Support for Parents of Gifted Children, #4 - Page 2

[ChristaN]

Dd#1 realised recently that people eat meat (we don't and she hasnt come into contact with it, and I've purposely steered her from realising due to all her issues and intense anxieties over death and growing up) Now she wants to start a 'campaign' to stop people 'everywhere' from ever eating animals. Yesterday she lectured us in the car about how it was 'just wrong and mean'.

She sounds a lot like my older dd. I think that mine has finally gotten to the point where she is able to let other people make their own decisions even if she doesn't agree with them, but it was really hard last year. It is hard for kids to understand why everyone doesn't think about the same things that they do and view them the same way.

[The Lucky One]

Hi ladies! I hope you don't mind my intrusion, I never can keep up with these 'buddy group' type longish threads, so I rarely post on them, but I do read, so I am familiar with most of you and your children. Enough so to know that many of you are dealing with perfectionism issues and sensitivity issues with your gifted children. Would it be too much trouble for you to look at my thread over in the gentle discipline forum and give your thoughts? I would very much appreciate your opinions since some of you may be able to relate.

TIA!

[mamamillie]

Hi mamas, hope no one minds my signing on to this thread. I saw the title and came in to read, wanting to post about this:

I have a question, totally unrelated. Do any of your extended family act weird about your dc's giftedness?

So I am glad someone has already brought it up. DS is 3 and he is obviously gifted verbally. This became apparent quite early, as he was speaking a few single words by 6 months and 3 word sentences (as well as recognizing some words) at a year. He was speaking words before he could sit up, sentences before he could walk, and yeah, reading well long before he used the potty :LOL
The problem I have is how the extended family shows him off at get togethers, constantly drills or tests him (Can you read this? What does this say?) He feels pressured and awkward in these situations. It has been going on for some time...I started cringing when he first learned his letters and his grandma held him at the fridge and invited every single guest at her party to come and see that he knew his letters. This whole thing bothers me particularly because I feel like ds is learning from it that he is special because he can read or whatever and not that he is special simply because he is, iykwim. For the most part I have bit my tongue, although there was one time when my b-i-l was visiting and had a large group of his friends over and they were all crowded around ds w a road atlas making him read the state names (I think he was right about 2 when this occurred). This episode was over the top and I was seriously offended, as it felt to me that they were treating him like some kind of circus freak! I pretty much went off on b-i-l over this. But the behavior (to a less extreme degree) persists from all of them. Recently, while visiting my parents, ds asked my dad to read him a story, and my dad refused and coerced ds into reading it to him instead...apparently because he can read himself, he is no longer allowed to enjoy having someone else read to him? I will stop ranting now, but I would love to know how you all have handled this kind of treatment of your dc.
Millie

[oldcrunchymom]

Hi Millie and welcome to the thread. This hasn't been an issue with my kids, but if I were you I would definitely say something. If you don't, the relatives will think their behavior is okay and it will probably get worse. If you aren't confrontational, maybe you could write a letter instead?

[allgirls]

hi ladies...love reading about your fascinating children...I was wondering if any of you saw the Ellen Degeneres show which had Brittany Murpy on who was saying words at 4.5 mos old and Dr. Bob Sears(son of William and Martha) were on and basically said it was impossible until 8-12mos for babies to speak words. I know it isn't true..Sophia could sign milk at 5mos and had several words at 6 and I know some of you with profoundly gifted children had words younger than 4mos.

Just curious as to your thoughts on this

[luvmypoonchkie]

Brittany Murphy the actress??? Trust me, I've seen interviews with the girl, if she was speaking at 4.5 months it wasn't due to profound giftedness, maybe Williams syndrome.

[isisjade]

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[mamamillie]

Well, we all know that "experts" and doctors are often wrong! I am positive it is possible for babies to speak much earlier than 8 mos, because mine did.
I am not certain that I am remembering correctly, but I would say he had more than 10 words before 8 mos. That isn't counting words he echoed but wasn't using (I remember clearly he said "monkey" clear as day at 7 months, but he just repeated it, didn't use it again.
I also saw someone post something said by an "expert" recently stating that it is impossible for children to read well before six years old because their eye muscles aren't sufficiently developed for tracking words on the page. Maybe these statements are true for some children or even maybe most children, but there are absolutely exceptions...although I will say that this eye tracking muscle thing must be a factor in reading as I have noticed it w my ds. He was able to read ANY word for a long time before he was able to read even simple sentences and still now will not read a book w too many words on a page...he can read complicated text and extremely long words in picture books or whatever where there are a few sentences on a page but won't read simplistic text like in early readers, if there are too many sentences on the same page.

[eilonwy]

Originally Posted by allgirls

hi ladies...love reading about your fascinating children...I was wondering if any of you saw the Ellen Degeneres show which had Brittany Murpy on who was saying words at 4.5 mos old and Dr. Bob Sears(son of William and Martha) were on and basically said it was impossible until 8-12mos for babies to speak words. I know it isn't true..Sophia could sign milk at 5mos and had several words at 6 and I know some of you with profoundly gifted children had words younger than 4mos.

Just curious as to your thoughts on this

My thoughts: :LOL :

Okay. Now to be serious. People have told me all sorts of things about my childhood are "impossible." For example, I've been told many times that it's not possible to remember events that happened before you a)learn to read, b)learn to speak well or c) are almost four years old. I have very clear memory from 18 months on; I was speaking well by then, but not yet reading and obviously not anywhere near four. I've been told that it's not physically possible to speak before the age of 12 months. Well, it makes sense to say that the mechanics of adult speech cannot be fully developed before 12 months, but to make the leap and say that it's not possible to speak at all strikes me as ridiculous. Both of my kids said words long before 12 months. BooBah doesn't talk nearly as much or as clearly as her brother did, but she's got quite a few words. It definately happens.

[oldcrunchymom]

Yeah, someone on another thread said they learned in a class that kids couldn't read before certain sections of the brain bridged (sorry, can't remember the details but if you check my recent posts you'll find it) at age 6 or so. Obviously not true, as there are many kids on this thread who learned to read at ages 2 and 3. I've heard similar arbitrary things about physical milestones and talking, etc. Someone once told me my daughter (as she was toddling across the room!!) "couldn't" be walking at 8 months because she hadn't reached X number of pounds yet. Um, whatever. Frankly I think people just like to spout BS as gospel truth because it makes them sound important and knowledgable.

[NoHiddenFees]

Originally Posted by lckrause

I've heard similar arbitrary things about physical milestones and talking, etc.

A great part of the expectations placed on children is cultural, and it's amazing how many peer reviewed studies manage to "find" an innate and neurological basis for what conveniently happens to be the cultural norm. I recently read an article about the "proof" that most children couldn't understand place value -- apparently irrespective of how it is taught -- until something like 4th grade. Bollocks. Place value is routinely taught to and understood by 6 and 7 year olds in many (if not most) Asian countries.

[allgirls]

Originally Posted by luvmypoonchkie

Brittany Murphy the actress??? Trust me, I've seen interviews with the girl, if she was speaking at 4.5 months it wasn't due to profound giftedness, maybe Williams syndrome.

My thoughts too however early talking is a sign of giftedness but not necessarily proof and some gifted people get real good at hiding it...if that's what it is she is a genius at it

[LeftField]

Originally Posted by allgirls

My thoughts too however early talking is a sign of giftedness but not necessarily proof and some gifted people get real good at hiding it...if that's what it is she is a genius at it

Is early talking a sign of giftedness though? I thought speech was an unreliable sign. I thought I had read that some early talkers are gifted, but some are not. Some late talkers are gifted, but some are not. Of course, I guess we'd have to define "early" and what actually constitutes talking. Does anyone know?

[loraxc]

Did Sears actually give any physical or neurological REASONS for his statement? We all know babies can make noises with intentionality very early on--it just seems silly to say that yes, they can intentionally blow raspberries but not intentionally say "cat."

DD said her first word at 8 months, and added quite a few more soon thereafter. Anyone who tried to tell me that babies can't talk till 12 months would have had me laughing my head off--I think she was saying at least 30 words at 11 months...

[luvmypoonchkie]

No Hidden Fees,

Hi, I took a peek at your pictures (your girls are dolls by the way) and noticed the one of your oldest in her martial arts uniform. I was thinking about signing Sam up and was wondering if you wouldn't mind answering a couple of questions.

Eventhough we're going to homeschool we've been debating a great play-based preschool nearby for a couple of days a week (2 hour classes) in the fall. Sam's a great kid and he's very social but I thought it would be nice for him to be able to go somewhere for a change of scenery and to play with other kids without me lurking nearby, KWIM? I'd also like him to be able to practice his listening/following directions skills with someone else for a change to see how he does when the direction is not coming from me. Anyway, I also thought martial arts would be great for this too and it would have the added benefit of being able to get some physical energy out as well as be something new and challenging to learn (which preschool can't offer). There's a great facility just around the corner that does classes for 3 and 4 year olds and we're going to check it out tonight.

Anyway, here's my questions:

-Overall, does your dd enjoy the classes and are they a challenge physically for her and the other 3 year olds?

-Martial arts is supposed to be good for developing a sense of respect as well as good listening skills, have you found this to be the case?

-Have you found any other benefits that you didn't expect?

-Is there anything you don't like about the classes?

This is of course open to anyone who's had their child involved in these type of classes and I'm open to all kinds of feedback.

Thanks so much in advance, I look forward to getting your response!

Jenn

[NoHiddenFees]

She's only been going a couple weeks, so take this with a grain of salt. She's in a twice a week 7 and under homeschool Taekwondo class that's kept fun and non-competetive. So far there's no kids over 5. A friend comes along who is much more competetive and coordinated than DD1 and she is a motivating factor all by herself.

It is definitely physically challenging, but the kids are not pushed to do what they cannot, KWIM? Obviously the older kids are capable of more, and that's not a big deal. I actually prefer the mixed age group because DD1 gets the message that it's OK if someone else can do something you can't, and it's OK to try and fail... jsut like the kid next to you.

We're working more on the active listening than the respect aspect. I don't expect her to say "yes, Mother" all the time, but I explain to DD that when she acknowledges people, it shows she's listening. I do talk actively about respect wrt to bowing (you're entering their house and must obey their rules).

We haven't been going long enough to discover unexpected benefits.

The only thing I'm hesitant about it the "good citizen" reporting. In our family, we don't keep tallies. However, I've decided to let it be DD's book, and DD's record... I'll just help her fill it out. She was also told when her belt was presented that it could be taken away for inappropriate behavior (we're talking something major here... not at a whim), but those are the rules.

[allgirls]

Originally Posted by LeftField

Is early talking a sign of giftedness though? I thought speech was an unreliable sign. I thought I had read that some early talkers are gifted, but some are not. Some late talkers are gifted, but some are not. Of course, I guess we'd have to define "early" and what actually constitutes talking. Does anyone know?

I think alone it is not a reliable sign however if you have that plus a whole bunch of the other traits then in hindsight you could see it as a possible sign I guess.

[allgirls]

Originally Posted by loraxc

Did Sears actually give any physical or neurological REASONS for his statement? We all know babies can make noises with intentionality very early on--it just seems silly to say that yes, they can intentionally blow raspberries but not intentionally say "cat."

DD said her first word at 8 months, and added quite a few more soon thereafter. Anyone who tried to tell me that babies can't talk till 12 months would have had me laughing my head off--I think she was saying at least 30 words at 11 months...

I think he basically said they just don't have the brain development for it and also the physical ability. He said if they make a sound that sounds like a word they are just saying a sound and don't really know what it means.

He didn't go into a lot of detail but said he had never seen it in his practice...well if he were my daughter's dr. he wouldn't have seen it...she only now at almost 22 months really talks to anyone other than us. She was very introverted but seems to be getting much more social as she matures.

[Foobar]

Moo is up to 7 words. They are NOT clear. For example her name comes out clearly,but daddy is "da dee" (not bad). Duck and dog are clear. Mommy or momma is not one of her words.
She just turned 10 months and she's been able to understand the words for a while, but it has taken her some time to get her mouth to work with it.

[eilonwy]

The more I hear that, the more I wonder how many people just aren't listening to babies speak. My babies did, my niece did (not the younger, she barely spoke at all until she was three), my siblings... I have the impression that many other babies do, but their parents or caregivers just don't understand them. I can remember hearing a baby about 9 months old say "gimme the toy!" and wondering why his mother said he couldn't talk. I understood him just fine. It wasn't the clearest speech I've ever heard, but it was definately English, you know?

Like I said, BooBah doesn't talk nearly as much as her brother did (a younger child thing, perhaps?) but she's got plenty of words which are very clear, and she makes it very obvious that she understands a heck of a lot more than she can say. I still haven't gotten her to sign anything, she's much rather attempt the words. :LOL

Speaking of which, if a baby can't talk, does that mean they can't sign, either? Lots and lots of babies learn to sign before they can say the words out loud, and if you think they don't know that the sign for milk will get them a nursie... :LOL