Where to go for Girl Scouts? Alternatives to Cub scouts?

[luv my 2 sweeties]

I'd like to sign dd up for Daisy Girl Scouts (the Kindergarten age group) in the fall. It seems like something she would really enjoy. I've already fired off an email to our local Girl Scout Council inquiring about homeschool scout troups. I haven't heard back yet, but I think there are some. However, now I'm thinking it might be better to sign up for a troup at our neighborhood elementary school. It would be a shorter drive, and she might make a friend or two who lives close by. Hopefully the school troup would be more ethnically diverse than the homeschool community. (My children are black/white bi-racial so I'd like her to meet some other children of color if possible.)

Has anyone ever tried something like this? Any downsides I'm not thinking of? Since this would be a troup for kindergarteners, I assume that none of the little girls would know each other very well yet -- might be a good chance for my dd to get into the group before she's the odd one out, kwim?

Finally, are there any alternatives to Cub/Boy Scouts that I could look into? My ds is only 2, so maybe he won't even be into that kind of thing, but if he does want to join such a group, I'm uncomfortable with the Boy Scouts anti-gay stance.

[2tadpoles]

My son was in Boy Scouts for about 4 months. I truly knew very little about the organization prior to that time, so the anti-gay and pro-religion stance kind of threw me. He's a big thinker and was a skeptic even back then, so both of those things bothered him, too, and he dropped out. I was glad, to be honest.

Alternatives to traditional scouting (boy or girl) include Spiral Scouts and Camp Fire Kids.

I know that many homeschoolers also participate in 4-H . You can locate a 4-H council through your local Department of Agriculture, I believe.

[Patchfire]

I'm thinking of doing something similar for my dd next fall. What I'm going to do first, though, is fill out the application for volunteers... so that when they contact me as a volunteer, I can say "I want to be a leader for a community-based Daisy troop," rather than wade through the rigamarole about 'most troops are based out of individual schools' (I know this isn't actually true in our area!) and how there are homeschool troops. Yes, there are around here - about thirty minutes away and, as you say, not very racially diverse.

I'll be interested to see what response you get from your local council!

[Ravin]

Scouts aren't necessarily based out of schools. They'll have meetings anywhere they can find meeting places. The Girl Scouts in my hometown have their own house used for meeting space, and the council office also has meeting spaces. Sometimes they'll meet at a church (not as affiliated w/ it, just using the space), or a school.

Meeting times will vary. Most will be either in after-school hours (which for K could be early afternoon if there's not all-day K where you live) or even on weekends (Saturday morning or afternoon isn't unheard of).

If you volunteer to be a leader or assistant, you get to help determine that. Often bringing a younger sib along isn't a prob as a volunteer, either.

Someone suggested Spiral Scouts--they're pagan. Or Campfire. But GSUSA doesn't have the discriminatory policies Boy Scouts does w/ religion and et cetera. In fact while their promise does have "God" in it, you can substitute the deity of your choice or leave that bit off if you prefer. Or just not say the promise, though if you object to the principles in the Promise and the Law GS may not be the right place for you, as true w/ the mission statement of any organization...

I'm rambling, aren't I? I was a Girl Scout for 11 yrs...

[SeekingSimplicity]

My son (6) was also interested in joining the Cub Scouts. I was uncomfortable after looking into it and reading their oath. I especially did not care for the part about being “morally straight”.

We decided on a Karate class instead.

[shaywyn]

Hey there
Not much help, but my dd just joined a homeschool Brownie troop. It's small but it's cool My children are also biracial (black/white), where abouts in Michigan are you? We are in a suburb of Detroit.

Our main objective was giving my dd an activity where she received positive female interaction (or is forced to, LOL!), she tends to gravitate to the boys at playgroup and other activities, she's my little ballerina/tomboy. I don't mind it at all, she's into pokemon and very high energy, but I thought it would be nice to be in a positive female environment and she wanted to join She's very proud Here first meeting was last week and she wore her brownie vest for 2 days almost non stop, LOL! We joined mid year, I don't know if the school troops are that flexible or not, I would assume they would welcome girls no matter when

ETA: Our meeting is at 1pm on a weekday, which is a nice perk because it's a homeschool group

Good Luck!

[EFmom]

My dd does Y-Adventure Guides, which is open to boys and girls. Her dad does it with her, although in some families the moms are involved. I like it this way because I loathe camping type activities and dh enjoys them. I really like the program. There is very little BS, you don't have to sell cookies, or have expensive uniforms beyond a vest and cap (and that's optional), and the kids have a fabulous time.

[ForestLakeMom]

My son (age 8, 9 next month) started Cub Scouts this year. It has been a great experience for him. My husband and I have told him that it is up to him if he wants to remain. He loves it. They do say the cub scout promise at the beginning of every den meeting. I am looking at his handbook and it goes like this:
I..................,
promise to do my best
To do my duty to God and
my country,
to help other people, and
obey the law of the pack.

They also say the pledge of allegience.

Obviously God is mentioned in the promise, however, it is not stressed at any time during any meetings. Maybe if I had joined the group from the local Catholic school rather than public, it would be more of an issue.

They stress giving goodwill. Smile. Be happy. Do things to help others. Little things make a big difference.

Everything he has done with the scouts has been positive and made him feel great about himself. He sees the same kids every week and also sees some of them at the sports programs he participates in. It's a nice constant in his life.
This Friday they are having a sleepover at the Museum of Science (Boston). My husband will be a chaperone.
This summer his "den" is going to attend summer camp (day camp) for two weeks. I am able to volunteer so I can be with him always,and he gets to go for free.

I tried starting a homeschool den but there wasn't much interest. So I joined the pack associated with the local grammar school. Most of the kids live within 2-3 miles of us. We meet at the school which is less than 1/2 a mile up the street.

Keep in mind, you need a constant group of kids to keep this going. We usually have 8-10 kids attending each meeting.

It has been a great experience for my oldest son and my youngest will join next year.

[2tadpoles]

Originally Posted by badonahue

Obviously God is mentioned in the promise, however, it is not stressed at any time during any meetings.

When moving up from Wolf to Bear scout, the first requirement in the Bear book is related to God and church. Our issue was that my son wanted to complete this requirement. We belonged to a UU church at the time.

However, because of differences between the UU church and the BSA, the BSA had deemed that UU scouts could earn their badge, but were not allowed to wear it on their uniforms. Jakob didn't care for that mentality.

As he's gotten older, he's labeled himself an atheist, anyway. He wouldn't want to belong to an organization where he had to pretend to be something else in order to belong. He also has a strong sense of fairness and is offended by the BSA's anti-gay stance, although he's not gay as far as I know.

[MamaMonica]

Originally Posted by EFmom

My dd does Y-Adventure Guides, which is open to boys and girls. Her dad does it with her, although in some families the moms are involved. I like it this way because I loathe camping type activities and dh enjoys them. I really like the program. There is very little BS, you don't have to sell cookies, or have expensive uniforms beyond a vest and cap (and that's optional), and the kids have a fabulous time.

What are Y Adventure guides? Are these everywhere?

[michelle1k]

Not trying to change your mind about Cub Scouts, but I just wanted to add my two cents:

We feel about joining the BSA the same way as about moving to the US (from Africa): our family and our values are needed in both!
In all seriousness, change can come much faster in organizations (or countries!) such as these when there are good people with progressive values working for change on the inside. And it's not going to help if good families who can be vocal about their progressive values boycott what is essentially a really great thing (for the boys and their communities).

Both my husband and I come from countries with histories of horrible social discrimination and it took us a very long time to make our final call on Cub Scouts for ds. Before joining, we corresponded with the den leader at length about our misgivings about their discriminatory policy against homosexuals, about their religious slant and finally decided that this particular den and this particular group of leaders (the one leader's partner is an atheist and completely intolerant of any religious dogma for his son) is a good fit for our family.

The pack is affiliated with the local Catholic church, but all their religious badges are electives - optional. We will in all likelihood not do those, since my son proclaims that he does "not believe in God". After some more research, I have discovered that it is completely ok (if we should so choose) to gain a religious elective using "Buddhism" as our faith (which our belief system is most closely aligned to) and it's even ok to substitute the word "dharma" for God in their promise (since Buddhism does not advocate believe in God / a god) or, as a previous poster said, leave that part out.

[EFmom]

What are Y Adventure guides? Are these everywhere?

This gives a pretty good description. You don't have to belong to the Y to do the Y-Guides.

http://www.ymca.net/programs/adv_guides/index.html

The Y-Guide program is pretty flexible and is administered locally, so the flavor of each local circle is unique. My two nieces in a different state did it with their dad and they loved it, too.

In some locations circles might be divided up by gender, but where I live they are not.

[MamaMonica]

Thanks! I appreciate the info. - had not known about this program.

[Linda KS]

Originally Posted by luv my 2 sweeties

Hopefully the school troup would be more ethnically diverse than the homeschool community. (My children are black/white bi-racial so I'd like her to meet some other children of color if possible.)

My DDs are in GS. Last year they were in troops through our local school, but this year they are in a homeschooling troop. The reason for the change was that we moved to a new city and this option just made more sense here -- we didn't have any problems with the public school troops. Anway, both of their troops at the public school were totally white, but the homeschool troop they are in has 1 African American girl and one girl who is half Egyptian.

GS has been a good experience for my DDs. They really enjoy it.

[Epicurus]

My kids participate in 4-H and we are really enjoying it. This is our 2nd year being involved and I am the adult leader of two projects. Someone already mentioned 4-H and posted the links. YOu can find out what your local group offers.

Also have you looked into Boys and Girls Clubs of America?
http://www.bgca.org/
We have not participated but I have heard wonderful things and the discrimination is not there. Is is a non religious group as far as I am aware.

Good luck in your quest!

Collette

[riversprite_ca]

My 6yo dd is in "Sparks" which is the GG group for 5-6 year old girls.
It is a "regular" troupe, not a specifically homeschooling troupe. There is one other homeschooled girl in her group, though.
So far, I haven't seen any downsides to it. Many of the other girls do know eachother already, through their kindergarten or grade one class in school...but it hasn't been a problem at all.
The only funny thing is that whenever the leader says something about SCHOOL, my dd *always* pipes up "I don't go to school...I'm a homeschooler". LOL!

Good luck finding something. Maia *really* loves going and looks forward to Monday nights every week.

[luv my 2 sweeties]

Thank you!

Thanks for all the input, everyone! I still haven't heard back from our local council, but I think I'll give the school based troup a try. She can always switch to a homeschool troup if we don't like it.

And thanks for all the ideas for boys! I wasn't aware of the Y group, and I hadn't thought of 4-H at all (even though I used to be in it! ) Someone recently started a Spiral Scouts around here, and I always figured it was Campfire *Girls*! :LOL I'll look into these options.

Michelle1k, you've given me something to think about. My ds, although only 2, seems very stereotypically "boy" in many ways -- always running, "innocently" agressive, fascinated with trucks, trains, tools, etc., loves being outside and getting dirty, etc. An all-boy group appeals to me as a place he can indulge all that stuff with peers in a fun and constructive environment. I'll have to give it more thought. I really have a problem with their stance on homosexuality, but not the God stuff, since I believe and we attend a Quaker meeting regularly. There are a number of gay and lesbian folks in our meeting who are dear to us. I'd hate for him to be introduced to the ugliness of discrimination in the context of a group he otherwise identifies with, KWIM? Maybe I'll look into the local packs to see if some are more like yours. I *know* the homeschool packs would be out of the question -- they are full of conservative Christian types who would be supportive of BSA's most conservative stances. Maybe the homeschool Girl Scout troups are the same, but since discrimination isn't part of the GS offical "code", I'm not as worried about it. I don't mind my kids being around evangelical Christians -- I would have to keep them from most of my family if I did! I *do* have a problem with sending them to a group that actually asks them to pledge to something I feel is wrong. But you make a good point -- thanks.

[welove2farm]

Check out www.earthscouts.org . I really like what I've read on their website.

[highenergymom]

Cub Scouting

I just wanted to let it be known that not all packs are the same or have the same way of running things. My son is in his 3rd year of cub scouting. Our pack is chartered through a family restruant that has a bar in basement. That being said we are not the "traditional" scouts. We are very relaxed in many areas. Sure we say the promise that includes "God" but we do not talk about religion, because our meetings are at a public school. I can't even think of one time when any type of discrimation was mentioned. The point is, don't rule it out until you take the time to check one out.

Heck, I don't see why girls aren't allowed, but I don't think that's a reason to pull my son. Our pack is so relaxed that we include siblings (both girl or boy) in probablly 90% Of our activities.

Any organization you get involved with is going to have people who do not agree 100% of the time with everyone. But don't judge 100% of all organizations based on a few. Go, check it out and find out for yourselves.
Nancy

[PeacefulSeams]

Does earth scouts have any groups yet? I looked on their website but couldn't find anything.