Is there a "window of opport'ty" for certain sounds? 4.5yo ds can't say "k"& hard"g"

[loftmama]

Speech development came up this weekend between my dh and another mom at a soccer game. Others have asked me through the years if I've ever been concerned about my ds's speech. The truth is I haven't. He has always been a rather quiet boy. He signed wonderfully. He can be understood by me and others. He just doesn't pronounce those throat sounds like hard "g" and "k". So, this friend recommended a speech pathologist through the city's public education service. Do you think it's true that there's a "window of opportunity" to learn certain sounds and then they go through their lives speaking incorrectly? My first reaction is: hogwash. They eventually learn their colors, their shapes, their numbers, and yes, all the sounds. They just don't all learn them at the same time or in the same order. However, if there are some of you who think this is true, can you direct me to some information where I can learn more? If you think it's not true, do you know of any references where I can learn more?

TIA, mamas!

[Marsupialmom]

Loftmama my sil is Japanese’s she cannot say her “r’s” like we can. She did not hear them so she did not learn them as a child. She has improved over the years but there is a difference. Some people can overcome these differences, like my brother. He can pronounce, read, and speak Japanese so fluently he can fool most Japanese people.

I do not have any links but I think there can be windows of opportunities we most observe when we try to learn other languages.

Also another reason to try to help him is psychological. If he is not speaking clearly in a “standard fashion” he will be treated differently. People can get frustrated with him. It can hurt him getting jobs and the such.

Maybe this one?
http://members.tripod.com/Caroline_B...artic.htm#eval

Also not pronouncing sounds correctly can effect the ease of learning to read and spell. So you might want to consider that when and if you are getting help.

[katt]

I think he would be fine. If it is affecting him in negative ways then maybe i'd check out your options, but if not, then let him go at his own speed for now.

The deep throat sounds are a bit difficult because you can't 'see' them happen. When you are watching someone talk, their mouths, you can see letters like P and M and such, Ks and Gs happen in the back where it is hard to hear. (one of the reasons that MaMa is an early word as opposed to DaDa.)

Also, there is no R in the Japanese language, true. It does make it harder for native Japanese speakers to say words like Library and Tyranousaours Rex (we've had exchange students from Japan for most my life) But, I always thought that was an accent thing and R can be learned.

There will probably be more and better information given on here after me. Good Luck

[Marsupialmom]

Yes it can be learn by some but not all. Plus wouldn't it be easier in the long run to learn it sooner than latter (if developmentally appropriate)?

One reason we are trying to get foreign language in our children younger.

My dd just finished speach theropy. She has hearing loss and minor speech issues. I know that her problems were so much easier to correct early on than waiting. Much of her theropy was just to keep her in the system and to monitor because she was high risk for speach issue. We saw many kids have to work much harder to correct issue because they started later.

[oceanbaby]

Have you had his tonsils checked? My almost 4yo ds can't make the back of the throat sounds either, and we just realized that he has huge tonsils. We are actually seeing an ENT doc today to discuss this further. Both my dad and I had very enlarged tonsils, and both had them removed. I'm not planning on this being the case for my ds, but my ped and the speech therapist we consulted both think that his tonsils are the reason he can't make those sounds.

[Linda KS]

There are windows for learning certain sounds, and if I child misses them it will be harder for them to learn the sounds later on. They can still do it, they will just have to work at it more. Some sounds emerge later than others, and it is normal for a 4 year old NOT to be able to do them all. I used to have a chart showing when each sound can be expected, but I've lost it.

I think the rule of thumb is that a 4 year old should be understandable by an intersted stranger, but they may not speak perfectly.

If you have any doubts, then get a speech evaluation. There are all sorts of little things that can make it more difficult for a child to make certain sounds. One little boy we know had trouble because of the way his tongue was attached, so he has special exercises to help him. There could be a problem that could easily be fixed.

[loftmama]

Thank you for your thoughtful responses. We have not gone to a doc in a year, so I'm thinking maybe we'll do that and see what she says. He's had a lingering cough for several weeks now, so we probably need a general checkup.

I did several web searches and found that there are about 6 or so letters/sounds that a 4-5 year old isn't expected to know yet, so that made me feel better. Among them were the l, r, and k. I didn't see the g.

[LiamnEmma]

Yes he should be able to make at least the K sound by now. My niece said things like apridot instead of apricot and she was eligible for speech therapy at age four. I'd guess the g is the same. They are made in the same location of the throat. I can ask a colleague tomorrow to make sure, but I'd say it wouldn't hurt to contact your local school district, ask to speak to the speech pathologist at your neighborhood school and just ask. You don't have to do anything after that, just get some input on it. And my niece has already remediated and is exited from speech therapy at age 5.

[loftmama]

Originally Posted by LiamnEmma

Yes he should be able to make at least the K sound by now. My niece said things like apridot instead of apricot and she was eligible for speech therapy at age four. I'd guess the g is the same. They are made in the same location of the throat. I can ask a colleague tomorrow to make sure, but I'd say it wouldn't hurt to contact your local school district, ask to speak to the speech pathologist at your neighborhood school and just ask. You don't have to do anything after that, just get some input on it. And my niece has already remediated and is exited from speech therapy at age 5.

Really???? Gee, now I feel neglectful. I guess maybe I will go ahead and make that call. At least getting informed won't hurt. Do you have a colleague who knows speech development? I would definitely be interested in his or her opinion. Thanks!

[jadegirl553]

I know that in tonal languages (Chinese, for example) hearing the language at an early age is very important. I read that even babies after three (I think it was three, maybe it was nine) months have trouble differentiating between tones. There are also some languages that use the very gutteral "g" and "k" sounds (arabic languages) that are learned.

When they are young, babies can learn to make any sound, that's why babbling is so important- they are learning to make sounds. And that by five, children know their native tongue perfectly, they're just working on expanding their vocabulary after that.

I don't know how any of this applies to your son, I'm just spouting the information about language development that I've learned. I'd second (third?, fourth?) the suggestion to at least consult with a speech pathologist.

[LiamnEmma]

Oh my goodness, you shouldn't feel neglectful in my opinion! Neglectful would be having had someone mention it to you and not checking into the thought at all. You're checking into it. You are a very thoughtful parent. And why should you know that? Anyway, yes, I have several colleagues who are SLPs (I work in special education). I'll ask tomorrow for you. I meant to look at my list of sounds today but I forgot.

[loftmama]

Thanks LiamnEmma, you must be a teacher. I taught before staying home and I remember how crazy it was to get through the day, remember all your paperwork, much less any request from an online communicant. Thanks for thinking of me.

[Artisan]

I'm with the "wouldn't hurt to get it checked" camp. (And no, I don't think you're neglectful.) There are windows of language development that start to close around 5-6. For example, it's much harder to learn a new language the older you get -- those windows in the brain begin to shut. They never close all the way, mind you -- it's never too late -- but it will be EASIER to get it taken care of sooner rather than later.

[LiamnEmma]

Okay, I asked, and the SLP said she'd definitely be putting the child into speech therapy for those sounds. She said he should have both sounds by now. Sorry for the rush, I'm at work.

[Benji'sMom]

You know, I couldn't say "th" for the longest time - I remember saying "sunder" instead of thunder, so I must have been pretty old, to be able to remember that. I figured it out eventually.

[L.J.]

I know I've read that most of those letters that kids are stuck on, should be in place by 7 or 8 years of age.

I'm in the camp of, if you don't think there's a problem, wait a while and see. I think many rush off to speech therapy when there's really no need for it.

My son was not that easy to understand at 4, he needed me to interpret. We never did speech and everything is just fine.