Mothering › Forums › Parenting › An Inappropriate Book?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

An Inappropriate Book?  

post #1 of 31
Thread Starter 
My daughter is a member of the Children's Book of the Month Club. I got her Curious George, because I remember that I liked those books when I was a child. After it arrived and we sat down to read it, though, I discovered that it's a book about the Man in the Big Yellow Hat who
*steals* George from Africa and brings him to live in a *zoo*! I certainly hadn't remembered that part. My daughter loves the book; however, my husband and I, who are vegetarians and animal lovers, are horrified by this! Tonight when my daughter chose the book, she asked me why George was sad when he and the Man in the Big Yelloe Hat were being rowed to a big boat. I said it was because the MitBYH took him from his home. She asked me whether I thought that was ok, and I said no. We asked Daddy, and he said he didn't think it was ok either. Then I asked my daughter if she thought it was ok, and she said yes. I said, "Oh, ok," and kept reading the book. My husband wants to get rid of the book. I do, too, but I also think maybe we should keep it just so we can talk to our daughter about it and how we feel. My daughter is only 2 1/2, though, so I don't know how much she would understand of our concerns, and in the meantime I don't want her to think it's ok to go around stealing wild animals for our own personal pleasure. Oh, and btw, at one point in the book they throw George in jail, and they call him naughty several times, too!

What should we do?

Namaste!

Ps. We're adopting our son from Ethiopia, and I certainly don't want
*him* to think it's ok to steal things from Africa for Americans' gain. Or to think of himself as stolen from Africa! Am I overthinking this??
post #2 of 31
I had the same response when I was reading this to dd.
Dh and I were thinking, wow.
That said, we still allow dd to read it.
.......but don't you love how he also ends up running from the police?
post #3 of 31
I don't think that your daughter will understand if you take away the book at this point. If you really feel she shouldn't read it again I suppose you could slip it away somewhere in the house until you are sure that she won't ask about it.

While I can see where you have problems with the book I assume that your daughter doesn't think that in the long run the " being stolen" hurts George - because he has so many adventures and is a monkey. I would want to be able to fully explain to my DD why I didn't like the book and some of the issues may be a bit much for a 2 1/2 year old.

Have you already brought up the issue of caging wild animals? Will you allow her to go to zoos?

A side note: we tend to read through books before reading them to DD - not to censor usually but to get a heads up as to what situations/ questions we're going to encounter. I know this won't work for everyone.
post #4 of 31
I didn't even like Curious George books when I was younger because of the things you didn't like. I was older though...

I also pre read books; one that I always liked was the bat book (brain fart; can't remember the title) but when DD received it as a gift and I read it, I realized that the message was that you should keep looking till you find the mom who looks just like you. Every other animal was wrong because they didn't look like the bat. Having adopted children, this was not the message I wanted them to get. I just tucked it away and will give it to her when she moves away from home. There was another that was very Christian and the message seemed to be that there wasn't much to be happy about in this world, but there was always the after life... also will be given to her when she's a grown up.
post #5 of 31
Thread Starter 
The bat book you mentioned is Stellaluna. We have that one, too, and I have had some of the same issues with it, although I have tried to convince myself that the main message of the book is what the birds and Stellaluna say at the end: we're so much the same but so different, we're so much different but so the same. I don't know ... the whole message about being with your own kind bugs me too.

Namaste!
post #6 of 31
Hey,

I am a vegetarian and a caucasian adoptive mom to an African American daughter. And I don't have issue with these books. This is why:

Curious George - my son has loved these books. We, as he got older, talked about issues that come up, like is a monkey really happier in a zoo than in Africa, etc. Then we just enjoyed the stories.

There is a reason why kids have loved these stories for fifty years, and it's not because they like the idea of animals being stolen from Africa. They are good for early readers, have repeated vocabulary, great illustrations, lots of varied and imaginative action, and a silly monkey!

And we go to the zoo often, and we talk about the animals and where they are living (we have an awesome zoo 2 blocks away) and if they seem happy and why or why not. Some just have more updated and roomy exhibits than others. And they are working on improving conditions all of the time.

Stellaluna - first, it's not a story about adoption, really. Stellaluna just happens to land in a nest. If a child who was adopted knows their adoption story, they will know that their parent was waiting for them and either chose or was chosen for them. And I do expect my daughter to seek out people who "look like her" and share her cultural heritage, and I will encourage it. And at the end, Stellaluna brings the birds over to show them new things, and while the birds were still different, they were still her friends.

Just my 2 cents.

L.
post #7 of 31
I agree with what Leatherette said.
post #8 of 31
Maybe it's just a book to put on the shelf for a little while. You can always revisit it when she is a little older and can understand your perspective a bit better. At 2.5, she has no idea about things like stealing, leaving one's home permanently, kidnapping, whatever. If you like the general story, a little creative editing can make a book a bit more palatable.

We have some older books from when I was a kid, and when my parents were children. They have much sentimental value, and I want to share them with my children, but they are often filled with values that I don't agree with. If I feel like my child is not mature enough for any discussion about it, I will edit it myself. My prime example is about spanking. I am amazed at how much spanking goes on in children's books! My 3.5 year old has no concept of what a spanking is, or why someone would want to hit another person, thankfully. I see no reason for her to be exposed to that yet. So, I'll exchange the word spanking for time out. This usually sparks a discussion she can understand about the moral of the story. As she gets older and understands more, I censor less.


Bec
post #9 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by dharmamama
After it arrived and we sat down to read it, though, I discovered that it's a book about the Man in the Big Yellow Hat who *steals* George from Africa and brings him to live in a *zoo*!
You're kidding!!! I must have been pretty young when I read those books because I do NOT remember that. How funny!
post #10 of 31
Yes, the man in the big yellow hat kidnaps George in Africa and takes him back puts him in a zoo...
There was a thread about these stories fairly recently:
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...curious+george
post #11 of 31
We edited our copy. It wasn't easy given the pictures, but we had George playing hide-and-seek with the colonialist with the yellow hat on one page. When George is tied up into a sack, though, it was trickier; we edited it to "they liked to play Harry Houdini" which got us into a great discussion of escape artists.
post #12 of 31
Personally, I think you are over thinking this. Your daughter is 2.5. She isn't quite ready for the deeper ideas behind that. I think it is better to discuss these issues when she is older.

Let children enjoy the stories. If she didn't think it was a problem right now, don't force it to be one. Just my 2 cents.
post #13 of 31
I think the fact that a 2.5 year old doesn't understand these concepts is *exactly* the reason why I wouldn't want my 2.5 year old exposed to them. I wouldn't want my child's first exposure to the concepts being one that normalized them & treated them like there wasn't a thing in the world wrong with them.

If I think ds is too young to have a meaningful discussion about why a concept in a book is wrong, then I don't read him the book. His default setting seems to be to accept what's presented to him first, whether it be from Mama, Nana, the TV or a book. Once an idea's got into his skull, it's the very devil to get it *out* or explain another side of it to him -- and these are just the ideas simple enough for him to be able to pinpoint & discuss verbally! (I am *still* trying to explain to him, for instance, that his Nana's religious beliefs are not literal fact, and that Indians do not ride around on horses shooting people. Grr.)

Anyway, there's not any Curious George around here, and there won't be until ds is old enough to talk about colonialism first.
post #14 of 31
If I remember right someone smokes a ciggarette in that book too I don't like the book so I avoid it. I haven't felt the need to get rid of it, but I try to keep it tucked away. We have so many great children's books that I don't see a need to read that one.
post #15 of 31
I have been known to glue pages together.

Darshani
post #16 of 31
What Leatherette said.

This topic has come up before on other boards, you should do a search and a lot will come up.

My ds loves-loves-loves Curious George books. George is childlike in his curiosity, gets into trouble but it all works out for the best by the end of the story.

The authors lived in S. America for a long period after escaping Nazi Germany and actually had a pet monkey they adopted, thus the Curious George stories were born. These stories were written in a totally different historic timeframe. The authors set up a fund to help animals that continues after their death.

Just reading a story about a monkey being taken from his natural home to be placed in a zoo isn't going to make your child think that is an okay thing to do. I love to read mysteries and detective stories but I don't think murder and robbery are acceptable nor would I want to be a private detective in real life.
post #17 of 31
I know what you are saying about how your 2.5 yo just takes whatever he's presented at face value. Mine too! Which is why, like girlndocs said, I don't read my dd books I can't explain, or that have strongly objectional ideological backgrounds she cannot comprehend.

We don't read our children everything when they're this young. For example, we are not a Judeo-Christian family and purposefully avoid the Noah's Ark books and other God stuff at the library because that is something I'm not ready to explain to her yet. She is not ready to understand my perspective. I agree it won't "make" her Christian, but I know she is not ready to understand it yet.

This dilemma happens a lot with us when she checks out books that have prominent parts with babies who get bottles from their mamas, or when everyone is eating chicken, or whatever. We edit out the small things when that happens, and can explain bottles, cribs, and chicken. But I don't think these books are inappropriate for her 2.5 yo mind.

And I don't like the Curious George books, either. I didn't as a child, either, because the man scared me. (and I turned out vegetarian....)
post #18 of 31
Here's how I've weeded books from our stash that I was uncomfortable with: Keep reading it at the child's request until the novelty wears off (it will eventually.) At 2.5, she won't remember it for long after you stop reading it anyway. When a few days have gone by without the child requesting the book in question, hide it. Go ahead and get it out if the child asks for it, but it won't be lying around to remind them. When a couple of months have passed and the child hasn't missed it, get rid of it however you see fit.

I let the kids get Curious George books, but I avoid the first one for the reasons the OP mentioned. Usually I do this removal method with books that turn out to be too old for my kids or give an overt moral message that I disagree with. "Arthur's Underwear" was a great example. It was about underwear being exposed at school and everyone laughing at the person. If my kid had been in 2nd grade, I probably wouldn't have had a problem with it, but she was only 3. She loved the book, but *every* time I'd have to explain why having one's underwear showing could be embarrassing. Ugh.

We love Stellaluna! I've never thought of it in the negative way some PP have. I doubt my kids have either -- the two families in question are different species after all. I imagine if I were saved by wolves, I'd eventually want to be with people!
post #19 of 31
There is a wonderful (adult's) book called "Should we burn Babar?" which discusses these very issues--the image of the elephants only being good when they're "civilized by the colionialists" and such. It has several short essays about children's books. I'd definitely recommend it.
post #20 of 31
Just some more thoughts.....we're very anti CG and Babar b/c of the colonialist/racist message. We take social justice very seriously at home- while my son may be too young to understand it exactly, this is in part b/c he is white, lives in the US etc. We seek to take those privileges and help move us all towards a sense of empathy and compassion, things which my son does understand. With an older child I think they are good teaching tools (my parents used them this way with my bro and I). For a younger child who's already been exposed to them, I think it's helpful to try to explain it in a way they can understand, as other posters mentioned. For example, when we see something (like yelling at a child) at the grocery, we simply say to ds (if he notices, we would never call attention to it ourselves!) "In our family words are not for hurting. We speak gently." So rather than critique the book in a mean way with a young child, you could perhaps try to talk about the monkey's life in Africa, use it as an opportunity to learn about Africa or a specific country there or a monkey species, etc. Kind of like redirecting

peace
h*mama
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Parenting
This thread is locked  
Mothering › Forums › Parenting › An Inappropriate Book?