Advice on approach please

[Margaret1022]

Hi again,

I am making my way through all the Web resources and have a question about something I've read. I was reading on the Nurses against Circ. website and they have sample letters they suggest parents send to the attending physician and hospital via certified mail.

It has been my experience that most doctors are extremely sensitive about lawsuits and even knowing a patient has looked into filing a lawsuit against a former physician (even without actually pursuing it) is enough to get them dropped as a patient. It's happened to me and others I know.

I don't want to make waves especially considering there are only two hospitals where my OB/GYNE is on staff. I absolutely refuse to set foot in one of the hospitals so I'm afraid of burning a bridge at the only other option left for me. It is also my nearest hospital so even if the delivery, itself, went well, it is the place my family and I would be taken in the event of an emergency. It seems like a heavy-handed approach especially when I don't even know if I'm having a boy.

How did you handle informing your attending physician and hospital so they are "officially" on notice without making everyone afraid to provide care?

TIA,
Margaret

Example: http://www.cirp.org/pages/parents/pr...on/doclet.html

[Margaret1022]

Another question

Since I'm here, I was on the Doctors against Circ. site as well and I couldn't find a list of partipating doctors. How do I find a No Circ./No retraction friendly doctor so I'm not paranoid everytime I take my child to the peditrician? TIA, Margaret

[mahogny]

Personally, I think the first thing to ask your OB is if s/he even does the circumcisions. I live in a VERY high-circ area of the country (midwest) and around here, circuncisions do not fall under the OB's scope of practice; the pediatricians are the ones who perform the circumcisions. The OBs take care of the baby while it's inside, but as soon as it's outside, it's under the pediatrician's care. So, sending this letter to an OB would be a moot point, anyway.

When your baby is born, whether boy or girl, just make sure that Mommy or Daddy (or other trusted individual) ALWAYS accompany Baby when it is out of the room. If you room-in, this will eliminate any extended stays in the nursery. Just make sure the baby is always within your sight, and they won't get the chance to circumcise.

Also, have you chosen your pediatrician yet? One of the things to ask him/her is their stance on circumcision. My kids' ped is VERY anti-circ, but unfortunately, she does not have privileges at the hospital I birth in. So, I'm at the hands of the on-call pediatrician. However, rooming-in and accompanying Baby will provide the hospital with no chance to circumcise.

Good luck!

[kxsiven]

Have you tried to contact http://www.nocirc.org/. At least in the past they have had lists of intact friendly doctors.

[Margaret1022]

Hi,

Thanks for the tips. I contacted the NOCIRC affiliate for my area.

I have my Dh and adopted mom to run interference. Both are under strict orders to protect the baby even if my life is in danger. S/he will NEVER be left alone with anyone for any reason. I am working on an Advanced Directive to include in my Birth Plan too.

Thanks for the help!
Margaret

[susienjay]

I think it's a great plan to not leave the baby alone but sometimes it is impossible to avoid it. I had it written into my birth plan that someone had to accompany a baby at all times and since I was having 2 babies we even hired a doula to have an extra set of hands there to make sure the babies weren't left alone. My plans went out the window when I went into labor 8 weeks early though. The doula who had no idea I was going to go so early was at her grandmother's funeral and wound up getting to the hospital after us. The hospital refused to let her in when she arrived. The babies were whisked off to NICU the minute they were born and it was impossible to have someone with them at all times. I really wished I would have sent that no-circ agreement. I didn't want to upset anyone though so I didn't but it would have made me feel a little more secure. My son was in NICU for 36 days so it wasn't feasible for me or dh to be there around the clock with him. I think it is unlikely that a hospital will perform a circ by accident but I was so worried it would happen. I had just had a horrible birth and had to go home without my babies so I was pretty emotional to begin with. I did wind up taking a red sharpie and writing DO NOT CIRC across his discharge papers. Got me several weird looks from the nurses but I really didn't care.

Where I had my babies the OB's don't perform the circs. It is the pediatricians or neonatologists (if they are preemies) that perform them. I had been under the impression that OB's perform them but I guess it depends on where you live.

[Margaret1022]

Hi errejasu,

I am sorry your son was whisked away from you like that. How is he doing now?

I don't know how the process works as this is my first child. I was under the impression my OB/GYNE would deliver my child and then pass him off to an on-staff doctor for the procedure while we were still under 24-48 hour watch. This is an assumption : as I remember my brother came home from the hospital circ'd.

I will do the Birth Plan and diaper labels. I personally don't care what any of the nurses think about me.

Thanks for sharing your experience. It helps tremendously especially when I can't talk to my mother or mother-in-law about these things.

Take care,
Margaret

[Itlbokay]

At our hospital you have to sign a paper for them to circ., I remember all too well signing papers and then asking...what's this one, and was told by the nurse "oh, that's just permission to circumcise, if it's a boy"

I don't think you have to threaten a lawsuit to have your wishes made clear.

Submit a birth plan (that includes your order for no circ.) to your doctor and the hospital, I did, and even though I was nervous..I was treated with respect about it. I also took my birthplan with me when I arrived at the hospital in labor and gave a copy to my assigned nurse.

[kiahnsmum]

i'm a little confused here

Hi i thought i might come on this thread as i often come online to check out what the latest topics are and on most threads i find anti-circ on peoples profiles, to circumcise in new zealand is a very rare thing and if you wanted your child circumcised you would probably have to make a special request and pay for the procedure yourself. what i would like to know is it a compulsary thing in USA. also i know this has nothing to do with circ but i also get the impression that you dont have your own personal midwife as we choose who delivers our baby and the would mostly come to your home for check-ups, if anyone has the time i would be interested to know how things are done in their countries.

[Itlbokay]

We choose who delivers our babies. If you are planning on a hospital birth you can hire a doctor, ob/gyn, or midwife. One is not assigned to you.

The nurses at the hospital are another story, I suppose you could request one, but in my experience you just get whoever's turn it is.

[susienjay]

My little guy is fine now. He's slightly delayed but that's about it. You sound really well prepared for your first baby. I was just wanting to point out that I think it is a great plan to never have the baby out of sight it's not always possible to follow through with it. Being separated from the baby is hopefully something you won't have to deal with but I think it's nice to have a back up plan just in case. Not just for circ but for pacifiers/bottles etc. I had a big problem with nurses in NICU giving my dd sugar paci's when I wasn't there. Not something I wanted them doing.

[Frankly Speaking]

Amy:

In some cases, the reason circumcisions are not performed in the hospitals is because they have had a circumcision death or other severe "unexpected outcome." I know of several hospitals where this is the case. They just don't want to be exposed to the liability and so they prohibit the OB/GYNs from performing them at the hospital. That means they are usually performed at the pediatricians office several weeks later. It appears the pediatricians are either not worried about killing a baby or they are more interested in the money.


Kiansmum:

I'm quite sure all of this sounds quite bizzare to you but unfortunately, it is life as normal in The US.

It all got started back about 130 years ago as a cure/preventative for masturbation. Back in those days, scientific method meant getting a idea that something would work and then just start doing it with no proof at all. Once they discovered that it appeared that circumcision actually increased masturbation instead of curtailing it, they had already discovered the lucrative profits that could be made and started making up all kinds of excuses to do it. It got so bad that boys were circumcised without even asking the parents and sometimes even when the parents had clearly stated they didn't want their son circumcised. The end result of this was that Americans came to believe that circumcision was beneficial, necessary and some even believe it is mandatory. Now, we are trying to get out of that hole the medical industry dug for us but they are not helping much. Many of them still strongly advocate circumcision and some strongly solicit it with stern warnings of all of the horrible things that can happen to a child if he is not circumcised. Of course, you know this is all trash talk but many people here believe it to be fact. The good news is that the circumcision rate here has dropped from more than 90% just a dozen years ago to just over 50% now. The bad news is that more than a million boys still suffer this genital mutilation every year. Hopefully, it will end soon. The Canadians had a similar circumcision rate just a few years ago and now they are nearing only 10%. Even though it took the circumcision death of a boy, they are making great progress and are showing The US the way.



Frank

[boingo82]

Originally Posted by kiahnsmum

Hi i thought i might come on this thread as i often come online to check out what the latest topics are and on most threads i find anti-circ on peoples profiles, to circumcise in new zealand is a very rare thing and if you wanted your child circumcised you would probably have to make a special request and pay for the procedure yourself. what i would like to know is it a compulsary thing in USA. also i know this has nothing to do with circ but i also get the impression that you dont have your own personal midwife as we choose who delivers our baby and the would mostly come to your home for check-ups, if anyone has the time i would be interested to know how things are done in their countries.

It's not mandatory, but a lot of people think so. The hospitals and docs CLAIM to be neutral, but to them, "neutral" means asking 6 times for permission to circ. (Happened to us.)
We don't really get our own personal midwife, but we see an OB/GYN at a clinic for appointments and hopefully that person's not on vacation when baby comes or you could get any old OB at the hospital.
In many states (like mine) midwivery is illegal, but they're working to change that.