My Child Is A *SLOB*...

[PajamaMama]

...and it drives. me. up. the. freakin. wall.

I don't think I expect too much of her. This is what I expect:

1. Make her own bed.
2. Get her own dirty clothes out of her room to the laundry room.
3. Put her own clean clothes away.
4. Bring things out of her room that she brings in there that belong elsewhere in the house (drinking glasses, my books, hairbrushes, etc)
5. Let her dog out early enough so that it isn't forced to urinate in its own kennel, thus making *her* room smell like an animal shelter...
6. Keep her floor clean.

She will be ten years old in a few weeks. She KNOWS my expectations, so that's not the issue. She has a written list on her door to remind her. Also, she has a large closet and 11 drawers for clothes in her room, so there is a specific place for everything. (sock drawer, underwear drawer, 3 shirt drawers, etc. plus a couple for whatever she wants...) Not to mention a desk with three more drawers for personal "stuff". We also have a play room for toys that are to be shared with her sister.

Please give me your thoughts on what I should reasonably expect from her, and how to motivate her to live up to those expectations.

I came in here and counted to THREE HUNDRED before I started typing. Sitting at my desk, eyes closed, just counting...

There were apple cores in her room, stuff the dog has shredded everywhere, a pile two feet deep in the bottom of her closet, play doh in the carpet, and on and on. You honestly could not see her floor. And this has all happened in the space of about a week...because we went through this before we went on vacation about 3 weeks ago, when she had to clean her room so she could pack!

Please help...I am at the END OF MY ROPE on this issue.

[PajamaMama]

I wanted to add, I sincerely do not think she has "too much" stuff. We pared down quite a bit before moving into this house about 6 months ago.

Also I am not a slob myself...I do think I set a good example, in case anyone was wondering if I expect more of her than I do of myself. I do not. I expect far less of a 10 year old girl than I do of myself, a grown woman.

[Arwyn]

Speaking only as a fairly-recently-teen (23) and a natural "slob" - not as a parent of a teen (or at all, yet) - here are my suggestions. As always, take what you like, and leave the rest:

1) the dog. If she can't take care of him, she shouldn't have him in her room. It's cruel to an animal to lock it up so long it eliminates in its own sleeping space. Yes, dogs feel humilation, and no dog can be happy doing that, unless it's been trained by repetition that that's what it's supposed to do. You have to take the dog out of her room, and take care of it yourself, until she does something to prove to you that she will not neglect it further. Yes, I'm sure it's supposed to be her responsibility, but at ten, she is still your responsibility, and thus any promises she defaults on fall to you - you owe the dog a better life than that.

2) everything else. Leave it. It's her room, her space, her clothing, her life. You can argue that if she's damaging the room - which you either own or otherwise are in financial obligation for - you have every right to prevent that, but beyond that, you should respect (even if it disgusts you) how she choses to live. Perhaps, to address the harm-to-the-room issue, you can set up a weekly/monthly/bimonthly/whatever date when she has to clean the room enough for you to do the necessary house maintanence (vacuuming, rug cleaning, whatever) - but let her keep it how she chooses between times.

That said, I would hope that you can gently help her learn how to keep her space sanitary and at a minimum level of cleanliness - but for you to learn that her minimum may not be the same as yours. Also, she cannot and will not learn from you how to until/unless she wants to. And that, you cannot force.

Good luck.

[philomom]

I have a tale that sums it up nicely:

Once, after getting dd to do the monthly mucking out of her room, the kind where I sweep and mop, she says to me "I hope I have neat children."

[snuggly mama]

My almost 10 yr. old dd is also a card-carrying member of the slob club
Her room is a complete disaster -- clothes absolutely everywhere, CD's on the floor, books falling off shelves and an entire zoo of stuffed animals strewn around for good measure. She shares the room with 4yr. old dd (who luckily only sleeps in there, not plays!). I have asked nicely and I have demanded that the room be clean -- it doesn't work. So we have two rules: Absolutely, positively NO EATING in the bedroom and If you want to wear clothing, it needs to be in the laundry. She pretty much manages to follow those. We also have occasions that the room must be clean (usually because I can't take it anymore!), and then I ask her to clean it "mommy clean". This means the whole nine yards -- and I must be able to see the floor, close the closet door, and walk to the dresser! She whines about it, but she'll do it, especially since she knows it doesn't happen often.

The truth is, if I want her room clean, I'll clean it myself. I think she just gets overwhelmed trying to put everything away neatly. Plus, I remember my mom yelling at me to clean up, and I was thinking "Whaddya mean? This IS clean!" :LOL Guess it's all a matter of perspective!

[PajamaMama]

Arwyn- The dog has been sleeping in the garage for the last week or so, since we came home from vacation, because I feel as you do, that she deserves a better life than one where she is trapped in a kennel with her own urine. Are you a current or reformed slob? Meaning, did you eventually learn to take care of your own space, or are you still struggling with it? And how much did your parents involvement/noninvolvement influence your lifestyle today? Not trying to be nasty, just truly curious.

Philomom- Thanks for the giggle.

Snugglymom- Nice to know I am not alone out here! I cleaned it myself this afternoon during toddler nap time, and made her go out and play with friends so I wouldn't be after her every 5 minutes with a fresh outpouring of disgust. I really do want to be a Peaceful Parent, but this issue pushes my buttons, HARD!

[UUMom]

I think 10 is too young to be given the job of having a clean room on her/his own. If a clean room is important--and i think it can be for organiziational reasons-- then an an adult needs to help the child. Each evening, if nec. When I go in at night to help my 11 yr old ds set out his clothing for the morning and tuck him in, I also go through clothing in the room with him...'is this clean? is this?" If it's clean, we hang it up. if it's dirty we put it in the laundry. every other Sat he has the job of vaccuming his room (his bnrother does it the other Sat), so Sat morn, we pick everything up off the floor. He does have baskets on his book shelves for cards, treasures etc, and a basket in his closet for his stuffies. Lego and other such toys are not in his room.

I just don't think 10 yr olds are in the mind space to have a clean room, Unless it's a 10 yr old who enjoys cleaning her/his room. :LOL I know they exist, i just don't have one.

[kathywiehl]

I think your list is perfectly reasonable, and I also agree with the pp about the dog. If she can't care for it, someone else has to.

My rules for my daughter's room:

1. No food to be taken into the room at all (I learned that lesson after finding a moldy cup of peanut butter and a spoon in her bathroom vanity drawer)
2. Turn the lights off when not in the room
3. Room has to look "decent" before being allowed to do other things like watch tv, talk on the phone, whatever.
4. Room, bathroom and closet all have to be "clean" and presentable if she wants to have friends over.

As far as clothes go, I don't care anymore. If she wants something clean she has to bring me her dirty laundry to wash. When it's clean, I give it back and ask her to put it away. She never does and it gets lost in her room, so then she has nothing to wear, socks never match, clothes don't match. I don't care anymore. Her closet is a pig sty and I used to get upset about it but not anymore- she can live with the consequences of not caring for her clothes properly.

Her bathroom is gross, but nothing that I can't fix with a little bleach and some elbow grease. She's required to clean it on the weekends and if she doesn't and it gets really bad then she's paying me an hourly rate of $6.00 per hour to be her "maid" Her toilet is nasty, the bathtub is usually grimy and the sink is covered in toothpaste but I don't care anymore. None of that is permanent.

Her actual bedroom has stuff all over, but she's not allowed paint, food, nail polish or anything like that in her room. I know that no matter what, no matter how bad it looks, none of it is permanent. If it gets really bad and we need to have people over or something and it has to be clean for some reason, then I'll go in with a trash bag and just chuck everything myself and she can pay me for my maid service. Of course she gets plenty of warning if it needs to look really nice for some reason so this hasn't had to happen yet.

Right now you can't see the floor in her room, books, papers, blankets, clothes all over the floor. I washed her sheets and gave them back to her to put on the bed and she is too lazy to to that so she has been sleeping with a mattress and a pillow with no case and a comforter. Oh well....... eventually she'll grow out of it and decide she wants better but until then, I have better things to worry about, like her attitude.

[Jane]

I would suggest keeping her company while she cleans. You can go and sit on her bed and hang out. Don't do anything or say anything room related - just sit there and talk about whatever you might talk about in the car. You might offer to put stuff on hangers if she hands you the hanger and the clothes. Or not.

I think you have to chill a little on the requirements, not because they are unreasonable but because it's driving you nuts.

[kathywiehl]

Apricot, you are a better woman than I am! I know I could never keep my dd company while she cleans her room. It's so disgusting it makes my blood pressure rise just thinking about it. I stay far far away unless I have to go in there! I wish I had the self control to hang out with her there without losing it but I can't. It's just one of those things that gets me upset, so while I think you offered a good suggestion, it's not for everyone

[Jane]

Maybe you could hang with someone else's daughter while she does the same for you?
I do understand peeves. I have my own. They just aren't messy rooms, luckily or unluckily.

Get me a glass of wine and I'll tell you about cleaning up a friend's apartment. There were maggots in the sofa. We threw the plates away instead of cleaning them.

[The Duchess]

PajamaMama - just wanted to let you know at 36 I am a reformed slob. Well...I'd still pick reading anything than cleaning anything but now I see what needs to get done and I do it. Now I like a clean home. I am also blessed as I married a very neat DH who likes to whirlwind clean the house constantly so that's a great help.

I was a total slob all thru my teens, and even when I had an apartment in my 20s it would start sliding into chaos unless I knew someone would be coming around to see it! I am wondering if there is anything genetic here - or should I say linked to personality types. In my family, my mom and brother were neat and me and my dad....weren't. I am an extrovert, I love to be around others and I love others coming over. I find knowing someone's coming over still gives me major motivation to get the house spotless. Would this work? What is your daughter's personality?

[Ruby]

Pajamamama, I don't think your expectations are to high. I have a 13 year old dd and she keeps her own room clean including changing sheets. Last week she even took down her curtains and washed her windows herself when we were spring cleaning. That said , this was a work in progress. Her room gets messy , but once a week she is expected to pick-up everything and tidy up. If it goes to long the task can be over whelming. She also has to put away her own clothes and sometimes they might sit on the floor a couple of days before they are put away, but that is okay with me. She willingly keeps her room up now, but this has been a work in progress. If the dog is her dog, she should have to be responsible for him or he needs a new home. If it is the families, then who takes care of the dog is negotiable. I put a hamper in dd room when she was younger and all dirty clothes were to go in the hamper at the end of the day and anything that didn't belong in her room needed to be put back. I would have her pick up each day till it became habit and when she starts showing more responsibility you can start giving her space. I gave dd more flexibility and space with her room after she learned to be responsible. Good luck and don't second guess yourself.

[SagMom]

I exect my kids to take care of their rooms and their stuff, but their threshold for mess is higher than mine. We don't have any requirements about their rooms, and I would only step in if they were doing something to damage the place (never happened.)

My oldest ds is pretty messy, but when it gets to him, he'll voluntarily clean up, dust, vacumme, the works.

Dd's room used to sound like your dd's room. At her request, I'd help her shovel it out from time to time, but in the last year, she's gotten waaaaay better.

I don't help unless they ask for it--their rooms are theirs to keep as they want. If it bothers me, I close the door and don't look. My room, as a kid, was always a mess--it wasn't until I had my first apartment that I felt I wanted the place to look nice...cleaning still isn't my favorite thing, but the house is presentable...mostly.

Anyway, it seems like your expectations are causing you a lot of grief. Maybe just turning her room over to her (and letting her know that) would help.

[PajamaMama]

Well, I've read everyone's responses so far and I'd like to thank everyone who's voiced their opinions.

I am going to keep on with the list, except that I'm doing the dog care for now. I am up early usually anyway so I really don't mind letting her out and making sure she has food and water. She's laying on my feet right now, in fact.

I appreciate the idea that her room is her space, and that her things are her own, but I also think that one of my responsibilities as a parent is to make sure that my children grow into responsible adults that can take care of themselves on their own, and part of that in my opinion is learning to do chores that you don't really feel like doing because they need to be done anyway!

Heaven knows that if I only did the chores I felt like doing, we would all be living in chaos. I may catch some flak for this, but I feel that it is my responsibility as the SAHM to make sure that my family has a nice environment to live in, food to eat, clean clothes to wear, and no filth around.

My chores don't take me all day. I have plenty of time to play with my kids, go to the park, the store, whatever. I just do things *AS THEY NEED TO BE DONE* instead of letting them pile up, and this is something I'm trying to instill in my daughters. So...I will continue to encourage her to be neat, and insist on at least this minimum level of compliance.

[Artisan]

I was a messy person as a teenager, and still have those natural tendencies. One suggestion I have that has helped me as an adult (which I wish I would have thought of as a child) is to set the timer and clean for 15 minutes every day. That's it. When the 15 minutes are up, she can be done. I *know* that some of her inability to keep her room clean stems from how overwhelmed she feels by the mess. Often saying "clean up" is too overwhelming for people who are messy. They often tend to be perfectionists, and if they can't do it right, they don't want to start. If you give her a timer and tell her to work as fast as she can for 15 minutes, she will get a lot done (the timer is a natural motivator), and you can put an end to the power struggle. If she does 15 minutes a day, once the room is tidy, it will be easy to keep that way by continuing the 15 minutes a day.

If she has a bit of a short attentions span, you might consider 10 minutes a day.

[kathywiehl]

You know what? Reading all of these posts has brought me to a realization... I'm not neat by nature. I have to work hard at it. It takes real effort for me to put things away when I'm finished, get around to putting away the laundry, etc. What helps me is a schedule, I use www.motivatedmoms.com

I wonder if setting up the same for my dd would work......like on a certain day she has to clean her bathtub, another day she has to go around the room and pick up all of the garbage that she sees. Another day, maybe pick up and put away all of the books that are laying around.

For me, once I get started with one thing, sometimes I get motivated and move beyond the one planned task and clean the whole room that I'm working in and other times I can't wait to get it over quickly so I can do something more fun.

Maybe this will work for her.....maybe she'll get motivated and keep cleaning if she's only required to do one task per day. It might seem less overwhelming if I say to her "here's all of your laundry, go put it away today" If she's expecting it, like on a certain day of the week, then maybe I won't get so much attitude.

I'm going to wake her up for school right now and on the drive there, we'll talk about this. I think I'm onto something!

[Red]

I ahve one of those slobs too. We've just recently , almost, solved the problem.

And it was easy.


New rule. Is your room clean? No electronics til it is. No tv, no puter, no video games. Since she never goes outside willingly, I allow her to go for a walk, etc.

Since she has certain shows she likes to watch, she cleans in time to see them. If I don't like the way the room looks, too bad, you can;t watch.

I could NEVER stay with her while she cleaned, or help. I'd kill her! Dirty dishes, dirty, smelly clothes, ugh! And it's messy every day, she has to start from scratch every singel time.

[Maderella]

Well, I was a very messy child and teen as well. My parents hated it but said that it was my room so I could keep it the way I wanted. When things got bad they would just close the door.

Unfortunately I NEVER learned how to keep things clean in an orderly manner. Even now, in my 30's I struggle with organization. My home is clean as far as dusting, vaccuming, scrubbed bathrooms BUT THE CLUTTER, OH THE CLUTTER!!!! I try, I really do but it's a struggle.

I wish my parents had been stricter with my responsabilities. I think they felt that since I was a good kid, a great student, a nice person that it was okay if I was a slob - it hasn't served me well into adulthood.

I have a 9yr dd who is following in my footsteps. I want to pull out my hair when I go into her room.

[alexisyael]

I was a teenage slob (hardcore -- thick mold in the tea cups on my desk/ windowsill, didn't change the sheets til they got crusty, the works. But at least I *had* sheets on my bed -- I knew slobs who were worse than me).

I am now a reformed slob. Now I realize that I feel better when my house is clean. It took me until I was 28 (two years ago) to understand that :LOL Seriously. And I doubt that without flylady I'd have been able to really figure it out how to make the change. (I don't follow her to the letter, but the underlying philosophy helped me tremendously).

I'd second the timer suggestion. Also, I think swapping with another mom for sitting with your dd as she cleans is a good idea, if you have a mom friend who'd be willing to do that. (My mom's neatnik friend used to come hang out with me while I cleaned. She didn't even have kids, she was just generous!)

I think the struggle over my room stayed with me a long time... only now am I able to step back from it and see that I don't need to be a slob to be rebellious. That's sad, but it's true. The way my mom handled my slobbiness made it clear to me that *I* was a rebel because I was a slob. My MIL said I became a "new Lexie" when I started following flylady's advice, and it's very true. I did.

FWIW, with my own kids (yet to come) I will help them set up routines, but I will try my hardest not to be disgusted by their rooms. After all, part of the maturation process is to come to grips with your space. I don't believe in being too lax (mold = no way!) but I don't want to relive the fundemental crises of my youth with my own children. Their space is their own. I can help teach cleanliness, but I don't want to dictate it.