Did Pa and Ma Ingalls practice AP?

[flutemandolin]

DH and I have been rereading the "Little House" series lately, mostly because one of the kids unpacked the books and brought them up to the living room. I am delighted that dh has been enjoying them and identifying with the values expressed in the stories, and it's been enlightening for me as well. I noticed in "on the Banks of Plum Creek" they referred to Baby Carrie (who had to be well over 2 at the time) in a couple of instances: one, when Pa and Ma went to town they couldn't leave Carrie because she was too little to be away from Ma for a long time. (She needed to nurse?) Then, when they moved into their new house, one bedroom was supposed to be for Pa and Ma and Carrie.They never spoke of having a cradle or separate bed for her, and I assume they didn't. In light of what I know now, this seems very interesting and I just thought I'd share.

[LiamnEmma]

Well, I'll be rereading those then. I used to read the whole set about once a year, but I stopped doing that about 5 years ago. I recall both those passages now that you've talked about them, and I think I remember things about Laura and Rose too, later on.

[Kylix]

I read these books when I was younger...I don't remember many of the specifics (like those two scenes) but I do remember that the family did use physical punishment, in fact I can think of a specific instance. So maybe they co-slept and didn't want to be separate from their young baby (those two things were NORMAL during the time period that the books are set...not so commonplace now though unfortunately...) but they didn't exactly use gentle discipline which I think is integral to AP. They're good books though.

Kylix

[Mallory]

My grandmother was born in the 20's on the prairie (western Kansas) and the youngest children always slept with someone else BUT I think the real reason was that it got cold and without central heat a 1 year old really can't sleep alone. You remember how they played on the frost on the inside of the windows? Brrrr. Yeah for central heat.

[marymom]

Maybe more like the continuum concepts?
Iloved the set but I dont think they are purist AP stuff- too much be a big girl and dont cry stuff- not that Im criticizing it or them for that, like I said I loved the books, I just wouldnt categorize them as APers...
and in the later books about her husband's childhood dont the parents go break a switch off the tree to whip the kids with?

[merpk]

It's been too long since I read the books, would love to review them & answer your question ...

But in the TV series (I know, I'll duck now ... ) one thing that cracks me up is a scene with a new baby (the boy that died, early in the series) where Ma had bottles for the baby.

Or maybe they did use bottles on the prairie???

- Amy

[flutemandolin]

Yes, I agree it probably wasn't AP in the strictest sense, and I'm sure they didn't even have names for parenting styles! Most of the discipline I've read (And I haven't picked up Farmer Boy, about Almanzo's childhood yet--that may have been different) seems fairly gentle and consequence-oriented. For example, when the family goes swimming in the creek Laura disobeys and goes out too far. Pa gives her a scare by swimming underwater and pulling on her foot, then explained why he had done that. But it didn't work too well, at least not for Laura, she kept going back!!! But she does seem to have been taught strongly to obey her parents. I think the natural consequences were generally far greater for disobeying back then, we're talking survival, and parents might have disciplined harshly out of fear for their childrens' lives. I don't know for sure, just a thought.

As for the TV show...yeah I think they took more than a few liberties with historical accuracy. And the landscape looks nothing like the area around Walnut Grove MN!

[oceanmommy]

You are all making me nostalgic for those stories (and the show). I was a HUGE LH/LIW fan when I was younger, and I am truly looking forward to sharing them with my DD when she is older.

As far as the AP question... I immeadiately thought of how beds were shared (with the baby and between sisters). Yup I am sure it was really cold ! Plus they didn't have a lot of room.... Baby Carrie couldn't have had her own room with a crib in that cool sod house (Plum Creek) even if they wanted her to. They all sure were tightly knit, very interdependent on one another. And they practised natural living... more natural than most of us ! (I like my toilet paper and my heat and my running water).

That thing about the bottles cracked me up ! Guess they felt the little house viewing audience just a wee bit too young to get a flash of Ma BFing ?

And I am *pretty* sure Ma cloth diapered


When I was a kid I would fantasize that Ma and Pa were MY parents.

[3girls1boy]

(first of all, can we please stop saying "AP" ? That makes it sound like a set of rules which have to be followed.)

Anyway, loved the books but hated the show. Michael Landon didn't even have whiskers!!

There are several references to sleeping. In the Big Woods, Laura and Mary had a trundle bed which pulled out from under Ma and Pa's bed. In the Prarie, mention is made of Carrie sleeping in the same bed with the parents. And later, on the shores of Silver Lake, Pa gets a big shipping box that they use for Grace's trundle bed.

There is a scene in Little House on the Prairie, where there is a storm and Ma is waiting up late for Pa to come back from his trip to town. Laura describes seeing Ma pick up sleeping Baby Carrie out of bed. She sits up in the rocking chair with the baby in her arms, waiting for Pa. It is so touching that the sleeping baby is such a comfort to her when she is so worried.

Also, in On the Banks of Plum Creek, Laura plays in the flooded stream when Pa has told her not to. After that, he tells her because he can't trust her, she will have to spend the next few days with Ma, so Ma can keep an eye on her. Having to stay inside and do chores is a worse punishment for Laura than anything else.

But, there is also talk of how Laura and Mary (at about 6 and 8) have to mind Carrie while Ma is busy at work.

[lisamarie]

I LOVED those books growing up and my ds and I have just begun reading "Little House in the Big Woods". As 3girls1boy said, in this book (and I think throughout Laura and Mary's childhood/teenage years) Laura and Mary always slept together. And then if I'm remembering correctly, after Carrie and Grace were older, didn't they slept together too???

Great Thread!

Warmly~

Lisa

[Mallory]

I just keep thinking of this.

I think the difference is that 200 years ago you slept with your children and nursed them because clearly not doing that would endanger thier lives.
And as AP/continuum minded parents we realize, that throghout the history of humans, infants and toddler expect these things, and even though we can now not only keep a child alive by artificial milk and heated bedrooms they can grow well. We believe that by keeping things as close as possible to what our newborns expect then we are giving them the best start.

I do think that an important part of "AP" is really treasureing and liking your children and I do think Pa and Ma do enjoy thier children as the growing little people they are.