Support for Parents of Gifted Children, #2 - Page 5

[NoHiddenFees]

Originally Posted by LeftField

I went to the Singapore math link to view a sample page of the EarlyBird program. There's one for preschool and one for kindergarten, but they show the same sample pages, so I'm not sure of the level of difficulty.

They are the same program. The Kindergarten one is the US edition and the Preschool is the original. AFAIK the only difference is spelling (Singapore uses British spelling) and pictures of the currency. The four books were designed for 4 and 5 yo's in Singapore's two year preschool/kindergarten program.

I strongly prefer the Right Start program over Singapore. I have a strong background in mathematics and I can really see where it's going and appreciate the groundwork that's being laid for more advanced concepts. DD, however, really took to the Singapore books so I didn't try very hard to keep them away from her.

[eilonwy]

Originally Posted by FreeRangeMama

Plus, he lives in fear of not doing things perfectly and he just couldn't make perfect letter or some shapes (octagons are still a challenge).

:LOL I didn't learn to draw a decent octagon until I took chemistry in college. In that class, I learned to draw several different hexagons, and I was able to apply that technique to make beautiful octagons. :LOL I'm totally not artistically inclined, but I learned to draw all kinds of things in calc/calc II and chemistry. It was amazing to me to watch it happen, but happen it did. I finally understood that art and math are very closely connected, and once I knew that my art got a lot better. When I can understand things mathematically, they get a lot easier for me because my brain is oriented that way. Hooray for calculus!

[Dechen]

~piping up for a moment~

Britishmum, you asked about teaching chess. My father taught my sister and I chess at a fairly young age. To the best of my memory, this is how he did it.

First he taught us how the different pieces moved.

Then he taught us about checkmate, and how to accomplish it. He would give himself a King, and us certain pieces, and it was our job to checkmate him with those pieces. It started out fairly easy, with say a Queen and two rooks, and got harder from there.

By teaching us the endgame, he taught us to look for and create the patterns that win a chess game. The rest followed from there.

I believe he also taught us some traditional killer moves, and how to avoid them.

Its been many years since I played chess, but I enjoyed it very much as a child.

[NoHiddenFees]

Go is another great game for little kids. Despite it's reputation in the US as a highly intellectual game, in Japan, it's commonly taught to 5 year olds, albeit on smaller boards. Here's tonnes of go info. I find the Janice Kim Learn to Play Go series to be the best books for beginners.

Suppose I should make an introduction too, if I'm to keep posting. I'm SAHM to two great kids. DD1 is 2.75 -- outgoing, effervescent and highly personable even at this tender age -- and is extremely adept with words and numbers... probably globally gifted like her father and myself, but she seems to be up a couple notches (at least) above either of us (I'm at the high end of moderately gifted, or the low end of highly gifted depending on whom you talk with). DD1 is constantly amazing us with the things she's picked up and what comes of her highly active imagination, not to mention her extensive vocabulary and sophisticated sentence structure. She literally plays with words and phonemes and can "babble" for hours, experimenting with different patterns and phrases. The only way I can really describe it is listening to her is like reading Nabokov. There is a beauty to the phrases quite separate from their meaning, but there is meaning as well, and how. She can make up rhymes extemporaneously (most likely inherited from DH) and has been punning since about 15 months. Mathematically, she's less prone to invention, but picks up concepts immediately and begs to "do math" every morning before breakfast.

DD2 is 11 weeks old and aside from making an staggering variety of sounds, is a perfectly developmentally average, beautiful 11 week old. DD1, while always very alert, didn't give us any clue she was exceptional until after her first birthday. DD2 already loves books though, just like her big sister... and she smiles at the completion of a good rhyme.

We're planning on homeschooling using a highly structured classical backbone: WTM approach for history & literature and Nebel's for the sciences. We'll use a more flexible (i.e. child led) approach for languages, math, music, and art (and philosphy if I can find a good program).

Me, sometimes I feel like a great waste of flesh, but am mostly over that now. Was bored to tears in public school and instead of channeling my energy into something useful (at least in retrospect), I seem to have managed to allow my own curiosity and creativity to be squelched in favour of fitting in, or at least making it through the system. I'm VERY good at school (graduated tops of the graduating class in my undergrad program), but am usually not proud of this. I did it by gaming the system, rather than by improving myself or taking risks. This is my biggest fear with respect to my children: I want them to be confident to face life head on and realize that one learns from mistakes. I chose to homeschool not only to ensure a rigorous education, but also to avoid the whole mindset that the final grade is the only thing that matters. I hope the girls grow up confident not only to do whatever they want, but to actually have something they do want. I lost my drive (at least for anything not to do with my children), and that just sucks.

[AlohaDeb]

NoHiddenFees...

I totally relate to your post... I couldn't have said it better myself!

[eilonwy]

Originally Posted by NoHiddenFees

Me, sometimes I feel like a great waste of flesh, but am mostly over that now. Was bored to tears in public school and instead of channeling my energy into something useful (at least in retrospect), I seem to have managed to allow my own curiosity and creativity to be squelched in favour of fitting in, or at least making it through the system. I'm VERY good at school (graduated tops of the graduating class in my undergrad program), but am usually not proud of this. I did it by gaming the system, rather than by improving myself or taking risks. This is my biggest fear with respect to my children: I want them to be confident to face life head on and realize that one learns from mistakes. I chose to homeschool not only to ensure a rigorous education, but also to avoid the whole mindset that the final grade is the only thing that matters. I hope the girls grow up confident not only to do whatever they want, but to actually have something they do want. I lost my drive (at least for anything not to do with my children), and that just sucks.

Hi! We've got a lot in common.. my little girl is 13 weeks old, though, and I lost my drive to do anything "useful" when I was about 8 and decided that school was where people sent kids who were too old for daycare.

I'm planning to do WTM for exactly those reasons: to ensure a rigorous, well-rounded education and to teach my children (and niece) that the journey is just as important as the destination. The curriculum is strongest in my weakest areas (history & geography) and weakest in my strongest areas (science & math) so I figure everything will balance out in the end.

I absolutely loved philosophy as a small child! I still do, actually. Logic and philosophy were fairly intuitive to me, so learning the forms was a snap. I never thought to look for a formal philosophy course for young children, but I suppose it wouldn't be too difficult to adapt one from an introductory college course. I took one when I was in 7th grade.. I'll see if I can find the books.

[oldcrunchymom]

Originally Posted by NoHiddenFees

I chose to homeschool not only to ensure a rigorous education, but also to avoid the whole mindset that the final grade is the only thing that matters. I hope the girls grow up confident not only to do whatever they want, but to actually have something they do want. I lost my drive (at least for anything not to do with my children), and that just sucks.

I can really relate to this. Highly gifted children so easily attain those top grades that it can make them lazy or unappreciative of the value of hard work or clueless when they get to the point where they actually have to make an effort (the latter is what happened to me). OR alternatively they become so bored in school that they do nothing and flunk out. Neither of which I want my kids to experience! It's important to their well-being to let these kids keep themselves challenged instead of learning to settle.

[eilonwy]

Originally Posted by Britishmum

Another thing that interests me, as I have girls, is some research that I read about how grades do a great disservice to girls especially. Apparently if they get As all the time, then the moment they find something challenging and get a B, they assume that they've reached the limit of their intelligence, and give up. (boys apparently externalise blame for their Bs, and so aren't affected in the same way, as to them it was someone else who made the mistake, not them).

I remember being early for a summer chemistry course (Chem 112, I believe; the second semester of first year chemistry) and talking to a guy who was also early. I was talking to him about the other courses I was taking (I loaded up my summer session, and was taking pre-calc, philosophy, and volleyball at the same time; I also worked 3-5 nights a week as a security guard at the dorms) and he asked when I'd find time to study for any of it. I laughed and said something like "If I don't get an A in this course, it'll mean that I overslept or that I'm just too darned lazy." He said "Did it ever occur to you that you might not get an A because it's a hard course?" I just blinked at him; that thought had honestly never crossed my mind. The course was very easy, but I got a B+; I overslept and missed part of my lab final. :LOL

I guess if all that fails, we'll have to home school, although how I'll continue to do that with two younger kids I jsut don't know.

It's not as difficult as you might think! I'm homeschooling my niece with BooBah and BeanBean at home, and we're getting on quite nicely. I'm hoping to plan a field trip for her next Saturday to Longwood Gardens. I'm entirely dedicated to homeschooling. For me, it's kind of like breastfeeding. It's something I always knew I would do, could do, should do, and there were really no other options in my mind.

Speaking of homeschooling, I pulled out a workbook and showed it to BeanBean. He was very interested in the letters and the pictures; I think I may get him one of the preschool workbooks they sell everywhere and see if he likes it, once I have some cash.

[Laughingmommy]

Back to Bragging

I just searched for "Gifted" here to browse discussions, and I found this topic of bragging interesting.

When people brag about my kids, how cute they are, how smart they are, how pretty they are. I just smile, nod my head, point to the kids, and say something along the lines of "Aren't they?! Gosh, I never knew how cute/smart/pretty kids could be until I had some! Now I just love watching these kids and their friends all day." It's worked out pretty well, 'cause then it's pretty inclusive. Those who are being judgemental (evaluative praisers) are validated. Those who are just in awe of my lovely children have me to join in the admiration. Then I follow up with a "Do you have any kids yourself?" to sort of let them "brag" a bit. And then I make a big deal about their kids or grandkids too.

The reason I sort of go out of my way to validate praise without making it like my kids are better than other kids is because I want to let my kids know that they are wonderful and special, AND that all kids are wonderful and special, each in his or her own way. It was hurtful when I was young and my Mom would always respond to praise of me with a criticism. I never want my kids to hear me speak ill of them.

[FreeRangeMama]

It used to be very difficult when she was a baby/toddler and did things that would stand out. Eg at one playdate she was crawling around the floor after a ball, shouting 'ball, mummy, look, ball, ball!' clear as anything, when none of the other babes had even said 'mama' yet. Everyone was fairly stunned, and kept on talking about it and commenting, and of course, she kept on talking, showing off all the words that she knew.

We have the opposite problem, whenever someone comments on something ds does he stops doing it all together because he lives in fear of not doing it exactly perfect (and therefore up to his own expectations). His perfectionism is crippling.

Just today he was doing a puzzle at MIL's house. It was easy by his standards, only 46 pieces. He was motoring right through it and enjoying himself when they started noticing and commenting on what a great job he was doing. He started acting like he couldn't get the peices and asked for help. Once the attention was shifted elsewhere he finished without a problem in seconds. He just can't handle the idea he might fail, especially in front of others (any suggestions on that one?).

Part of the problem is that they don't really understand what he is capable of. This is partly because he never lets anyone know what he can do because of his fear of failure and partly because they don't want to acknowledge how advanced he is in comparison to the other children in the family (as if his ability to do more will somehow make their value less or something). I understand the worry about making one child appear "special" in a playing favourites kind of way, but to not even acknowledge it kind of makes it seem shameful YK?

I am really torn as to what to do, on one hand I don't like to mention what he is doing because I don't like the reaction I get. On the other hand it feels like I am hiding it too. Argh, these things are so hard.

[Laughingmommy]

When my first was a baby, I had a very difficult time dealing with other parents. Fortunately, I found a baby movement class where most of the parents and the instructor were warm, non-judgemental people who set wonderful examples for me. Now, I try to separate my attention and responses to parents and children. I've noticed that if I sincerely attempt to make real connections (one at a time), I have fewer regrets about things I say. Example: if I'm near a child and parent and the child is eating her hand. I look into the child's eyes and tell her that she seems to have a yummy hand. The parent inevitably feels embarrassed and says something about how the child is slobbering over everything, or something apologetic about the child's teething, or something. Then I would look into the parent's eyes and say something like "Isn't it weird how you just don't mind the slobber when they're being so cute!?!" And then we all revel in how cute the child is.

I think the real trick to dealing with other parents is not to refrain from bragging. I mean, come on! We're grown-ups. And we're parents! We HAVE to be over-the-top proud of our kids. I think the trick is to genuinely see the special-ness in every child. Then comparisons simply have no judgement. I mean, gosh, forget intelligence. Some parents (like me on an insecure day) have a hard time even with comparisons of height of a child. That's just silliness!

[Laughingmommy]

Originally Posted by FreeRangeMama

We have the opposite problem, whenever someone comments on something ds does he stops doing it all together because he lives in fear of not doing it exactly perfect (and therefore up to his own expectations). His perfectionism is crippling.

My daughter take it out on me when she can't handle the attention. What I try to do is to notice when it's a difficult situation for her, and then I'll try to either whisper to her that she's doing a great job, or get down to her eye-level and ask her what she's doing or say something like "That looks cool." Something, anything. One, to disrupt the tension that's building. Two, to reassure my daughter that I'm here, and that she can feel safe in our own little secret world.

I think with perfectionists, it's just really impossibly hard. I'm trying to go at it in a bigger picture way: reduce stress (i.e. limiting stressful interactions with people), relaxing or calm home, relaxed schedule, and good role models (hey, if I can't figure out how to stop being such a perfectionist, how can I show my kids another way of being?). I try to remind all of us that it's not important how well we do something, the important thing is to enjoy doing it.

[Calm]

I was looking for support and info on gifted children and found this thread going strong. So here I am! Nice to meet you all, since I have read a lot of your posts.

Straight into it....
about bragging - I do it, and I DON'T CARE!!!! We get comments all the time about our daughter and I say, "Hell yeah! You should see what else she can do!" LOL I was brought up that way, and I am no worse for wear for it. I don't ramble at people though, but I always agree with the truth.

And she is beautiful, absolutely magnificent to look at. I should just go and start a brag thread, I say, and call it "The Brag Thread!" (or is there one already?)

Since I am here, does anyone know if there are any threads about psychic children? And I don't mean maybe's or crystals, I mean out and out psychic without a doubt kind of psychic. I want to help her develop this particular gift, along side her intellectual gifts.

We don't have trouble with perfectionism. In fact, we could use some!! We are a family of messy, fly-by-the-seat-of-our-pants, introverted/extroverted creative genii (my plural for genius). Aside from the talking at 7 months and other more obvious indications of my child's mind, what got me is her comic timing. She is one funny person. She has a humour that isn't all physical like most toddlers, it is subtle. Like when you say something ironic, she looks askance at you for a moment then throws her head back in laughter. Just like an adult. Or I lose something and say, "Oh, sh**" and she comes over and says, "what's happening mama, ohhh, noooo, are you ok? Lost something again?" and sends me a sly grin. She's TWO! Incredible.

It is terribly fun with her. I love it. Best person I've ever known, and the funniest.

With love from the BRAG QUEEN AND PROUD OF IT!

[eilonwy]

Don't get me wrong-- I love to talk about my children. I'm totally impressed by everything BeanBean does, and I tell him so all the time. The thing is, I don't want to make other parents feel bad, or feel like I'm comparing BeanBean to their children. This was a huge issue growing up, because my mom would always bring up the fact that we sucked at other things. "Wow, she's very bright!" "Yeah, but her handwriting's atrocious and she doesn't have any friends." Then of course there was the way that she expected perfection of us at all times, while steadfastly refusing to admit to it.

Every now and then, I start a "brag thread" just so I can talk about BeanBean, and so other people can talk about the cool things their kids are doing without feeling bad. The last time, someone else started a thread in response. It was something like "Is my kid the only one who doesn't know the alphabet?" she went on to say that her son was three and a half years old or something like that and could barely talk and wouldn't know the letter B if it jumped up and bit him and was there something wrong with him, she was reading that thread about an 18 month old who knew his letters... People responded not only with encouragement and sympathy for her (which would have been just fine) but with all sorts of negative comments about people who force their very young children to learn things. Someone said "You can teach an 18 month old the alphabet, but I doubt they'll know what it's for anyway." This went on and on, over and over again; people thinking their children were delayed and wondering what they were doing wrong.

If your child is very bright, people get the idea that their child isn't bright because of a parenting choice or something else which they did. It's really silly, but they do it all the time. I hate making people feel that way, so I find myself refusing to talk about my children. Even BooBah, who is only three months old: she pushed up on her little arms and picked her head up to look at daddy while I was still in PACU, and I was only there for an hour. Now she's three months old and has much better head control than her brother did. She's been rolling over consistantly since she was about two weeks old, holding her head up well since about four weeks, and saying hi, hug, and her brother's name since 2.5 weeks (well enough for other people to jump and for the color to drain from their faces). These are just physical milestones, which people are far less touchy about (until you get to walking), but I'm already disinclined to share with my Birthday club. Of course I'm proud, and I want her to be pleased with herself (as if anything could stop her at this age) but I don't want other to look at their babies and wonder if something's wrong with them because they're perfectly average.

[Laughingmommy]

Originally Posted by eilonwy

Of course I'm proud, and I want her to be pleased with herself (as if anything could stop her at this age) but I don't want other to look at their babies and wonder if something's wrong with them because they're perfectly average.

I try to approach it by finding what's not "average" about the other parents' children. Or what's so great about the other parents' parenting. And letting the parents and children know that. But you know, these parents are grown-ups. It's not your job to protect them from dealing with reality. I was a very insecure mother, and person in general. In the beginning, when I saw other babies pull their heads up, all I could see was how my child wasn't. Did it feel bad? Hell yeah!!! I felt like shit. And that's sort of what helped me figure out how to be different, that I really wanted to be different. I mean, I eventually decided that being consumed with jealousy and resentment for these cute little babies and nice mothers was a really absurd thing.

I think a lot of our desires to downplay our kids' achievements has to do with many of our (sensitive women) very real desire to protect others from pain. A lot of times, I think it's useful for someone to experience pain, pain can signal something wrong. I know pain has been very useful in my growth as a person. But sometimes, people could do with kindness. Tough call.

[Laughingmommy]

Originally Posted by NoHiddenFees

Me, sometimes I feel like a great waste of flesh, but am mostly over that now. Was bored to tears in public school and instead of channeling my energy into something useful (at least in retrospect), I seem to have managed to allow my own curiosity and creativity to be squelched in favour of fitting in, or at least making it through the system. I'm VERY good at school (graduated tops of the graduating class in my undergrad program), but am usually not proud of this. I did it by gaming the system, rather than by improving myself or taking risks. This is my biggest fear with respect to my children: I want them to be confident to face life head on and realize that one learns from mistakes. I chose to homeschool not only to ensure a rigorous education, but also to avoid the whole mindset that the final grade is the only thing that matters. I hope the girls grow up confident not only to do whatever they want, but to actually have something they do want. I lost my drive (at least for anything not to do with my children), and that just sucks.

I can really relate to this. I was pretty good at school. Enough to get me into Princeton (and graduate with honors) and then Berkeley for grad school. I am in the midst of a bit of a crisis about going back to finish my PhD having disavowed academia for five years now. It had finally dawned on me that I was okay doing coursework, but once I had to follow my passions and intellectual interests for research, I was lost. I couldn't fake it. I couldn't pull a few all-nighters to make up for a semester's crap work. I'm just not that smart. And then, of course, for me, there's the absolute terror of being confronted with real success, which accompanies real failure, risk-wise.

For me, growing up smart meant growing up dumb for me. I didn't know I was smart, and no one told me. So I just assumed everyone else faked it like me, except I wasn't faking it as well. It was surreal for me, starting preschool, learning this strange universe where people moved in slow-motion and we all agreed to participate in strange rituals, through consensus, apparently. I also had a lot of family troubles (though that's a whole 'nother discussion), and I suffered from kind of bad depression. So my memory really sucks. It's like the neurons were directionally-challenged to begin with (I think I was born VERY absent-minded), and with a few tweaks from depression, my neurons lost all ability to find their way. I somehow managed lots of work-arounds, and managed to succeed in school, but it was all a game.

So, now, I feel like a "great waste of flesh" too! What of all this potential? All these talents that all the teachers marvelled at, that my Mom was quite to discount. I fought my whole life to prove my Mom wrong, that I wasn't a pointless person. But here I am, un-accomplished. And trying to take joy in that. And realizing that maybe it's okay to try, and to fail, and to do things with no regard for my Mom and her opinions and legacy inside me.

I'm homeschooling too. I want to control my children's environments, especially early on, so that I can help them interpret praise and criticism. Both are detrimental because of the inherent evaluation and judgement. I envision something more meaningful, guiding them to solicit real, authentic connections with others. And guiding them to know to walk away when this isn't happening, even if it's rude.

In the end, all these parenting choices and socialization choices go back to what our view of life is. What is kindness? Is it more kind to tell someone the truth? To shield someone from the truth? To distract someone from the truth? To understand that the particular truth is not a meaningful truth? I mean, it's all case by case. What are our connections with our children? What is the purpose of having them in our lives? I know, for me, my children and myself being gifted is not a good or bad thing, a happy or sad thing. Rather, it's something to be recognized and its meaning attended to so that we may lead authentic lives according to our true selves.

I mean, it's great that my kids do all these "tricks." But they also suffer from confronting mortality and others' unkindness. And a bunch of other things I don't have to tell you 'cause I'm sure you all suffered the same or similarly. I mean, it's great that I'm so musical and have perfect pitch. But then there's the inability for me to sleep due to noises in the night. I mean, I'm already getting up to nurse and to change diapers, Lord, I swear I need more than 4 hours of sleep a day!!! And the feeling of never living up to my potential. I mean, don't I have some responsibility to DO something with my perfect-pitch-ness? Like all the other "talents" I have or "tricks" I can do? These are existential questions that come with giftedness. Not good, not bad, just is. (by the way, my answer is that we're not supposed to do according to our ability, but according to our desire)

[Calm]

Is it more kind to tell someone the truth? To shield someone from the truth? To distract someone from the truth? To understand that the particular truth is not a meaningful truth?

There is a few point plan on how to speak that I learned a couple of years back -

Is what you say true?
Is what you say necessary?
Is what you say helpful?

I can't remember the rest, but sometimes, when I am faced with certain things, I run these three through my head to help me answer or deal with a situation. It guides me. Buddha said something similar about speech, which is a big part of the path of a Buddhist -

- to the point
- truthful, as in no lies
- no gossip
- gentle
- kind
- helpful

This ties in with other posts about talking about children also. Physically, my child was average, and when it comes to running, she is slower than average. So I have been on the receiving end of parents talking about the physical milestones of their child that my child was not at yet. I never felt bad about it, my child is developing at her own pace and that's fine with me.

So it's the same with her intellect. She was fast with that and continues to be, and if someone is offended or hurt by that, then they have a problem. She is a child! A very young one at that, and if i have to shelter parents from her achievements because they then doubt their own child's abilities, I feel for the child, but never that parent. I feel for the child because they have a parent that isn't respecting their child's development. Eventually, we all learn the alphabet, we all learn to run, we all can learn to read and so on. Usually these milestones are only years apart at most, so who cares?

Some parents worry because their child hasn't walked yet, but they are only a month away from it - a month! One of my nephews didn't walk until he was 17 months and he didn't do a lot of things until he was older than 'average', but my brother couldn't have cared less, he still thought the sun rose out of his precious boys behind.

If a parent posts on these forums a question pertaining to a milestone, then it is indeed unhelpful for me to point out what my daughter has achieved. You can avoid a truth without lying.

The word 'gifted' is for a reason, because it is rare, so when I mention my daughter is gifted intellectually, other parents immediately feel better, because that is different to achieving a milestone early, and they then don't compare their child to mine because it is obvious she isn't the kind of child worth measuring against.

So, now, I feel like a "great waste of flesh" too! What of all this potential? All these talents that all the teachers marvelled at

It's never too late! Get on that horse and ride into the wind! And on the flip side, what is achievement anyway? Are you using your own measuring stick, or someone else's? Is it really you you have let down, or someone else? The only measuring stick we use is "Am I happy, do I laugh with abandon regularly?" Now that is an achievement worth carving on a gravestone.

With love.

[eilonwy]

Originally Posted by Calm

And on the flip side, what is achievement anyway? Are you using your own measuring stick, or someone else's? Is it really you you have let down, or someone else?

I've spent my entire life being told what success entails. I guess most of us have. It's very very difficult to let go of those "ideals"... I have a hard time moving past it. I can list dozens of things at which I've failed, and very few things at which I've been successful by these definitions. It's very easy to say that the most important things in life aren't things at all, but when you've been urged all your life to strive for those things it's really difficult to let go.

So, what have I achieved? Well, I'm really good at breastfeeding. Seriously. I've nursed through a pregnancy and am now nursing two children, who are nearly two years old and three months old. My baby girl never goes hungry, even though her brother seems to spend half his life at the breast.

I think I've been more successful at breastfeeding than at anything else I've ever done in my life to date. So validate me! Everyone pat me on the head and tell me that I'm not a complete failure in life! :LOL

[Calm]

I failed at breastfeeding, I envy you. To me, you are the epitome of motherhood that I failed to achieve. I still cry at the site of a nursing mother, in joy and in sorrow. I had too much milk and was choking my baby. Expressing worked for a while, then everything went wrong.

I pinned a lot of hopes and dreams on nursing my baby. It was my 'vision' of motherhood. I can't even go the nursing part of these forums because it hurts sometimes. So let me tell you, you have achieved what so many women wanted to achieve. I am not saying this to validate you, although if it does, all the better. I am saying that achievement is in the eyes of the beholder.

If you aren't a banking executive (or other high flying career woman) or you aren't a published author, or any number of things you may 'not be', it doesn't matter, it means absolutely nothing. It is what we 'are' that is an achievement. If you have more than 20 dollars, you are also in the top 7% of the wealthiest people on the planet. Fact.

So, compare not, for you are a glorious being.

With love.

[Laughingmommy]

Originally Posted by Calm

Is what you say true?
Is what you say necessary?
Is what you say helpful?

Nice! Easy, simple, profound. Thank you.

Originally Posted by Calm

It's never too late! Get on that horse and ride into the wind! And on the flip side, what is achievement anyway? Are you using your own measuring stick, or someone else's? Is it really you you have let down, or someone else? The only measuring stick we use is "Am I happy, do I laugh with abandon regularly?" Now that is an achievement worth carving on a gravestone.

Thank you for this. I am laughing. But I'm also dying. I don't care about letting anyone down anymore. I think getting my PhD might be a need. I've always taken offense at the proposal that life is all about compromise. You know what? I'm going to take my own advice and throw that idea out the window! I will get my PhD, and homeschool my two kids, and birth two more, and be a domestic goddess, and do it all perfectly - perfectly happily, that is!