Sposies, Sposies EVERYWHERE at a LLL meeting!?!?!?!?!?!? - Page 2

[Mama~Love]

I agree with klothos and Double A. They just might not know what's in a sposie.

A few women in my BF support group (not LLL) CD. I've made some positive comments on their cute covers (not sure what kind they were). We had a discussion about diapering and it really got me interested in CDing. I've only been CDing for 6 months. I'll never go back to sposies, that's for sure!

[didelphus]

You know, I think all our leaders CD but I don't think I've ever seen one of the visiting moms CD. At least it's nice that the leaders do! And there are always lots of slings.

[Yarnia]

Well I've always been very pro bf and attended LLL meetings with my dd in a sposie. It never occurred to me to cd until I switched and I can't get over how easy it was and is!
I had never seen a "modern" cloth diaper or cover. I know now that there was at least one cd there (cause she sells them!) but she didn't advertise it so of course I didn't notice at the time.
There were usually plenty of slings tho - but still some little ones in carriers the whole meeting. My kiddo wouldn't have stood for that so I guess everyone is different.

I don't think I usually took my sling in as it was a short walk and I'd be sitting rather than slinging. I never got the knack of slinging and bf

You did right to change publicly - tho perhaps next time you could point out cd as the "crunchy" way to diaper even if nobody asks!

[WhimsyTyme]

Originally Posted by Village Mama

As a cloth dipering mama, I have never experienced such snobbery amongst cloth diapering mothers. Why do we cloth diaper in the first place? There are lots of reasons that people choose to parent in the ways they do.I for one diaper my child in this way for the environmental/comfort reasons. I would prefer that people did not fill our landfills with lots of crap. I would also love for there to be world peace, but I don't spend my energy critisizing others who choose different lifestyles. What is a LLL meeting for anyways? Be thankful that you are so enlightend... just look at what the rest of us poor saps are up against! I know I will get burned for this post but when did this choice become such a definining point for you; and why the obsession? (ignore me! )

First understand, I went there not just for BF info but to compare wool and fitteds w/ all the crunchy mamas! Can you imagine my dissapointment!!!!!


I blieve I did not make myself clear in my OP so I will here -

I AM NOT obsessed w/ personal choice but AM obssessed w/ UNEDUCATED SNOBBERY.

No one told me or suggest to me that we CD. In my continuing quest to make sure that I am making the RIGHT choices for my son, I came across many topics on CDing. I reasearched and found that this was the right choice for us and the environment. So, here we are in the diapering forum (and frequently the TP or some WHAM site . It was and is my continuing quest that has helped me to better Dylan's life/lifestyle.

Here is the difference between myself and those moms - I DON'T boast my feigned superiority in front of others to make them feel small or to make myself feel good.

Bottom line this was not what I thought a LLL meeting should be to me it was a gathering of the local CDless clique.

Total and complete honesty here - I don't boast my superiority but I do at times feel both superior and different because of the CHOICES I have made for Dylan. But, I am comfortable with these feelings. (Hey I AM being honest. ) I am ver concious of not making others feel inferior because of my or thier choices.

It is not my place to judge thier uninformed/informed choices, but I don't have to subject my son or myself to thier actions.

Another quick visual for ya - Have you ever been to a sporting event where the fans in the stands have done the wave (standing up and throwing thier hands in the air in succession)? Well imagine a wave of noses when we began changing our cloth diaper or WIO. They all around the room began to go up in the air, then would ever so briefly come down out of couriosity, only to shoo right back up again before any of thier peers or myself could notice. It was quite entertianing, :LOL really!

These ladies were just RUDE : . They made plans for all of them to go to lunch pointedly excluding Dylan and myself. Seemingly because we were different; because we oenly and proudly : . The leader did ask us to join them but we declined. I could tell she was bothered by this because I spoke with her late last night and she said she felt bad that we didn't join them for lunch. I told her not to think twice about! It was our "date" lunch day anyway.

Anywho, to prove to you that I am not anti "sposie-mommies" - there was another visiting mom at the LLL group that needed help and I invited her to my afternoon group in the next town and she came and was quite thankful. She had two children in sposies.

Again, I AM NOT choice obsessive! What I AM is uneducated snobbery obsessive - this effects others . A mama less sure of herself or her choice, be it CDing, BFing, whatever might have second guessed herself when these ladies so quickly and rudely shunned her different choice.

CDing like many other avenues we choose is decided through educating ourselves continuoiusly and not being closed minded when something new rears it's head.

I have now stepped down off the box, you may contiue with your post browsing and please overlook me!!!!


...

[halah]

This is going somewhere interesting and not just about diapers.

I am starting to feel like it is more difficult being friends with "ap" or "natural" or "crunchy" moms, or whatever they are wanting to call themselves, that I supposedly have more affinity with. It seems like when they get together, everyone is checking everyone else out with the mental checklist---slings, check! BF'ing, check! CD's, check! homemade no-sugar-added baby food--check! etc., etc., It is getting ridiculous!

Consequently, everybody is busy judging others because they are feeling judged, or they're feeling judged because they know they internally judge others---which is it?

For this OP'er, I think you felt a little shut out of this clique (I was saddened when I realized cliques exist outside school!) and were feeling like you were being given the once over, and hearing them b***ch about baby food in jars, yes you're right, it is idiotic, but not just because they were being hypocritical with their plastic diapers. It's just idiotic to pick apart moms' decisions, period, and base one's allegances on that.

But returning the favor by dissing them because they had no slings (it's HOT where I am personally, I wouldn't want a sling hanging round my neck right now) and no CD's is not going to help situations. Though it might make you feel better for a while (I can dig that, done it too).

To clarify, I'm not down on you WhimsyTime, I'm just commenting on the rather sad state of "support" among mothers these days.

[Village Mama]

Great to inspire some honesty here!Now that I have slept on my irritation( nothing personal.... It has been building for a long time) I will tell you a bit about my cloth diapering experience. We are a fairly low income family, and couldnt afford to buy new fancy diapers and covers. I scavenged as many as I could from the local thrift stores(including the dreaded plastic pants!) I didnt have a washing machine in the house that we were renting at the time, therefore I had to wash all of the poopy diapers by hand in the sink and hang them around the house to dry. At the time I didnt even know anyone else who CD.I had one friend who went diaper free, whom vocally trashed all of the other moms around for thier choices. Let me tell you that after 30 little pees a day and almost as many outfits, You wouldnt have blamed me for going to disposibles. The only thing that kept me trying was sheer determination.Just to put it in perspective... there are many situations like this, and others that drive peoples choices. Now when I frequent the thrift stors, I pick up any slings or cloth diapers and offer them to new moms in the niebourhood that I know(with the offer of a lesson over tea!) Just remember that not everyone has the resources monetary or support wise to make the choices that they themselves may want to make.

[GeoBaby]

ahhh, don't be too hard on them. Yes, they were being a bit hypocritical with their talk vrs. their actions, but oh well.

I'm new to this CDing thing, and I love it, but honestly, the thought just didn't occur to me to use CD, even though we had a natural birth, and were already practicing some of the AP protocols. I know, it doesn't make sense NOW, since it really is all a package deal, but some people just choose to do what they can.

We all pick our ways of helping the world, and some of us just don't do everything.

OH, and yes, a lot babies ARE sensitive to sposies, but I must say that the chemicals can't be all that bad because my dogs have eaten them with no ill effects... I know... gross. One more reason I've gone to CD.

[JohnnysGirl]

I just wanted to quickly chime in that I understood the OP the way it was intended: that it's quite a lot of hypocricy to put a chemically laden diaper against your child's genitals and then trash-talk jarred baby foods because of the chemicals in them. Of course they may not know that there are chemicals in the disposable diapers...but.... I think it would be hard 'not to know' especially when you find the gel beads ON your baby's bottom. And a group so critical of what's inside those little jarred babyfoods should be wondering what's inside those strange feeling chemical underwear they put on their child.

I agree though, that it's good not to use energy trashing other mama's choices and instead simply offer information (or even supplies! that is such a coool idea Village Mama) to mamas who you see missing out on a better way.

[radish]

Wow! I thought the OP was simply sharing frustration for not finding CD mamas in a place you might expect to. She didnt sound like she was judging, just venting.

VillageMama
LLL is La Leche League

Mom2Kyla and ChrsitinaB
ITA w/ your posts!

I have been to tons of AP events/playgroups where mamas are crunchier than me and less crunchy than me - I have NEVER felt jugded, it was always an open exhange of info, ideas, books, etc...

[TigerTail]

i get the vent, when i was all into the hyena thing i was disappointed when i had no one to share my treasures with, but seriously, expecting all women in LLL to share the same hobby is unrealistic. (and supposing them all to be uneducated simpletons in need of enlightenment is a tad presumptious.)

i have had the whole gamut, from wool to fbs to fmbg to liz's to keester kover aios to the finest of chinese pfs with an assortment of wahm covers, and frankly, after two babies, they leak. (speaking of chemicals, the things i have sprayed on them in a futile attempt to rewaterproof them make the corn-derived polysorbate crystals look like granola nuggets.) with my last baby months away from being potty-trained, i don't have the $ or inclination to buy a whole 'nother stash.

so, when we go out for an extended period, rather than change outfits repeatedly while running around after two wild toddlers, i put on one of the maybe three disposable diapers i will use that week. if it's the LLL meeting, you would suppose me to be one of the unwashed herd of unthinking sposie users. but by the time you have a couple toddlers, impressing the other mommies with your fashionable cds has become somewhat less of a priority.

i am sorry you felt snubbed, but i would bet it wasn't 'cause you cd. that's getting paranoid (i'm sure it has more to do with being new to the crowd.)

ps older babies can quite easily go two hours without peeing. hard to believe, but it's true. :b and of course, not all paper dipes are gel-filled; i'm sure some of the crunchier moms pay a premium for 'biodegradable' no-gel etc sposies (yes, i know, they are still vile and environmentally evil; but that may jibe more with the jarred baby food snobbism.)

pps the only ones that have held up to all the washings w/out leakage are the uncoveted flannel lousy-absorbing hyena-maligned kooshies aios! (and yes, i have lanolin; i just don't put wool on babies in 98' humidity.)

just another pov, i really have been there & it is fun to show the cute ones off!
suse

[Miny20]

When I first started using cloth a few months ago, I went to a LLL meeting and saw a mother there bust out her spray bottle (we use sposie wipes, but it's out of consideration for the other people who use the washers in our building), a diaper, and a wetbag.

I made a beeline for her! I was new to cloth and it all of a sudden felt 'real' to me when I saw someone else take out a fuzzi bunz. Woo hoo.

Of course Arden was throwing a fit, it was nap time and we HAD HAD HAD to leave. But, it was so great to connect with her for a couple of minutes.



I feel your pain. Although, the LLL meeting I went to last month was entitled--"Wearing your baby: The art of slinging" There was HUGE show. It was so great!

[gothmommy]

Yeah, I noticed the same thing last night. Kind of disappointing, IMHO. One mama went to change her wee one's diaper and I asked if she was planning on using cloth. SHe mentioned that she would like to, but just hasn't started in. So I offered to make her a few dipes. Little cute girly print fleece AIOs. YAY! I so cannot wait to give them to her!!

[WhimsyTyme]

Not just frustrated, but disapointed as well.

Yes I was frustrated at the double talk or hipocracy. But mainly I was venting here too out of CD disapointment. Again, my expectations had been set by others as to what to expect at the LLL meetings. I was actually afraid of not fitting in because we were not crunchy enough! :

None of our play pal or group mamas practice co-sleeping, slinging, making thier own baby food, or CDing. And those that BF are pretty much weaning over the next month.

So, we would have liked to find mamas & bebes that we could share sling stories (I have heard many times in the MDC forums that LLL is a great place to meet slining mamas) and CD excitement.

I know the mamas we hang out with always get a kick out of the new or different dipe/cover Dylan is wearing each time we meet or get together. I too would like to look forward seeing another CDd bum bum or two or three or four or five .

When we get together, in addition to talking about how fast they are growing into thier carseats and what is thier favorite toy this week - I'd like to talk about the joys and benefits of extended BF, the great new postion we tried w/ the sling last week, how wonderful it was for Dylan to wake me up this morning with his sweet little hand on my cheek and all of the fabulous WHAMS out there, what dipes/covers are working best for us this week, what our current nighttime solution is and what WHAM dipes we have our eye on.

I realize I was probably looking to the wrong group to fulfill these needs. But AP groups are equally as hard to find here. I have posted around the boards here and have heard nothing back. I know there was one in the area last year and I PMd the mom with the thread and a couple of the moms that posted there, again nothing.

So, it is up to you mamas to keep on posting those FABULOUS CD pics, share your CDING stories and frustrations, talki about what dipe you wanna try next and OCASSIONALLY attend a stocking w/ me in your best suit!

..

[GeoBaby]

That was my deal... I TRULY did not know there were ANY alternatives out there to swirling and pins and LOTS of laundry. When an acquaintence from the Bradley Birth circle (not even from my class) invited me to a MOE party, it opened up an entirely new world for me! Now, I visit places like MDC and the Diaper Pin and am just FLOORED by the CD choices out there! It's almost like it is an underground society! CDing, ironically, is still in the minority these days. Sposies are normal, and seem to have a false monopoly on new mothers. I mean, really, when was the last time you saw a commercial for Bumpkins?

I just think it was great that you DID openly change a diaper in front of the other moms. You know, if you had attended lunch, who's to say that they might have had questions for you? It only takes one mom to ask the question, and the rest will usually follow.

[Village Mama]

Radish, thanks for clarifying but I did know what LLL stood for! I was just meaning to say that LLL is for breastfeeding support for all types of mothers. Personally I have found them to be much more straight edge than I thought they would be. But who needs more support than the women that are more straight edge themselves, and where breastfeeding is not the norm amongst thier peers.I just think that this is a silly issue to divide people! By "enlightened" I ment that not everyone is lucky enough to come across information on more natural parenting issues. It is not exactly available in the mainstream media. We are lucky to have discovered this information or having been led to a place where we can educate ourselves. Anything in the media regarding natural parenting styles is put forth as more of a novelty. The only way we can help people learn is to gently guide them... not to assume that they already have the information. It's not always easy for people to break free from the norm.

[ja mama]

Breastfeeding and chemicals in jarred food have something in common. They are nourishment being ingested into the child.

Diapers are topical. They may or may not irritate the baby's skin. But they are not ingested.

LLL is there for nutritional support. For how the food goes into the baby, not what type of diaper the leftovers come out into.

[Britishmum]

You know, I'd tend to be less critical of what people put on their baby's bum, and more impressed by the fact that they are putting breastmilk in their baby's tum. Celebrate the fact they are breastfeeding, don't deride them for not following your ideals in natural family living. Please.

I wonder how judged I was when I used to take dd#1 to LLL meetings in her disposable diapers? I never realised that I didnt fit in because I was not pure enough in those days.

Breastfeeding does not equate natural living in every way. Many mamas cannot use cloth for whatever reason, (finance to start up, support from partner, lack of washing facilities....) or do not know about it. I didnt know until I'd been using disposables for almost 18 months. I'd never seen a decent modern cloth diaper - and the few I saw at my first LLL meetings, to be honest, were enough to put me off for another year! Maybe if some of you hyenas had been around, I'd have been inspired, but the couple of saggy, greying cds I saw at LLL meetings in the early days did not inspire me one bit. (just to qualify, I wouldn't see it that way now, I'd just see it as someone cding on a budget, but I was not inspired by the sight back then).

I"m glad that a few other people found the tone here disturbing. I've tried in the past to stick up for those 'terrible' sposie users in threads here, but am usually a lone voice. Why the snobbery? I love cds, but I dont expect others to agree with me!

Aren't there far worse things you could do to your kid than use disposable diapers? Personally, I would rank feeding formula unnecessarily as a bigger deal than using disposables. And how wonderful that so many women were there at LLL finding support for breastfeeding!

[radish]

Geez can everyone please stop riding this Mama and her post about their OWN issues.

She was venting - most of us know BF does not equal NFL or CDing. She was hoping to meet a CD mama there and didnt.

[WithHannahsHeart]

Originally Posted by Britishmum

You know, I'd tend to be less critical of what people put on their baby's bum, and more impressed by the fact that they are putting breastmilk in their baby's tum. Celebrate the fact they are breastfeeding, don't deride them for not following your ideals in natural family living. Please.

Yeah, that. You went to that meeting with completely unrealistic expectations and NOT for what the meetings are for, which is breastfeeding support. Did it every occur to you that these women might have felt insecure (as so many people think that cd'ing is this big hairy deal and takes such a sacrifice) that you were cd'ing and nervous that you might not like THEM? And if your attitude is that you are better than them because you cd (and frankly i think that you DO feel that way even if you deny it here), then no wonder they didn't invite you into their circle. Also, it takes time to get to know someone in the LLL arena.

[PatchyMama]

This is a natural family living board and disposables are not natural! If a mom wants to come here and point out how sad she was that there werent more cloth diaper users at a LLL or otherwhere, thats what this forum is here for!!! No one was being a snob... in fact I thought she was doing quite the opposite by publically changing her ds so that others would maybe be interested in a non imposing way.

This board should be the one place where people feel comfortable saying they dont like sposies and when people use them its dissapointing without being called judgemental and snobbish. You dont HAVE to use cloth to fit in on MDC ... but you cant blame people here for commenting that they are better than sposies.