how do you deal with toddlers cursing??? - Page 3

[NYCVeg]

Originally Posted by newmommy

Yeah, I guess those who don't mind teaching their toddler cuss words would say: "Awwww, isn't that cute what he said to his sister?"

I think you've missed a crucial distinction. My mom always told me that words are just words--it's how you say them, not what you say, that makes a difference. So, if my dad said "s*t" what he dropped something, that was just a word. If he said to my mom, in anger, "You're a s*t," that would be a different story altogether--totally inappropriate and wrong, because the word be used to hurt. And this would be true of any word, swear word or not. (BTW, this is just a theorectical example--my dad never said that to my mom!). Any words used insultingly can be harmful. But just saying words out loud...I guess I don't see why one should be "bad" and another "good." If your child says "Fudge!" when he drops something, he's engaging in exactly the same emotional release as if he said a swear word--that is, he's just using a word to express frustration, not hurting anyone. And I think the reason why some mamas might make a distinction between words that are okay at home but not okay in public is not because they think that, yes, those words are inherently "bad", but that OTHER people would find them uncomfortable. On the other hand, other people find NIP uncomfortable, so...?

BTW, as a medievalist, let me tell you: in Chaucer and most of the canonical, founding texts of English literature, you'll find plenty of obscenity! My students are often shocked to come across this stuff in "literature"--but I think medieval people were not quite so Puritanical as we are when it comes to stuff like this!

[newmommy]

Originally Posted by NYCVeg

I think you've missed a crucial distinction. And I think the reason why some mamas might make a distinction between words that are okay at home but not okay in public is not because they think that, yes, those words are inherently "bad", but that OTHER people would find them uncomfortable. On the other hand, other people find NIP uncomfortable, .

Ah sorry, I don't belive I have. And to me, the above is a hypocritical statement.

If words are "just words" then you wouldn't mind if someone called you a "fng bi!@@" to your face? Can you honestly walk away from that person and shrug "oh they are just words"

Come now, cuss words take on a sort of *evil personality* if you will. Enough that people are killed, shot, stabbed, hurt...

Why do you think the film industry has Rated R for strong language? It IS with purpose, I assure you.

I'm getting off this thread, but you can continue to say "cuss words are just words" if it makes you feel validated in your decision...

[peaceful herbivore]

I don't think anyone would be okay with someone calling them a F-ing B- ...but it has nothing to do with the actual words and I think a lot of people have attempted to explain that, though it seems you refuse to accept at least the distinction---even if you don't agree.

I would be JUST as upset if someone came up to me and said "You are an ugly fat cow" as I would if they called me a F-ing B-. An insult is an insult is an insult, the actual words said don't particularly matter to me.

The same goes for cursing. I curse occasionally, and have no problem with my child doing it in appropriate situations. For example, saying "oh shit" at a football game when the guy drops the ball is WAY more widely accepted than saying "oh shit" in the middle of church wouldn't you agree?

In very, very young children I can understand people (like the OP) not wanting to use the words in any context because they haven't yet grasped social graces and what is appropriate and not in public, around certain people and so on---

However, in my parenting, I strive to avoid the "do as I say, not as I do" type parenting, that is not only ineffective, but also very hypocritical and as it relates to curse words, uselsess.

Please no arguements about "if you have a beer at home, can your 5 year old?" I think we would all agree that underage drinking is illegal and you can be punished by the law due to it and that alcohol and the like are drugs that affect your brain and nervous system.

I am speaking more metaphorically in terms of arbitrary rules that in my humble opinion, have no basis in common sense, such as the arguement "Daddy can say shit, but you may not." I feel when my children are older, as long as it is in the scope of accepted social situations and they are not being insulting towards another person, "shit" when they break something is the least of my problems. I have enough faith in my children that they will learn appropriate social behaviors due to my modeling and that they won't write "I learned a lot of useful shit in school" on their college applications.

[Pam_and_Abigail]

Has anyone seen Penn & Teller's Bulls**t show about swearing? It's very enlightening, especially the interview with the linguist. Really, why should the sounds that come together to make a word mean it has some inherently evil quality about it?

[water]

Originally Posted by newmommy

Ah sorry, I don't belive I have. And to me, the above is a hypocritical statement.

If words are "just words" then you wouldn't mind if someone called you a "fng bi!@@" to your face? Can you honestly walk away from that person and shrug "oh they are just words"

Come now, cuss words take on a sort of *evil personality* if you will. Enough that people are killed, shot, stabbed, hurt...

Why do you think the film industry has Rated R for strong language? It IS with purpose, I assure you.

I'm getting off this thread, but you can continue to say "cuss words are just words" if it makes you feel validated in your decision...

Yeah, you just don't get it. What NYCVeg said:

I think you've missed a crucial distinction. My mom always told me that words are just words--it's how you say them, not what you say, that makes a difference. So, if my dad said "s*t" what he dropped something, that was just a word. If he said to my mom, in anger, "You're a s*t," that would be a different story altogether--totally inappropriate and wrong, because the word be used to hurt. And this would be true of any word, swear word or not. (BTW, this is just a theorectical example--my dad never said that to my mom!). Any words used insultingly can be harmful. But just saying words out loud...I guess I don't see why one should be "bad" and another "good." If your child says "Fudge!" when he drops something, he's engaging in exactly the same emotional release as if he said a swear word--that is, he's just using a word to express frustration, not hurting anyone.

That is exactly how I feel. My ds can say whatever he wants when he drops something on his toe, but I don't want him to say f-you just like I don't want him to say you are stupid, or any other insult. The two are totally different things.

And yep again to what NYCVeg says here:

And I think the reason why some mamas might make a distinction between words that are okay at home but not okay in public is not because they think that, yes, those words are inherently "bad", but that OTHER people would find them uncomfortable. On the other hand, other people find NIP uncomfortable, so...?

I am teaching my ds that other people will feel uncomfortable with him swearing and so maybe he shouldn't do it in public. Not because I think it's bad to swear, but to respect other people. Just the same as not swearing AT them.

Why so worried about what other people are teaching their children? Why should you get so upset about what my son says in his own home? Maybe you need to look at your own issues here...

[IncaMama]

wow. didn't mean to start all of this. sorry! i do think it's been very helpful, though. i feel the same way in general about curse words not being inherently evil, but i am very sensitive to social expectations. not saying everybody should be, but i am. so when my son screams "f*cka sh*t" (he's never heard that particular string of curses, but hey he's creative) in the middle of Target, i get embarrassed. because i know that a lot of people equate cursing with a certain level of ignorance, trashiness, etc. and i don't want to be perceived that way. not necessarily because i believe that that sentence is particularly evil.

i do agree about using the words TO someone as being totally unacceptable, just as insulting anyone without curse words is unacceptable. i hope that DS is able to grasp the distinction and the difference between "home" language and "outside" language or i'm in for big troubles!!

thanks for the thoughtful responses everybody...hope i haven't inadvertently hurt anyone's feelings by bringing it up.