least crunchy options, I can get it as low as 115!
post #1572 of 2728
Thread Starter 

I really appreciate you all as sounding boards and value your advice, so I hope you don't mind that I'm going to pick this all apart to see if I can find some ways to try new things...

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by seraf View Post


I know, I know, it will pay off later, but some things will also come naturally as they get older.

Some things will, certainly, but my kids rarely chose to be more independent when I do things for them. I they would still let me put their socks on and tie their shoes if I was willing.
 
A good point... Avalon would still prefer me to tie her shoes b/c I tie better knots than she does, but there is only one way to learn.  However, Austin is way behind Avalon in fine motor skills and has trouble putting on his velcro shoes.  He literally just figured out how to put on shirts a few months ago.  I work with him Montessori style whenever I can, having him pour things, use tongs to transfer items, play with eyedroppers, sort objects, etc. etc. to try and improve his motor skills, but I think I have to accept it will take him longer to master things.  I cannot trust him to wipe thoroughly- this would be a hygiene issue.
Avery needs to be held on the toilet and wiped so I have to take care of that. 

All my kids have been able to perch on the toilet from 14-18 months. Avery probably just doesn't know he can yet. My older kids had me convinced thy couldn't wipe before 4, but since Shay can, I'll tell you how he does it. He squats on the floor and uses a damp cloth wipe. A regular baby wipe would work, too. He wipes, checks, wipes, checks, wipes. He usually has it in 3 wipes. He's not totally independent with this yet, but he will be much earlier than the other kids were.
I've tried letting Avery perch on the toilet.  He falls in.  Yes, I've dropped my son in the toilet on more than one occasion.  I've started holding him with just one hand to get him to start balancing better, but he grabs my hand and puts it on his side, clearly telling me to hold him.  Wiping?  No, it would be a swipe at best and my kids have mushy poop that needs to be cleaned out.  I'm amazed at what Shay can do.

Avalon can get her own cereal in a bowl, but can't reach the rice milk.

Move the rice milk lower?
Yes, you would think this would solve the problem, but the rice milk doesn't fit on the lower shelves and we want all the liquids on the top so that Avery doesn't pull them down, which has happened.  It's a ridiculous problem.
She could with a step stool of course, but by the time all this has happened, Avery has taken off with the majority of the glass containers in the fridge and I'm chasing after him to prevent major spills and glass breakage.

Hmm, my kids love to empty the fridge, but I don't mess around with that running around stuff. I don't chase and my children can generally tell when I'm serious. "Shay put that in the fridge and bring me the ..." Is usually effective for me. I usually make them put everything back if they get it out. And thy don't spill or break, they're gentle. Mostly.
 
Gentle?  Not my children.  Objects are pretty much always thrown after a few seconds of examination.  Austin and Avery feed off each other's behavior.  I think Austin would be passed it by now if it weren't for Avery carrying on the behavior.  I have tried being very direct and firm, asking for the objects to be returned.  I try trading.  I've tried asking him to bring me something else.  It doesn't work.  Someone always has to go after him or ignore him completely and risk mustard or BBQ sauce on the furniture.  The same happens with knives, which he has swiped on numerous occasions from the dish washer, the counter, and even the knife block with the aid of a chair he pushed from two rooms away.

Similar things happen when I try to get Austin to make his own stuff... Avery will take everything out of the cabinets while Austin is in there rummaging around in his slow, 3 year old fashion.  So by the time he has chosen his cereal and gotten out a bowl, I'm cleaning up spilled cereal boxes, dumped oatmeal, and dishes all over the floor.  Not to mention all the hitting that goes on while Austin is choosing and Avery is trying to take things.  Again, just not worth it.  So I do it.

My biggest trick is to put the boys on the counter when they need to be contained. They love t sit on the counter to help me. They can't get down by themselves so they are effectively in a playpen, but they see it as a privilege.
Avery would see this as a privilege as well.  But he would not sit.  He would stand.  And jump.  And dance.  I know this b/c every chance he gets, he pushes chairs from the other room to the counters, gets up on them and begins to empty out the cabinets.  You saw in my snap the other day that he made it into the liquor cabinet.  I have rubber bands around all the cabinet hardware now that doesn't already have child proofing.
Do you guys with olders not deal with this?  Am I missing some magical way to be doing things?  Or is it the combo of 3.75 years old and nearly 2 that is doing me in?  'Cause, Sara and Ash, both your olders are older than Avalon.

So, Ari turned 8 in August. She is freaking awesome. ... I can't even think f all the helpful things she can do. She's great. And I have two of them! Life is so much simpler when all four kids are home than when it's just adults and babies.
This is awesome.  Avalon has grown mostly tired of Avery's antics (I can't really blame her) so she gets sassy and defiant when I ask her to help me with him.  It's really unfortunate.  I've forced the issue a few times, telling her it is part of being in our family and she'll do it, but when her heart isn't in it, she doesn't do a very good job.  The other day I found Avery abandoned outside in a wagon that she had been pulling around (something they both seemed to enjoy for a while).  He was trying to get out and would have soon succeeded and likely run into the street in the next few minutes.  Not good.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Abraisme View Post
 

Jaimee,  I think it just depends on your kids and their personalities really.  Luckily for me, Olivine and Coralie don't fight that much and O never hits Coralie (but C will hit or bite O sometimes).  Our biggest issue here is who gets to pick the game or show on the iPad.

Yes, I think I have to agree.  Austin and Avery beat the crap out of each other.  Like cause each other to bleed.  Avalon will do her fair share of pushing and clotheslining as well, but generally can avoid violence.  She prefers to yell at them instead.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dashley111 View Post
 

Jaimee, I'm with Sara in the setting rules and boundaries even if you have to be stern.  Making giant messes does happen, but I would not tolerate pulling things out of cabinets while someone else is looking, just for the sake of making a mess.  I know your kids are a little crazier than mine, but have you tried being more stern in setting boundaries for the younger ones?  Its a hassle and there would be a learning curve, but not letting Avalon be self sufficient because her brothers would be in her way making messes seems like it could be detrimental to Avalon learning to take care of herself.  Independence is huge for development of self care skills, and it sounds like she is not able to be as independent as she could because of her brothers. She is a VERY bright girl and is probably way more capable of taking care of things on her own than you are giving her credit for (or giving her access to).  Can you put up a gate to keep them out of the kitchen while she makes herself snacks and breakfast?  Or even while she makes ALL the kids snacks or breakfast. 

I totally agree with you, but I have no idea how to make it happen.  I don't tolerate the messes either, but that doesn't stop them from happening, unfortunately.  Stern doesn't even cover what I have tried.  And it isn't fair to Avalon that she doesn't get to do certain things that she could do on her own.  And as for the kitchen, nope... we have three entrances to the kitchen, one of which is not blockable as it's 10' wide.  The only time Avalon gets without her brothers is 2 hours on Saturday morning when dh takes the boys grocery shopping with him.  I try to spend that time doing things with her- crafts, homework,  projects, or having her help me with things like cleaning, cooking, gardening, etc.

 

I know things will change in the next year, I'm just wondering what I can push, what I can focus on that makes sense to focus on, what sort of tricks or tips other might have that have BTDT.  I feel like my kids can do a lot of things that other kids can't do and I'm mostly proud of their abilities (I know it may not sound like it right now!) but the destructive behavior is really killing me.

post #1573 of 2728
Thread Starter 

Oh and I got a 177, too!  Sara and I are crunchy twins!!

post #1574 of 2728

I got 162, so I'm pretty up there..  It's not using cloth diapers that killed me, heh.

 

Jaimee,   Gah, parenting is hard and it's so hard to relate to what someone else has to go through if your own kids are just different.  I've had plenty of times where I was totally judgy about the behaviors of my friends kids..  Now Coralie does most of the things that I used to judge about, sooo.... yeah....  Parenting is humbling and I'm certainly a lot less judgemental these days.  Some people literally do get 5 super easy kids and some people have 3 very difficult ones.  It sucks that there really isn't a great answer sometimes.  :dizzy  I guess my best advice would be to pick 1 method and sticking with it.  Like I said, it literally took us a year to teach Cyan how to do some of his chores, but with patience and persistence he did learn.  Following through it the absolute hardest part of parenting and I have to work on it all the time.

post #1575 of 2728
Jaimee, plan B is duck tape.
post #1576 of 2728
I'm surely not trying to sound judgmental. I'm the first to admit that I got easy kids. I don't really think of Shay as being advanced, he's way behind where the big kids were at this age on everything but gross motor (O was the latest with fine motor).

Here he is bawling because I won't let him walk on A. Hurting people is non-negotiable in my book. He lacks the empathy to understand that walking across her stomach is painful. I enforce the rule.
post #1577 of 2728
Thread Starter 

Sara, you're seriously not the first person to mention this to me.  I had a semi-friend (I say this b/c we've only hung out a few times) over the other day and she hadn't been over in a couple months- she was surprised by Avery's behavior.  She said his behavior would not fly at her house and he would be stuck in a play pen.  Yeah, that's not happening, but still... perhaps this helps to illuminate the tornado that is Avery.

 

Abra, thanks for the reassuring words.  :)  I hate to just keep coming back to the place where I feel like I can't really do anything b/c of their temperaments.  My fixer self wants to try new things and try and solve my issues.  I wonder, too, your anecdote about Cyan... did it take him a year to learn or was it just that once he was older, he was able to learn it?  I often wonder if I just waited a little longer to push some things if they would happen so much easier than if I try to push things when they simply aren't ready. 

post #1578 of 2728
Jaimee, I really think a lot of it is genetic. 3 hard kids in a row just says to me that you or your DH is a firecracker. wink1.gif my kids make messes. Sometimes I ignore the mess so I can clean something else. To illustrate the other side, I've had people ask how much I have to beat my kids to get them to behave so well. Lol. Not lately, the babies are brats in public anymore, but I recognize that my kids' behavior is unexpected.
post #1579 of 2728
Quote:
Originally Posted by birdhappy85 View Post

Um, did any of you receive a Snap from me today? Because I'm pretty sure Sora sent something and I have no idea what it was...

It was a beautiful scribble.
post #1580 of 2728
114. Mmm. Love that whole grain crunch.

Higher than I thought it'd be. LOL
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