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When Should Kids Start Kindergarten (redshirting study) - Page 2

post #21 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asiago View Post

I am confused by red shirting.
US state laws have a minimum compulsory age to begin school of age six (24 states), age seven (14 states) and age eight (2 states). http://www.ncsl.org/documents/educ/ECSCompulsoryAge.pdf
Only eight states are age five.
It seems cutoff dates are seen as the required age but in reality they are not, they are to send children a year earlier than the law states to begin education.
Shouldn't this this be the exception and not the norm?

I live in one of the 8yo states, and "begin education" is a bit of a misnomer.  It's a truancy law, pure and simple, since it's based off compulsory attendance.  A child must be accounted for by age 8, either enrolled in school or registered as homeschooled.  

 

And in our state it is the child's birthday that counts, not the start of the school year that they turn 8, so really a child could wait until their birthday to start school, though I doubt that ever happens.  Because our compulsory age is so old here, the only people really aware of it are the ones intending to homeschool.  My 9yo is registered, my 7yo not.  Parents who fully intend to send children to school are rarely aware of the age of compulsory attendance here, IME.  

 

So, yes, they are the required age, not a year before, at least in WA.

 

Otherwise, I'm a little confused by what you think should be the norm.

post #22 of 36

Right. And this compulsory age is also a not big consideration for building school parents because age of compulsory attendance has little to do with grade-level appropriateness. Kids may not "have" to start until age 8 in some places, that doesn't mean that they can begin kindergarten at age 8. 

 

I see redshirting a lot but I also see a lot of families petitioning to have their child start kindy before 5. The economy is likely to curb any extreme excess in redshirting in many places. 

post #23 of 36

Asiago, the age at which your child attends school is not really the issue with red-shirting: it's the grade-level in which they are placed as compared to the "normal" age that counts. In practice this usually means that in order to place your child a year back you start them in KG a year later than you would otherwise. 

 

I'm in Canada where red-shirting isn't really a thing. That's because when parents keep their kids out of KG for that first year because they don't feel they're quite ready to start school, when they do start school the following year, the kids are placed in 1st grade (where they would have been if they'd started the year before.)

 

Miranda

post #24 of 36
My birthday is in late March, so when I started kindergarten I was 5.5 and a pretty average age for my grade. I ended up skipping 2nd grade, though, so by 3rd grade I was by far the youngest in my class (I was 7 until nearly April of 3rd grade). I know this is just anecdotal, but I never had any problems, socially or academically. It just wasn't ever an issue, even in high school.

My DS has a late October birthday, and at the time he started kindergarten the cutoff was in December (now it's September, or will be come fall). We struggled with whether to send him to school at 4-going-on-5, especially because in my area red shirting, especially of boys, seems to be the norm. We ended up deciding to send him, and he's now in 4th grade and we're confident that we made the right decision. He would be insanely bored if he were in 3rd grade this year.

I do wish there was an maximum age cutoff the way there's a minimum cutoff. Even when the cutoff was December, I knew people who held their kids with April birthdays back "so he'll be big for football," and that irked me, to have my kid competing academically with kids THAT much older than him. Luckily he's very bright and is at the top of his class despite being one of the youngest.

Now that the cutoff is September, all it's done is make parents of kids with summer birthdays worry about whether to send their kids to kindergarten, the way parents of kids with fall birthdays used to.
post #25 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by limabean View Post


I do wish there was an maximum age cutoff the way there's a minimum cutoff. Even when the cutoff was December, I knew people who held their kids with April birthdays back "so he'll be big for football," and that irked me, to have my kid competing academically with kids THAT much older than him. Luckily he's very bright and is at the top of his class despite being one of the youngest.

 

It irks me for some reason too. Selfishly it's because it makes my life more complicated when I ponder early entrance for my LO who barely misses cut off but I know some kids enrolling will be a year or two older than her because of redshirting. LOL

post #26 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by lauren View Post

I hear you!!



 



The other problem that I see, is that 5 year old who are still in preschool can be terribly bored! Some of them act out as a result of this boredom. They're just trying to create something interesting! 



 



It's almost like we need another "grade" between preschool and kindergarten now!!


 



One of my kids attended a small, church-based preschool. The classes were divided into the 3's, 4's, and the pre-Ks. The Pre-K track was for children too advanced for preschool but not yet ready for kindergarten. They attended a 1/2-day program 5 days per week. I really like this idea, especially where I have an LO who turns 5 late-summer. On the other hand, it's a little absurd that our System has changed so much and so drastically that we *need* a program like this.
post #27 of 36

This is an excellent point.

The fact is though, most parents have their kids in school  the year they turn 5, and many more, like them to begin  full time preK, at age 4, as well. Im  about the only person i know who didnt enroll either  of my children in full time pre K, and that is considered radical.

 

As for the Kindergarten year, my own motivation was that getting into a good private school is about as easy is pulling your teeth out, and if you get a spot, then you take it!

The same could be said for a good public school.

Another important consideration, is that had i not enrolled my son at age 5, he would have had to start First grade  when all the others had done Kindergarten.  So there's no point in waiting   a year, because the child just has to start in the older grade.

post #28 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by contactmaya View Post

Another important consideration, is that had i not enrolled my son at age 5, he would have had to start First grade  when all the others had done Kindergarten.  So there's no point in waiting   a year, because the child just has to start in the older grade.

Dos this vary by state, I wonder? I've definitely known kids (in CA) who started kindergarten at 6 and a half years old.
post #29 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by limabean View Post

Dos this vary by state, I wonder? I've definitely known kids (in CA) who started kindergarten at 6 and a half years old.

I've taught in three states and have never come across the problem Maya mentioned.
post #30 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by contactmaya View Post
 

Another important consideration, is that had i not enrolled my son at age 5, he would have had to start First grade  when all the others had done Kindergarten.  So there's no point in waiting   a year, because the child just has to start in the older grade.

 

This is how things generally work in Canada. Assuming you're in the US, I'm surprised about this: I thought most states were happy to red-shirt by starting 6-year-olds in kindergarten.

 

Here in Canada I know several people who have held their kids out of kindergarten because they felt they were too young, and I think there definitely can be a point to it. It gives kids who need it an extra year to mature, to reach the point where they're ready to cope with being away from home all day in a structured environment. It gives them an extra year of grounding amongst home and family, and of unstructured play time. They entered first grade secure and ready for school and thrived in 1st grade. 

 

If you believe that school readiness is a matter of training and experience, then you won't see the point in giving a miss to the kindergarten year and starting in 1st. But if, like me, you believe that there's a strong element of developmental maturity, then keeping your child out of school that year can be seen as a precious gift, allowing him the time to grow up and become ready without the stress of a situation he's not ready for. 

 

We started homeschooling because my eldest wasn't emotionally ready to separate from home and school at age 5. We stuck with it because we all loved it. But when she did start school years later, her best academic and social fit was not with kids a year younger: it was actually the group a year or two older. Lack of readiness for KG doesn't necessarily mean your child is globally young-for-his-age, that he'll be slower to reach adolescence, less mature at age 18, unable to grasp multiplication or quadratic equations until he's a year older than most, that he'll forever connect best socially with kids younger than him. It may just mean that with his particular temperament and developmental quirks, he'd be best off learning in a less structured environment for another year at age 5.

 

Miranda

post #31 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by limabean View Post


Dos this vary by state, I wonder? I've definitely known kids (in CA) who started kindergarten at 6 and a half years old.

 

I can't say what other states do but yes, in CA, starting kids at 6 is common in many areas. There is no rule making red-shirted kids go straight into 1st grade.

post #32 of 36

In both CA and MD kids can go to kindy a year later. I'm not sure what happens to kids who are older than that - my guess is that if a whole lot of kids were turning 7 in kindy that districts would start encouraging kids to start 1st grade instead. There is obviously a cut-off but I don't know what that is or how its managed. 

 

Everyone I've met has made the decision to start kindy based on personal family concerns for childcare needs and on developmental needs of the child during that particular year compared to the expectations of the schools available. I don't know anyone who made the choice to redshirt because they wanted their kids to have a competitive edge over other children (for sports or any other reason).  

post #33 of 36
I wanted to clarify that I was not old.for grade. I skipped kindy, but started first grade on time. I was older than many others because I had a december birthday, but not because of redshirting.

Anyway, I really think it should be what's best for the children, though. All of them. My 4 year old is in a music class with a seven year old who is slightly delayed. It might he good for him, but it certainly isn't for her. He is loud, and a bit of a bully, and she is so much smaller and.younger, it really does interfere with what she is learning. It is a class for 3, 4, and 5 year olds.
post #34 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by IdentityCrisisMama View Post
 

Everyone I've met has made the decision to start kindy based on personal family concerns for childcare needs and on developmental needs of the child during that particular year compared to the expectations of the schools available. I don't know anyone who made the choice to redshirt because they wanted their kids to have a competitive edge over other children (for sports or any other reason).  

Unfortunately, it's quite prevalent here in my small community. A personal friend of mine actually redshirted her daughter with a July birthday because she wanted her daughter to be reading before kindergarten. Never mind that the schools here absolutely DO NOT expect readers and kindergarteners typically have a wide spectrum of fluent readers to those who can barely recognize letters and numbers.

post #35 of 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by grumpybear View Post
 

Unfortunately, it's quite prevalent here in my small community. A personal friend of mine actually redshirted her daughter with a July birthday because she wanted her daughter to be reading before kindergarten.  

I worry about that on a couple levels, as I'm sure you do too. For one, kids who are too advanced on material being taught will have a negative experience. Also, I'd be worried about just the general idea of a parent wanting their kid to be "better" than other kids - or more advanced than they are. It's just not good way to view our own children. The reality is that we're all pretty darned average and it is just so crappy to be raised  thinking that's not good enough.:( What a bummer that this is common in your community. 

post #36 of 36
My son is a young 5 and started K this year. He was definitely ready. 6 months in, he's doing fine. His teacher is pleased with his performance and he's well behaved and has friends. I did get funny looks when I told others that I wasn't red shirting. Red shirting is very common in Texas.

I don't like how schools are so hung up on you must be x age by x date. DS has lots of friends who missed the cutoff and even though they are doing private K, they will still have to enroll in k at the public school and then take the acceleration test to skip into first.
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