Brooke Shields/PPD on Oprah - Page 2

[applejuice]

Being so successful and glamourous all of these years with an image to hold up and hang on to, she was probably unbelievable pressured to be the perfect mother. Too bad. Life is so severe with some women, no one can have a hair out of place without someone writing about it.


Also with all of her $ I am sure she had hired help. So sad that even then she was depressed. How mcuh more must a woman be depressed who does not have the options that Brooke had?

[Tanibani]

Originally Posted by captain crunchy

Wow, I watched it and I was very impressed at how candid, and honest she was! I think she came across as very intelligent, very real, and didn't seem to hold anything back.

I am not a therapist at all, but after hearing about her birth experience, it is understandable to me why she suffered from PPD (though I know people who have great births can suffer too!)...

I think her experience will help a lot of women who (as mentioned) are too ashamed or embarrassed to put words to how they feel.

I TiVO'd it. I am also going to TiVO all the OPrah-After the Shows and see what the continuation dialogue will be (with the panel perhaps?)

My heart goes out to her... she was really put through the wringer.



She said that she wasn't over come by instant love for her baby at birth. She also said she thinks people lie about it (and there was laughter and applause in the audience.)

I didn't have PPD, but it was love at first sight with my 2 babies (one hospital birth, another home birth) either. Anybody else?

[ChasingPeace]

I agree that she was very courageous to do this. During the interview, I kept thinking "if someone hasn't gone through this, they're going to think she's horrible." There's just not enough public education about PPD. I remember being terrified of my "dark thoughts" before I got treatment for PPD. Fortunately, I never had thoughts of harming my son, but like Brooke, I would have visions of terrible things happening to him, and I also thought about death a lot. I felt like I couldn't tell anyone about it because I was afraid my ds would be taken from me. When I finally told my midwife, and she was totally nonplussed by it, I was so relieved! We really need this issue to come out in the open, and I really admire her for what she's doing.

I also want to point out that she tried many different meds before finding one that worked for her.

[JaneS]

I admire her greatly for being so honest and exposing herself like this. I'm sure it will help many women, and for that I'm grateful for her courage.

However, I think the fact that she has appeared in advertisements for formula contemptible.

Yes, formula does need to exist for those mothers and babies that truly need it. But the WHO code was developed for a reason... advertising formula as a "choice" makes it more likely for it to be used for convenience. And the more formula that is used, the poorer health our babies/children/adults have. Lending her celebrity cache to formula makes it an acceptable choice for mothers who might be better served with more support to BF instead. Not to mention the fact that PPD has been shown to be lower in BF'ing moms.

[OnTheFence]

Originally Posted by sistermama

This is pretty crappy, but I would imagine it has a fair amount to do with the money she is making.... kind of like the formula ad.....

That said, I did see her on Oprah today and thought she was pretty courageous to admit the things she did.

Not everything is about the $$$. I know that she has briefly talked about PPD in the past (before this book) for no $$$.

Also, do you think the regular woman brings this to the forefront? Not unless they murder their children -- unfortunately we need celebrity moms to be candid about it.

[JaneS]

Originally Posted by Tanibani

I didn't have PPD, but it was love at first sight with my 2 babies (one hospital birth, another home birth) either. Anybody else?

Did you mean to say "wasn't love at first sight?"

I'll admit to that. DS didn't sleep well at all, I had a traumatic hospital birth with lots of meds I didn't want, hemorraging after birth and hallucinations when I got home. I really connected with Brooke when she said permanent damage happens when mothers go through things like this.

[OnTheFence]

Originally Posted by CarrieMF

She switched to ff'ing becuase the meds she ended up on for the PPD were not compatable for bf'ing. I know someone will counter that with there are other meds out there, but I do not know specifically what med she was on and not every med will work for every person.

I am looking at taking a med that may or may not be compatible with breastfeeding, Lexapro. I have successfully breastfed three other children and will not begin taking it until my milk supply has been established -- my doctor thinks that will be a big positive for me since I am an experienced mom. However there is the risk that Lexapro will affect my milk supply and make my baby lethargic. I am going to play it by ear. I am a lot more comfortable with my mothering and myself that supplementing is not going to be the great horror I thought it once was. When we adopted, I would cry hysterically making Formula bottles -- I am over that. It's more important for me to be sane with four children, and enjoy them and my family life.
I have looked at other meds, and have taken other meds -- they were just too strong and didn't work for me, some I have looked at just are not that great for breastfeeding at all, so it seems like Lexapro is the best choice for now.

[OnTheFence]

Originally Posted by Tanibani

She said that she wasn't over come by instant love for her baby at birth. She also said she thinks people lie about it (and there was laughter and applause in the audience.)

I didn't have PPD, but it was love at first sight with my 2 babies (one hospital birth, another home birth) either. Anybody else?

I had all those thoughts and expectations like Brooke did (while I related so well to her whole story). I did not love my oldest child at first site. I felt distant and unsure and just really wanted to not be in pain anymore.
With my second child, I was ambivalent and hesitent. It was an adoption situation and I did have like a PPD -- which two OBs believe I had because I made myself lactate to nurse him. (once I quit breastfeeding all together, and had a "vacation" from my him, I bounced back to being non-crazy)
With my third child, I planned (like Brooke plans too) a csection, choose a really great staff and OB to treat me, lined up help, and took meds during the third trimester and after birth for PPD. I felt wonderful. I had a wonderful experience. And I fell in love with my son. It was instant. For the first time I felt comfortable to fall in love with a baby. I just melted right into him. He's three now, and our bond is so strong -- its unfortunate I don't have this with my other children even though I love them dearly.

[Tanibani]

Originally Posted by CarrieMF

She switched to ff'ing becuase the meds she ended up on for the PPD were not compatable for bf'ing. I know someone will counter that with there are other meds out there, but I do not know specifically what med she was on and not every med will work for every person.

More likely, is that she was never shown her options. I doubt very much her doctors went down the list (with Tom Hale's book) letting her know which drug would work best with breastfeeding. So I don't blame her for that. Women still wean because of meds (after Csec, whatever...) and that is simply because they are not self-educated about it (like us, which isn't their fault) and they don't have wise women (LLL friends, their own BFing mothers, girlfriends who have been there/done that, LCs...) with them.

Originally Posted by CarrieMF

Alot of women suffer from PPD due to these hard core militant bf'ing women who look down on, are rude and judgemental to other people's situation.

That's pretty shocking to me, because I don't know any militant B'fing women in real life.

I have 1 friend IRL whose incredibly high expecations (when it didn't match reality) sent her into a bad PPD immediately after birth... She ended up weaning shortly after (due to a lot of issues) and I never blamed her for it or anything. I just had lots of compassion for her (probably not so) unique (probably preventable ) situation. She was still a great mama.

Originally Posted by CarrieMF

She had a bad miscarriage, went through a horrific birth, suffered from severe PPD and subconsciously was asking for help but it was over a month before anyone else listened to her. Her thoughts on not wanting to be around her baby, on walking out, on the baby not living with her were poo-poo'd by her friends and family. IMO the key message anyone should get from watching Oprah and those who may read/borrow her book(or any other book on PPD) is for everyone to be on the watch for PPD to catch the signs before it turns into the next case of a mom killing her children.

Yup. And that's why her book is a great service. She is entitled to make $$$ but in this case, it's a very worthy cause. Her celebrity will bring great, much needed attention to this issue, so in this case, that's a good thing.

Originally Posted by CarrieMF

FF'ing vs BF'ing has no spot in this discussion.

Yes and no.

No, it's not relevant to this discussion. This thread is not the place to hang her high for doing the formula ad. Yes it was horrible for the cause, but she doesn't know any better!!! I just WISH she would read the MILK, MONEY & MADNESS book... or go to a LLLI conference or something. If she became self-educated, and didn't stand up for the right thing, THEN I'd be self-righteous about it.

Yes it is relevant... because when you start attacking 'militant BFers' who exactly is that? Everyone has their own definition and that needs to be cleared up. I'm not going to judge a mother who decides to wean earlier than 6 months (out of her own needs). But I do think BF advocacy is important. Some people think BF advocates (and people who nurse for 3 years - like me) are 'militant BFers.' See? That's why my back gets up.

Though I do think some posts on this thread were mean and insensitive. I chose to ignore the issue up to this point (because the Formula ads aren't relevant to the discussion.)

Originally Posted by CarrieMF

Once she got help she made a choice that was best for her and her child. It may not be the idea choice or the choice that another would make but it is still her choice to make. Being judgemental to someone does not give emotional support that new mothers(especially first time mothers) need. Supporting a mother in her choices helps to decrease their chance of PPD. When you are judgemental towards a person's choice you are pushing them and telling them what they are doing is wrong. You push that "ideal perfect mother" syndrome onto them and their confidence and self esteem lowers, they start thinking that everything they do is not good enough.

ITA with you there. I don't need Brooke Shields to represent all women and motherhood and BF for the public. She is a human being - imperfect - just like the rest of us. But man, doing those Calvin ads (and being told you are a "role model" for years and years) really does a number on your brain. Note to self - never let my teenagers become models.

Originally Posted by applejuice

Also with all of her $ I am sure she had hired help. So sad that even then she was depressed. How mcuh more must a woman be depressed who does not have the options that Brooke had?

Now that issue deserves it's own thread. Are you sure? I'm not. I think most American women come home to nobody to help them. Just the hubby. But the hubby is in no mental place to really * support * a new mother. Other cultures have women (family) coming over to help the new mama. Here, after the baby is born, people forget about the mother and just dote on the baby... which makes new, traumatized mothers tailspin even farther.

Let's say she did hire a "baby nurse." Baby nurses just focus on teaching new parents how to 1) care for the baby or 2) just take care of the baby. Again, the baby nurse isn't there to zoom in on mom's needs.

And with the baby being cared for by a nurse, that takes the mother off the hook, doesn't it? Though apparently, it was pretty obvious to dad something was very wrong. But poor guy, he wasn't trained to deal with it.

I wonder if they gave her Cyotec? I was wondering about the meds she got in her induction. Could anything have caused her to bleed internally? Just wondering.

[ChasingPeace]

I just want to point out again that in the Oprah interview Brooke said she DID start with meds that enabled her to bf with her dd.

I think the judgmental tone of many of these postings is dangerous. I know I resisted meds for my PPD because I was not satisfied with the research on long terms effects on nurslings. However, I finally was scared enough to try Zoloft. Fortunately it worked, and I continued bf-ing. Had it not, I'm not sure what I would have done. I know if I couldn't continue bf-ing, it would have contributed to the feelings of being a failure that I was already having, and I may have decided not to take the meds, which may have been disastrous. Each mother must weigh the risks and benefits of continuing to bf while on certain medications, and I don't think it's helpful to condemn someone for deciding it's a risk they're not comfortable taking. In fact, that kind of condemnation may make a woman less likely to get help.

[Tupelo Honey]

Does anyone else remember when brooke Shields was a child actress? What I remember is the contraversy over her doing a nude scene as a child, and how could her mother allow that? I think it's also very likely she has some issues carried over from her own childhood. I didn't see the interview so I don't know if she talked about any of that.

[lunadoula]

I didn't watch the entire interview, but I do think the fact she chose to speak out about her experience with PPD could reach a lot of women who otherwise might not realize there is help out there for them, kwim?

[Momtwice]

Tanibani, I had ppd with dd and did fall madly in love with her. I also feel madly in love with ds...no depression but complications after the birth meant I had to take meds that made me feel somewhat detached from him at times .
But still fell madly in love.

Not judging others...just answering, since you asked.

[Momtwice]

Just because one needs or want formula does not mean one condones the horrifically unethical marketing methods of formula COMPANIES. This theme has been discussed for pages at bf advocacy, and at one thread at activism.

I have experience both formula feeding and breastfeeding, both premature mom-led weaning and long term child led weaning. I hate Brooke's formula commercials with all my heart and soul, and the commercials make me angry, but that doesn't mean I want her or any mom to suffer from PPD, having been there.

In Marie Osmand's PPD book doesn't she discuss weaning from the breast as something that can worsen PPD?

[rado]

Originally Posted by mama2kyla

wow. how mean. i dont like that she did formula commercials either but that isnt a reason to feel good about the fact that she had such a horrible bout with PPD. I wouldnt wish that on ANYONE.

Hmm. I don't recall mentioning that I feel good about her PPD or that I wished it upon her. I'm not a voodoo snake charmer or a meanie. Just an opinionated mama whose sense of humor sometimes lapses into the inappropriate.

My apologies to those of you whom I offended with my remarks about Brooke (which were written while in the midst of a deep fatigue as we've no sleep around here these days, and WERE in fact meant to be tongue in cheek...)

Please DO feel free to refer to me as a militant bf'er. I've no problem with that. We need more militancy in bf'ing because we've got a LONG way to go before the moms who can bf are bf'ing, and I don't see anything wrong in saying that. I'm more mad at society and our health/government/social infrastructure about that than I am at individual moms, who are products of our society. Also, last I checked, my bfing friends and i are often the minority in our part of the country and some of us are still being asked not to nurse various places, so I don't really feel that we've gotten to the point where the bf'ers are the dominant oppressive majority.

Again, my remarks were not intended to minimize or disparage mamas with PPD, and obviously I was insenstive as several mamas responded to my post. I just find it difficult to separate Brooke's profiting from advertising formula from her mothering in general. I am certainly sorry to hear she had a difficult birth experience. I NEVER would wish PPD or any other difficulty on her. However, on MDC I thought I might be safe to fling a little mud her way for promoting formula. After all, it's not exactly a public service. I DO commend her for talking about PPD, however, and I'm glad to hear that it's helpful for so many others. If you are a mama who has or had PPD, you have my sympathy and what I say about Brooke, who is not a personal friend or an MDC'er, has little to do with you. I'm sure I managed to offend somebody else, so I'll stop here.

[lemon]

I think she can only be writing the book to help educate. Or for her own therapy. If she was just interested in airing her dirty laundry for cash, she would have written many a tell-all by now.

As for the formula issue. I noticed that she took care to stress the breastfeeding aspect of her relationship with her daughter in the interview. That it was the one thing that kept her physically involved with her daughter during her most difficult PPD days, and that it was during breastfeeting that she began, eventually, to bond.

Really, I wonder if she didn't take the formula job to help perpetuate the great mom/perfect baby image she thought she needed to show to the world. Not that she would think formula made a great mom, but for those camera images of mom & baby radiant together.

[LizD]

I hadn't heard anything about her and then happened to see her book in BnN yesterday, and my initial reaction was the same as sistermama's- just another moneymaking ploy, like all those magazines that sold when she did interviews about infertility, her formula ads, etc. I don't dislike or disrespect her because of the ads, I just feel her whole journey into motherhood has had a heavy dose of earning power that the rest of us don't have. How many books on PPD by women on this forum would sell?

As far as reasons for cesarean birth, an alarming number of celebrities have csections, esp those who have publicly expressed plans for a natural or "alternative" birth; more there than meets the eye.

[LizD]

Someone responded to the comment about hired help and baby nurses not doing much beyond infant care & advice. But I doubt Brooke Shields has to do laundry, clean the house or cook a meal, call repair people, do her taxes, drive a car, or even change a diaper unless she wants to. I think this was what was meant by hired help. It is an issue worth exploring in PPD in general. It is often assumed that "not enough support" is practically the cause of PPD. Yet I have seen women who have too much support, too many people present, not enough to do, really, in the early pp days and it seems to interfere with their own bonding and confidence with the baby. It seems everyone is different when it comes to this and I wonder if there is some way to predict what will best support any given individual?

[DaryLLL]

Originally Posted by JaneS

I admire her greatly for being so honest and exposing herself like this. I'm sure it will help many women, and for that I'm grateful for her courage.

However, I think the fact that she has appeared in advertisements for formula contemptible.

Yes, formula does need to exist for those mothers and babies that truly need it. But the WHO code was developed for a reason... advertising formula as a "choice" makes it more likely for it to be used for convenience. And the more formula that is used, the poorer health our babies/children/adults have. Lending her celebrity cache to formula makes it an acceptable choice for mothers who might be better served with more support to BF instead. Not to mention the fact that PPD has been shown to be lower in BF'ing moms.

:

I do not judge her one whit for switching to aritficial baby milk. I wager she tried bfing compatible drugs before she finally was forced to use one not compatible.

My heart also goes out to her for losing her dad 3 weeks before her baby was born. She will also still mourning the loss of a friend who committed suicide 3 yrs earlier, she says here:

http://my.webmd.com/content/Article/...?printing=true

These things, combined with her apparent need to keep a happy shiny front up, IVF and c-section, led to her depression.


I do however judge her for shilling for ABM! Too many young moms will keep thinking it is the glamorous, easier thing to do because of her.

[lemon]

Originally Posted by LizD

As far as reasons for cesarean birth, an alarming number of celebrities have csections, esp those who have publicly expressed plans for a natural or "alternative" birth; more there than meets the eye.

Yes. This is an interesting point. On the one hand, I am sure that some celebs give lip service to natural birth because they think it is a more virtuous thing to claim to want. On the other hand, I imagine that the pressure of "expert" advice is heightened for a celebrity who can afford the "best" practitioners and is encircled with assistants, etc. reinforcing any medical advice she is given.