What to do with formula samples? - Page 5

[sapphire_chan]

Originally Posted by annettemarie

But studies have shown just the opposite- formula companies market more aggressively to women who indicate they are planning to breastfeed, and having formula samples available in the home can interfere with the breastfeeding relationship.

Ooo, a mission in life! I'll write all the formula companies and tell them I'm going to breastfeed, and then they'll direct their attentions to me and leave the people who are uncertain alone.

I do know my cousin who'd been bfing in the hospital (latched on right away, may we all be so lucky in our future/current nursing relationships) got sent home with a bunch of samples. She was supposed to be sent home with the bfing pack.

[sapphire_chan]

Low on protein?

[stafl]

Originally Posted by sapphire_chan

I do know my cousin who'd been bfing in the hospital (latched on right away, may we all be so lucky in our future/current nursing relationships) got sent home with a bunch of samples. She was supposed to be sent home with the bfing pack.

That is the breastfeeding pack. It's paid for by a formula company (take your pick, they all do it) and the sole purpose is to undermine the breastfeeding mother's confidence and milk supply. It's very tricky, and underhanded, and it sells formula or the formula companies wouldn't do it.

[tayndrewsmama]

Originally Posted by stafl

That is the breastfeeding pack. It's paid for by a formula company (take your pick, they all do it) and the sole purpose is to undermine the breastfeeding mother's confidence and milk supply. It's very tricky, and underhanded, and it sells formula or the formula companies wouldn't do it.

I am not so sure that's entirely true everywhere. I got a diaper bag with a couple of freezer packs, another little padded pack for putting milk in it and a changing pad. No samples or coupons in the ones I got. They did all say Enfamil on them though.

[mommytolittlelilly]

Originally Posted by stafl

I can't disagree with you more! If a woman is having difficulties breastfeeding, if her baby isn't gaining enough weight on breastmilk alone, giving just one bottle of formula can make it near impossible for her to breastfeed that baby! I know, I was that woman. It took two months of pumping at least 8 times every day to get my milk supply back. That is not something just anyone would want to or is able to do to save the nursing relationship, and I can't blame them for that. Some women just don't know any better than to follow everyone's advice, "go ahead and give him a bottle of formula at night, he'll sleep better" or "it won't hurt anything to give that baby some formula every now and then" when the exact opposite is true! ONE bottle can totally undermine breastfeeding. ONE bottle can lead to nipple preference or a bad latch. Without adequate support or information, most women cannot make breastfeeding work in those situations.

And again, I'm agreeing with AnnetteMarie. Formula companies give those samples out for the sole purpose of undermining the breastfeeding relationship. If it didn't work, they wouldn't do it. Giving those samples to an unsuspecting new mom is the same as helping the formula companies make more money. I vote for throwing the stuff away, and I'm not ashamed or afraid to say so.

And I can't disagree with you more. I think women are smart enough to make their own decisions about whether or not they want to breastfeed, and how far they can and want to go to make that happen.

For me, I had always envisioned formula feeding, well before I ever got pregnant. I was formula fed myself, and I didn't know anyone who had breastfed. It's not a fate worse than death by the way. I was totally opposed to breastfeeding because I didn't know anything about it and my husband kept bugging me about how I should do it. But when I got pregnant, I read all about breastfeeding and decided to do it on the basis of the benefits to my baby. So I knew all about the law of supply and demand because I did a little research beforehand. There was also an LC group at the hospital I gave birth at. They were a tremendous resource for me. With my own research and the help of these women at the hospital, I was able to breastfeed successfully without supplementation.

I still signed up for all of the formula samples and the coupons I could possibly get while I was pregnant in case it didn't work out. I could care less if the formula companies have my information. I got more than 3 whole pallets of the stuff. I was thrilled to be able to give this food away to people who need it.

To me this whole argument reminds me of people in 2000 who had to "vote their conscience" with Nader. It's easy to dump out a bunch of food as a protest when you don't need that food.

[annettemarie]

Well then. Just... wow. I don't know what to say. We are at fundamentally

And I can't disagree with you more. I think women are smart enough to make their own decisions about whether or not they want to breastfeed, and how far they can and want to go to make that happen.

Heck, why advocate at all then. Breastfeeding vs formula feeding is more than just a simple matter of choice. It is a health concern, and one that is doubly important because an innocent baby will be effected for the rest of her life. is not like choosing what brand of car seat to buy, or whether to use cloth or disposable diapers. It is more along the lines of telling women that drinking when they are pregnant, or smoking around the baby have serious health risks.

I still signed up for all of the formula samples and the coupons I could possibly get while I was pregnant in case it didn't work out. I could care less if the formula companies have my information. I got more than 3 whole pallets of the stuff. I was thrilled to be able to give this food away to people who need it.

You were lucky that you didn't use it. Statistically, because it's there, many women do end up using the "free" samples of formula.

To me this whole argument reminds me of people in 2000 who had to "vote their conscience" with Nader. It's easy to dump out a bunch of food as a protest when you don't need that food.

Some things are a matter of conscience. Life is not about getting as much free crap as you can, just because you can. Sometimes, we need to take a stand.

[WickidaWitch]

Originally Posted by annettemarie

You were lucky that you didn't use it. Statistically, because it's there, many women do end up using the "free" samples of formula.

Very true!!!
If I didnt have free formula in my house with my son (now 4) he wouldnt have gotten any for sure when he was a small babe and maybe when he started biting and wouldnt stop around 10m I wouldnt have given him those all bottles of formula I did becuse the thought of getting bitten made me crazy. Maybe I would have tried harder to get him to stop biting?? Instead I gave him the formula because it was there and he didnt care what it was so long as his belly was full.
With dd (17m now), I tried a few times to give her a bottle. Formula because it was here and free and pumped breastmilk. She would only take from the tap!!! Wanted nothing to do with the bottle.

(Wanted to note that I have no problem with formula or people who use it)

[mommytolittlelilly]

Originally Posted by annettemarie

Heck, why advocate at all then. Breastfeeding vs formula feeding is more than just a simple matter of choice. It is a health concern, and one that is doubly important because an innocent baby will be effected for the rest of her life. is not like choosing what brand of car seat to buy, or whether to use cloth or disposable diapers. It is more along the lines of telling women that drinking when they are pregnant, or smoking around the baby have serious health risks.


You were lucky that you didn't use it. Statistically, because it's there, many women do end up using the "free" samples of formula.


Some things are a matter of conscience. Life is not about getting as much free crap as you can, just because you can. Sometimes, we need to take a stand.

Well, I myself don't like being preached to about doing anything, particularly as it pertains to my body. If I had people coming up to me with a militant stance about breastfeeding, I would respond negatively to that. As a mom, I WANT to have more choices and options, not less. I'll do the research, and decide for myself if I want to breastfeed or FF.

I'm not going to do any searches for statistics. As for your statistics on the samples, I just have to think there's a lot more going on than what's accounted for there. Such as, accounting for what resources new moms have. Can they take some time off work, enough for a good BF relationship to be developed. Do they have the income to be able to take time off work and still pay for decent food, diapers, and other essentials. Do they have support from a partner or family for household managment. Do they have healthcare resources for mom and baby. All of this is CRITICAL to BF success, not simply whether women have formula in the house already.

Fighting for equitable healthcare and workers' rights is the area I choose to direct my activist energies, not in throwing food away. My conscience tells me it's wrong to waste food that other people can use.

[annettemarie]

Well, I myself don't like being preached to about doing anything, particularly as it pertains to my body. If I had people coming up to me with a militant stance about breastfeeding, I would respond negatively to that. As a mom, I WANT to have more choices and options, not less. I'll do the research, and decide for myself if I want to breastfeed or FF.

How is it militant to share the simple fact that breastfeeding is the norm and that formula feeding has inherent health risks? If someone came up to you and said "You must put your child in a car seat" would you not put your child in a car seat just because you disliked their preachy tone? And yes, it's your body. It's also your baby's body.

All of this is CRITICAL to BF success, not simply whether women have formula in the house already.

Of course there is more to it than JUST formula samples, but formula samples are a contributing factor. Whether you believe it or not, they really are.

I was not getting samples for the hell of it. I was getting them in case I needed them. My conscience tells me it's wrong to waste food that other people can use.

Like in case your breasts fell off?

[Momtwice]

Originally Posted by tayndrewsmama

I am not so sure that's entirely true everywhere. I got a diaper bag with a couple of freezer packs, another little padded pack for putting milk in it and a changing pad. No samples or coupons in the ones I got. They did all say Enfamil on them though.

And you remember the name Enfamil, which is just what the company wanted. With soft, warm, fuzzy feelings they hope, like the ones evoked by the gentle music in a certain company's formula commercials.

[Momtwice]

Originally Posted by mommytolittlelilly

To me this whole argument reminds me of people in 2000 who had to "vote their conscience" with Nader. It's easy to dump out a bunch of food as a protest when you don't need that food.

http://mothering.com/discussions/sho...d.php?t=194893

Breastfeeding boards: what we are about by Raven (mod)

bold emphasis mine

Mothering Magazine supports and advocates Breastfeeding and all the benefits to both mother and child that result from breastfeeding. As an extension of Mothering Magazing, MotheringDotCommune (MDC) upholds this as an integral part of its community purpose. MDC is a platform for SUPPORT and ADVOCACY to mothers and babies who are passionate about their right to breastfeed. As such it is a valuable and safe place for those who seek advice, support, and action when it comes to the many challenges, obstacles, and societal conditions they experience as breastfeeding mothers.

Members who formula feed out of necessity should not take posts critical of formula feeding personally. Members are reminded to post within the parameters of the User Agreement and refrain from personal attacks. If you feel concern about a post or discussion, please contact the moderator of the forum.

It must be clear that although we certainly do not encourage formula use we do support mothers who are doing the best they can for their children. It is very possible to find oneself compelled to use formula due to personal or family circumstances; such a mother can still be a Lactivist while seeking out support and information for her child's nutritional needs from the MDC community.

[mommytolittlelilly]

Originally Posted by annettemarie

How is it militant to share the simple fact that breastfeeding is the norm and that formula feeding has inherent health risks? If someone came up to you and said "You must put your child in a car seat" would you not put your child in a car seat just because you disliked their preachy tone? And yes, it's your body. It's also your baby's body. ?

It sounds about as militant and preachy as I could imagine. Equating non-use of the car seat to FF is inappropriate.


Of course there is more to it than JUST formula samples, but formula samples are a contributing factor. Whether you believe it or not, they really are.


Well you're not mentioning any of those other factors, are you? If I were to go with what you're saying in this thread, everyone would suddenly be breastfeeding if it weren't for those darned formula samples.


Like in case your breasts fell off?[/QUOTE]



Yes, I got the samples in case my breasts fell off

[mommytolittlelilly]

Originally Posted by Momtwice

http://mothering.com/discussions/sho...d.php?t=194893

Breastfeeding boards: what we are about by Raven (mod)

bold emphasis mine

So what's your point here? That I don't support breastfeeding? You could not possibly be more wrong. Maybe I don't fit your mold of what a BF advocate should be. What I don't support is people throwing out food that other people could use.

[annettemarie]

You may want to familiarize yourself with how to use the quote feature. It is difficult to read and make sense of your responses.

[annettemarie]

It sounds about as militant and preachy as I could imagine.

Saying that breastfeeding is the norm (or "best" if you will) and the formula feeding has health hazards is preachy and militant? Well, dang, then, even the formula companies are militant breastfeeding advocates.

Equating non-use of the car seat to FF is inappropriate.

Why? Are they not both health and safety concerns?

Well you're not mentioning any of those other factors, are you? If I were to go with what you're saying in this thread, everyone would suddenly be breastfeeding if it weren't for those darned formula samples.

Actually, you have completely misrepresented me. No where did I say formula samples were the sole cause of breastfeeding failure. I said they were a contributing factor. I didn't mention the other factors because they aren't what this thread is about. If you check the title, the thread is "what to do with formula samples" which should sufficiently explain why I am only mentioning formula samples.

[OnTheFence]

Originally Posted by annettemarie

But studies have shown just the opposite- formula companies market more aggressively to women who indicate they are planning to breastfeed, and having formula samples available in the home can interfere with the breastfeeding relationship.

I would like to read these studies, links please?

[twopeasinpod]

They sent us home with a CASE of little nutramigen bottles for our bf'd twins, after berating us for not supplementing repeatedly.

We used them for baby animals on the farm. baaaa.

The world commiserates on substituting breastmilk. (PDF)

[Momtwice]

Originally Posted by OnTheFence

I would like to read these studies, links please?

Here are two from the American Academy of Pediatrics policy paper
"Breastfeeding and the Use of Human milk"

Howard CR, Howard FM, Weitzman ML Infant formula distribution and advertising in pregnancy: a hospital survey. Birth. 1994; 21:14-19 [Medline]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...&dopt=Abstract

Howard FM, Howard CR, Weitzman ML The physician as advertiser: the unintentional discouragement of breast-feeding. Obstet Gynecol. 1993; 81:1048-1051 [Abstract]
http://www.greenjournal.org/cgi/cont...ract/81/6/1048

[annettemarie]

Articles for general knowledge
http://www.salon.com/mwt/feature/199...ula/index.html
http://www.zipmall.com/bab-bott.htm

Secondary Sources
http://www.4woman.gov/editor/Aug03/aug03.htm

Formula Industry Advertising - There is always free cheese in a mouse trap. Free samples of infant formula, coupons, and hospital discharge packs are pervasive in the United States. Pregnant women and new mothers are bombarded by industry advertising on TV, in popular magazines, at the grocery store, at the doctor's office, and in the mail. Usually there is a disclaimer that breastfeeding is the preferred infant feeding method, but most authorities agree the disclaimer does not balance the impact of the advertising. A study reported in the March 2000 Public Relations and Marketing News, found that women exposed to commercial information about formula were five times more likely to stop breastfeeding before they even left the hospital.

http://www.breastfeeding.com/reading...marketing.html

Researchers from the University of Rochester School of Medicine randomly distributed commercial formula marketing materials or non-commercial breastfeeding materials to 444 women who were at their doctors� offices for prenatal visits. Researchers then followed up with the women at 2, 6, 12 and 24 weeks postpartum.

A study published in the February issue of Obstetrics & Gynecology revealed the researchers� findings. Among the women who received free formula samples and other commercial materials, there was a five-fold increase in the number of women who quit breastfeeding while still in the hospital. Also among the women who received the commercial packs, there was also a two-fold increase in the amount of women who quit within the first two weeks after birth. The researchers found that in the long-term, there was no difference in breastfeeding duration among the two groups of women.

http://www.compleatmother.com/study.htm

Breast-feeding cessation in the early peripartum period was significantly higher in women exposed to the commercial intervention. For every 100 women exposed prenatally to commercial materials in this study, six women quit breast-feeding before hospital discharge because of that exposure (one out of every 17 women);

Abstracts of Actual Studies

The meta-analysis showed that when comparing commercial discharge packs with any of the controls (no intervention, non-commercial pack and combinations of these), exclusive breastfeeding was reduced at all time points in the presence of commercial hospital discharge packs.

http://www.breastfeedingtaskforla.or...arge-packs.htm

Breast-feeding initiation (relative risk [RR] 0.93, 95% confidence interval [CI] 0.61, 1.43) and duration after 2 weeks (hazard ratio 1.19, 95% CI 0.86, 1.64) were not affected. Women in the commercial group were more likely to cease breast-feeding before hospital discharge (RR 5.80, 95% CI 1.25, 54.01) and before 2 weeks (adjusted odds ratio [OR] 1.91, 95% CI 1.02, 3.55). In subgroup analyses, women with uncertain goals for breast-feeding or goals of 12 weeks or less experienced shortened exclusive (hazard ratio 1.53, 95% CI 1.06, 2.21), full (hazard ratio 1.70, 95% CI 1.18, 2.48), and overall (hazard ratio 1.75, 95% CI 1.16, 2.64) breast-feeding duration when exposed to the commercial intervention.

http://www.greenjournal.org/cgi/cont...tract/95/2/296

Additionally, Milk, Money, and Madness is an entire BOOK dedicated to the subject of breastfeeding and formula company tactics

[Momtwice]

America Academy of Family Physicians breastfeeding policy

AAFP Policy Statement on Breastfeeding

Breastfeeding is the physiological norm for both mothers and their children. The AAFP recommends that all babies, with rare exceptions, be breastfed and/or receive expressed human milk exclusively for about the first six months of life. .....

...General Recommendations For All Family Physicians
1. Breastfeeding promotion and education need to occur throughout the life cycle.
a. Provide accurate and appropriate breastfeeding information at all preventive health visits throughout the lifespan.
b. Provide accurate information about infant feeding during preconception and all prenatal visits.

2. Family physicians, whether or not they provide maternity care, should establish a breastfeeding-friendly office.17,20
a. Avoid the direct or implied endorsement of artificial baby milks (formula) by eliminating the distribution of samples and formula-company sponsored materials.11,12

http://www.aafp.org/x6633.xml