How do parents get children to participate in time-outs?

[IdentityCrisisMama]

I just don't entirely get this ~ the whole time-out thing.

I mean, if the child won't participate to the point that she/he gets a time-out...how or why do they participate in the time-out?

[Calm]

Time outs only work when they are chosen by the child, and therefore do not work when they are too young to understand the reasons behind a time out. There are two effective methods of disciplining I believe - consequences that fit the action and time outs that the child chooses.

I have to assume some things here, so bear with me. Perhaps the place you use for time out is not welcoming. Perhaps your child is too young to understand what its all about. Time out space should be comfortable to a child - with a big teddy bear, some music etc, placed somewhere like a corner of the room, or a spare room if you have one. They work best (only?) like this -
Parent - "Ok, that behaviour is unacceptable to me. I really think you need to go and think about it. Why don't you go to your thinking space."
If the thinking space (time out) is welcoming, they may well trot off and do just that. Which gives them the opportunity to have quiet time and digest the whole event. I don't believe in punishment and I fully support choice, this gives them the choice. Time out should be useful and have a point, therefore it should be welcoming and comfortable - not akin to a jail cell where priveleges are taken from them (punishment).

And yes, I have had many an argument with other parents about this method, and yes, their argument is always "how does that do anything, if it is comfortable and welcoming and they would choose to go and sit in teddy's lap, where is the lesson in that?" to which the only response from me is "what is the lesson in punishment?" Keeping in mind that whereever possible, time out can be on you. My DD often uses me as her time out, I just say "thinking time, darling" and she either goes to her space, or throws herself on me and processes the event which usually culminates in her coming back to me/looking up at me and saying, "oh, sorry mama, I was just playing."

A strange and wonderful thing that occurs with a gentle time out space, is that sometimes you will catch them waltz themself over to it, switch on the soft music, snuggle on the big ted's lap and do some voluntary thinking. It takes time to introduce the space, and if it is delivered in a loving way, you may find your child will be more cooperative when you offer the suggestion she may need some time out.

[NatureMama3]

Time-outs are one of the most misinterpreted things, IMO.

They're meant to be a period of time where the child has attention withdrawn so they can calm down before moving on with things. Unfortunately they're often used as a form of non-violent punishment where the child is made to (sit in a chair, stand in a corner, go in a room, etc) as for doing something "wrong".

Used as they typically are (punishment) they're very ineffective at producing positive change. Used how they should be (calming down time before going on with working on a problem) they work well.

[sunnmama]

Originally Posted by NatureMamaOR

Used how they should be (calming down time before going on with working on a problem) they work well.

But how do you persuade the uncalm child to take the much needed timeout? And at what age do children generally cooperate with timeouts?

I have only one child, so she is my only experience. Sometimes we need to do a timeout, because she is either going to, or already has, hurt someone. But it is always forced, unfortunately. And I have to keep her there forcibly (I hold her tightly, like a bear hug). Maybe not all children are as intense as my dd....but she is quick to rage, and, when her fury is unleashed, she is focused on lashing out--and disinterested in a timeout (even though I do *not* use them punitively--and I always accompany her).

[NatureMama3]

Well, that's just it, it is best done as a removal of the parent's attention, NOT a placing of the child in another situation for punishment (I give the example of sending my kids outside as one way we've found to help them expend energy they have due to ADHD. we wouldn't probably if they didn't have that issue).

It doesn't require their cooperation, only mine.

If she's hurt another child, what to do would be remove you and the other child from the situation until she calms down (and you calm down). Attend to the hurt child without dealing with the other at all at that point. When the parties are calmed down dealing with it will be much more effective and less clouded with emotion.

[sunnmama]

Originally Posted by NatureMamaOR

If she's hurt another child, what to do would be remove you and the other child from the situation until she calms down (and you calm down).

Ah, I never heard of that approach. Interesting.

She only hurts me or dh, generally. Removing myself doesn't work, because she follows and attacks :

[~Megan~]

I dunno, dh uses them with dd. He tells her to sit on the couch until she's ready to talk and she does it. She comes down when she is calm and ready so they can talk.

[NatureMama3]

close a door then. shut yourself in the bathroom for example. explain first that you're going to "time out" because of hitting and when she's calm you can discuss and deal with it. Obviously this will work better in the 3+ crowd (younger, time outs aren't going to be too effective anyway).

Here's some articles I've found helpful in understanding time-outs:

http://www.naturalchild.com/guest/peter_haiman.html

http://www.positivediscipline.com/ar..._Children.html

http://www.positivediscipline.com/ar...veTimeOut.html

http://www.positivediscipline.com/pa.../quest001.html

[TiredX2]

DS does not do time-outs yet (he was 3 in August) but DD does (she will be 6 in January). I do not know if we will do time outs with DS, so far he does not seem to have the same overstimulation issues as DD.

When DS was younger, though, and him & DD were getting in lots of physical confrontations, we would hold DS until he calmed down.

Time-outs for DD: she is definately an introvert (like momma) and she just does not yet identify when she needs some alone time. When we can tell she is getting out of control we tell her to go to her room (which we actually put together *because* she needed a place to be alone & to have her things safe from DS) and she generally does. Sometimes it will be 30 minutes and she will be curled up on her bed reading, or have put together a new marble run. Sometimes she doesn't get all the way upstairs before she is ready to re-join us.

As an adult, if I behave badly I am not "punished." BUT, I am expected to be responsible for my own behavior. Time outs are one way to help a child, IMO, become responsible for their own behavior--- to learn to recognize the value of alone time.

[Britishmum]

I don't use time out, but do tell dd that if her behaviour is not acceptable towards others, she must go somewhere else - she can choose where, but it has to be somewhere where she is not going to hurt me or her sister. I"m not comfortable with making dd#2 go elsewhere, as that seems like a punishment for her because her sister is being inappropriate.

Luckily for us, just the suggestion to dd that she might need to remove herself is enough to pull her up, and usually results in a rush to get into my arms or hug her sister and cry and then put things right. I like the fact that it brings home to her immediately the realisation that the behaviour is not acceptable to others. She doesnt actually need the time to think about it and calm down, as she can reorganise her behaviour very rapidly. But then, she is an extremely sensitive child and hates to ever think that she has done something wrong, so our experience is different to many others, I think.

[IdentityCrisisMama]

Thanks, everyone!

This is really interesting information for me. What I'm realizing is that the reason I don't understand this is because my child is either way too young or just not suitable for this type of thing. Although, I may suggest a (non-punitive) time-out just to see if I'm wrong.

I see a small difference between a time-out because of 'misbehavior' and a time-out because the child is over stimulated, no? The over stimulated thing I totally understand but the other. I guess I just don't relate to a child who's not in the mood to be cooperative, cooperating with the timeout. Can anyone describe this for me?

Anyway, I'm going to check out the links. Thanks again.

[IdentityCrisisMama]

Oh, well...I can see a major reason why I don't understand how time-outs can be used positively ~ because my child is too young. One of the links says that it won't be effective with a child under 3.5.

[Houdini]

[QUOTE=Britishmum]I don't use time out, but do tell dd that if her behaviour is not acceptable towards others, she must go somewhere else - she can choose where, but it has to be somewhere where she is not going to hurt me or her sister. I"m not comfortable with making dd#2 go elsewhere, as that seems like a punishment for her because her sister is being inappropriate.


ISN'T THIS WHAT TIME-OUT IS?? HAVE THE CHILD GO SOMEWHERE ELSE SO THEY ARE OUT OF THE SITUATION. WE SAY "TAKE 5" WHEN THE KIDS NEED A BREAK FROM THE SITUATION. THEY TYPICALLY GO TO THEIR ROOM. DEPENDING ON THE CHILD THEY WILL LAY ON THEIR BED. WHEN THEY ARE CALM AGAIN AND READY TO BEHAVE APPROPRIATELY THEY ARE WELCOME TO COME OUT. WE DON'T USUALLY HAVE A SET TIME.

[Calm]

"Oh, well...I can see a major reason why I don't understand how time-outs can be used positively ~ because my child is too young. One of the links says that it won't be effective with a child under 3.5."

That is sort of what I was trying to say. When you asked:

"I guess I just don't relate to a child who's not in the mood to be cooperative, cooperating with the timeout."

it sort of answers itself. If they aren't cooperating, they aren't cooperating. My dd is 2.5, but she will use me as a time out, as she is not really ready to be alone and "digest" things yet. All they really need at such young ages is a moment to collect themselves and reassurance that they still have your acceptance.

I went to great lengths to explain that it must be inviting, or no one in their right mind is going to go somewhere that sucks and feels like punishment - adult or child. You could set up a space in the family environment for your child and get her used to it being her own space. Over the next months and years, with it being referred to as her thinking space, or time out space, whatever, when you mention "time out", she may well go to it, showing you herself at what age she is ready, if it is available.

Your question was and is a valuable one, in that many parents confront the same issue - the child just won't go. They end up forcing the child or abandoning the idea altogether. So the factors of age and reason for time out should be addressed - as you did.

Blessings.

[annh]

I dont know?? I guess i am the odd one out here. My daughter is going to be 3 very soon and we have been doing time out with her for a while now. She has a chair in her room that when she does something that SHE KNOWS is unacceptable, she will go in and sit in it. It actually works great and has worked since we started. To tell you all the truth, we havnt had to use time out on quite while!!!!
I just brought up to Dh that she hasnt had to sit in her chair in months and he was shocked as well when he thought of how long ago it actually was that she has sat in it!
Now some toddlers her age may not know what they are doing is not the right thing to do, so a time out wouldnt work for them. My daughter knows all too well when put in time outs, and we make sure that she knows BEFORE we would use a time out. If they dont understand whats wrong it wont work. she would never go in time out for doing something that she wasnt aware of as being unacceptable.