What are the negatives (and positives) on soy milk?

[mother_sunshine]

I drink soy dream daily and no longer drink cow's milk at all (except in cheese and yogurt). I was recently told not to drink very much soymilk. Can anyone tell me why? I also heard something about it interrupting or somehow messing with female hormones? My daughter drinks it as well.

[pottermamma]

Hi again !!! I'm not sure why someone would tell you not to drink too much soy milk, but I have always heard that soy is really great for women especially those in menapause (I don't think I spelled that one right: ) or approaching it???? We all LOVE Eden Soy here so I'd be really interested in hearing why you shouldn't use it so much. The only negative thing I've heard is that soy is really allergenic so you should be careful introducing it to a child too early on other than that I've only heard good things about soy

[mother_sunshine]

Thank you pottermamma

BTW, I love your quote.

[phathui5]

negatives

* I read in Getting Pregnant that intake of soy products can decrease your chances of conceiving (not good to me).

* It contains plant estrogens that may not be good for pre-menopausal women (or for a guy's sex drive).

[Zina]

We go through a lot of Edensoy and have conceived under the most unlikely circumstances. And it definately has not had an affect on my husband's sex drive! But then, maybe we are just freaks rather than a random sampling.

[pottermamma]

I guess we'd be in that freak boat with you then zina:LOL We drink tons of soy milk too and Dh is as horney as ever and no problems getting preggo either

[tessamami]

Soy really isn't all that and a bag of chips...

Tofu with meat or seaweeds is fine
and so is Miso (fermented soy)

But other kinds of soy products aren't very easily digested.

My DD's pediatrician tried cluing me in in his own primitive way: "they make plastic out of soy"

I finally got the real dirt from Susun Weed, herbalist and author of Herbal for the Childbearing Year at her website: http://www.susunweed.com

Type "soy" in the search box.

Here's a synopsis:

THE DARK SIDE OF SOY
Herbal expert reveals too much tofu can be dangerous.
Consuming large amounts of unfermented soy-including soy milk, tofu, "fake" cheese and lunchmeat, tofu hotdogs, and soyburgers can lead to a myriad of health problems.
Herbal healing expert Susun Weed says soy can promote brittle bones, thyroid problems, memory loss, vision impairment, irregular heartbeat, depression, vulnerability to infections, and increased risk of stroke. Are all soy foods bad? Weed explains:
· Why tamari and miso are the soy family's "good guys"
· How soy interferes with the body's ability to liberate, utilize, or create key nutrients,
such as calcium, zinc, B12, and thyroid hormone
· Current research showing soy isoflavones may promote breast cancer cells
· What complementary foods, such as seaweed, counteract soy's negative effects

Real food for real people. What is real food? Real food contains no added ingredients.

Quick quiz
Which is real food: milk or soy beverage?
Which is real food: margarine or butter?
Which is real food: hamburger or soyburger?
The above is also from Susun's website. Note: vegan alternatives need not contain soy. What about natural oils like olive (delicious on bread)
or veggie burgers assembed from whole grains, nuts and sprouts? Yum.

I loved the full article - she's really done her research. Available at: http://www.susunweed.com/Weed_letter...1.htm#surprise

[bebe luna]

Soy can be very good... but people tend to overdo it. I prefer to keep the soy products I eat, as close to natural as possible. I eat tempeh, miso, and edamame. I occassionally eat soy vegi burgers and soy cheese.
I know that fermented soy is meant to be the healthiest (tempeh, miso, etc).
A lot of soy products contain not-so-good ingrediants. Like Tofutti brand products contain partially hydrogonated oils. Many soy drinks contain lots of sugar.
Soy consumed too often can cause soy allergies.
Eat soy, but eat it consciouslly and jut don't over-do-it.

[valeria_vi]

just go to www/mercola.com and search for "soy"
you'll find tons of info.

[TwinMom]

Ack, I don't want to know all this! I'm trying to move my children to healthier eating habits and thought I could add more soy to their diets as I reduce the meat they eat. In the last 6 months I have stopped buying milk for them; they drink soymilk every day with dinner and have it on their cereal. I cook with it. What do I do? Do I stop using soymilk and go back to cow milk? Do I pump and use breastmilk for everything ?

I don't eat a lot of tofu, but I usually have a little bit each week--is that okay? I've started cooking with tempeh and am really enjoying it so maybe I could do more of that.

There are just too many foods to worry about. I have to be concerned about whether there are hidden meat and dairy ingredients in my food, artificial dyes in my kids' food, and I just don't have the energy to focus on anything else. What's a mama to do? :

[hippiemom]

i heard susun weed speak on soy last summer... very interesting. soy milk is highly processed, and also naturally high in aluminum. the "isoflavones" that many soymilk boxes tout as their benefit are phytoestrogens that mimic the action of actual estrogens in the body. i do drink it sometimes, and like it for smoothies, but i view it as a treat.

[pottermamma]

WOW What an article!!!!
Guess it just goes to show almost nothing is truely "good" for us anymore, unless we make it at home out of good, whole, REAL foods!!!!!!!!( Although I'm not so sure that I'd consider todays version of a hamburger a "real" food~ maybe elk or deer meat, although no meat still sounds good to me!!!!!) Back to the drawing board for us!!! I've been so happy using Eden Soy in place of milk and have not had any problems with it in any way, but if it is not healthy and especially considering the info about children we'll have to find something else
This is one of those times I am so happy to be informed but it would certainly have been easier to remain ignorant ~ There seem to be a lot of those situations in my life these days ~ Ignorance sure is bliss!! (Just kidding of course Thanks for sharing the info!!!!!)

[mother_sunshine]

:

Does anyone have the positives and negatives on RICE milk? Besides the fact that it doesn't taste as good...

[EnviroBecca]

Re: soy interfering with conception, I would think that's true if you have enough or too much estrogen already. If you have low estrogen, seems like it could help.

Saying that cow's milk is superior to soy milk because it's "real food" is overly simplistic IMO. Cow's milk from your average American supermarket is loaded with hormones and antibiotics. Any organic plant food is going to be lower in environmental toxins than any animal food, because animal bodies accumulate toxins into milk and meat. Supermarket milk may not be officially "processed" with a lot of stuff (except added vitamins) but it does go thru a lot of equipment and could be picking up bits of industrial lubricants and who knows what....

In general, moderation in all things! I have some dairy and some soy products in my diet, hoping to maximize the benefits and minimize the detriments of each, and I buy organic whenever I can.

[elainie]

Raw milk and products made from raw milk from grass fed cows (not grain fed as most organic milks are ) is the best way to go as far as consuming dairy is concerned. Rice milk is a very highly processed milk that is high in sugars and high on the glycemic index.
I make my own almond milk which is made from soaked organic almonds.
It tastes much better than any boxed milk out there and has none of the synthetic vitamins added like soy milk often has (synthetic vitamin D) which has been linked to cancer.
I would steer clear of any soymilk as far as giving it to my children or any child for that matter.

[pottermamma]

OK guys ~ I am so confused: :
I will do my own research when I finally have the time, but just from reading one of Susan Weeds articles and the rest of the posts from the folks here I don't know what I'm going to do...????

I look on the back of the box of the Eden Soy Extra that my family and I have been enjoying for the last 2-3 years and see that it does have seaweed in there, tessamami's post stated that combining soy with seaweed lessens/counteracts the negative effects of soy???? Does this work in the soy milk or is it simply the process of making soy milk that is bad??? or both???? then I read that it contains vitimin D2 "from the vegetable kingdom", whatever that means, guess I should call the company on that???? But ~ is that the same as synthetic vitamin D that you are talking about elainie?? And aren't our foods so often depleated of naturally occurring vitamins (and D I guess though you can get from the sun???) from over farming and poor faming methods in the past that even with buying organic as we do, don't we continue to need fortified foods to some extent???????

I am just so bummed cause the Eden Soy Extra is so nutricious (at least as it is writtend up on the "Nutrition Facts" label on the back : ) that we thought it was a good base for the rest of our meat free diet. I'd really like to hear more as milk is not an option for me either ~ I feel the same as EnviroBecca ~ that it really isn't much more of a real food than soy milk is chalking up to be. I also wonder if moderation isn't the key. Our diet includes a wide range of foods (dairy in yougart and cheese, eggs, grains, nuts, of course fresh fruit and veggies etc ~ so it isn't a diet based wholly on soy based protein like Ms. Weed warend against) and I think that is one of the most important aspects of eating to maintain a healthy system.

Can you post your recipe for almond milk elainie? and how do you store it? and, how often do you have to make a new batch (we go through about a case of soy milk a week (12 1 liter boxes))????

Thanks to all of you for your information and knowledge about this issue

[TwinMom]

I feel like you, pottermamma, totally confused. I mean, how are we supposed to know what to eat and what not to eat? The reason I give my kids soymilk is because of the calcium it has in it. I know there are other ways to get calcium, but they're not ways that my kids are likely to eat. Suggestions?

Does this mean that I have to give up Purely Decadent soy ice cream? That's just not gonna happen!

[mother_sunshine]

Tell me what you all think about this conflicting info...

Here is what the FDA has to say:

http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/fdsoypr.html

and another link with lots of articles (mostly positive). Type in soy benefits in search:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...CMD=&DB=PubMed

I am a bit leary of believing 100% in the FDA because I feel that they are largely controlled by money and big business. Then again, I don't know who Susun Weed is backed-by either. I just don't know who to believe anymore...

elainie, would you be willing to share your almond milk recipe with us? I would LOVE to try it! It sounds like a good solution to all this mess.

[EnviroBecca]

Pottermamma, instead of 12 1-liter boxes a week, have you considered powdered soymilk? (That is, if you are still going to use soymilk after this thread!) At my co-op the powder (from the bulk section) is a lot cheaper, it's less weight to carry home, and I'm not throwing away all those plastic containers. Also, if I'm not going to use a whole liter within a week or so, I can mix up a smaller amount and not worry about it going bad. It mixes up well in cold or hot water, and I can add vanilla or almond extract to make fancy flavored soymilk!

[Mommy StormRaven]

I have a bit of soy info in another thread regarding soy intake while PG and nursong. The overall gist of it is that the stuff isn't good.

It is a baby in the plant kingdom of the human diet - only been around for about 500 years and becasue of that it doesnt' digest easily.

I'm not saying it is EVIL but I am saying that it isn't good - It has been known to cause hypospadia in boys of PG women with a high soy intake. See my post about it for more info. It is on both the I'm PG forum and this one at Peggy's request. Dr. Mercola is the preemminant doc referenced in the articles.

What I do know is that the stuff is processed all to heaven and then some - given that how can it be that good for you?