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Our dog pooped on the floor, and my husband... - Page 3

post #41 of 81
Well, to be fair, rubbing the dogs nose in it and swatting them with newspapers was standard housetraining years ago. We know better now. We don't housetrain dogs that way anymore. Pehaps you dh doesn't know about all the recent studies in pack mentality that debunk the old ways of training and diciplining dogs.

My dad kicked our dogs and swatted them with newspapers, and he wasn't ever abusive to the family. He wasn't the greatest dad or husband, but his abuse of our dog wasn't, as is often the case, a tall-tale sign of a person prone to abuse people (which, I know, didn't help our three dogs any, the last of which he accidentily killed by throwing it for chewing up the carpet. It makes me a little ill writing that - in part because it is painful to have to reconcile my view of my dad with my vision of the kind of person that throws a small dog against a wall and in part because I know how much he suffered for it. He hasn't owned a dog since, BTW, and has never been violent otherwise.)

BUT a stun gun?! This is where I just can't relate to the situation anymore. A stun gun?! Buying it to use on the dogs seems so diliberate and cruel.
post #42 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by kellyb
My dh got the older dog when we were teenagers, and thought he knew how to "train" a dog...I was 17 and didn't know any better. The older dog is an 11 yo half Chow, and would growl at my dh when he would put his nose in poop when housetraining was going on.
Okay, it really sounds like your dh doesn't understand how to train a dog and may also not realize how harmful a stun gun can be. We had a thread on MDC at an earlier date about the use of tasers in schools on children, and I read some of the linked articles. I think most of us here at MDC realize that a stun gun is actually a potentially fatal weapon that can cause injuries, but it was originally sold as something that would stop behavior but would be essentially harmless. If your dh believes the hype about the stun gun, it would account for him using the stun gun on the dog. The first piece is that he has to understand that it's painful and could maybe cause the dog to have a heart attack and die.

I agree with all the people here who think this means you should give the dogs away. The dog isn't safe--it's not safe from your dh and it's not safe to your family.

Your dh thinks that punitive discipline will work with the dogs, and has escalated to cruelty. He needs to go to a parenting class to learn about other methods of discipline for children. Immediately!
post #43 of 81
I agree, CMM, we shouldn't be attacking kellyb....we should be helping her.

Kellyb, the dogs need to leave your home. Just get them out. If they incite that much rage in dh, they need to go, for everyone's sake. Seriously, a stun gun is WAY over-the-top for dealing with a dog. Especially for a poopy accident. If he is otherwise kind and decent, great. But your dh should not be living with dogs.

Please, take the dogs to the pound. And destroy the stun gun.
post #44 of 81
Thread Starter 
Our options were to put one or both dogs to sleep, or do something extreme...they were trying to KILL each other...constantly we were at the Emergency Vet.
It was a total act of desperation. I'm not defending it, but we were really, truely desperate.
post #45 of 81
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnmama
I agree, CMM, we shouldn't be attacking kellyb....we should be helping her.

Kellyb, the dogs need to leave your home. Just get them out. If they incite that much rage in dh, they need to go, for everyone's sake. Seriously, a stun gun is WAY over-the-top for dealing with a dog. Especially for a poopy accident. If he is otherwise kind and decent, great. But your dh should not be living with dogs.

Please, take the dogs to the pound. And destroy the stun gun.
Every pound around here is a 3 day kill pound...it would be less crual to just have them euthenized...
post #46 of 81
You need to call the police and release the dogs to the officers (in the animal control dept.).
post #47 of 81
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by edamommy
You need to call the police and release the dogs to the officers (in the animal control dept.).
So they can be euthenized in a pound gas chamber as opposed to by a vet?
How is that better?
post #48 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by kellyb
Our options were to put one or both dogs to sleep, or do something extreme...they were trying to KILL each other...constantly we were at the Emergency Vet.
It was a total act of desperation. I'm not defending it, but we were really, truely desperate.
As The Offspring would say..."Gotta keep 'em separated."
My 100lb Akita mix constantly fought with my In laws 80 lb Lab. We kept them separated. The other option was to put our dog up for adoption. When we go and visit...they stay separated. We've had to break up several fights in the past. You have other options.

Best of luck.
post #49 of 81
You know, I keep thinking about my dad's abuse of our dogs and his role in our family. He wasn't abusive physically or verbally (and prob not more emotionally abuse than average - the unintentional cruelty of families astounds me). But there was this tyrant thing, a dynamic of power that marred our family life. Without real cause, we were a bit afraid of him.

So, I guess I just cannot say there was no connection between the way my dad treated the dogs and our family life. It wasn't that his abuse of our dogs was a warning sign for abuse of us, but it wasn't completely irrelevant either.

You may want to really talk to your dh about this and about what it means. He does seem to have a punishment solves the problem mentality (even though he has seen it NOT work on your dogs). Is he on the same page as you about gentle dicipline of his child?
post #50 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by kellyb
So they can be euthenized in a pound gas chamber as opposed to by a vet?
How is that better?
Better than being hit twice with a stun gun? Are you serious? Is it better that your dh abuses them to death than being humanely euthanized? If those are your ONLY two options I think you know which is the better one.
post #51 of 81
Your husband's behavior is dispicable and disgusting to say the very least. It is CRUELTY. I am not being dramatic. What you described is someone who is much, much more disturbed than "someone who doesn't know how to train dogs". To cause another living thing undue and cruel punishment or pain for any reason indicates to me a serious emotional or mental defect that needs immediate attention.

There is nothing in this whole entire world that would make me stay with a man who beat an animal, much less bought and used a stun gun specifically for the purpose of hurting an animal. It is absolutely sick and twisted. It is also a proven fact that animal cruelty is a marker for violent criminals and is one of the symptoms of a sociopath.

No "understanding" post or explanation from the OP will convince me that this man is not seriously, seriously, utterly, and purely disturbed in an extreme way and to me it is only a matter of time before his violence and cruelty extends to people and not *just* animals.

If I knew someone was treating an animal like that I would report them without haste.

I don't know what you were looking for when you posted. Support? Well, I am sorry but I am not going to sugarcoat it. It is disgusting. It is just as shocking to me as someone who would type "my husband looks at child porn but he would NEVER touch my child" or something of that sort. Yeah right.

Run, don't walk, as far as you can away.
post #52 of 81
You're in Memphis? Try this

http://www.raot.org/
Responsible Animal Owners of Tennessee

or the Animal Protection Association of Memphis

You have other options. And there are rescue places perhaps in other states that would rather come and get your animals than leave them to be abused by your husband.
post #53 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamawanabe
You know, I keep thinking about my dad's abuse of our dogs and his role in our family. He wasn't abusive physically or verbally (and prob not more emotionally abuse than average - the unintentional cruelty of families astounds me). But there was this tyrant thing, a dynamic of power that marred our family life. Without real cause, we were a bit afraid of him.
(emphasis mine)
that counts as abuse. abuse is about so much more than physical violence. It's about control issues first and foremost. Fear is often a huge factor in controlling and manipulating people. I stand by what I said earlier to the OP. Neither she, nor her baby, nor her dogs are safe with such a man. I don't care what his reasons or excuses are, abuse is abuse and it's always wrong. It's still wrong even when the abused justify it and downplay it. It's still abuse and it's still wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong.

If your husband ever belittles you or makes fun of you, that's abuse. If he ever blames you for his violent outbursts, if he ever blames the dogs for his behavior towards them, that's abuse. If he doesn't take responsibility for his own actions, if he doesn't think he did anything wrong, if he's always finding reasons to justify it or explain it away....

your dogs are aggressive because they have been abused. Period. further abuse won't make them any less aggressive. They will turn on you, or your DH, or heaven forbid, your child, one day. They deserve to live a better life, and so do you. (((hugs)))
post #54 of 81
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by willowsmom
Is he on the same page as you about gentle dicipline of his child?
Totally and completely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trish
Better than being hit twice with a stun gun? Are you serious? Is it better that your dh abuses them to death than being humanely euthanized? If those are your ONLY two options I think you know which is the better one.
This is the first time ever he's used it in this way.
I don't really expect ya'll to get it necessarily, but when you have 2 huge dogs trying to kill each other with a toddler around, a stun gun seems less abusive than it does under normal circumstances.

Quote:
Originally Posted by willowsmon
As The Offspring would say..."Gotta keep 'em separated."
My 100lb Akita mix constantly fought with my In laws 80 lb Lab. We kept them separated. The other option was to put our dog up for adoption. When we go and visit...they stay separated. We've had to break up several fights in the past. You have other options.

Best of luck.
That was our first strategy. But they'd still get at each other sometimes...
Anyway, they don't fight any more now...
Thanks for the links..
post #55 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by kellyb
That was our first strategy. But they'd still get at each other sometimes...
Anyway, they don't fight any more now...
Thanks for the links..

Sure thing. HTH. Take care.
post #56 of 81
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by stafl
If your husband ever belittles you or makes fun of you, that's abuse. If he ever blames you for his violent outbursts, if he ever blames the dogs for his behavior towards them, that's abuse. If he doesn't take responsibility for his own actions, if he doesn't think he did anything wrong, if he's always finding reasons to justify it or explain it away....
He doesn't do stuff like that to me, but he has blamed the dogs for his wrong treatment of them. He also has admitted that he thinks the dogs started fighting because he made them vicious, which is why I was so dumbstruck by what he did last night. I thought we were on the same page with all this, and then he does something awful, totally out of the blue.
All I could think was "that's really psycho", which, if I already thought he was a little nuts, I wouldn't have been surpised by, but I was in total shock.
post #57 of 81
did you ask your DH why he freaked so bad?

anyway maybe he could have sprung for obedience classes instead of the stun gun? I hate to say it but I think euthanizing the dogs would be more humane than keeping them if they are going to be abused. I really do hope you can find them a home though. the situation you describe is so unhealthy is many ways, I hope you find a solution.
post #58 of 81
Sorry to see some very passionate animal lovers crucify you here, when youre looking for help. But abuse is never something that most people can say "oh, well what else can you do?"

Ive got 2 10 yr old dogs now......and trained them with dh, so while not an expert, I do know that any kind of abuse, hitting....electric collars....stun guns....is not the way to get an animal to learn. They will only get more aggressive, first towards eachother, than to someone less dominant than your dh....(you, your dc). Also, I agree with pp that dogs wont poop on the floor unless they have to (stuck in the house, unable to control themselves, fear) When we havent spent time with our dogs....they purposely chew something and leave it at the front door....as a way of telling us...."Hey, we need attention!" Maybe this is your dogs way of telling you something.....

My philosophy has always been........if you cant control your dog thru responsible ways.....if a dog is too big or aggressive for you to handle, than you should not have said dog(s). Chows are known to be a VERY aggressive breed anyways. I know its hard to think of giving up one or both of your dogs.....but now that you have a baby in the house, that needs to be your priority in making safety decisions, not your dogs. Besides, what kind of life are they having spending the day locked in a room, then sent outside. Without socialization, this situation is not going to change. I think youre sitting on a time bomb!

If you surrender them NOW, BEFORE they bite someone.....they will have a much better chance of getting placed....then waiting for something to happen.
post #59 of 81
I don't think that anyone has mentioned that dogs fighting is a natural behavior. They are territorial (hence the peeing a little bit to mark it) and when a second dog, especially a younger dog, enters the older dogs territory, and the older dog is unable to maintain his territory (because you've brought the younger one to live in his area) then he's going to be aggressive to try to maintain dominance. If you punish him for trying to do that, it doesn't stop him from his instinct of wanting to be dominant, which he must try to ignore. Animals can't just reason out things like we can in these instances, and so it's unfair to the older dog (as well as the younger.)

I also don't understand the "going out to buy a stungun". I can see (not myself) someone else grabbing it if it was there and two huge dogs are going at it and the person is unable to separate them. But if the situation is so bad between them that you feel the need to buy the gun, it's time to give up one of the dogs!

I just don't understand the many things humans due which is not in the animals best interest because they feel like it. "But I like both dogs" is not a reason to keep two dogs in a situation that sets off their instincts in a bad way. It's not fair to the dogs, nor is it fair to you. It's especially not fair to an animal to be kept in a situation where it's owner feels it must be abused. Where's the fun in that for anyone?

Yes, I'd say euthanasia is a better option than living that way and being abused. You're arguing about whether going to the vet is more humane than the pound but you haven't done either. BTW - if you go to the vet, make sure to ask that the dog be put under gas anethesia before injected. Most vets don't do that, which means the dog dies while awake anyway, so it's not much different than being killed with CO2. And why do you need to give away both dogs? Why not just one?
post #60 of 81
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rainbow moon
did you ask your DH why he freaked so bad?
Yeah...He said "I'm just sick of it all."

Ok...deep breath...I was a little overwhelmed by some of the responses when I got on the computer tonight, and didn't mention what was said about it today.

We talked about it, and agreed that I was probably the better one to handle the dog/poop/dicipline stuff from now on.
He agrees that what he did was psycho, and agrees that all his past attempts to deal with the dog's bad behavior only made things worse.
So, hopefully, that's that.
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