nursing and night waking beyond 12 months

[toothlesswonder]

I am curious to know what your nursing and night sleep patterns are, especially after the approximated 12 month mark, when babies' metabolism changes. Answer whatever ones apply to you.

2 months ago, when baby was 12 months old, i kind of had a breakdown due to sleep exhaustion due to 2 hour nursing around the clock, and other health concerns. We explored the Gordon and Pantley methods a little bit. Gordon's idea of making waking at night a little less appealing, but only after 12 months of age, made a lot of intuitive sense to us. Several nights we kind of did the first stage of Gordon, but never went beyond that. After that, every night we explained "no nursing until morning" and it was like when he woke up to ask for it, he EXPECTED us to turn him down. At the same time, during the day we started giving him some whole milk bottles, (and he's always been a good eater too). he often prefers the bottle to nursing, i think he loves the freedom to have his milk and run around at the same time.

I have noticed a direct relationship between slowing down my nursing and increased sleep stretches at night. I don't know if it was a fluke or not, but gradually, his sleep got better and better at night, till now, 2.5 months after we started, he CONSISTENLY sleeps about 8 hours at night!!! I don't know exactly what worked, perhaps a combination of all those things.

[onehipmomma]

My ds is 17 mos he nurses for brief periods throughout the day (when I am home, I work fulltime) he sleeps for about 4 straight hours and then is up once an hour from then on. he is a typical toddler when it comes to eating: lots sometimes, nothing others, NO veggies, ever unless they are disguised *sigh*

We just bought the No Cry Sleep solution and are hoping to stretch the 4 hours to 6. our biggest problem is lack of routine.

[indiegirl]

12-20 months were the absolute worst with our dd and her sleep patterns. It was crazy. Up every hour screaming, inconsolable--angry and unhappy. We were all unhappy. I used to call 11pm the "witching hour" cause Violet would always wake up then and it woudl be an absolute nightmare to get her back to bed before 2-3am.

What helped was when we moved her into her own room and a big bed. At 24 mo she generally sleeps though the night now--and is easily settled.

[mamaduck]

Most nights my 2 yr. old Ds sleeps a 3 hour stretch, followed by a 5 hour stretch, followed by another 3 hours stretch. This is tolerable. He has only been doing it since we started the Pantley method -- before that it was every 30-90 min. I doubt he'll progress to longer stretches anytime soon. He has some respiratory issues and seems to get sick every month or so, which really sets us back on a regular basis. But I think I can live with this routine.

He nurses all day long as much as I'll let him. I swear, the kid would be happy if I spent all day long in bed nursing him. He stops every now and then to kiss me passionately on my lips and compliment my "treats" as he now calls my breasts, and then goes back to town.

My older child slept EXACTLY the length of time between daytime nursings. So, if I nursed him every 4 hours during the day, he'd wake every 4 hours at night. He self-weaned around 14 months and then went to waking 1x a night for snuggles (he was in his own bed) and that lasted until he was 3 or so.

[Irishmommy]

I voted 6+ hours, but it's really 11 hours, and while she gets offered cow's milk during the day (with meals), I would guess she has about 2 ounces in total, so I don't consider that supplementing. Sleeping has never been a problem for my kids.

[NorthernLight]

My son is 11 months now (maybe I should not have voted ) He sleeps for a big 4 hour chunk at first, then wakes every 2 to 3 hours until morning. He eats a very wide variety of mushy food and is still breastfeeding with no suppliments.

[hasnoptnce]

My 22 month old is allergic to so many things, including cow's milk. She nurses every few hours during the day, and would do more if I would let her! At night she is up every few hours too, and cannot go to sleep unless I nurse her. This means, obviously, no one else can put her down for a nap, or get her back to sleep during the night. Any suggestions??

[Sahara]

DS is 15 months old, eats solids regularly, and nurses every 4-6 hours during the day. He sleeps a 2-3 hour stretch, then a 4-6 hour stretch, then a 1-3 hour stretch. He generally only wakes up when he needs to pee, then nurses back to sleep but it only takes a minute or two. It is fine with me, I get enough sleep. I take a nap with him about once a week and that seems to catch me up. This all goes out the window with teething, of course.
I don't know, my DS went through a rough sleep spell from 11 to about 13 months, and he just sort of grew out of it.

[anotherthinkingmum]

My dd is 13 mths, nurses as much as I tolerate (which is an awful lot, up to 2 or 3 times in an hour when she's got a cold or teething) during the day, and same at night. Night pattern varies enormously, from every 2 or so hours some nights, to as much as every 1/2 hour or so, swapping sides endlessly, feeling like I get zero actual *rest*. Though I'm strongly committed to extended breastfeeding, some have suggested limiting day feeds to improve the night situation, others have suggested controlled crying, the no cry sleep solution, the Pantley method, etc. Anyone have any favourites?

I'm feeling quite torn about my perceived schism between what's good for her (ie let her do what she wants) and what's good for me (ie no more night feeds - or at least down to one?).

It's great to read about how common this problem is - makes me feel better in the face of older relatives looking askance at me when I say she's still in bed with us and wakes a lot.

Cheers,

Tammi

[amy]

more on night nursing

Hi, I also have a 13 month-old who usually sleeps in small intervals --anywhere from 1/2 hour stretches to 3 hours (we used to get the occasional 6 or 8 hour stretch but no such luck anymore). She nurses to go down for naps and bedtime and everytime she wakes up at night. If she wakes up and I'm not around and she can't nurse, she's IRATE. I want to keep her in bed with us for awhile still, I like having her with us, but I have to say that I do wonder if she'll ever learn to fall back asleep without nursing. I don't see her stopping of her own accord ever.

I'd like to hear more about the Gordon and Pantley methods and the no cry method people are referring to. Right now she nurses every 2 to 4 hours usually in the day, eats a lot of food, has no milk...do people agree that frequent nursing in the day causes more frequent nursing at night? Also, a concern I have about night nursing ending...I wouldn't want it to cause her to wean herself during the day yet. I'd love to hear other people's experiences with dealing with night nursing. Thanks!

[shanleysmama]

DD didn't start sleeping thru the night until she was 2. I remember her being 16 mo, and I had moved her crib from beside our bed to next to the wall (I was preggo with DS), and we had a witching hour! 1:00 to 3:00 a.m., every night, and I would try to get her back to sleep without nursing, but no way! I ended up bringing her to bed with me every night. Her crib is back next to our bed, she nurses 1-2x a day.
DS is 16 mo, and he wakes up a lot at night, and won't go back to sleep without nursing - no backpatting or pacifier has ever worked. Last night he was up 3 times in 45 minutes. It can be exhausting. He nurses when he gets up, before nap, after nap, nurses now and then thruout the day, then nurses to sleep. He eats 3 meals a day, plus snacks.
I would LOVE to know how to get him to sleep longer stretches! We have a big 'ol family bed, all four of us, I wonder if that keeps him waking up.
Melanie

[islandmama]

I've been away for almost 3 months, and I'm so glad to be back! My daughter sleeps for a 3 hour stretch and then is up at least every 2 hours. She's 15 months old. I'm just so happy to be back where others are going through the same thing I am. I'm exhausted. She has been doing this since day one, except for one 6 hour stretch. All my friends babies sleep through the night and then complain when their child wakes up once. I wish they could feel how tired I am! Every night I think, this is the night that it will change. I can't wait for that day! I know that she will sleep when she is ready and doesn't need me!

[anotherthinkingmum]

Amy, I'm right there with you in hoping that night weaning won't change dd's day feedings, though I can't imagine it would?! We are feeling a wee bit desperate and are considering having dd sleep with dh for a few nights (while I hide in a bed where I can't hear her! or I won't cope, wimp, wimp) so she still has the comfort of a dear parent, but no milk. At 13mths, I believe she doesn't *require* the milk (as ds didn't), but I also think she's pretty dependent on it. I've heard of others (on these boards and elsewhere) doing this - what do others think? I'd love to keep sleeping with her, just not constant nursing every night!

So torn...

[hasnoptnce]

It is so reassuring to keep reading that others are spending their nights the same way I do! I was told that the only way to stop the all-night nursing was to stop the day nursing too. I really don't want to do that, but I am really tired!!

[EllasMama]

Our DD is 17 mos. - goes to bed when we do and usually has one long stretch (4-6 hours) before waking to nurse, followed by increasingly shorter ones. I'm guessing she nurses 2-3 times a night on top of nursing to sleep and when she wakes up. She is finally showing interest in eating solids at 3 meals a day plus occasionally a snack - but the quantity typically is fairly small. She nurses about every 3 hours during the day. We have family allergies and she is obviously sensitive to dairy, so we're thrilled that she is nursing so much (though not always so thrilled in the middle of the night when she screams if I take my boob away from her mouth!).

-Carol

[amy]

It is reassuring to read about other people going through this. After hearing so many people talk about the Pantley method the other day, I did a search for it, read about it and ordered the book. It sounds like it has helped some people, so I think I'll give it a try. I think my main goal is just that our 13month-old learns to be able to sleep without nursing to sleep at some point and that she can be put down to sleep and comforted if she wakes up by my husband. I'm working 2 nights a weeks soon and he'll have night duty, so I think it's important. Anotherthinkingmum, if you do try hiding out in another bed, let us know how it goes.

Another question: Has anyone out there had a child that was a super avid night nurser who did learn on their own to fall back asleep without night nursing? And if so, how old were they?

[mama2m&m]

I'm kind of on the fence about this issue. My dd is 17 mos. gets soy milk during the day at daycare and usually no milk at home except mama's milk. and other milk products.

She tends to nurse frequently when I'm home and lately has been nursing 4-6 times between 9p and 5:30 a.m. Can you say tired? Her normal pattern was 1-2x a night around 12a and 4a. She goes to sleep between 8-10 and sleeps until around 12-1 then she comes in our bed. She also eats table food regularly for the most part but does pick certain times.

I was in a quandry because I wanted to help her learn to go to sleep but not quite ready to night wean. Since I work full time outside the house, it's very important to me to nurse when I'm home to keep my supply up. So I don't mind the occasional 1-2x a night but any more than that is so tiring.

I got pantley and started reading but got stuck on the logs. I worked really hard at not looking at the clock when she wakes to nurse so now that I have to not only look at the clock but time it is not convenient, but we'll see how it goes. Now I need to do the analyizing. I really just hope that she'll fall asleep a little easier. I see I'm not alone in some of my toddler's nursing habits and it's a comfort though I'm sorry we have to go through these not so pleasant parts of parenthood. But it does help the sweet things seem oh so much better! And now I'll stop rambling LOL!

[mom at home]

I didn't vote because nightwaking and food aren't necessarily related. My second dd was addicted to nursing at night until I weaned her at 2.5 yrs because I was tired of not getting any sleep.

Toddlers are usually much more demanding nursers than babies because it's more comfort and less food oriented. I don't think my 2 yr old was nursing all night because she was hungary. She just wanted mama. She's now 4.5 and weaned but still wants mama at night. Weaning doesn't necessarily mean the end of nightwaking.

Last night I asked her if she could/would go to sleep at bedtime by herself once we get her new bed set up. She said "no, mama, not until I'm 14. Then I'll go to bed without you.

My 6 yr old still wakes up and wants one of us occasionally as well. I'm resigned to nightwaking lasting quite a few more years. But nightwaking without nursing is a lot easier to deal with and so it does get easier.

[anotherthinkingmum]

Hi again. Things are still the same with dd (waking every 1-3 hours each night, feeding then and every 1/2-3 hrs in the day, plus heaps of solids & other fluids). I re-read the Sears' atttitude in "The Baby Book" and was reinvigorated to keep at it and gently work on her habits. So instead of hiding out in another bed, I'm trying to stretch out her feeds a bit during the day on the theory that this might help at night. It's early days yet, but I'll report any change to those interested! If that goes well, then we may try the other bed for me and dd alone with dh in our bed.

Momathome, I totally agree that nightwaking is not only about feeding. Our almost 3y.o. still joins us most nights, but is quite content to climb into our bed and go right back to sleep. This gives us great cuddle sessions in the morning with all four of us, but also lets us start the night more easily (well, once we get dd out of there, is the theory!). We're aiming for this outcome with both eventually. LIke you, we don't mind nightwaking, it's just the constancy of dd's and the fact that it has to be me to help her go back to sleep with a feed. We can't go out for dinner past 9pm at the moment (leaving kids with the grandparents) b/c dd is due to wake up around then.: I NEED more of a night out with dh!!!

aaaahhh... the joys and frustrations...

[kaje62]

Charlie is nearing 16 months.

I have night weaned for about three and half weeks now. This all came up after I went for my yearly exam to the doctor and mentioned my struggle with night nursing. I guess I was feeling a bit depressed and way sleep deprived. As I would usually nurse 6-8 times in the middle of the night.

I am thinking about BABY No. 2, so I asked the doctor if she was worried about me getting pregnant at age 40 and being a full figured gal and she said she was more worried about my emotional health and my sleep. So she encouraged me to kick Charlie out of our bed, wean him and for me to exercise daily. She told me I need to sack out 6-8 hours a nite. And she said we should have sex 2-3 times a week.

So I take everything with a grain of salt, I am not anxious to kick him out of bed. I hope to exercise a couple times a week and if we do sex a couple times a month, we will be doing good. And sleep, I won't argue with that but it seems real foreign. Does that sound like a good compromise?

So I called my lactation consultant, who I adore and she said to have DH start sleeping with Charlie and me in another room. She recommended not putting Charlie in the crib yet cuz that would be too much change for him at once.

It has been working out great. I feel more patient and less overwhelmed and he is way more snuggly during the day. And he nurses more during the day too. He slept through the night a few times but fell out of bed the third night, which was a set back. That happened once with me too, so I won’t fire daddy yet. But we made some changes like Charlie by the wall, not daddy, DUH!!! And he slept through the nite last night.

I am waiting to go back to the family bed. I am not invited back yet. I miss them!! I sleep with the 67 pound dog. We all shared a bed in a hotel about a ten days ago and it was a nursery night.

Have to say I feel a little guilty. Cuz some mama's nurse in the middle of the night and never complain. I guess at 15 1/2 months I burnt out. We are nursing more and cuddling more during the day. So I feel guilty and great at the same time.