Raising your spirited child thread...

[mattjule]

I am reading Raising Your Spirited Child and would love to talk to other mamas that found the book helpful and insightful. Anyone interested?

[sassytap]

I found the book very helpful. My 4 year old dd is VERY spirited, as am I. I remember after Echo was born and the nurse was showing us how to give her a bath, as soon as the first drop of water touched her head she started screaming and never even took a breath until the nurse finished. She was totally blue, kicking and punching and the nurse just looked at me and said "You've got a live one here." She's never "mellowed" and when she's happy the whole world is rainbows and sparkles and just aglow. She is intense and persistent about everything she does and wants to do it perfectly. She is extremely extroverted and one of the best things I learned from the book was how much she really NEEDS to fill up her reserves socially. Even when she was 3 months old she wanted to be perched kangaroo style in the sling interacting with every person she saw. There is just no way for me to be enough to fill that for her so from very early on I learned to involve her in play groups and music groups and library times.and church, and.... You get the idea. It's incredible how much easier it makes the day go. The other thing that was very helpful to me was finding out how spirited I am and how explosive or how positive that can be. But I can trully relate to the intense physicality of her emotions in a way that my husband and sister just never could. i KNOW what it's like for emotions to be so strong that your whole body is crashing and it feels like your chest will rip apart. I actually should look through the book again because it's been so long, but I'm glad to see this post and to see what others respond.

[Dechen]

Sarah, my dd is similar in many ways.

One of the things that jumped out at me while reading "Raising Your Spirited Child" is how well *I* fit the descriptions. It was scary! Dd definately gets her intensity and sensitivity and energy from me. While it can be exhausting to help her manage her emotions, I understand what it feels like to be hit by overwhelming waves of emotion.

One of the hardest things for me is knowing when to let her emotions run their course, and when to step in and help. Left to her own devices, she can work herself up to vomit in a short period of time, over issues that seem fairly minor. I don't want to reward tantrums, yet I don't think it is kind or loving to leave her overwhelmed and out of control, if I can help her.

[mattjule]

Dechen-that is such a hard thing to figure out, made more difficult because it is different for every child.

What I love about the book is how it reinforces what I have already been doing. I feel like I have to defend my parenting to everyone I know and I am always saying "that doesn't work with him" to every piece of advice. I don't think people believe me and I start to wonder how I can know it doesn't work when I have never tried it (like time-outs every time he hits-I did finally try it. It didn't work). The book uses a lot of things I was already doing and it is so nice to know I WAS doing the right thing no matter what anyone said.

I agree that it is shocking how much I am like my spirited child. I have realized that I need some therapy. If I don't feel good about the way I am, how can I teach my child not to feel the same shame? Honestly, I can't list one good thing about the way I am. I could tell him good things about himself but if he sees the similarity between us and the difference in how I feel about it, I think he is going to start not believing me. And anyway, *I* want to feel good about it too.

This is the first time someone has told me it is okay to have intense reactions, that I can't stop getting very angry quickly but I CAN control what I do with that anger. I have been trying for the 3 years ds has been alive to stuff it and not let things anger me. It totally doesn't work and I don't need the guilt on top of it plus the anger that I feel guilty. Sheesh!

When I first started the book I thought the insistence on labels was silly. And still I think some of them don't quite jive. But it makes such a difference! Instead of seeing my ds as a wonderful kid with some very troubling behavior, I can just see him as a wonderful kid. I don't have to add a disclaimer to him. And I can teach him how to channel his challenging feelings into something constructive in ways I was never taught to do.

[pippet]

I've heard lots of good things about this book! My dd was the easiest baby but once she hit about 18 months she started getting more and more intense. Now at 3 after pulling my hair out for a year trying to figure out the best way to parent her and seeing her tantrums escalate I've come to see that she's different than most of her 3 year old peers. I can't believe sometimes when I look at others kids and how they can take their 3 year old to a store or exercise class and the 3 year old will sit there contently or ask questions politely and just behave nicely and without incident for 15-30-45 minutes. Not that I should compare I know but it has been an eye opener to witness my 3 year old as the only one in the class (whether it's gym 'n swim or soccer) not participating while the other kids are listening to the teachers/coaches and anxious to please - mine is always the one off on her own doing her own thing and when asked to rejoin the group, with arms crossed stomps off with "I don't want to".

And do you hear this a lot? "Wow... she's got a lot of energy, you really have your hands full with her don't you?"

um yeah... do you wanna help out? :P

Guess I'll be picking up a copy of that book - does it give you tools for how to avoid butting heads all the time???

[quaz]

I read this book when dd was about 5m, and it was helpful then. LOL. DD is spirited/high needs, whatever term ya want.

I think it was this book...one of the most useful things was about me. The some people fill about their reserves by being with others, and some fill it up be being alone. Well, I NEED alone time. This hit me when at 5-6m, she was still waking up MANY times each night, and was taking 3 hours to get to sleep each night. I think recognizing that is how I fuel up, was important.


DD is 15m now, and tantrums all the time...has since 6m. I'll have to post on that other tantruming thread too.

Tammy

[mattjule]

Tara-It teaches a lot of ways to avoid butting heads and is very AP oriented. It doesn't ask you to do anything that goes against your mama instinct. I really like that.

[AngelBee]

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[mamazee]

I have a spirited child and I read the book when she was between a year and 16 months or so, but for some reason I don't remember it at all. I hope it's because I incorporated what she wrote about, or it was what I was doing naturally, or something. I'm going to have to dig that book out again.

I don't get as many strangers asking me if there's something wrong with my daughter, or if she has ADHD (can you even tell with a very young child?) I don't know how anyone could think she has ADHD. Once she gets her attention focused on something I can't get her pried away from it for the life of me. But she doesn't tantrum as much, or as long, or whatever. She has other ways of expressing her anger and frustration. When she gets angry she pretends to be a tiger or dinosaur and makes terrible growling and roaring noises. I've had people tell me I should punish her for that, but I'm so happy to have her find a way to express how angry she is without tantruming, hitting, biting, etc. Back in the day, we got kicked out of library storytimes, we had to stop going to a playgroup, and we could never go out to eat. It's suprising how much more we can do with her now. We still have struggles but it isn't nearly as bad. I tried dance classes with her a year ago but she wasn't really able to handle them. My husband said he thinks maybe I should try gymnastics classes now. I hate putting money into these activities when she was trouble following directions and doing what everyone else is doing. She's going to preschool in September. We'll see how that goes.

I found a spirited child checklist on the internet and I see we still have problems with many of these:

Intensity - she reacts so strongly, both positively and negatively, to things that it freaks people out. I'm used to it so it doesn't bother me.

Persistance . . . ARGH not much to say about that other than "yup".

Sensitivity - her ability to speak has really helped with this. I remember when she was a baby the first summer and she kept screaming in her carseat until I figured out she wanted a blanket over her legs because there was an A/C vent near her. Now she can say "That is too loud in my ears" or "too bright in my eyes" or tell me that her socks aren't on right or something like that and we can adjust whatever is bothering her. I have to run the vacuum after dh gets home and can take her somewhere out of earshot. She hates the sound of the vacuum.

Perceptiveness - or distractibility - it is very hard to walk even just from the car to the house with her. I just give enough time to sit on the front porch now until she's looked at everything. I think the answer to that problem is allowing for extra time in everything.

Adaptability - I ask her about everything. What clothes does she want to wear. How does she want her sandwich cut. Does she want water in her yellow sippy cup, her blue sippy cup? I now know I have to ask about everything. If I forget to ask I have to be willing to throw toast cut in triangles away and make new toast. I know not everyone is willing to throw away food but I'm not willing to get into a fight over a piece of toast.

Regularity - people think she should have a regular bed time and she just doesn't get tired at the same time every night or even sleep the same amount of time every night. I let her tell me when she's tired. It usually happens between 8:30 and 9:30 but I don't complain if it's later than that. She usually likes to sleep with me but sometimes she wants to sleep alone. I let her sleep where she wants. She was nursing through the night until around 2. She still wakes up in the middle of the night and needs hugs. My parents want her to spend the night with them but with her irregular sleeping habits and their reluctance to be flexible, I just don't think it's a good idea. She also doesn't always eat at mealtimes and just eats when she's hungry. That drives her grandparents nuts.

Energy - not much to say about that. She wakes up running and runs non stop until she tells me she's tired and wants to go to sleep. We've actually recently progressed. She used to just suddenly get quiet and we'd notice she was asleep (hopefully after we'd gotten her ready for bed.) Now she tells us ahead of time. If I put some soapy water in the sink, I can keep her busy with that while I do other things for a pretty long time. A sink full of soapy water is the only way my house stays clean.

First reaction - this is the one case where she doesn't fit the "spirited kid" mold. My daughter loves new things. New people, new places, she even usually likes trying new foods.

Moody - She's either very very happy or very very angry. She goes back and forth. She is not very often neutral. If ever. She's happy much more often than angry.

I'll have to re-read the book now that I've finished Unconditional Parenting.

[mattjule]

Originally Posted by mamazee

Intensity - she reacts so strongly, both positively and negatively, to things that it freaks people out. I'm used to it so it doesn't bother me. He has intense reactions too. But I mostly get the "your kid is a brat" look rather than anyone actually being freaked out. He isn't quite on that level, though he has taught me a lot about empathy (with other moms).

Persistance . . . ARGH not much to say about that other than "yup". :LOL

Sensitivity - She hates the sound of the vacuum. Tain hates the vacuum too! He always says "okay, don't scare me." Then runs into his room and shuts the door. After that it is safe to vacuum. :LOL He doesn't like any loud noise.

Perceptiveness - or distractibility - it is very hard to walk even just from the car to the house with her. I just give enough time to sit on the front porch now until she's looked at everything. I think the answer to that problem is allowing for extra time in everything. I do this too! If I really need him to hurry I find that if I keep up a litany of "hurry, hurry" or as a friend says "quick like a bunny" he can focus a bit better (I would think this would annoy him, but it doesn't seem to. I think because half the time he doesn't hear me anyway). Also I ask him how fast he can run to the car, I bet I can beat him, etc. Didn't work in the store today, but it does work more often than not.

Adaptability - I ask her about everything. What clothes does she want to wear. How does she want her sandwich cut. Does she want water in her yellow sippy cup, her blue sippy cup? I now know I have to ask about everything. If I forget to ask I have to be willing to throw toast cut in triangles away and make new toast. I know not everyone is willing to throw away food but I'm not willing to get into a fight over a piece of toast. I do this too! I am realizing I do it way more than anyone else in his life. It stems off so much frustration on his part and lots of times when he is having a problem it helps him forget his problem because he gets so engrossed with making the decision. It only works if I give him 2-3 options, though. More than that and he falls apart.

Regularity - people think she should have a regular bed time and she just doesn't get tired at the same time every night or even sleep the same amount of time every night. I let her tell me when she's tired. It usually happens between 8:30 and 9:30 but I don't complain if it's later than that. She usually likes to sleep with me but sometimes she wants to sleep alone. I let her sleep where she wants. She was nursing through the night until around 2. She still wakes up in the middle of the night and needs hugs. My parents want her to spend the night with them but with her irregular sleeping habits and their reluctance to be flexible, I just don't think it's a good idea. She also doesn't always eat at mealtimes and just eats when she's hungry. That drives her grandparents nuts.

Energy - not much to say about that. She wakes up running and runs non stop until she tells me she's tired and wants to go to sleep. We've actually recently progressed. She used to just suddenly get quiet and we'd notice she was asleep (hopefully after we'd gotten her ready for bed.) Now she tells us ahead of time. If I put some soapy water in the sink, I can keep her busy with that while I do other things for a pretty long time. A sink full of soapy water is the only way my house stays clean.

First reaction - this is the one case where she doesn't fit the "spirited kid" mold. My daughter loves new things. New people, new places, she even usually likes trying new foods. He's about 50/50 but I am definitely a rejector so that is hard.

Moody - She's either very very happy or very very angry. She goes back and forth. She is not very often neutral. If ever. She's happy much more often than angry. He has days. Days where he is in a good mood and days where it just sucks for no apparent reason. I tend to be negative (though not with him, just a practical, half empty how do we fill the glass type person)

Interestingly enough, he was never much of a fit thrower. He threw some doozies at home but never in public, or at least VERY rarely. I think it was a combination of very careful parenting when we'd leave the house and his extreme introversion. He hates being noticed, like when someone tries to ooh and aah over him he used to tell them "Shut up!' in a really nasty voice. At least he just ignores them now or growls. Most strangers have no idea what an improvement that is! :LOL

[pippet]

Hey mamazee... what website did you find that checklist?

[mamazee]

Originally Posted by pippet

Hey mamazee... what website did you find that checklist?

I found it here: http://parenting.ivillage.com/gs/gsb...,,45pv,00.html

[Dov]

Dov's not posting this one, I am (you asked for mamas... so I kicked him off the Mac for a moment).

Our only gripe was that it didn't go into enough detail on how to parent the spirited child. We have one BP child and one spirited child. We're visual, role-play-learner type parents and reading the book wasn't helpful in figuring out good strategies to parent with nor was it helpful in mitigating public scenarios (where others are not as "educated" as we). But in terms of identifying and describing the spirited child, it rules!

[darlindeliasmom]

Dov's partner: I always wondered if the workbook would help with that...or having a group of parents to meet and discuss, so you could hash out what YOU do and what works...

I like the book, mostly because of the "you are not alone; you are not a bad parent; you did not make your child like this" tone...your child just is what she is...

I find the "language" reframing helpful in dealing with others, like the book says. use the old broken record routine--"Man, your kid is stubborn!!" "Yes, we find that she is very persistent and really stays on task til she gets things done." As an aside, now that she is 8, her persistence and intensity are assets as she learns softball and karate. To see her focused, intense concentration in class is a wonder. Her coaches comment on it POSITIVELY. What a change from the days not so long ago when she COULDN'T stay in the pool for swim class or in the gym for tumbling.

Anyway, hi. I have read the book I think 3 times...when she was a toddler (she was a happy but intense baby; sassytap's great description of the extrovert in the kangaroo carry was my girl), then when she was 5 and we were dealing with school starting (and mourning the loss of the homeschool dream, because my intensity and her intensity equaled explosions), and just this last spring, when mean girl stuff sprang up at school (it's amusing to the pack to goad the intense girl into reaction!!

Kids Parents and Power Struggles and Kids Are Worth It! have helped me along these lines as well.

[TanyaMT]

This was the first book for DH and I that made us feel like we weren't complete failures and didn't have an abnormal child, just a "spirited" one. Our copy is a little worse for wear for all the reading but it is actually time to get it out again as DS is 3 and going into new stages and changing. I like that the book is adaptable and allows us to go back and refresh our memories or reread sections that weren't as applicable when DS was tiny.

I really can emphasize to the poster above who couldn't go out to eat, got kicked out of the library, etc. I was so tired of relatives telling me I must have been doing something wrong because DS was the way he was (and so-and-so is the same age and isn't like that, blah, blah, blah). Now they are probably sick of telling me that is the way he is and there is NOTHING wrong with him and he is going to be a very successful adult with that persistence, energy, curiousity and sheer passion for life. :-)

[phathui5]

I've wanted to go through the workbook with a group of people in person for years. Does anyone know if there's a way to find out when/where study groups for that meet?

[Proudly AP]

Originally Posted by phathui5

I've wanted to go through the workbook with a group of people in person for years. Does anyone know if there's a way to find out when/where study groups for that meet?

perhaps some parents here would be interested in doing something like this on-line? would that even work?

hi, my dd (40 months old) is very spirited, as well. i have been 'book-hopping' rysc, unconditional parenting, and playful parenting.

i really enjoyed rysc, and i bought the workbook, and have simply been reading through it on my own. i also found that the reframing the language had a positive impact. dd now will say, 'i have lots of energy in my body!'. i tell her she's exuberant, energetic, enthusiastic, and dramatic.