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Sexism and our daughers

post #1 of 37
Thread Starter 
Fresh start? Please discuss.

Mothers of sons are welcome to chime in but may find more relevance in this thread: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=270920
post #2 of 37
Good idea, but unfortunately I should make an attaempt to get some work done today! Be back later.
post #3 of 37
: I can't help it... :

Back to the feminist board I go....
post #4 of 37
It's hard to discuss sexism as a woman with the "feminists" looking down on you all the time.

I'm with the boys' moms, women are just as mean to women as men are.
post #5 of 37
By the way- my internet went down this afternoon, which is why i stopped posting.
post #6 of 37
never mind, not worth it.
Please, those with daughters discuss sexism and girls.
post #7 of 37
I thought cmb had good points and expressed herself well. It makes me sad that discussing girls and women is such a loaded subject matter.
post #8 of 37
Yeah that.

I am very hesitant to post on this thread after the previous misunderstandings and allegations of man-hating. And I'm sad about that, because this is a subject I'd very much like to discuss.
post #9 of 37
Women are just as much to blame for sexism as men? I need an explanation for that one.

Although I'm not sure I'm interested in a conversation that starts with someone putting the word 'feminist' in quotes.

Sad.
post #10 of 37
The problem is the idea that the "isms" depend on individual people being nice or mean to each other. Sexism and racism don't orginate at the individual level and sexism have little to do with how a particular man (or woman) treats the women s/he knows.

When a woman tells a little boy on the playground not to be a sissy, she is teaching him NOT to be like a girl because being like a girl is a bad thing. It does harm the boy, but it is really about femininty being viewed negatively. THAT (the debasement of femininity) is the problem. If being "girlie" wasn't bad, boys could be girlie without facing reproach (like how girls can be boyish without facing reproach). Sexism is operating through the woman because she, like most of us, has internalized sexist norms that make femininity something bad. The problem doesn't lie with individual men and women though we need to fight it, at least in part, at the level of individuals.
post #11 of 37


"Patriarchy Hurts Men Too", but that doesn't negate the fact that it's the men who are in power in a patriarchy.
post #12 of 37
Wow, I am actually disappointed in this thread. I expected some lively conversation and instead I see people afraid to talk and the word feminism used as though it were a bad thing.

I think girlndocs pretty much hit it there. Patriarchy does hurt men. It limits their choices and binds them to stereotypes and represses things that aren't manly enough. BUT, it is still better to be male under that system than female. We should strive for a world that values all of us.
post #13 of 37
boy, I sure missed some stuff huh.

gonna go try to make sense of why on earth discussing sexism and our kids has been gender segregated here!
post #14 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEAK's Mom
Wow, I am actually disappointed in this thread. I expected some lively conversation and instead I see people afraid to talk and the word feminism used as though it were a bad thing.
True true. I was going to address the idea in the other thread that we can help our daughters avoid sexism by teaching them how to dress appropriately (i.e. cover thier bodies), but then I decided I couldn't take that discussion . . .
post #15 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamawanabe
True true. I was going to address the idea in the other thread that we can help our daughters avoid sexism by teaching them how to dress appropriately (i.e. cover thier bodies), but then I decided I couldn't take that discussion . . .
mamawanabe, on the one hand you say you don't want this discussion, yet on the other, you did put this out there and I feel compelled to respond.

sexism is not about our bodies and it is not about how we dress. I plan to make sure my daughter knows that certain people might treat her differently based on what she wears, but also, that that isabout them, not about her.

The approach that we can avoid sexism by covering our bodies teaches us that our bodies are the problem, and also, being covered is no protection, actually.

WHat has to be changed is how men treat women, how men are socialized to treat women, how the society as a whole (men and women) accept and support this stuff. How women and girls dress is not the problem and if we treat it like it is, it places the blame back upon us.
post #16 of 37
Is there a feminism board discussion on this topic? I can't find a feminism board so I am puzzled.
post #17 of 37
imagine a grass-roots movement dedicated to changing the public image of women presented in the media, what would be the first thing you would do?

Public images to change:

laundry detergent commercials
fashion magazines
"women's" magazines
Advertising

HOw to do this? Create a movement to boycott the magazines? Boycott the products of the advertising?

Change all middle schools to all girl schools through High school...make a huge movement to get equal pay for equal work.

I am mos def a Feminist and I'm proud of it - wassup with y'all. Lets fight the good fight!
post #18 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by sadie_sabot
sexism is not about our bodies and it is not about how we dress. I plan to make sure my daughter knows that certain people might treat her differently based on what she wears, but also, that that isabout them, not about her.
Thank you!!!

post #19 of 37
Hey,

Busy day yesterday, couldn't post.

I put "feminist" is quotes because I feel that as a woman who beleives in women's rights I am a feminist. However, in many conversations regarding gender issues it's easy to have women who feel more enlightened that I am jump down my throat for not being feminist enough.

For example- all people get a reaction based on what they wear- men and women. Teaching my kids how to dress to modulate how people see them is not bad IMO- it's life.

Yes I suppose electing women to more offices, mchanging the school system, reorganiozing American culture woulod all help address the issue of mysogyny and sexism- however, none of those things are particularly useful for me in terms of parenting my kid today.

Of course it's great for my dd to see me battling sexism in various ways, but non of that will make her feel any better when some teenage boy calls her fat-ass or tells her that girls' vaginas stink.

So I reserve the right to put "quotes" around the term "feminist" that applies to anyone who makes other women feel bad for expressing their real life concerns.

This is not a thread about activism, it's about parenting. There is overlap, but they are not one and the same.
post #20 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommyofshmoo
This is not a thread about activism, it's about parenting. There is overlap, but they are not one and the same.
That mommyofshmoo, is exactly where my "problem" lies. For me, it IS all one and the same. Always and All ways.
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