ARRRGGGH ! MIL cut my boys' hair ! - Page 2

[katt]

ground her from seeing them until their hair is as long or longer then it was.

[Shann]

Katt, that's a REAL good idea, cause she cut quite a bit off their hair ! It was well down on their shoulders ! That could take it until next spring or maybe early summer before she would see them again, because both boys have rather slow growing hair ! I love that idea, esp. the "longer than it was" part, because we had plans to let it get considerably longer than it was anyway. It could be a year before she sees them again, and I really like that thought ! Thanks !

[frand]

What's really interesting is your note that your bf told you his mother was intimidating to children. That's a unique and honest statement for a guy to make about his mother--makes you wonder what she was like to him when he was a child. She needs a major 'check' on her actions around your children. I wouldn't think in terms of punishment because that puts you in a role you may not want. But I agree trust has been broken and you can't trust her right now and that's pretty much what I would say to her. You can't put a date on when that's coming back. I just wouldn't leave them alone with her.

[Stevie]

Well, you could hold her down and let the boys shave her head

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and until she agrees; no visits!! ah otoh, we don't want the boys to end up just like her... I would tell them that this is what I want to do though! Under no circumstances would I allow her unsupervised visits unless she got some serious therapy. Just tell her the truth; that you'll never trust her again since she HURT your boys so brutally. It was a rape, nothing less

[Ann-Marita]

I wouldn't allow her to see the boys until your sons ask for it. Under no circumstances would I make your boys visit unless THEY want to. (I also like the "until the hair grows back idea.)

And I wouldn't allow unsupervised visits until your sons are strong enough (physically and/or emotionally) to fend off her attacks. That might be until they're grown.

[reilly's momma]

I would leave it up to your boys as to when to see her again. They are the ones who deserve a relationship with her, if they want it. So if they want to go see grandma next week, although that doesn't sound likely, but if they do want to, then they should be allowed. On the other, more likely hand, if they don't want to see her for a year or two, well, that should be up to them as well.

But I do completely agree that when/if they ever choose to see her again, it should be supervised. The fact that she is so sure she is right to the point of not even offering any sort of apology even AFTER the fact also disturbs me a great deal. I would be wondering what else in the past she may have done against your wishes, perhaps in terms of food, discipline, etc.

And whatever you do decide, no matter how livid you are, put your parent hat on & calmly explain to her that she now has to deal with the consequences of her improper behavior & actions, for two reasons. One, because it it the proper, mature way to handle the situation, and two because it will throw her off, she'll be less likely to know how to repond. She is expecting the anger, and is obviously all geared up to respond to it. Or better yet, let the kids tell her what her consequences will be (with you present of course, or listening in if it's on the phone). Ask them what they think would be a fair consequence (I hate to use the word punishment, even if it is kinda appropriate this time) for grandma's actions. Since she showed no regard for their opinions when she forced her opinions on hair length upon them, I think it is perfectly fair to reverse the situation.

[Shann]

MIL and I had a HUGE battle last night on the phone ! She called and said she felt we needed to "talk" (which I agree with), but she then proceeded to try to make it a monologue instead of a talk. She said she knew I would be mad when she did it, but that she was tired of my kids looking like "dirty little hippy GIRLS" and had decided to take matters into her own hands because "no grandkids of mine are going to look like that !" (She has always made little comments about the way I dress my boys, saying that they always look "dirty" to her ...which they are NOT...because they like to wear holey jeans, old t-shirts, and grubby sneakers without socks. They enjoy playing like all boys do, and yes, they get really dirty and stinky sometimes, but they wash up when they choose to). She has also always hated their long hair. I knew she didn't like the way I dress my boys -- granted it's sloppy !--, but I never DREAMED that she would do something like this ! In the conversation, she was still COMPLETELY unrepentant and at one point said I was lucky she hadn't shaved their heads to make them look like boys !!!! OMG !!
Well, you can imagine where the conversation went from there (I will spare you the details). Other issues came out, including the fact that her son and I have never been married and have had 2 kids "in sin" (GIVE ME A BREAK !!! It's not 1950 anymore, lady !). I did my best to maintain my composure, but all in all I let her know that she would NOT be seeing her grandkids again for a long time (if ever again). I also asked her why she continued to cut when the boys cried and asked her to stop. She said "sometimes kids need to be told what they need by adults !" She said the boys cried, screamed and even swore at her to get her to stop, and she was more determined not to then...because their "tantrum" showed her how badly I was raising them !!!!! I was LIVID ! I seriously thought I would have a stroke !!!! I am DONE with her !!!! (Hearing all that, I can understand why the boys swore at her ! I would have too, in their situation !! (and no, they WON'T get punished for having done that, so don't even suggest it). Comments ? Suggestions ??

[weebitty2]

My comments : wow, what a @#*$&! I wouldn't let them see her, unless they choose to sometime in the future. Honestly? (I'm not a very polite person when I get angry, and I am SO ANGRY for your little guys!) I'd tell 'er to sit on her fists and bounce.

[Ann-Marita]

Don't ever make your boys visit her. When (if?) they decide to visit her at some point in the future, supervise the visits until, like I said earlier, they are able to stand up to her intimidation and verbal (and physical) attacks.

Have your BF tell her this - that you aren't letting her see them until the boys ask for it and that even then the visits will be supervised. Emphasize that the boys were very deeply hurt by her actions and that you doubt that they will ask to visit her any time soon. She violated them! She did something to their bodies that they absolutely did not want her to do!

Have your BF do the telling. He is her son and he should be the one to deliver the news. Then simply do not have contact with her. You personally don't have any reason to answer her phone calls or open the door if she comes over. If your BF wants to see her, that's his choice. But you don't need to. If the boys ask to see her, send BF with them (if you feel that BF can stand up to her).

Also you might want to check out www.motherinlawstories.com - they have a good message board. Some of the posters are clearly not AP, but they all have had experience dealing with difficult MIL's.

I would be livid, too. This woman thinks that her preferences outweigh your parental decisions! How dare she. Your boys' "tantrum" showed, not how badly you are raising them, but how horribly she was treating them at the moment. Ugh!

[lynsage]

That woman is toxic and you need to put her out of your life and your children's lives.

I'm so sorry she said those hurtful things to you. She had no right and you didn't deserve any of that.

[Evan&Anna's_Mom]

I agree that when/if there are future visits should be entirely up to your sons. And any conversations about this or other issues should be framed from the perspective of the impact this is having on them. Make it not about you, but about their feelings, their betrayal, their anger.

Remember in all of this that your sons are watching and learning. While you have every right to be angry and feeling the need for revenge, remember that you are teaching your sons lessons as they watch you. If you don't want them to learn that it is OK to punish someone when they make you made, you need to be careful about the words you use. Which is really, really hard sometimes!

[Greaseball]

I think you should have her arrested. That cannot be legal. Of course, children have very few legal rights but as their parent, you have rights. In my state's CPS handbook, it even says that haircutting for punishment is illegal. And it sounds like this was done to punish both you and them.

[TiredX2]

Now that you are here, though, try to look at this as a good thing: you go her to reveal her "true" self and now you can cut her out like she should be. If that is what she is thinking about you, your children and your family, you don't want that poison in your lives anyway.

I am so sorry. The haircut, itself, is not a "huge" issue, IMO. The utter disrespect and contempt show, meanwhile, is reason enough to never speak to her again.

Good luck

[joesmom]

Shann, in some of your posts you seem like you don't mind confrontation- but this is above & beyond the "zoo shirt" thread!! Totally beyond your control & it really stinks for your MIL to have done something so mean. I am sorry. What your MIL did was 100% wrong. At first I thought that punishing her would be wrong- she is an adult. BUT she has completely & totally disregarded your feelings... For her to say, "no grandkids of mine are going to look like that !" is just totally wrong. A grandparent has NO say in how a kid looks. If my MIL did something like that I can absolutely guarantee that she would not see Joe again until HE wanted to see her. I am mad just thinking of it. Here is a for you & the boys. I hope their hair grows back fast & thicker than ever!!

[Greaseball]

Oh, you're the zoo shirt mom? Next time your MIL sees the boys, they should have their long hair AND be wearing those shirts! :LOL And maybe some nail polish too. And something tye-dyed!

[Meiri]

I think, given the details of the situation you have presented, that I would not phrase things to her in terms of you and bf not allowing the boys to see her or vice versa.

Explain to her in no uncertain terms that The Boys Do NOT Want To See Her.

If it would help them to feel better, let them put their feelings on paper for her to read. Send her a letter!

She obviously has no respect for them or their persons and personal tastes, nor for you and their father and your parental decisions.

A person doesn't have to agree with someone's parental decisions to respect their right to make them.

[Shann]

Great idea, Greaeball ! I may just let their hair get super long, then let them go out and have a couple days of hard play outside and get REAL dirty and not give them baths for a few days, and then take a pic of them in the shirts(maybe with their middle fingers stuck up at the camera) and send the photo to her and say "From your dirty, longhaired, girly looking grandsons ! @#$% You !" (I am kidding of course, so don't flame me, people ! But the thought DOES occur ! LOL !)

[captain optimism]

She cut their hair because she couldn't stand to see them look that way another minute?

Okay. So she won't see them. Then she won't see them look that way.

My thought is that you should hold off seeing (or maybe even speaking with!) her again until you and the boys have completely cooled down about this incident. You can tell her that. Then really wait until you are completely mellow. But still don't let her see them alone.

[allgirls]

This is absolutely horrible..omg...

what say you put neet on her head while she's sleeping? Then when she showers all her hair comes out and you tell her you couldn't stand looking at her old grey wiry granny hair anymore and sometimes senile old seniors need to be told what to do...

Then tell her when she's old and feeble she is welcome to come live with you...in fact you will make sure the boys take real good care of her

I am so sorry this has happened to your children..to be judged this way because of how they look/dress...what a terrible lesson to learn so early on in life...

I would leave the "punishment" up to the children...give them suggestions but since she took their power, then you have to give it back...they get to decide...

Good Luck and hugs for you and your children

[Meiri]

what say you put neet on her head while she's sleeping? Then when she showers all her hair comes out and you tell her you couldn't stand looking at her old grey wiry granny hair anymore and sometimes senile old seniors need to be told what to do...

Then tell her when she's old and feeble she is welcome to come live with you...in fact you will make sure the boys take real good care of her

I would leave the "punishment" up to the children...give them suggestions but since she took their power, then you have to give it back...they get to decide...

And this fits into the Gentle Discipline spectrum, where?

Just because this grandmother made the horrid decision to not respect the grandsons by inflicting physical change on them should not be grounds for an equal lack of respect in terms of physical harm onto her.

We teach our children best by modelling our best most loving behavior. We may fail occasionally, but we try, apologize, move on and keep trying.

How will the suggestion that they inflict the same harm on her teach them to become loving towards their own children some day?

I agree strongly that they need some means of feeling that they control their own bodies and as much of their lives as possible within what works in their family, but inflicting harm on grandmother will only infect them with her violence.

They can take back their personal sense of power by being allowed to be the ones who decide when she sees them again. There are ways that they can safely express that to her: e-mail, snail mail, phone, court order....

An eye for an eye leaves everybody blind. Not to mention that that kind of retribution is NOT what that passage means according to a Rabbi acquaitance at another website...