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Is there such a thing as a one sided affair? - Page 2

post #21 of 54
MSR, I was very undiplomatic in expressing my opinion since you did specifically mention the list had relevance to your particular situation. I was responding more in the spirit of general discussion, since you were advocating the list for the original poster. I did not mean to crap on your personal experience and I'm sorry that you took my post as doing that. Also, I didn't call you sexist; I called the list sexist. I stand by my opinion. While I'm at it, let me state that I also think the creator of the list is sexist. I didn't state any conclusions as to whether or not you are sexist.

To the OP (who I didn't post about at all in my first post because I was breastfeeding!): what a terrible betrayal. Bad enough no matter the circumstances, but especially while you were pregnant and freshly postpartum, when you deserved additional support and consideration. I heartily agree with those who said you can't get beyond it because he really hasn't given you any reason to. A full apology includes an attempt to make amends and a pledge never to do the [thing-apologized-for] again -- neither of which your DH has done.
post #22 of 54
I cant beleive i am about to write this, i guess it is s if I am admiting something....
well I met hubby when i was 17 and he was 24. We started dating about 3 days fter we met and fell in love. I remember everything form the begining of our relationship to when and where we went for fun the first time we ummm.... ya know.... and everythting about it. But thru all of this time, (now 9 years later almost exactly) I have been in love with my ex. he is a great guy and my first love. My brotehrs best friend, and one of mine as well. we only dated for 4 months when we broke up shortly after I had a MC on my 17th birthday. too much for our HS hearts to handle.

WELLLL.. about 2 years ago he was coming thru town. I was havingissues wiht hubby. Nothing big lack of communication and whatever. i just wanted to pack up adn go with this guy. I wanted to be with him. Afterall I loved him soo much after all these years. I was so wantinghim to call when he got to town and i knew what i wanted to do with him. Ihad so much to tell him and so much i wanted to do..... BUT When it came down to it. I couldnt do it!!! I love my hubby too. I think My love for my ex will NEVER end, but it does not grow, like it does with my hubby.
I dont think it is right what i did. and i told hubby, we discussed every aspect of our marriage. how he almost cheated on me while iw as on vactiaon with his familyand our children. how the distance has grown between us. Largely due to a child that litteraly screamed 24-7 for the first 7 months of her life due to some medical issues. i know that my example is not exactly how yours is but i know it happens and it happens quick it can sneak up on you. and before oyu know it your bags are packed.

I am not saying you should ignore this. it hurt hubby really bad hwen i told him my plan. and i was equally hurt when he was tryingto find a fling. I think it is a good opportunity for hte both of you to te time and talk about your goals as a family, and to talk about all the underlying issues. you dont need a counselor to do this. MOst men dont beleve in couseling. and there are several great books. ask him if he can explain to you why, and how and all hte others, ask him how he can fall in love with you again like he was with her. How to redisciver your intimacy, relationship, friendship. Even if he says there is nothing wrong iwth the relationship. ppl dont normally fall in love when everyhting is great with their current relationship. Yo need to take time and TALK really talk. go to the park, and get away from the phone, the tv, the radiio, everything. Just talk. lok inot each others eyes and heart. Find out where you want to go from here. Tell him how angry you are, how hurt. if he doenst really know, how can he make it right????

good luck
post #23 of 54
I am so sorry that you are going through this. I know that it would have hurt me to the core if I ever found out something like this, and it would take a lot of time for me to get over it. I definatley would look into counsiling, sometimes they have sliding scales if you are short on cash. I agree that sometimes you can get through these things without counciling, but I think a councilor can hlep to mediate when emotions get high, and sometimes it is easier for an outside person to help you qualify things.

I was wondering also if he had "gotten over" his feelings for this woman, why did he keep the letter. Maybe your right, that he wanted you to find it, but it could be something much more serious than this. I'll tell you what though, I know you aren't laying any of the blame on this woman, but if someone elses husband was spending hours talking to me about problems he was having in his marriage, I would tell them they need to be talking these things over with their wife, not me! I think I would also suspect that man of having a crush on me also, if he was spending that much time with me complaining that he couldn't talk to his wife, but could talk to me.

But I really do think that it is great that he told you the truth, and didn't try to lie to cover his tracks. I think that shows that he is willing to lay it all on the line to work it out. I hope it all works out for you, but give yourself time to work through it.
post #24 of 54
Thread Starter 
Quick update....I told my hubby that I posted our situation on here, and that most of the posts said that we should probably go to counseling. He FLAT OUT said NO. I've never heard him be so insistent on something. He doesn't think him or I need it. And I'm really starting to think maybe we do. And him saying no is more of a sign that maybe we probably should. I don't know. I'm not a psychologist. We haven't really had another chance to talk about it... he's been working all weekend. Let you know when we do. But does anyone else find this strange from a man who apparently would do anything to make amends with me but won't go to therapy? Even if it is just for a little while?
post #25 of 54
YES, I think his resistance is an issue. No therapist is going to make it seem "ok" to hang onto his fantasy, and at some level, maybe he wants to hang on to it.

But you sure can't force a grown man to do anything. I am SO sorry that you have to struggle with this! He has to know that you're hurting, and I think that marital counselling is the LEAST he can do, if he's serious about moving foward and sorting this out once and for all.

Good luck, ma'am.
post #26 of 54
Maybe give him a bit more time. Stress the fact that you think it will help you to deal with this. Maybe by framingit this way, he will feel less intimidated by the prospect. If he still refuses, youcould start counciling on your own to try to work out your owqn feelings on the subject and then try to draw him into it later. Good luck, and keep talking to him.
post #27 of 54
Originally Posted by cks321
And he proceeded to tell me that he thought about having an affair, and he planned out exactly how he would do it so I wouldn't find out. (WTF?) AND he also fantasized about doing her. Every way that I wouldn't. While he was...yaknow.... He also said that he would go over to her house and talk to her for hours becuase I wouldn't understand what was going on in his life.
I would be devastated if I was in your shoes. I don't think I could be emotionally or sexually intimate with Cameron if he had written that letter and it was found by me. It certainly would take a lot of therapy to work through all that, at least for me. That said, I can't control what is going on in Cameron's mind or who he masterbates to. I sure hope he only fantasizes about me...but how am I to know. As long as I don't know, I'm good. I guess its admirable that he did work through his emotions on paper instead of in the "bedroom", kwim...but he should have burnt that paper, IMO, so you never found it. But now that you did, you both should go to therapy. Work through these issues TOGETHER and then get your intimacy back. Sexually, emotionally...whatever which way. You can work through this! Big Hugs!

I just read that he refuses to go....well then, you go Cheryl. Do it for yourself.
But, honestly, I hope that you can eventually go together because although his fantasy is "healthy"...he is a married man and he should be willing to live up to whatever "damage" his fantasy has caused you emotionally. He should stand BY you and work through your & his issues with HIS fantasy together.
post #28 of 54
I do think counselling would be a good idea for the two of you, since it's obvious that you're having a lot of difficulty with this issue.

I think a lot of couples fail to discuss, when they first talk about getting married, what they expect in terms of faithfulness, and this is something I always recommend. It seems to me that your husband doesn't think he was unfaithful to you, because he didn't actually do anything with the other woman besides talk with her. His definition of unfaithfulness doesn't include fantasizing about someone else, thinking about having an affair, etc. -- from his point of view, he's faithful as long as he doesn't actually act on his feelings.

Your definition of faithfulness, on the other hand, seems to include not fantasizing about anyone else and possibly some other things, like not confiding something in another person without first confiding it to your spouse.

Neither one of you is wrong. You just have different definitions of what faithfulness is. From his point of view, his faithfulness was tested by his feelings for Katie, but he withstood the test and came through the experience more committed to your marriage and family. Who knows, he may have kept the letter to remind him of his success at overcoming this challenge and his commitment to you. From your point of view, he betrayed you by seriously considering having an affair with another woman, and by fantasizing about having sex with her.

It seems to me that what the two of you really need to talk about is your different views on the subject of faithfulness. It's entirely possible that you may not be able to come to agreement on a single definition of faithfulness that works for both of you, but at least by talking about it, you'll be able to better understand each others' views. At worst, you should be able to reach a place where you don't think he's a reprobate for thinking it's OK to fantasize about women he sees on the street, and where he doesn't think you're a controlling prude for expecting him to only ever think about you. At best, you'll be able to reach a compromise on a definition of faithfulness you can both live with.

Oh, and my husband says, "you can't stop your partner from thinking in passing about another person. But depending on your level of comfort, he should be able to keep from thinking about them in any more depth than he might think about how tasty a hot fudge sundae would be right now."
post #29 of 54
I am confused about something. Maybe I just missed it. he was writing the letter about the woman he loved but who was he writing it to? Who else was in on this?
post #30 of 54
Thread Starter 
Lilyka- He was writing the letter to his best friend who has been in prison for a crime he didn't commit...not that it makes a difference, he's in prison but- he told me later when we first talked about the letter that his friend "supported him" in him having a fling. UGH! But the letter was written about one of our good friends, very good friends...

not just "some woman he saw on the street" if it was just some woman ya know that he was fantisizing about.... I wouldn't be so upset. Still would have been upset but I would've gotten over it in a day or 2. No, this was much worse. This is someone we see all the time. Which is the hardest part about it all. Knowing that he did those things, and considered going thru with it but didn't. I don't care. What he did was wrong. No one falls in love with the centerfold of the latest porn, goes over to her house and talks to her for HOURS about things that I wouldn't "understand", considers having an affair with her to the point that he'd knew how he'd do it without me knowing. It just doesn't happen, even with the chick who walks down the street. He might fantasize what she looks like naked. But this is a totally different situation. Ya know?
post #31 of 54
I so know.
and I am so sorry you are going through this. I am sorry he won't go to counseling with you. I wish I had something helpful to add but I am mad for you and I am mad for me and I am mad for every other women whose husband has turned to the sympathetic ear of some other woman when they should have been home working on thier relationship they already have. I am mad at the men but I am really wmad at the women who know good and well what they are doing and like the attention. no I don't have issues or anything. . . .

even if he won't get counseling go get it for yourself. win or lose in this whole thing you need to be healthy for you and your children.
post #32 of 54
Thread Starter 
Thank you Lilyka

And if you don't mind me asking....what did he do to you? Maybe we can club em together! HA!
post #33 of 54
Originally Posted by lilyka
I am mad at the men but I am really wmad at the women who know good and well what they are doing and like the attention.
This may well be entirely beside the point, but I've spent a lot of time talking with a couple of male friends over the years who were having relationship problems. I really don't think there's anything wrong with that -- these men are my friends, and they needed someone to talk to.

Of course I encouraged them to seek counselling and helped them figure out ways to work things out with their partners.

I guess what I'm saying is, it's entirely possible for a woman to be a genuine friend to a man who's having marriage problems.
post #34 of 54
I would never let someones husband come over and whine to me about thier relationships. That is not helpful. it is not fair to thier wives. If my friends hsband (or even a married man whose wife i didn't now) started telling me how bad thier wife treated them or that they were having problems or just wanted to be my frien I would send them to thier wives. Life is short, days are short thier time and attention needs to be onthier wives and thier children and male friends who they can be safe from emotional/sexual atatchments.

I have made it very clear to my dh from before we got married that it is not OK to me for him to be friends with women. That I want all of that sort of attention. he can hang with the guys all he wants and we can be friends with couples but no alone time/close relationships are exceptable. He refuses to accept that and as soon as we were having problems he ended up in love with the first woman who came along. and guess what they bonded over . . . "my SO sucks and I am not loved enough whaahwaaa" wel maybe if either one of them had gone home to thier SO and tried to work on thier relationship and done the hard work ni the hard relationship they could have avoided all the pain thier relationship caused.
post #35 of 54
Originally Posted by Bleu
That is sexist drivel.
post #36 of 54
Originally Posted by lilyka
I have made it very clear to my dh from before we got married that it is not OK to me for him to be friends with women. That I want all of that sort of attention. he can hang with the guys all he wants and we can be friends with couples but no alone time/close relationships are exceptable.

Ok - I ask this now - do the same rules apply to you? are you not allowed to have any men friends? WEre you both jsut supposed to abandon the friendships you had with members of the opposite sex because they were the opposite sex?

THat makes no sense to me at all. DH is allowed to have whatever friendships he wants - as am I. I was not about to dump the many male friends I had becuase I committed to DH.

And in the OP's case it wouldnt' have mattered because they are friends with both the woman AND HER SPOUSE.
post #37 of 54
I agree Mommy STormRaven.

I have lots of male friends, and I am not going to drop them, and my partner has a couple female friends as well.

That line of thinking is so foreign to me.
post #38 of 54
Originally Posted by the_lissa
I agree Mommy STormRaven.

I have lots of male friends, and I am not going to drop them, and my partner has a couple female friends as well.

That line of thinking is so foreign to me.
Thank you!

One of my very BEST friends is one of my Ex's even the Ex that was my "backup" we had such a good ongoing relationship that we had decided that if we didnt' find THE ONE then we'd get married. I'd still bet that we know more about each other than our spouses know about us simply becuase we have known each other much longer. Hel, jsut sunday he said that I still hold the #1 place with certain "talents" over anyone else - including his wife. But tah is jsut it - we both know that we are friends and that is it. He was the High Priest at our handfasting/wedding and he did the naming ceremonies for both of our children.

If you cannot be secure with the friendships that your partner has then you really to need to question why you are with them IMO.
post #39 of 54
Thread Starter 
I never once questioned any of my dh's relationships with any of his friends. After all they were the people that introduced me to him in the first place. But they were also the ones who did not tell me that he pulled this kinda s*it all the time in HS and in college, until I confided in my BF about the situation who is also friends with "Katie" and she wasn't at all surprised by his actions. WHY THE (BLEEP) didn't they tell ME???? Aren't your friends supposed to tell you this kinda stuff when you first start dating a guy they have known longer than you? How could I have missed this?

But he did make a call to a counseler here in town for HIM....which surprised me b/c he said no the first time I asked. And he said once he got his stuff together then we can work on this....which he is also leaving me in the dark about.
GOD why does this have to be so frustrating????????
post #40 of 54
Originally Posted by Mommy StormRaven
Ok - I ask this now - do the same rules apply to you? are you not allowed to have any men friends? WEre you both jsut supposed to abandon the friendships you had with members of the opposite sex because they were the opposite sex?
yes they do apply to me as well. I do not have any close male friends. There are some couples we are close to but only socialize with as a couple. This is to protect us from forming attatchements that might threaten our marriage, avoid any hint of suspision and to protect the marriages of our friends. There is no need that can't be met by my husband or a girlfriend. I simply don't need to have close male friends that I confide in and form emotional attatchments to or spend alone time with.

And even before I was with my husband ( we have been serious since we were 17 and he was my only boyfriend) I didn't hang out alone with members of the opposite sex. I have male fiends but we only hung out in groups or in family groups. It was simply to protect us from growing emotionally or sexually attracted to someone before we were ready for that sort of relationship. And everyone I know feels the same way.

I have to say if my dh had a previous partner that he thought was better in bed than me and told her he thought so (or told anyone else or continued to compare me to her) I would be livid.

Iguess we come from completely different cultures. My dh and I talked about it just yesterday, about what was acceptable and what was not and he agreedw with me after I explained my point of view. I expect my dh to be my best friend and that he won't give anyone else more than he gives me in any area. if he refuses to work hard enough to make our relationship great then he would have to settle for less than whatever he is giving me in every other relationship he has. I expect absolute loyalty and devotion from my dh. I want to be his nnnumber one friend. maybe I am expecting alot but he knew this si what I expected when we got married.
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