Pre-Eclampsia Watch Dog on the loose. - Page 23

[sarah9774]

Levels

Gossamer-

here are my results..

AFP .55

Estriol .48

HCG 3.5

Inhibin 3.4



the counselor I spoke with today said that with the US that I get due to being high risk already have not shown any abnormal signs. I did the quad screening and US at week 15 and they were normal. That is why she said that I will possibly have problems in the third trim with hypertension/ pre-e/ plecental problems or preterm labor.. I think that I feel a little better about this I am keeping an eye on my bp and will talk to the Dr about 24 hr urine and liver enzymes.. I am trying not to stress too much as it does not help..

[maxmama]

Originally Posted by bradleybirth2mom

I had learned in my Bradley birth classes of a doctor who had virtually no incidence of preeclampsia with his patients, and he told them to get at least 100 grams of protein a day. I stayed at home and got this amount with my second one since I kept a nutrition chart, and I had BP that was 90/60 and no birth complications. With my first, I was working full time and not keeping tabs on my nutrition and showing BP of 140/80 and protein in the urine, but it dissipated by my next doctor visit. Most people don't get enough nutrition, so I think this may actually point to the cause. I do think stress is a major factor---if the body and mind have to deal with too many stressors in the environment, I think it feels forced to reject the pregnancy as an auto-immunological response, with devastating effects on the mother and baby. We can look at pregnant animals, too---for example, livebearing fish will abort their brood if moved by hand too close to their 'delivery' date, and a mother bird will abandon her eggs if she can scent another animal on them. I don't think humans realize that the pregnancy needs to be nurtured, and that a smaller dose of everyday life combined with rest and relaxation would probably reduce the incidence of this horrible disease----just my theory, gals.

I guessing you're referring to the Brewer diet. Diet has not been supported as either a cause of or treatment for preeclampsia, and it's been studied extensively. Brewer's results haven't been repeatable in larger studies.

The perinate I see has been doing interesting work in vascular function and insulin resistance as risk factors for preeclampsia, but they freely admit they don't have a cause or a cure for pre-e -- as I think most reputable researchers agree.

[flyingspaghettimama]

Originally Posted by maxmama

I guessing you're referring to the Brewer diet. Diet has not been supported as either a cause of or treatment for preeclampsia, and it's been studied extensively. Brewer's results haven't been repeatable in larger studies.

The perinate I see has been doing interesting work in vascular function and insulin resistance as risk factors for preeclampsia, but they freely admit they don't have a cause or a cure for pre-e -- as I think most reputable researchers agree.

Nevertheless, some of us do feel that the high-protein diet was very helpful to us personally. I do feel my increased protein, nutrition, and low-stress lifestyle was helpful in avoiding pree and HELLP second time around, and helping me to have a healthy homebirth.

I guess, I wouldn't ever discount it completely, and it sure doesn't hurt a person (at least in my case) to eat plenty of protein. I also do not have any preexisting medical conditions (clotting disorders) as other have faced.

[sarah9774]

I went to the Dr. and found out that the test was not accurate. However they will watching me closely, urine, BP and doing blood flow studies as I get further along.. the baby looks good, and I am still on the heparin 2x's a day along with the other vitamins they have me on.. I feel good about this.. thanks for info...

[maxmama]

Originally Posted by flyingspaghettimama

Nevertheless, some of us do feel that the high-protein diet was very helpful to us personally. I do feel my increased protein, nutrition, and low-stress lifestyle was helpful in avoiding pree and HELLP second time around, and helping me to have a healthy homebirth.

I guess, I wouldn't ever discount it completely, and it sure doesn't hurt a person (at least in my case) to eat plenty of protein. I also do not have any preexisting medical conditions (clotting disorders) as other have faced.

One reason I'm not a fan of the Brewer diet is that there may be an underlying vascular renal issue for some women who develop preeclampsia, and the high levels of protein may not be beneficial and may increase the renal workload.

I don't discount anything completely, but I have to say my skepticism goes way up when the results have not been repeatable in 30 years of research in diet interventions. Also, the recurrence rate for preeclampsia is quite low in second pregnancies (it varies according to onset time), so while I'm glad you had a good outcome, I'm not convinced it was the Brewer diet.

What scares me is that some women may self-treat with Brewer or feel completely protected, and it jsut isn't the case.

[shannon0218]

I agree Maxmama--the thing about the whole brewer diet that scares the crap out of me is stuff like the post saying some doctor had NO incidence of pre-e in his practice because he used this diet. That is not possible and if it's true it's because he treats VERY few women or he just doesn't test for it--hey, I never had a clotting disorder until I tested for it, I was blissfully unaware and it cost me 4 babies.
Anytime someone spouts off that x, y or z diet is the be all and end all cure for a disease that can KILL mama and baby but has ZERO repeatable proof or research, it sets up some poor mama to "believe" in the diet and possibly loose her child or her own life.

[flyingspaghettimama]

Oh no, I agree, I don't think it was the Brewer Diet completely either, I think it was probably a combination of factors. However, my MW really recommended BD and exercise as the contributing factors to healthy homebirths for previously pre-e women she's attended. I also saw a high-risk doc who gave HIS advice (you know, the sperm theory) and nutritional suggestions (folic acid).

FWIW, I had onset at 26 weeks the first time around, and made it to 34, but with HELLP.

ETA: I think none of us (patients, docs, midwives) know for sure what causes pree, but whatever works for each of us is great - for some, it may be high-protein diets, for others close management by an OBGYN, others exercise and nutritional management. It's really about what makes one comfortable mentally and gets you (and baby) through physically. I wouldn't discount any approach out of hand. Well, maybe shaking a rainstick at the sky and eating donuts nightly won't work too well.

[shannon0218]

Ahh, see folic acid is a blood thinner, often used to treat clotting disorders...the difference is, you never hear anyone saying "Oh, just take folic acid and that will prevent the pre-e"

I totally get what you're saying and I know many a midwife and OB recomends it but like Maxmama said--they've been trying desparately to reproduce "good" results using brewer diet for 30 yrs and have been totally unsuccessful. Alternatively, "good" results from rest, meds, heparin, finally figuring out what was actually wrong, are able to be repeated with ease.

Brewer made a HECK of a lot of money off his own research that couldnt' be reproduced

[flyingspaghettimama]

That OBGYN said that he'd seen a huge reduction in pree since recommending folic acid to women. I was already taking a healthy dose, but he suggested basically megadoses. Also, the baby aspirin.

One of the biggest contributors to my healthy outcome (in my opinion) was exercise. I read a great study that talked about the role of exercise for one year prior in warding off preeclampsia for previously preeclamptic women, and exercise throughout pregnancy. I was running up until my seventh month.

I was basically taking about 10 pills per day throughout the pregnancy, and doing the mega protein (but I'm a vegetarian, so it's normally not something I get a whole lot of either). Very exciting. Gag.

[shannon0218]

Yeah, I see a rheumatoligist who specializes in recurrent miscarriage and pregnancies with autoimmune issues--he's considered a bit of a clotting guru and anyone who's had pre-e or unexplained miscarriage is put on mega dose folic acid and baby aspirin--some of us are also put on heparin.
I guess that's the thing for me--he can sit down with me and show me 10 different studies telling me how it works, why it works and what the numbers are.

[flyingspaghettimama]

I getcha. But I also enjoy my naturopathic medicine too, which has little in the way of peer-reviewed studies but plenty of long-term anecdotal and historical support. So that's why I did BD the whole way through - my MW's opinion and experience. She was a very intuitive and cool woman, and she was one of the few that would take me on with a history of severe PreE and not be a paranoid freak about it.

Because there was only room for one paranoid freak in that relationship, and that would be me.

[gossamer]

I will say again, that a good healthy nutritional diet is always the best way to go, and if you have no underlying conditions that could put a strain on your kidneys, why not eat more protein. If you are eating protein, those are calories you are not wasting on simple carbs and sugar. Of course we all have to do what we can to survive our subsequent pregnancies and I don't think any one of us will discount the benefits of a healthy diet and lifestyle. Just don't discount the other unknowables, like blood clotting idsorders, high homosystine levels, and poor implantation of the placenta, that cannot be "cured" by diet alone. Until I lost Mary Rose I had no idea how serious pre-eclampsia is. I didn't know it is the number one cause of premature birth and the number two cause of neonatal death (behind domestic violence). SO yes, do what works for you, but whatever you do, don't take the diagnosis lightly.
Gossamer

[taradt]

I think for many following the BD also makes us feel we are "doing something". I don't have clotting disorders but I do have high homocysteine that I feel led to pre-e with my daughter. This time I am following the BD (trying I can never get the whole 100g of protein) as well as taking high levels of B6, B12 and folic acid as well as fish oils and calcium and baby asprin the first many months. Did any of it make a difference? who knows but I can say in 5 pregnancies (including a loss in every trimester of pregnancy) this is the healthiest one I have had, I am now past the 35 weeks mark.

tara

[maxmama]

Originally Posted by flyingspaghettimama

Well, maybe shaking a rainstick at the sky and eating donuts nightly won't work too well.

Damn it, there goes my anti-preeclampsia diet!

Seriously, I agree that there are so many approaches and it's important to find one you're comfortable with. I'm on an atenolol/lasix protocol right now (because I have elevated cardiac output hypertension, and the idea is to reduce the risk of vascular endothelial damage) and my BPs are 100-110/60-70. Will that keep me from getting pre-e? Maybe, maybe not. What it might do is get me to term (I had late-onset pre-e with early-onset hypertension last time). a lot of people wouldn't be comfortable with that protocol, and that's fine. I love the side effect of no edema with the lasix though -- it's so nice to have ankles. Ones that bend, even.

[flyingspaghettimama]

Originally Posted by maxmama

I love the side effect of no edema with the lasix though -- it's so nice to have ankles. Ones that bend, even.

Braggart! I didn't even have that last time, with the "normal" pregnancy!

[flyingspaghettimama]

fwiw, there's a very interesting article in this week's New Yorker about preeclampsia and recent research into causation.

[Mamatoto2]

Here's a link to that article:

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/conten.../060724fa_fact

[2 in August]

Very interesting article. Thanks for posting it.

[Katana]

I posted this in Birth and Beyond, and at a suggestion, am now posting it here.


My SIL had to have an emergency C section at 31 weeks because of her placenta detaching from the uterine wall and also high blood pressure.

Two days before her birth, her eyes got blurry. It's almost five weeks after, and they're still blurry.

The doctors are telling her, it's fine, you can have blurred vision up to six weeks after.

Is this true? Is there anything she can do to help her eyes?

She's scared they're going to be blurry for the rest of her life.

Any thoughts?

Oh, edited to also mention, her bp stayed high for at least the first three weeks, but the doctors kept monitoring it, and once it went down, said it was okay.

[2 in August]

Hi ladies,

It's been awhile since I posted an update. I'm now 37 wks and honestly never thought I'd make it this far. My protein is bouncing between mid 300s and mid 400s. My bp is still ok but the last time is was 129/82 before that 140/82 then when I layed down it went back down.

My ob is talking about doing an induction at 38 wks just in case. I want to meet my baby and I'm all for being safe, but I'm kind of worried about inducing. Last time my water broke at 35 wks, I had cytotec, pit, epidural, mag for my high bp, an iv for GBS and it was miserable. I'm scared to go through all that again. But, I don't want to risk going to long and having my bp go higher or any other complications that pre-e can bring.

Any thoughts from those of you who have btdt?

Thanks, Jen