Moms dealing with elevated lead levels - Page 3

[sandrajoon]

Hey, I understood that blood lead levels are not an accurate indicator of the total exposure to a heavy metal, and in fact only gives a picture of the last three weeks exposure. The body stores & accumulates heavy metals in the fat (this is called the 'body burden') and that is much harder to test. Maybe that info that changed as the book I am referencing is about 7+ years old (Turning Lead Into Gold http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...27215?v=glance )

In essence I gleaned that typical heavy metal tests are not very reliable. Any info on this from others?

[Ahimsa]

My 1 year old's level jumped from 10 to 14 in the past couple months. I am pretty sure it has to do with me moving in with my parents. Their house is old plus they are fixing it up. My relationship with my son's father ended and I need to live here until I can get my own place. It will probably be another month before I can afford to move. Cleaning this house is a huge task because it is such a big house. I am giving him the liquid iron and vitamin c. I am going to see if he'll eat cilantro. I hate cilantro, so we'll see.

[provocativa]

Yes, the lead is everywhere in our systems. Lead mimics calcium as well as iron; it is knit into our bones. It has a half-life of 20 years at least. It is hard not to cry when I type that. Our ped read an article recently about the lead lining children's intestines. Does anyone know anything about hair testing? Heavy metals affect adults too, BTW. It's not so much of a risk because we don't mouth things, and we wash our hands. Peeling paint was everywhere in our old house, and more would peel when I tried to clean. After dd was born, I had significant joint pain in my ankles, hobbling every morning when I got up. I thought it was a post-pregnancy thing. But since we moved, it has about gone away. I think the lead caused it, and I have much more energy since we moved. In addition, we have battled thrush- a condition lead can exacerbate. Okay, dd typing, more later. . .

[Subhuti]

[QUOTE=gardenmom, You need a true hepa vac that will capture dust down to 0.3 microns to capture lead dust. It really needs to be one of the ones that's certified for allergens. I plan to order a Nilfisk vacuum next week (to the tune of $400 to $600--mega ouch!). You also want a bag or one-time use cartridge so you don't have to handle the dust or end up spreading it around when you dump it.[/QUOTE]

gardenmom--
I have been trying to find a true HEPA filter VAC but unable to get a strong recommendation from anyone. How did you settle on a Nilfisk? Does it have a truly sealed cannister? Where are you going to get it?

I think someone recommended a Miele but I don't know if it has the blow-by problem or the air is all forced through the HEPA filter.

Thanks so much. Yes, we are ready to pay that amount, too.

Thanks for all your other info.

Liz

[sugarmoon]

Hi.

I just got back my one yo ds's lead test today, and he is at 14. It really sucks b/c we have already *done* abatement work, due to my 2.5 yo having a level of 29 (21 venal) at one.

grrr. I had slacked off on cleaning w/ the cascade etc. after getting the work done, but I guess I shouldn't have. I do have a hepa vac though.

One comforting thing I read when I initally freaked out when I found out about ds1 having high lead was that in 1975, the average kid's lead level was 25. I don't know if this is true or not, but it kind of makes sense, lead paint, leaded gas etc. I know I grew up in a house full of lead paint and I'm pretty okay. I try to focus on that, yk?

My ds 1 seems to be okay. He does have speech apraxia, but so do lots of people w/out lead problems.

I am thinking about consulting with a naturopath this time around though. I knew about cilantro, and we did lots of cilantro in scrambled eggs, but I'm wondering about other chelation options.

Anorien'smom, you sound like how I felt the first time around. ((((HUGS)))). Biting is normal in a 17 month old. I'm sure your dd will be okay.

Elsa

[Ahimsa]

I have been feeling sluggish lately. It could be depression or stress, because I do have a lot going on right now, but it feels physical. I wonder if lead has anything to do with it? I have the health depatment coming Wednesday, so I'll get a better idea how much lead isin thi house. I am afraid it might be a lot. This is an old hpuse with lots of peeling, old paint.

[gardenmom]

Originally Posted by gus'smama

One comforting thing I read when I initally freaked out when I found out about ds1 having high lead was that in 1975, the average kid's lead level was 25. I don't know if this is true or not, but it kind of makes sense, lead paint, leaded gas etc. I know I grew up in a house full of lead paint and I'm pretty okay. I try to focus on that, yk?

Sorry to hear about your dc's lead levels being high. I had to comment and add that I completely believe what you said about how high our levels (all of us) were when we were growing up. We did so many renovations/painting, etc. in and around our homes, I figure lead exposure had to be the rule rather than the exception. My sister used to help scrape and paint the bottom of the boat as a child (lead anti-fouling paint). My friend scraped and painted his grandparents' entire home as a fairly young child. I used to go fishing all the time, handling lead sinkers and even using my teeth to close line weights. When they stopped making leaded gasoline, I used to buy the lead additive and dump it into our old car to mix with the fuel (I was older then, but still more exposure).

Not that any of those were good things, but our tolerance for lead is probably much higher than the government allows today, and I agree with you that there's a bit of consolation in the knowledge that most of us had high exposure by today's standards, and turned out OK.

[gardenmom]

Originally Posted by CatskillMtnMama

gardenmom--
I have been trying to find a true HEPA filter VAC but unable to get a strong recommendation from anyone. How did you settle on a Nilfisk? Does it have a truly sealed cannister? Where are you going to get it?

I think someone recommended a Miele but I don't know if it has the blow-by problem or the air is all forced through the HEPA filter.

Thanks so much. Yes, we are ready to pay that amount, too.

Thanks for all your other info.

Liz

OK, I finally have more info on the Nilfisk. I emailed the company directly and asked a few questions, specifically stating that I had an old home with some lead issues, and asked if the vac would be safe for household use as well as final type cleanup on small renovations/vacuuming paint chips out of my windowsills, etc. An employee emailed back--here's the text of her message:

Thank you for your inquiry. The Family Vac will absolutely work for
> all of your applications. In fact, your applications sound like a
> description of a week of my personal vacuum's life. I have a child
> with allergies and asthma, two cats and an old house that is in a
> constant state of renovation. Although I don't have the Family Vac, I
> have had it's predecessor for more than 15 years.

> Our largest dealer for the Family Vac is Aller-caire. Their phone
> number is 800-547-8095. Because they purchase in volume, they offer
> great prices. They are very helpful and will work with you.


She also sent me the specifications sheet for it. (I want to add that the company does not advertise it specifically for lead removal, and she was cautious about saying that it should be used that way, but my gut feeling is that stating that is a liability issue and that she personally felt comfortable with it, if that makes any sense.)

Today I called her for more info and asked a few more questions. The Nilfisk vacuum is definitely sealed--all air must go through the filters before exiting the machine. It has 3 'filters', the first is a paper bag, which collects the large particles and debris. The second is a cotton filter which fits inside the lid and supposedly lasts 'for ever'--like 2000 hours. Behind that is the HEPA filter, which is supposed to be replaced once every other year, I think (thought I wrote that down, but I can't find it now). The woman from Nilfisk said that the filters they use for this vacuum are the exact same filters that are used in some of their commercial vacuums that lead abatement contractors and other 'clean room' type people use. I didn't specifically ask, but I assume the difference is in the power and size of the vac, and the attachments needed for a household use as opposed to commercial use.

So I called Aller-caire and ended up buying it today. After looking around on the web for comparison pricing, their price was definitely the best at $470 plus $15 shipping for the vac, 5 bags, crevice, upholstery and brush tools, wand and hose. I bought an extra pack of bags for additional $15. The sales person there said the basic floor tool would work for my home because we have no carpet, just wood floors with a few area rugs. That floor tool has two settings with a switch--brushes for the area rugs or plain for the wood floors. They also sell 2 power nozzels which are extra if you have a lot of carpet to vac.

Anyhow, that's a lot..whew! I also have a few details about emptying the bag and cleaning the cotton filter for anyone who wants more info, and I can dig up the PDF file with the specs if you want those as well. Feel free to PM or email me for more info!

[Subhuti]

Gardenmom--

thank you so much for doing that research. I am going to purchase one this weekend (time permitting). It sounds as if it will be more than adequate. It is less than I thought it would cost.

I am just curious, where would one get it repaired? Would a local vac repair shop be able to repair it or is too "speciality?"

Thanks!!

Liz

[gardenmom]

Both Nilfisk company (in PA) and the Aller Caire company in Chicago said they do repairs on site, so you'd have to mail it to them if repairs are needed. Also, I think Aller Caire only had hours on Saturday.

Good Luck!

I'll post again after I give it a try and see how it works.

[sincitymama]

Ok so I've been trying that recipe(minus the nuts) but, um, what the heck is dulse powder and where do I find it? Is it a supplement of some kind? I neve rheard of it before so I don't even know what part of the store I should be looking in or what kind of packaging or anything. Thanks!

[sugarmoon]

Sarah, dulse is a seaweed. I'm not sure where powdered would be -- maybe with bulk spices? also, if you buy it un-powdered, you can grind it yourself, in your blender when you are making the pesto

I'm not sure how important it would be anyway, unless it does something for the lead? The pesto will be good w/ just cilantro, olive oil, parm. cheese, walnuts and or pine nuts, garlic and salt. We had some the other day with lime juice in it, which was very yummy. unfortunately, my boys didn't like it as much as I did..

[sincitymama]

Thanks I checked all around my grocery store today-with the natural supplements(the store I use has a big area of natural/organic/imported stuff), with the regular spices, with the organic spices, and by hte seafood counter. No luck. We have a gnc in town, so maybe I'll check there. I don't know if it has an effect on lead or just is there for flavor, so I didn't want to skip it in case it was important. I'm already not using any of the nuts(ds is too young), just cilantro, and pumpkin and sunflower seeds, and olive oil.

Next lead check is in just a couple weeks now and I am starting to get so scared.

[provocativa]

Seaweed is very important in chelation. I wish I had thought to grind it up when my daughter was younger. I put the whole leaves in soups and beans as they cook, and pull them out before serving. I neglect it now, but we had dramatic results back when her level was so high they were testing her every week. Look at an Asian market or in the Asian section of your HFS. (Kombu or kelp were the most recommended ones in my reading). It is very high in naturally occurring iodine, which supports liver function. I have just been reading about the liver's metabolic pathways, but my book is downstairs and I can't fetch it right now, or I'd have more details.
IMO, some of this paranoia about nuts is unfounded. True, the rate of peanut allergy in the U.S. has increased exponentially, but interestingly, they have not found a corresponding rise in China, where they consume much greater quantities. Peanuts are a legume, and much of the worry about other realated foods is that they were processed in a plant that also processes peanuts, and so that food corporations lawyers have spun some of this to protect themselves, and doctors too, yada yada. So the experts here haven't figured out the differences btwn. US and Chinese behavior, but we breastfeed less (so our kids have more allergies). And we may be overexposing ourselves prenatally because our restaurants often fry with peanut oil (high smoking point), and many lotions and cosmetics contain hidden sources of peanut oil. When my dd almost succeeded, at nine months, to snack on a toddler friends sandwich, I researched We breastfed, and I was never much of a beauty product queen, or into fried foods, and nuts are so healthy, we gambled- but stacked the deck. At one year old, we took almond and peanut butters on a picnic right next to a hospital. No anaphalactic shock, but no worry- because if she did start to react, we were right by the ER! Pumpkin seeds are so healthy. And they are so easy for toddlers to chew at at young age.

[Barcino]

Hi,

After reading all your posts I am thankful we live in a new house (I have always envied the beautiful character full old homes!) but had a "heirloom" piece of crap from my husband's family that was painted with lead paint inside my new house. My son has not been around it a whole lot - it was not in his room or play areas... so I am hoping his levels are fine. It was an old bench and truth is I never saw paint chips coming out of it but I am totally freaked out regarldess of the fact so I am having my 20 mo. old checked tomorrow. I wish I could live in a bubble!

Anyway just wanted to let you know that i have been doing research on HEPA vacuums and there is a very affordable EUREKA that has the same HEPA filtration that the expensive Nilfik or whatever has... the Eureka is the
http://www.eureka.com/products/upright/4870d/4870d.jsp Eureka Model 4870D/DT It sells for around $150 in amazon. The nilfik seems to have the same specs for HEPA than that Eureka. Here is a link so you can compare: http://www.natlallergy.com/cgi-bin/M...&spreadid=1385

I just thought this might help since the price difference is quite impressive. Both of them get rid of 99.97% of all particles down to 0.3 microns in size. The Eureka is also named a Consumer Report best buy.

Hope this helps some of you looking for good vacuums. I will let you know how my son turns out. I am also now going to go on a raid for toys that might contain lead... my inlaws have some stupid toy they brought from mexico that looks awful suspicious to me.

[gardenmom]

Originally Posted by Barcino

I just thought this might help since the price difference is quite impressive. Both of them get rid of 99.97% of all particles down to 0.3 microns in size. The Eureka is also named a Consumer Report best buy.

I just wanted to add that I am skeptical about this, both due to the price, and the fact that it's not a canister style, and from basic cleaning info I just read in their own specs (part of the instructions said you should 'shake out' one of the filters, which is not acceptable from a lead safety standpoint). From all I have read and been told, unless you purchase a sealed (pressurized) canister style vac with HEPA filtration, it doesn't matter how great the filter is, because the air isn't all passing through the filter. Though I admit I'm not familiar with the Eureka, I would want to speak with the manufacturer to find out if this vac is sealed prior to purchasing it for allergy or fine dust removal.

Edited to add that the specs on the Eureka (when you open the little window by clicking 'true HEPA filtration') talk about the HEPA filter being able to catch 99.97% of particles, not that the actual vacuum performs to those specs.

I hope your son tests low! Best of luck.

[Barcino]

I guess when it sounds too good to be true... it usually is
What you explain makes sense. Thanks for clarifying!

We should have the results in a couple of days. They did the finger prick test. I am not expecting it to come back abnormal but I guess better be safe than sorry.

[Subhuti]

Dear Baricino

I think that I have to agree with Garden mom, that you're not getting a true HEPA filtration with the Eureka. I appreciate your trying to get a cheaper vac, but in a real lead situation (old house, for example, construction, etc.) you really need to have a full HEPA function.

I hope your kids are OK. From reading your situation, I don't think they will be in much jeopardy from a single peice of furniture. My sense is that it has to be day in day out exposure to lead dust or consumption of a large peice of lead to actually poison a child. Still, I really do feel for you with your worries!

Good luck.

Liz

[Barcino]

Thanks so much! I did get the results today and the finger prick came out at 1 so the doctor said not to worry at all - especially since the fingerprick versus the vein tends to show a little higher. I am so thankful and the piece of furniture is out of here as of last week! I am glad I got it checked out though... I would have wondered and worried if I hadnt. Good luck to all of you!
BTW yes... totally agree that the Eureka is worthless for a true lead filtration since not only the filter is important but the sealing of the vacum itself. I just got excited too quick!

[Barcino]

Double posted