I think we've made a mistake (re:Santa) - Page 2

[mamawanabe]

no right answers in mothering

I've followed a lot of these threads and it seems that people's decision to Santa or not depends on their childhood expereince with Santa or their ideology.

But basing our decision on such won't assure we make the right decision for our children's childhood.

Like everything else, I think the answer depends on the kids. Are they "literal" types who like consistant and clear rules, or do they thrive on ambiguity and like to blur the line between real amd make-believe (as a kid I SERIOUSLY believed in fairies until I was 10 or so)?

I hope I have kids who are the types to be into it cause I loved Santa so much as a kid. But if I have literal minded kids (who favor my dh), I hope to recognize this and present Santa just as fun make-believe.

We don't nec have kids who think and are like us. Recognizing and responding to who our kids are and what they need is the hard and (and impossible to do perfectly) work of parenting.

You choose what you thought was a universally right answer (Santa is lying) and discovered that there are no universally right answers in mothering.

In this thread you got good suggestions for helping him expand his notion of "real." Another solution might be to rent one of those "miracle on 42 street" movies where Santa turns out to be real despite the parents and kids at first not believing. Ask him what he thinks at the end of the movie: "What do you think? Is Santa real?" and then if he says "yes," do Santa until your son chooses not to believe in him anymore.

Good luck. You are a wonderful mama, of course.

[nicholas_mom]

Santa Claus is based on many more things than just St. Nicholas. He's based on Scandinavian figures, pagan figures, and Celtic figures, too.

I think you mean Christmas is based on many more things than St. Nick. Santa Claus is just ONE figure of Christmas.

[dharmamama]

No, I meant Santa Claus. Lots of different cultures had Santa Claus-type figures, and most of them were not based on St. Nicholas. Santa Claus as we know him today is an amalgamation of different figures from different cultures.

Namaste!

[Linda KS]

on doing Santa later -- have you ever seen the movie Miracle on 34th Street? The really old black and white one is best (they remade it color and changed things). It is about a little girl who doesn't believe in Santa because her mother told her it was all pretend, but she meets the real Santa and he has to convince her that he is real. I love this movie. You might want to watch it with just your DH and talk about it before you show it to your son so you could decide if it would make things better or worse

We "do" Santa, but my Dh are I are not very sneaky and our kids are bright, so we are pretty sure they are on to us They really like the idea so we are all just playing at it and it is fun. They love leaving cookies for Santa.

Today we were out and bumped into Santa, who was for some odd reason at Jason's Deli. My 6 year was so cute. She calmly told Santa the the one thing she really wants for Christmas. She has already made it clear to DH and I want she wants a certain doll, but she was telling Santa just to cover all her bases.

We've got the doll hidden at the top of a closet, but Santa won't be leaving it. It is just to important too her so we want her to know it is from us. Santa is going to leave her a board game or puzzle or something.

We do not feel that we are lying to our kids. We are allowing them to particiapte in a myth that has deeper meanings -- giving to people who have no way to give something back to you.

[onlyzombiecat]

I would also find out why your child is really upset and try to reassure them on whatever upsets them about the situation. Of course, you can't say "Santa is really coming to our house" at this point.
I think telling them the legend of Santa as a story might be good and explaining why some people pretend about Santa and why you haven't been. I would continue to emphasize what you feel is real/important about Christmas- the birth of Jesus- but if they understand Santa is make-believe and want to have fun pretending in addition I say go along. You can do it in a fun way.

We have told dd the story of Santa and pretend together about Santa coming. I don't feel pretending is the same as lying. My 4 year old dd is imaginative but also very bright when it comes to make-believe versus reality.

[zaftigmama]

We were raised in a Jewish home, so the issue of Santa wasn't something that came up. But some of my cousins celebrated both Christmas and Chanukah, and I remember them asking repeatedly if Santa was real. It seemed important to them to know-I think they were 4 and 6.

We were sleeping over there one night and the four of us, me, my sister and my two cousins got in a huge argument about Santa. I don't remember how it started. So my aunt came and sat us down and explained about Saint Nicholas. She said he was a real saint, and the Santa we were fighting about was the same saint. She said some people believe that he is still alive and that he brings presents to girls and boys who celebrate Christmas. And we kept pestering her if it was true, could she prove it, etc.,. And all she would say is, "Some people believe it. It can't hurt to leave cookies out for him, in case he comes."

Somehow that always stuck with me and seemed like a great explanation. My cousins didn't know for sure if he was real, but they knew some people believed it and some people didn't. And they decided they did. But I don't think they ever felt lied to, or mislead. My aunt didn't say he did exist or didn't, left it up in the air, a mystery to be solved.

I remember years and years later my cousins and I talking about the fight we had about Santa, and we were trying to remember how old they were when they realized Santa didn't exist. One of my cousins said, "I don't know, some people still think he's real..." I think that's how they'll teach it to their kids.

When I worked in a daycare after college, some of the kids would ask if we believed in Santa. I told them the same thing, that there are people out there who are sure he's real, but no one has seen him. It's kind of an evasive answer, but it leaves it up to them.

We've been teaching my daughter (she's three and a half) about different holidays, and that we celebrate Chanukah because we're Jewish. She was asking me if we believed in Christmas trees, lights, various things (I don't think she fully got what I was explaining) and asked about Santa. I said that Santa wasn't part of Chanukah, it was part of Christmas. She said, "That old man in the mall? He's something to celebrate??" It was very funny.

Good luck and happy winter!

[Linda KS]

Another thing about pretending together -- I don't tell my kids there is a Santa. I don't tell them there isn't a Santa. When asked a question about Santa I smile and ask them what they think.

[newmainer]

naking...

i discovered there was no s.c and where babies *really* came from through reading a judy blume book (super fudge, i think?) obviously my reading skills were above my reality sluething skills.... :LOL anyway, i was shocked and disappointed, but i think more because i wasn;t ready to not believe anymore. sounds like your son wants to as well. i personally will guage dd and her reaction... we'll do the santa thing until she starts to ask (or reads j.b books ) and do the, what do you think? approch

[Simplicity]

I think there are some great tips here!

Just thought I'd share my son's Santa story.

My sons father and I are not together anymore. We had very different views on this and many other topics. However, I did agree with his father that we would do the santa thing. When my son got alittle older (he's 10 now) we sat him down to tell him there was no santa. I'm sure he knew already and the first words that came out of his mouth... It means more to me that you both gave me those gifts. It was adorable!

However, my sons father when he was younger freaked out when he heard there was no such thing as Santa. He screamed, yelled and even punched a hole in his bedroom wall.

Eeek! I'm happy our son did not react in that way!

[PikkuMyy]

I found out on my own that there wasn't a real S.C. or T.F. but I kept it a secret from my parents, who enjoyed the whole thing as much as I did. I didn't care that he wasn't real, it was the rituals and the love involved that mattered. And a year or two later, I brought it up to my parents, who said that SC and the TF were spirits who lived inside the people who wanted them to, so anyone could be SC or the TF if they wanted to live the spirit themselves. It made a lot of sense to me and even at age 15, I was leaving milk and cookies and some carrots for SC and his reindeer.

[Embee]

Originally Posted by Qerratsmom

maybe you could get a book that tells the story of the myth of St. Nicholaus... Many times kids will let their own imaginations fill in the rest. You have only imformed them, not lied to them.

We have taken a middle of the road approach on Santa. We don't encourage it in a huge way, but we don't discourage it either... "letting his imagination fill in the rest." DS gets the main idea and because he's nearly 4, believes a lot of things that aren't real, huge imaginative age for sure so why not Santa? The story of St. Nicholas is interesting and of Christian origin so it seems perfectly tied in with the celebration as well. As to Santa gifts: I'm actually taking a rare cue from my own parents on this one where anything in the stocking is a little something special from Santa and other gifts are from us, relatives, friends, etc. We keep the stocking presents special, but minimal (this year, two new engines to add to his train set). I think this way he gets to hold onto that magicical thinking, but it doesn't go over the top. (The drum set will be from DH and I and the rest of the family.)

At any rate, I got a great book at the library about St. Nicholas, geared for children. We're planning to read it together and talk about the origins of Santa Claus/Sinter Klaas/St. Nick from that perspective so that DS will actually know why Santa is part of the celebration of which he already knows about a "very special birth."

Having grown up Catholic/Methodist, respectively, DH and I now consider ourselves to be agnostic--lots of questions ourselves and we want DS to find his own way here. We do celebrate Christmas out of strong extended family tradition and consider it part of our larger winter celebration which also includes the solstice. Now, DS is very interested in other celebrations as well and this year we're adding a special Chanukah celebrationl--been reading books about this too and DS truly loves and appreciates the story about the miracle of the lamp oil...

So I'm rambling, but there are so many wonderful suggestions on your thread here. I do imagine there is someway you could capture the magic of the Santa myth, but still hold to your original feelings on the matter? Best of luck to you.

[girlndocs]

We don't "do" Santa, but MIL went behind our backs and told 5-yo ds that he was real, hugely hyping it up. So then ds was really disappointed & felt like he was missing out on something because Santa wasn't coming to our house :

We did all the explaining, but he still seemed kinda bummed, so I asked him if he wanted me to write "From Santa" on one of his presents. He lit up & said "Yes! All of them!" Then he announced to DH, "Santa's coming!" and giggled madly. Problem solved

[joesmom]

Well... My sisters & I "do" Santa with our kids... I found out in 1st grade when I caught Mom wrapping presents, then I helped her keep Santa alive for my sisters for several more years. I felt SO superior & wise!

Actually I have never come right out & told Joe that Santa is real; I just follow his lead & ask him what HE thinks.

He has a loose tooth now & I am trying to think of something cool for the tooth fairy to leave him.

I can't help but feel sad for the kids whose parents won't "lie" to them about Santa. To me, it is not lying, it is keeping a wonderful story alive. Last year Joe's dad shook jingle bells as I lay with Joe in bed- to see his eyes light up thinking Santa was nearby...

It isn't that I don't understand the reasoning- I just can't imagine telling a little kid, well, Santa isn't real- Joe's mommy LIES to him. I would NEEEEVVVVEEEERRRR lie to you.

(Said with utmost respect. I realize those who don't do Santa will never understand my reasoning either, so...)

Peace to all!

[Marsupialmom]

We do Santa but we don’t drag it out.

Kids get to the age were they start to wonder and that is when we let them in on the secret of Santa.

Yes, we explain the Santa in the malls are Santa’s helper.

When my son was about 7 he question Santa. I talk to him and explained why we have the myth and the meanings of the Santa story. The love of giving, not receiving. At this time he was old enough does to ask about the tooth fairy and why we used that story. I was honest and told him I had no clue on the origins but I think I know why it was started. My son had a lot of pain with his teeth coming out (now my daughter is having the same pain issue). He also bleed. The thought of the tooth fairy calmed him and distracted him.

My four year old asked if we had the presents down stairs again. LOL She found them last year. She knows the story. Knows to keep it a secret and is excited about going shopping for stocking stuffers.

My son and 4 year old have that special feeling that we do about buying gifts just to make others happy. My mil is excited because she is going to take them out to do this shopping, while I take my oldest to a doctors visit.

My 6 year old is completely clueless, which really surprises us . Here personality is very literal but she wants to believe in Fairies, God, and Santa. I see no harm in this. My dh and I have discuss the God issue and we both agree if it makes her happy to believe and go to Church than so be it. We do occasionally take her to a Church that we can tolerate. When she is old enough to go and stay by herself we will take her anytime she wants to. (I know that is another topic but it brings out the point some people need these ideas, myths, and traditions.).

When my 6 year old figures it out we plan on doing family gift baskets for a few neighbors, knock and run. We have some older people in our neighborhood once or twice a year I will make a basket of stuff, coffee’s, teas, toiletries, magazines or large print books, et. Put them on their door step/porch, knock and run.

I do wonder if your son feels like he is missing out on the fun. I would show him the fun and joy of being the giver with out asking for anything in return. Would he get a kick out of being the fast runner or deliver of a basket? Would he enjoy buying stocking stuffers to surprise his sister?

[USAmma]

I think most of the time children will come to their own conclusions and believe or disbelieve what they want to, regardless of what we teach them. We have never taught Abi about Santa but she knows all about him anyway from books and popular media. She came to the conclusion on her own that he was pretend, and that the man in the costume at the mall was just pretending to be Santa.

We also taught her about God very early and she thinks God is pretend because we can't see God. Someday she may believe in God, or maybe not. She's always been the skeptical type who thinks too deeply about things.

I will do the tooth fairy with her when she's older but I'm sure she'll know that's also pretend.

BTW there have been some wonderful responses on this thread!!

Darshani