At what point would my family be better off without me? - Page 5

[Calm]

AHA! You just said a very important truth -

"And that’s what I’m really scared of. Getting ‘better’ and then, if I don’t do so well (at being a mom, wife, friend, human), what will be my excuse then? I will have to admit imperfection and inadequacy – how that is harder than hiding under this rug of depression, I simply cannot explain!"

That is exactly how I felt, and once I acknowleged that, (and boy, was that not the hardest one to confront) I had to learn to gain the strength to be "not good enough" or "lazy" or whatever other label i was afraid of FOR NO REASON. When we are ill, depressed, we are finally free to just be. No one asks much of us, and when we fail, we can put it down to our state of affairs and get instant forgiveness. Even self-forgiveness comes much easier with our title - "depression".

To this day, when I get angry or sad, I still revert back to my depression, and my excuse is "I am having a rough spot today". It is our cover-all excuse. Our "get out of jail free" card. People literally get away with murder under the umbrella of "mental illness" - in all its forms.

You are allowed to mess up - for no reason. You are allowed to have bad days, to feel down, to be lazy, to cry, to isolate yourself, to scream, to wither - FOR NO REASON!!! You are ALLOWED. Embrace the totality of your being - all the flaws, all the crap and all the smiles. The perfection of life lay in its imperfections. Passion is "suffering", literally, and what good is life without passion?

You will be hiding your happy moments, you will be veiling your smiles, you will be hampering your joy - simply to make sure that others are aware you are suffering, that "it isn't over yet". If you are caught laughing, or even smiling, do you get the urge to say "hey, this doesn't mean I'm ok now."?

Let me just say it one more time - you are allowed to be a total being, you are allowed to be all the things you have always been, without being depressed. It is your right. You are not required to tiptoe through the tulips picking flowers singing and laughing with joy. You are not required to do anything. So how about starting by dropping your label - depressed. I am depressed. No!
"I am." Period.
I am, I was, and I always will be.

With love.

[MsMoMpls]

Welcome Rivermouth

So- since you are obviously doing amazingly much better than when we all first met you, would you mind my hijacking your thread for a bit?

This post (and many others) has gotten me thinking. If I were to open a family therapy center in my neighborhood (something I actually think I could do) how would I make it supportive and easily accessable to mommas like you? (BTW- real name?) And how do I get mommas IRL the kind of support that they can get here? I mean as brave as you are, I can't imagine you could have walked into a room full of us and said what you did. Even I can't do that and I am a total blabbermouth.

Wonder Mommas of MDC- give it some thought- what would you want in a community drop in center with parenting/mental health support that in any way could be what we get here?

[pishnook]

Okay, one more time today, and then I’ve really gotta POST-and-RUN! This is overwhelming – I’m soooo slow to absorb all of this (uh, all 2 posts!) and respond!

Calm…(you know, your posts always reduce me to rubble & tears!)

Our "get out of jail free" card.

Oh yeah, you know it baby! Heaven forbid I should get my act together and actually have to put some effort into living, like everyone else. And what the hell forbids me from enjoying the possible rewards of such effort? Only me – I want to keep telling myself that what would make me feel much better is that kind of all-embracing, unconditional love...from other people. But guess who I really could use it from? Duh – oh yeah, me. How can I let myself forget that? Crap, it doesn’t matter if every atom in the universe adores you, if you don’t at least like yourself.

You will be hiding your happy moments, you will be veiling your smiles, you will be hampering your joy - simply to make sure that others are aware you are suffering, that "it isn't over yet". If you are caught laughing, or even smiling, do you get the urge to say "hey, this doesn't mean I'm ok now."?

Yet again, bang-o, right on the mark! The way you word it, makes me see all this as a (rather despicable, or at least desperate) ploy, trying to discover – at first – whether anyone else (one poor unsuspecting guy in particular) cared about me enough to try to intervene, to express at least some basic human concern for the harm I’d been dishing myself. Turns out that even if anyone does happen to notice you’re unhappy, unless they’re already close enough your friend to speak up, they either don’t want to intrude, or don’t know how. Whatever. It only marginally matters. What’s more important, and worse, is that it turns out I didn’t have that ‘basic human concern’ for my self. I, apparently, care very little how much I harm myself. And that’s not a very nice thing for my self to have to discover. In trying to see if anyone would feel sorry for me, I found out I don’t even feel sorry for me!

You are not required to tiptoe through the tulips picking flowers singing and laughing with joy. You are not required to do anything.

Thank you! You have this way of making me feel better than ‘normal’ or ‘okay’…better than believing someone else might just be capable of loving me, warts and all…you make me feel capable of loving (and maybe even – gasp – having some respect for) myself, warts and all…thank you!




And Maureen…I remember one post where you pointed out how many views this thread has had – well, now it’s at like 1300 (and I must account for only about half of those!) So, hijack away, please! I want to say I wish I lived in your community – but that just makes me think ‘what could I do to make my own community more enviable…?’ So, along with trying to answer your question, can I also pose one of my own – what would make this awesome-sounding idea possible here, for me, too? I can’t be the only less-than-happy parent in town, who would feel a heckuva lot better to at least commiserate over a cuppa…

The only thing I can think of, right now, is that the more I am in need of socializing, the more I feel like I’m gonna scare everyone away…that, and you’re right about the anonymity of the web making it much easier to bare all…but I don’t suppose many people are going to go for wearing paper bags to the meetings, or be warmed over by ads calling for All Freaks, Come One, Come All! (ok, so there’s your first ‘idea’?? from one of the Blunder – Mammas of MDC, lol!) Seriously, someone will have better ideas (not difficult), and who knows? I might even have some for you too!

And, btw, (I can’t believe I’ve managed so far to omit this!), my name’s Melanie (thanks for asking!).

[number572]

Rivermouth! Thats so awesome... and so you! Great summation of your inner character.

*glad to see you back with us, keep swimmin'

[Calm]

I don't know why, but I got chills reading your name. I wish we could be friends in real life. I would jump at the chance. I am in Australia more often than America, but I hope we can keep in contact anyway.
I am enjoying your journey...

[MamaAllNatural]

HL, Did you get the PM I sent you?

[wonderfulmom]

I like "Rivermouth"- it reminds me of canoeing.
Your first appointment might be easier if you print all these posts out and present them to your counselor. You could highlight some of it, if you'd like.

You say you are "in need of socializing". So say hi to the stockperson at the store as you pass by. Wave to a neighbor. Say "Hello, Cutie!" to someone's little baby. Tell a cashier or mailcarrier, "Thank you- have a good day!" Be bold and PM a member you haven't contacted here yet, whose post you liked, and say hi and tell them what you liked about their post.
Reach out just a little bit.

[MsMoMpls]

Originally Posted by wonderfulmom

You say you are "in need of socializing". So say hi to the stockperson at the store as you pass by. Wave to a neighbor. Say "Hello, Cutie!" to someone's little baby. Tell a cashier or mailcarrier, "Thank you- have a good day!" Be bold and PM a member you haven't contacted here yet, whose post you liked, and say hi and tell them what you liked about their post.
Reach out just a little bit.

Those are great suggestions! If people would take a few baby steps- do what you can to be the person you want to be, fake it till you make it, I would be out of business. I wouldn't mind a world where we didn't need to hire a stranger to guide and support us but got all that we needed from our family, friends and community.

[Red]

First, Welcome and hello!
I was just reading the thread where you admit to being an awful, horrible, nasty women. My, my. Do you really think you're the worst? Get a grip, you're only mediocre at being terrible.

Look, life is hard. They should tell us that sooner so it's not such a surprise. It's really hard. We suffer. We screw up. We hurt others. There are a few people here at Mothering who believe they are perfect. Don't believe them, for they are the true liars, we are all imperfect.

I never was unlucky enough to be put in the position of aborting or giving up a baby. I ddi adopt one though. He was in foster care for 9 months after his teen mother had him, I was the foster mother. She was a mess, poor girl.

He's 22 now. Went to find her when he was 19, with my blessings. He sees her on holidays, though they didn't hit it off, he does have a close relationship with his bio brother and sister. He's not scarred or ruined by the loss, though it is a loss. He had love and caring and was protected and adored.

You expect too much of yourself.

I have fought depression. For many years. I've stood holding the knife against my arm, dreaming of the peace I'd find on the other side of the pain.

Know what? THings change. YOU change. I'm stronger now. I understand my depression and have found new ways to deal with it. I think they are mine alone, and I doubt they'll help you, but I'm willing to share.

First, what have I done for ME today? A hot bath, a glass of wine, a hot cuppa and a favorite tv show, a good book, a trip to the library, a new bottle of fingernail polish. Do something YOU enjoy. Of course, alone isn't always possible, but the kiddo will like a trip to the dollar store, and you can afford $2, one each, right?

Next, I consider all those depressing thoughts: my sisters death, losing my siblings (Long story, posted on the Grief and loss board, ain't goin' there now!), my son's cancer(he's fine but the trauma still makes me sob), etc, all live in a special place in my head. I think of that place as the 'black hole'. All thoughts that bring me to tears and are in the past, can't be fixed, are consigned to the black hole. I visualize myself putting them in there, and walking away to the bright sunny side of my brain. I slam closed a big door, lock it. I occassionally sense that I'm walking around the edge of that hole, and I move myself away. I don't dwell there, because I know the monster depression lives in that hole, waiting to drag me back in.

When feeling the monsters reach, I truly do fake it. Put a pencil between my upper lip and nose and curl my lip to hold it there. Really. It makes your foolish body think you're smiling and helps to release chemicals that improve your mood. I go to the store or mall, and strike up conversations with strangers in line. (Ha, they have the dog-faced baby or the cover of the Enquirer, wonder why we never see those kids out and about huh? My goodness, did you notice the price of butter?) I take a walk, play something physical with the kids, tag or hide and seek, or frisbee. It's hard to cry and run.

Every night as I close my eyes, I think, Ohh, tomorrow is going to be a good day! I'm going to....(take that walk and watch the leaves fall, make bread, buy a magazine, something)

If I wake up to use the bathroom or because I hear a kid, I remember to think, hmm, what's fun about tomorrow? What's good? Oh, yeah, I'm going to....When I wake in the morning I repeat it. It helps me start out on the right foot

Counseling helps if you find the right person. I understand the small town part. We don't even have a doctor, or a priest or a freaking stop light. THere are 900 people here. If I want privacy, I drive a few towns away.

My cousin wrote a book, it helped me. It's called The Day Room by Kathleen Crowley, about her time in a mental institution and her way back to mental health. She had two small kids at the time. She also has a website, Procovery.com She has a rather unique view on getting well.

When will your family be better off with out you? Never. That just doesn't happen, it's a cop out. Your family will only be better when you are. Hmm, and I was raised a guilty Catholic (no offense to anyone!) I thought my fantasies were perverted. Then I read the Joy of Sex and I think the other was called a Woman's Garden. NOt sure if that's the right name, all about women's sexual fantasies. Mine were so DULL by comparison. And innocent.

One last thing, the best way I found to get over one of those bizarre crushes has been to get to know the guy. After a bit, you think, ewwwwww! All guys have enough gross habits in my opinion, to make them hard to love more than one at a time. Just think of all that spitting and burping and belching and farting! They blow their noses like foghorns, and never clean up after themselves. What the heck would I want two of them for!!!

That said, I believe there are some poly relationships here. No offense to them either!

Head up, Honey. Your among other real world, imperfect women, trying their best to make it better. Good for you for realizing what the problem is and that you need some help. Hang out often, Give your son a hug today and tell him you love him. Then do the same for yourself!

[pishnook]

I sat down and made a list of any and everything I could do, right now, any time. (Including sticking a pencil between my lip and nose - how can you not laugh when you're doing something so silly?! Thanks, Red...for all the things you said...) Thought this would be an easy task – wow, was I wrong! Shows me how much I’ve been clinging my focus onto what I can’t do. I haven’t seen my son this happy since he spent the weekend at my mom’s (she plays with him tons). Scary how little it has taken to improve things around here – another indication how poor they were!

Right now, I feel like I have to run screaming from every depressing thought that tries to work its way into my awareness. But, sooner or later, I have to sort them out. I have to listen to what they are trying to tell me. I have to make some sort of peace with them. Because they aren’t going away, no matter how long I ignore them, or how tightly I lock ‘em up. To me, every thought is from me – I don’t want to block them or destroy them, I want to hear them.

How on earth have I let one spoiled feeling, the loss of one potential connection, drop my confidence so low? I think so little of myself, lately, it’s awful. I suppose I just need to pick a few small things I feel capable of doing, do them, then pat myself on the back for doing them. Good girl, have a bone. Keep my eyes to the immediate task only, because when I step back even an inch, and see how far I’ve fallen from what I wish I could be, I crumble into tears.


Reminds me of a lyric – “when I look down, I just miss all the good stuff…when I look up, I just trip over things”!



MamaAllNatural, I did get your PM, thank you…I think I’m procrastinating changing my username, b/c once I do, I won’t have that puny excuse for not posting elsewhere on MDC…

…same reason even though I say hi to people, and am dying for more than that, I still keep a wall up, so that I appear unapproachable. My little shell.

When I was younger, I was wonderfully oblivious to what an annoying, dorky chick I was. Now, every time I attempt to interact, I see much too clearly what a horse’s patoot I am, and I can’t stand it. I read the things I write here, and I just cringe ! (Although maybe if I posted more often, I wouldn’t have a zillion things I want to say each time??)



PS – Maureen, post your question in a new thread, so it can get the attention it deserves! All my ideas are so obvious…offer ‘bribes’ like babysitting & coffee…to make it more like MDC, could you invite or attract parents who have made it through hard times and have their own advice to add to the mix?…if I picture a place like the one I think you’re imagining, it’s much more like a big living room than an office, an atmosphere you can’t help but relax in, you know?

Like I said, I don’t have anything brilliant for you…

[MsMoMpls]

Originally Posted by horrid-lurker

PS – Maureen, post your question in a new thread, so it can get the attention it deserves! All my ideas are so obvious…offer ‘bribes’ like babysitting & coffee…to make it more like MDC, could you invite or attract parents who have made it through hard times and have their own advice to add to the mix?…if I picture a place like the one I think you’re imagining, it’s much more like a big living room than an office, an atmosphere you can’t help but relax in, you know?

Like I said, I don’t have anything brilliant for you…

Oh- you have no idea how much you have given me. I love watching your progress. You fill up my hope bucket. And with the work I do, I need my hope bucket filled regularly. I will post my question, as soon as you are baptised and ready to post. I am brewing the idea. I went to Ikea today and kept daydreaming about a children's area that was bright and welcoming and lots of fluffy couches, pillows, good coffee brewing. My job is to create a place so safe that someone who felt like a horrid lurker could walk in the door and spill her guts. That is a tall order. Thanks for sharing your journey. Please keep posting.

Maureen

[charmarty]

RED~

[liawbh]

Wow, just got done reading this thread. It's very inspiring in several ways! To see such love and support from so many is great, and to see you come so far is really heart-warming.

I have a few ideas, though some of them fall into the "who am I to talk" category, since I haven't tried them either

1. Start a coffee hour/playdate group if there isn't one already in your town. See if there's a room at the library, the hospital, a school, or community center that you can reserve.

2. To get #1 going, post flyers at all of those places, as well as the grocery store, health food store, toy store, etc.

This won't address the counseling part of things, but there are a ton of great ideas already said by other mamas. It will, however, get you out, with your son, doing social things for both of you.

3. Schedule something for yourself on a regular basis. It can be a solo night at a "chick flick," a scented, candlelit bath (try cheering and uplifting aromatherapy scents) or chocolate and a good, girl-power, funny book or movie in bed, while your son and husband get some guy time.

Stick with it!

[pishnook]

…just a thought…(and not a welcome one)…

If I can’t have even an ounce of respect for myself, how on earth can I actually grasp anyone else being able to have any for me?

How do ya get off this $#!%ing (not-so-)merry-go-round? It’s a catch 22. (I swear, I’m addicted to those mind-traps, little eddies in my thoughts that suck me in to their spin sometimes for hours.) This one goes like this: I feel like major crap about myself, which discourages me from accomplishing anything (like eating lunch, or going out of the house ) which might actually cause me to feel better about myself.

Ok, so that’s just the definition of depressed, and ok, so the answer’s baby steps (aka paddlin’ my butt off, hey Lynn?!)

Would somebody please just tell me that yes, of course things will improve…(so I can whine ‘When??!?!!?’)


Why do I have to insist on feeling so stupid for everything I say, or do (or don’t do)? Why do I continue to battle every intention I wish I could express? Can it really be so hard to just be yourself? (...and does anyone have any clue where I might, in me, find such a thing?!)

[charmarty]

Oh My Gawd Woman! I think I may need to beat you! I just read a post here YES here at MDC to which you replied to helping anpther woman out who is in dire needs. NOTHING you said there was stupid. It was wonderful, seeing you helping others. I was PROUD of you!!!!!!!!!!!!! The only stupid things you say are when you beat yourself up. NOW STOP IT!

[pishnook]

Really???

...That's what I was feeling (especially) stupid for - talk about the blind leading the blind...or the unwise giving bad advice!

I don't want to get the poor woman in trouble b/c of my dumb comment, yk?

I should think before I speak...but then I would never say anything!

[wonderfulmom]

Sometimes, the best advice for you is what you would say to a dear friend who was in that situation. Would it be ok with you if your friend skipped eating- even if she had eaten too much before--- or called herself stupid- even if she'd made a mistake, or even a hundred mistakes? Your kindness is so obvious to me. Use some of it on yourself.

[charmarty]

Really!

You did not make a dumb comment!
And you know what? Some women here who replied to yuor thread here are still in thier bad place too and I'll bet those are the ones you can relate to most. Because it is from such a real raw place to give those feelings out, you can't help but take notice.

[pishnook]

(thank you)

[morgainesmama]

I haven't read all the posts. But props, mama. I got to where you are recently; depressed, overwhelmed, a bit suicidal, decided to move out. Told my husband I'd send him money and milk and he could stay home with the kids.

I went to a cognitive behavioral therapist for the second time in my life. It helped. I've come to understand (much like Red expressed in her post below) that living with true depression is like living with a bad back; some days it's just too bad to handle, but you mostly just learn to live with it. I've got my own set of coping mechanisms, pick-me-up notes and reminders all over the house, etc. I was at one time yelling at my kids so much I wrote to the child abuse hotline for help. They never wrote me back.

As far as meds go, my thoughts are this: if I had a yeast infection, I'd get meds for it. But I'd also attack the problem from a dietary/lifestyle perspective. Likewise any health problem. Depression is the same. A bit of medicine to help you over the hump while you're addressing the lifestyle/imbalance issue through therapy, diet, etc. may make everyone's life better.

Take a breath. Take a break. Breathe more air and drink more water; look at the sky, read some depressing books or the newspaper to give you some perspective, then something uplifiting to give you hope.

You'll get there. For me when I hit bottom, wanting to move out, it always turns out to be a good place bc the next place I go is up.

Hugs, mama!