4.5 y.o. DEMANDING mommy milk!

[sea island mama]

Dd is driving me nuts lately, but today was the WORST!
She only nurses once in the morning & she has to wait if her brother is nursing. The problem is, the first words out of her mouth are, "I WANT MOMMY MILK!" & she starts climbing over ds to get to me even if he is nursing. If I hold her off she thrashes around & hits him (inadvertently) with her knees & elbows. At this point the last thing I want to do is let her nurse :.

Well, today she did the same thing only louder & more freaked out than usual. She gets this high pitch to her voice that makes me crazy at the best of times - first thing in the morning is not one of them. I had to just get up & close the door. Half an hour later she is still in there crying & screaming & "I want mommy milk"ing. I will go in there when I'm done here, hold & probably nurse her, but this is insane!

What am I doing wrong?? I hear all these wonderful tandem nursing stories & ours has never been like that. Of course, I had to suddenly "wean" her at 2.5 when I was pregnant with ds & developed a nursing aversion. She only gradually started nursing again after he was born. It still makes my skin crawl somewhat when she nurses & I can only handle a few seconds before I have to tell her to stop. Don't even think about both at once - I've done it a few times & it was really bad .

I feel really bad about this because I really wanted her to nurse as long as she wanted, but most days I wish she would just stop already : . I am getting the same feelings with ds sometimes as well & we even talked about this at a recent LLL toddler meeting. Apparently it is quite common to want to .

Any suggestions?

[Lula's Mom]

Lula doesn't get quite that rambunctious about it, but sometimes she does come over saying "Nurse nurse nurse!" like she's on a protest march or something. Or she'll just say "I want to nurse", while reaching for my shirt. That gets my hackles up- I want her to be respectful of my body too. I always stop her and say "If I wanted to nurse, I think I would ask more nicely." (I taught her some time ago that the rude way won't work- I'd like her to say "May I please nurse?") So she gets the hint and asks nicely. It sure feels nicer that way.

[Satori]

It sounds to me like she's wanting more one on one time with you and is feeling a little left out with the new baby. I know dd tends to get a little more demanding of boob time when she feels she's not getting enough attention. Like today i'm pouring though lots of books and letting her do pretty much what ever which is mostly watching tv today : and she's come in wanting to nurse mutiple times. If I read her a story she's happy to keep herself busy for a while after.

[*Erin*]

i think your bodily aversion may be your clue that it's time to go ahead and stop nursing her. i agree with above poster that she wants some one on one attn. my dd does that, she'll freak out and want to nurse but if i offer to stop what im doing and play with her she's happy as can be and doesnt want to nurse anymore.
xo

[foreverinbluejeans]

It's OK to stop nursing if you want to. What are you doing wrong? It usually works out best if a child is allowed to breastfeed when they want to. It's possible to nurse a four year old and a baby and your daughter has figured that out. Nursing only when you want to may cause more behavior problems than not nursing at all.

[Love my 2]

I agree, she may be feeling a bit left out and wants more mommy time.
With my son, I would let him know that "sister would be wanting to nurse soon "(he was already weaned) "and you know that can take a long time. What can I get for YOU now?" I'd put on a special video, or get a special toy, book, or snack and be sure he's gone potty, then sit down to nurse my daughter. this really cut down on the demands for things when I was nursing. I also let him know that I wouldn't listen if he yelled and demanded or if he whined, but I would listen if he asked for things nicely. I do this with both of my children and they don't whine or demand as much as they used to.
I think a special bit of mommy daughter time with her would help.
HUGS to you, mama. I hope this gets better soon.

[TigerTail]

the whole flesh-crawling irritation can come and go- a lot to me has to do with where i am at emotionally (and menstrually), how much coffee i'm drinking, & particular nursing styles... for one stretch of time the baby may be a mellow nurser & the big one all twitchy & weird, & sometimes big will be very businesslike and calm and the baby will get in a plucky mood that makes me want to scream. knowing that these moods can be temporary may help you deal with how it makes you feel.

i know 4 is a v 'demanding' age to begin with; lots of trying out styles of communication ('if i demand that you put the baby back in the van and leave him behind before i get out & go in the library with you, will it work? or will you ask me nicely one more time to come out, & when i throw a fit instead leave *me* in the van with daddy?' this was my afternoon )

it helps him deal some of the urgency of his nursing needs, i think, that at times, *he* gets to nurse first (obviously harder to arrange with a nb, but a two yr old will often be happy to read a story with daddy while 4 yr old gets first crack at it for once.) when i tell him baby needs his first it helps to be able to say, 'you got it firt last night, now it's baby's turn.'

no perfect answers, but if i had thought that everytime i got irritable about nursing it was time to wean, i would NOT have, er... (counting) 11 years of nursing under my belt, for certain! (i think those first cracked nipples might've done me in... gawd, but that hurt. *air* hurt, let alone a sucking infant.) it all passes, and the next time there's raging rotavirus and all your children's aquaintances have been hospitalized for dehydration you will quietly thank yourself.

suse

[Pallas]

4.5 is old enough to understand that approach means everything -- mine knows that no matter what he's wanting, his chances are hugely increased when he treats people respectfully and asks politely. I'm not saying that it doesn't require 10,000 reminders and modeling language and all -- but it's a reasonable expectation at this age.

I don't nurse my 4yo much anymore, because I get impatient and snappish, and I'd rather keep it a positive relationship. We started nursing for the count of ten when he was 3-ish, and that helped both of us. Me, because I knew that after ten he was finished, and him because he knew he *could* nurse if he needed to. I could be patient for that count of ten, kwim?

The deal is, no one has to explain *why* they dont' want to be touched a certain way -- and imo that's an important lesson for kids to learn. They don't have to discuss why they want you to stop tickling them, or why they suddenly need the door closed when they pee, or want to dress alone. You don't have to explain why you don't want to be mauled or yelled at and need to be treated gently.

Frankly, I feel that nursing is a powerful tool to teach these things. I feel certain that both my boys stopped biting MUCH sooner because when you hurt mommy, you get put down for a moment and you can't nurse (which happened to be when they bit most often). When you demand to nurse and scream at mommy, it makes it a whole lot less likely that you'll get to nurse than if you approach her in a polite and respectful way. (two totally different ages, btw. my youngest is barely 1yo, and of *course* he demands to nurse, he demands bloody everything, and gets it! developmentally appropriate behavior, baby.)

Yeesh. Reading over this it sounds so manipulative! But hell, it's all behavior mod. As long as essential emotional and physical needs are met, I don't see anything wrong with a little cause-and-effect lesson.

Flame on, ladies! :LOL

Namaste,

Pallas

[sea island mama]

Thank you all for your responses. Most of them have made me feel a bit better & not so alone in my feelings. Not sure about this one, though:

Originally Posted by foreverinbluejeans

It's OK to stop nursing if you want to. What are you doing wrong? It usually works out best if a child is allowed to breastfeed when they want to. It's possible to nurse a four year old and a baby and your daughter has figured that out. Nursing only when you want to may cause more behavior problems than not nursing at all.

Are you saying it would be better for HER if I didn't let her nurse at all?? I can't see that. She is old enough to understand that most of the time she only gets to nurse in the morning. Under extenuating circumstances (injury, illness, meltdown, etc.) she gets to nurse other times as well, but not often.
She seems to be fine if she wakes up before ds & manages to crawl over him without waking him. Then she asks nicely, nurses briefly (I count down from 10 when I've almost had it) & we have a nice cuddle time. It's the times that he's already nursing when she wakes that are the problem. She even starts pulling him away & trying to climb over while he's still latched on ! That's when I usually end up refusing to let her nurse at all. I hate to do it, but...
Also, it may be easier to distract an almost 2 y.o. at other times, but first thing in the morning isn't one of them. None of us are in much condition to be reasonable. DH isn't much help because he's usually worked really late the night before & hardly had any sleep or he's gone to work already for the early shift. He does try when he is there, but it gets me even more annoyed when all the screaming & carrying on wakes him up as well.

Anyway, just wanted to say thanks again & I really do appreciate your comments.