SAHM a "choice?"

[Greaseball]

This is another argument that seems anti-SAHM to me: Telling us that it was a "choice" to stay home, so therefore we don't have a right to complain about lack of money.

When did SAHMing become a luxury? It used to be just the way things were; why is it all of a sudden something one can choose or not choose? To me, staying home with my children, educating and socializing them, is the absolute bare minimum I can do! This is not some frivolous luxury; something I have picked out of a large plate of options.

The argument seems to be that SAHMing is reserved only for those who don't have to worry about money - either those whose dh's are very high earners or those who planned for this years in advance and put together a large amount of savings. And low-income SAHMs are then told "If you don't like it, go back to work." or "You chose this; now deal with it."

I don't see SAHMing as a choice I can freely make or not make, any more than breastfeeding is! Or having a natural birth! My children must be born naturally, they must be breastfed, and they must have me at home at all times. How and when did these become mere "options?"

I'm sure someone else could say this a lot better than I could...but it's really aggravating to hear the bare minimum requirements of childrearing be called "choices."

[SmilingChick]

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[SmilingChick]

Originally Posted by Greaseball

It used to be just the way things were; why is it all of a sudden something one can choose or not choose?

Umm, because times changes and usually not for the better.
My neighbor went back to work because she wants to put a family room addition on her house. Nice to think that this is where society is going.

Hmm....family room...spending time with my daughter...tough decision.

[MamaFae]

I agree for a lot of people it isn't a choice. For me it wasn't, for DH it wasn't. For my MIL well lets just say she isn't happy that I am not working.

When we chose to have children we accepted the responsibility of raising them. WE did, not some daycare, or babysitter.

The facts are though I couldn't work if I wanted to because we couldn't afford the childcare! We would actually go in the hole to pay for it. Of course my MIL doesn't understand this. She worked DH's whole life and sometimes two jobs. But she had her mother to watch the kids.

As for not having the right to complain about fianances? Give me a break. The economy and such are not in this state due to our decision to stay at home. DH's company hasn't given him a raise in 4 years, due to the economy. Not like I can fix that by working. We do a lot to be frugal and we sacrifice the creature comforts because our children's upbringing is much more important than a new car or even owning a house. (but the house thing is another topic all together!)

So for what it's worth I agree, for me it wasn't a choice. It was a given.

Blessings,
N~

[NB Mom]

I do think of it as a choice I made. I must think differently than you... but I did choose to stay home I also chose to breastfeed, natural childbirth, etc, etc. There were other options, but I chose what was best for my children.

BTW, when I am told that "I chould choose to go back to work if money was tight", I always remind that person what it costs for daycare for 2 toddlers. We would be in more financial distress if I worked, than we are now.
This is not the reason I chose to be a SAHM, but it does clear it up for some people (like my FIL).

[AllyRae]

For us, it's not really a choice... The cost of 2 kids in daycare, work clothes, gas, car maintenance, etc. for me to go back to work is almost exactly what I'd make without my PhD (working in the field of human services doesn't really lend to a high salary). So, with all of the additional costs of working, I'd probably be making $50 or $100 a month...completely not worth it! So, it wasn't a choice at all...the fact that it can cost $1000+ a month for childcare made that choice for me!

[Bleu]

Of course it's a choice, but it's not a very free choice, and it's nothing but naked misogyny to try to use the rhetoric of "choice" to beat SAHMs up with.

If it were more of a real choice, we'd be talking about jobs with pay equity so that there wasn't such a disparity between the father's pay and the mother's pay. In a huge number of families, the wage difference is so huge it would be financial folly for the father to stay home while the mother works.

If there was more of a real choice, there would be more flexible hours for parents and for all the people who need them. It's one thing to work 30-35 hours a week (which is full-time in many other countries) if your partner also works 30-35 hours a week. But how can you do that if your partner works 60-70 hours a week? Not without enormous personal costs for everyone in the family.

I could go on and on but Bleuet's waking up -- good topic.

[Bleu]

I'm baaa-aaack! NAKing, of course.

If SAH vs. working were more of a free choice, we'd see family subsidies for babes with SAHPs.

If is were really a choice, we'd see *paid* leave with protected job status so that a woman could establish breastfeeding before returning to FTE. We'd see a tranformed legal landscape and employment market such that stepping out for a few years wouldn't trash a woman's employment possibilities for the rest of her working life. Employers would not be free to penalize parents for taking off o stay home with sick children.

If staying at home versus working were really a choice, we'd see subsidized, high-quality childcare everywhere, the same way public education should be excellent everywhere without regard to your ability to pay. As an affluent sopciety, we could amply afford it -- the priority just isn't there. Low-income working parents often have to rely on informal arrangements with relatives, friends or neighbors in unsafe homes without good supervision, much less developmentally appropriate stimulation, because decent daycare is just too expensive. And it's not like daycare workers make a living wage, either.

[simply me]

Hi...

I guess to ome it is achoice & to others we know we want to be home with our kids. I know yes i could go back to work, leave my kids in daycareetc & never seethem. BUT I CHOOSE NOT TO!!!!! I want to be home with my kids. They derserve a parent to be around 24/7. Thats what they need. I would rather be broke & stay home & LIVE LIFE with my kids. I knew from my 1st 8 yrs ago i would stay home. It is hard & some months WOW i want to just beg for money, but i as content with raising my kids as a SAHM..

Also my 1 child has SN & is medically fragile, if i got a job al lthe time i need of for medical things my god i'd be fired in an instant.

Daycare costs... OMG, my SIL is paying $850.00 a month for her kids to be in daycare.. Thats only 3 days a week for 2 kids.... Hello just stay home!!!! ugh...

It is easy for people to say "oh go back to work & you will have money" it is not like that & people need to stop saying that. Why is it society thinks its ok for kids to spend 12 hrs a day in daycare?? You chose to have kids, chose to raise them.

Now i in know way am saying moms who work are wrong, its their choice. just like i am home is my choice, and i knew it was my choice & the right choicefrom the start.

[MomInCalifornia]

I see it as a choice. I made the decision to be a stay at home mom. I decided to stay home because I felt like it was best my my family. Sure, many days I would rather be doing something different, but for now, this it what works best for my paticular situation.

I may be in the minority, but I don't think being a SAHM or SAHD is best for everyone. It is a hard job, and it can be too much for some. Each parent knows their limitations, and a mom who knows herself well enough to say "my kids would not benefit from having be home full time" is being honest. In some cases, I do think a child is better off with a well trusted and fantastic child care provider for a few hours a day than with a stressed, burt out and resentful parent.

So, yup, I see staying home as a choice. And I am thankful I am in a financial situation where it is possible. How horible it must be for the mom who longs to stay home, but is forced to go to work to put food on the table or a roof over her littles ones heads.

[sillymommaX2]

Hi...I am new here....

I see it as a choice. I am going back to work b/c I want to. I dont have to use daycare-my MIL and mom are both at home. So paying for daycare is not an issue for us.

I love my kids more than anything in this world but I also like to work and have adult friends-not saying that SAHP dont have adult friends !!

The world is different know. Things are more expensive and most families have to have 2 incomes. There is nothing wrong with a parent working!

[saphire]

Many options in life are choices, some just make more sense than others. I knew all along I would choose to be married, have kids, bf, homeschool, all that. So that is my choice. And I wouldn't change a thing, I willing do without the "things" some extra $ could buy. Spending time raising my girls cannot be replaced.

[simply me]

""""""How horible it must be for the mom who longs to stay home, but is forced to go to work to put food on the table or a roof over her littles ones heads.""""""



Oh gosh i so agree with you. My mom was forced to work while we were growing up & it was horrible. I think thats why i am so for staying home. My mom was always at work, my dad was gone & we basically were on our own. My brother was 5 yrs olderthen me & from the age of 5 & he was 10 he took care of me while my mom worked. My mom couldn't afford childcare.. It was hard & to this day my mom cries to me about how bad she feels still to this day 20 yrs later...

[skueppers]

To me, everything we do in life is a choice. The other options may be terrible, but they do exist, and I think it's empowering to recognize that we've made conscious choices to be where we are today.

I could have more money. But I don't, because I chose to quit my job and stay home with my kid. Or, going further back, but I don't, because I chose to marry the person I married, rather than someone who was going to become a lawyer.

I could have more free time. But I don't, because I decided to have children.

I could be thinner. But I'm not, because I'd rather eat what I want to.

I could have a bigger house. But I don't, because I'd rather save what money I do have so I don't have to scramble when unexpected expenses come up.

I could be getting more sleep at night. But I'm not, because I breastfeed.

And so on.

I'm not a big fan of complaining about the results of choices that I've made. Either I'm happy with my life, or I need to figure out what choices I could be making to improve the situation.

[abac]

: I agree with every single thing skueppers said. I strongly agree that I shouldn't complain about the choices I make...if I feel like complaining, I need to change something.

I think it's empowering to recognize that we've made conscious choices to be where we are today.

[Greaseball]

It's easy to use the argument that daycare costs would eat all of the second income. I've used it...though it's not entirely true. I don't have as high an earning potential as dh, but I do have qualifications that could get me a "real" job with benefits, so I could stick the oldest in Head Start and the baby in daycare and still have money left over. Of course, the last time I seriously looked for a job in my field (mental health) this was after moving to a small town and nothing was available. If I seriously wanted to go back to work, we'd have to move back to my hometown.

So what it looks like to outsiders is someone who could work, but refuses, and stays home living off everyone else. I can't seem to explain to them that I cannot work right now, I cannot be away from my children. No, they won't die without me; yes, they still need me to be with them all the time.

[~Megan~]

Well for us we'd make less money if I worked. I didn't make all that much to start with but the cost of daycare combined with commuting, parking, car insurance, food, clothes, disposable diapers, etc, etc I wouldn't have made any money.

I wanted to stay at home with my kids so it wasn't a sad choice for us.

[captain crunchy]

Well, it is a choice.

It was something I chose to do, weighing ALL the pros against the few cons--one of them being that we have a lot less money than some people.

HOWEVER...

I don't believe that just because you make a choice, you should be expected to be some suffering martyr, NEVER able to even have a down day, or a complaint or worry, or whatever...that is foolish and simpleminded in my opinion.

For instance, I am sure in the course of my motherhood, there will be times where I will have the thoughts of "man, life was so much easier before I had children! It would be great to be able to have a night alone!" ---Does that mean I love my children less or that I made a wrong choice, or that just because I may not relish in the responsibility of motherhood 24 hours a day 7 days a week...that I made a *mistake* and that I shouldn't have *chosen* to have my daughter?? Absolutely NOT!!

I hate the misogyny directed at all women, but especially mothers. I get this damned it I do, damned if I don't attitude towards mothers ALL the time...(not here, well, only occasionally here) ...but I feel like it is very much to the advantage of women-haters (and yes, they can be women too) to pit mothers against mothers, women against women, to make us all adversaries in some way or another, in competition some way or another, and even me, who is painfully AWARE of it--falls into it sometimes!!

It sucks!!

Anyway, back to topic, sorry for going off there...

I do feel it is a choice, and in some instances, a sacrifice --though for us, the reward and benefits outweigh the sacrifice....

It just stinks to me of the same old tired disgusting arguement people have when say, a single mom is struggling or whatever and some holier than thou *sshole is like "shouldn't have had kids"...

Just pisses me off...

[Bleu]

Greaseball said "So what it looks like to outsiders is someone who could work, but refuses, and stays home living off everyone else."

I think that is only what it looks like to child-hating and woman-hating outsiders. I agree with your underlying notion that the decision is not purely economic, but not made in a vaccuum without economic ramifications, either.

Skeuppers, I'd have to disagree with your post in some regards. though I agree that yes, of course all those elemets of your life (generic you) are "choices," they are not all equal choices or all free choices. So I think to emphasize them as choices, as you've done, is a bit misleading. It's not as if making the decision to SAH/WOH is made as simply as if as if you're choosing from chocolate, vanilla or strawberry, without 30 years of socialization or any impact beyond your immediate moment of decsion.

I don't claim to be a mind-reader, but it sounds like you're laying the groundwork for a libertarian argument, where society is responsible for nothing and the individual is responsible for everything, because, well, it's their "choice." Would that be where you're going?

I also don't see how framing them as choices is necessarily "empowering." perhaps you could elaborate on that?

[Bleu]

x-posted. great post, capt crunchy!

nak