14 month old smacking me and biting me

[minasmom]

hi all!,
I've recently been dealing with an issue with my dd who is 14 months old.
She seems to get quite angry for reasons that I can't figure out and while
nursing will lash out at me and smack my face or push it really hard to the side. Also she is starting to bite me all over the place [wherever she can get a bite] and I just don't know what causes this and how to help her. I try to stop her before she hits me by holding her hand and telling her 'you don't hit mama' but she just smiles and swipes me as soon as i let go. biting is the same, i try to bring her up to my eye level and she wont look me in the eye ever and tell her not to bite mama. She sometimes gets really angry when i tell her this, cries very hard.

I just don't know how to deal with this. She has hit other people as well [a little girl i babysit] and her dad, but mostly its me she lashes out to. Anyone have any suggestions how i can handle this? I'm trying not to get too upset about it, but its really bothering me

thanks
--Angela

[cjr]

Do you think she's doing it to hurt you, or trying to channel her emotions?

Our dd#2 acted this way when she was an infant/toddler. She would be sitting on our lap and being as sweet as could be and then all of a sudden she would grit her teeth and choke us, or hurt us in some other agressive way. We never could figure out why. It is only now that I am beginning to understand as I watch her behavior towards her little brother and older sister. She is so full of love and emotion, that I think she has a hard time expressing it. She loves us, absolutely unconditionally. She gets very upset when the family dinamic is disturbed. She will want to give ds a hug and end up squeezing him so hard he screams. She's not trying to hurt she just can't figure out how to show her emotions without being overly aggressive. It's like she gets so carried away that she becomes hurtful. She has all of these emotions and does not know how to deal with them.

That's the only thing I can figure. She's very lovey and sweet. She is always kissing and hugging, but then she takes it just one step too far and becomes hurtful. However, when she was smaller she just came across as hurtful.

[Wilhemina]

Just a couple of ideas, FWIW:

(By the way, I LOVE the name Mina!)

1. Use positive phrasing. Instead of "Don't hit mama" try "Be gentle with mama" or, "hands are for soft touches." Fills her mind with something she can do instead of keeping the negative action in her mind but making it off limits. Sorta like asking someone to "whatever you do, don't picture an elephant in your mind."

2. Give her something else (especially while nursing) she can hold, squeeze, pinch, etc. A blanket? Stuffed animal?

3. Maybe she is just going to be a very physical person. Make sure she gets plenty of opportunities to explore this side of herself appropriately. Outside play, wrestling on the bed with someone willing, toy tools to bang?, pillows to punch?

4. Before you begin every nursing session, sit her in your lap. You have her full attention. Remind her that this is a gentle cuddle time. The mimis (that's what we call my boobs :LOL ) are delicate and need only gentle hands and gentle mouths. [I don't know if everyone here will agree with this, but I would unlatch her and set her down - gently, of course - as soon as she bit me. Natural consequence for biting, to me, is to be removed from the person being bitten. You can immediately pick her up again, with another reminder to use gentle mouths with Mommy.]

You (of course!) have a much better idea if she is really expressing anger than I do, but from your post it seems possible that the problematic behaviors are not motivated by anger.

[mamazee]

This is completely unrelated to GD, but Mina is a traditional Dutch nickname for Wilhelmina. My great-aunt Mina was a Wilhelmina.

[Tanibani]

Author Aletha Solter has a theory (she wrote the book Aware Baby and others) that babies (all humans) need to release stress/trauma (maybe there was birth trauma, maybe there was built up stresses as a baby...) to heal from them, and the primary way babies do this (since they can't talk it out the way we do, and sometimes we need to cry afterwards anyway) is by CRYING.

She is very AP. She is not a fan of CIO. She is a fan of comforting them (holding them) if they are having a tantrum or crying. She says if babies don't cry enough when they are babies, if they are immediately shushed, nursed to stop it, rocked, put a paci in the mouth, whatever... the need doesn't go away... it will come up later as aggression. Seems toddlers hitting for no reason is pretty common with APers.

I saw the same thing with my own toddler (he is now 5). I also didn't know what the heck was going on either.

I NEVER let my son cry as a baby (and he has a lot of birth/hospital trauma) I thought it was my motherly duty to comfort him at the first peep, anticipating all needs and meeting them. I did this out of guilt... I felt so bad about his hospital separation from me.

I attended her talk a few months ago and learned a lot. My son has been very difficult in the past year (since his sibling was born) and her thing was (similar to Alfie Kohn) is that any misbehavior is due to unmet needs. I bought her books... I was so desperate for advice, I had a phone consultation with her. She asked me a bunch of questions via e-mail... My son was "high-needs" and her theory is that HN babies are babies that need to cry. Hmmmm.... she might on to something.... and that NOW he still needs to release whatever trauma to heal. That he might be looking for excuses to cry/have a tantrum. YES! He does this way more with me than with DH. So she said... that basically he's going to go through 3 months of "colic" now. Lovely, isn't it?

But, I have been meeting his needs and his behavior has improved. And... whereas I used to "give in" to his demands a lot, now I just say "no" more, allowing him to cry/rage. But I'm dealing with a 5 year old who is very sassy with me because I never gave him good limits. I was a permissive parent.

Anyway, her theory is not very popular with first time, new AP mamas. Had I read her beliefs when my son was a baby, I would have dismissed her as kook too. I don't anymore. You can do a search on this board for her and find posts.

But... I think her book(s) is worth reading. Make up your own mind.

She also has a website with articles.
http://www.awareparenting.com/

[mamakay]

My ds is almost 2, and has drifted in and out of these behaviors since he was one.
As my ds becomes more verbal, he's doing it less and less. I think it's just their way of saying they're mad a lot of times.
So, try and sympathize with the emotion, but remind her "Be gentle with mama."
Mostly, don't let it get to you. It's really not a big deal.

[twostraightlines]

Hi, my son is nearly 18 months, and a few months ago we went through something similar. He would hit me and dh for seemingly no reason, he would reach up and slap me while nursing, even if he wasn't agitated for any particular reason. He would also throw things at our heads. He seems to have pretty much stopped it now, he does it rarely. I never did figure out why. He is a good communicator, and I can usually figure out what he is asking for, so I don't think this was the problem.

If you are anything like me, you are probably wondering if you are heading down the road with an aggressive toddler, but I bet your dc will outgrow it too. Just sit tight, set clear limits, but also structure your environment to limit "no's." I was pretty happy the other day when my son was playing with his best pal, who he occasionally was aggressive towards, only to find that his friend is now the aggressor. I guess his non-AP Mama got to see what it felt like for the shoe to be on the other foot! :LOL

[Destinye]

Originally Posted by Tanibani

Author Aletha Solter has a theory (she wrote the book Aware Baby and others) that babies (all humans) need to release stress/trauma (maybe there was birth trauma, maybe there was built up stresses as a baby...) to heal from them, and the primary way babies do this (since they can't talk it out the way we do, and sometimes we need to cry afterwards anyway) is by CRYING.

I really liked her book Tears and Tantrums and have/had a High Needs Baby. Since I let her sometimes just cry when I felt it was pent up emotions she has been a lot happier.

I also use homeopathy and flower remedies too.

[Dal]

I think the Aletha Solter position sounds dangerous. AP is not to coerce babies to be quiet. It is to meet their needs. If an AP baby needs to cry, s/he will, whatever the caregiver is doing. Sometimes we do everything we can and they still cry. In this case, yes, the baby does have something going on and may just need to cry to get it out. In these cases, the baby can be comforted to our best abilities and helped through her or his pain. Still though, I would ALWAYS with an infant, try to figure out why they are crying and make sure everything has been covered.

Solter is suggesting that something is wrong with promptly responding to our babies cries. This is not the case. Crying is their way of communicating. If they are very unhappy and need to deal with something, they will do that, there will be no stopping them. If they stop crying because they are offered a breast, rocked, or ssssshd, this is because that has comforted them and met their need.

I can think of so many scary ways of interpreting what Solter is saying, and that these would lead to ignoring a baby's genuine needs on the false premise that the baby just needs to cry. Babies do what they need to do. A baby who needs to cry will cry.

That's my take on it.

And... there are a tonne of nonAP'd toddlers who are also aggressive, so blaming this on AP doesn't convince me.

[Destinye]

Originally Posted by Dal

Solter is suggesting that something is wrong with promptly responding to our babies cries. This is not the case.

I don't think she is suggesting that at all having read one of her books and looked at her website which states:

"Recognition of the healing effects of play, laughter, and crying in the context of a loving parent/child relationship"

as well as the following:

Aware Parenting Consists of:

Attachment-style parenting
Natural childbirth and early bonding
Plenty of physical contact
Prolonged breast-feeding
Prompt responsiveness to crying
Sensitive attunement
Non-punitive discipline
No punishments of any kind (including spanking, "time-out", and artificial "consequences")
No rewards or bribes
Search for underlying needs and feelings
Anger management for parents
Peaceful conflict-resolution (family meetings, mediation, etc.)
Prevention and healing of stress and trauma
Recognition of stress and trauma as primary causes of behavioral and emotional problems
Emphasis on prevention of stress and trauma
Recognition of the healing effects of play, laughter, and crying in the context of a loving parent/child relationship
Respectful, empathic listening and acceptance of children's emotions



----------------

I don't agree with everything she (or anyone) says but I did find some useful info and it did make sense to me in context. She is not advocating CIO or ignore your baby or don't meet their needs.

[Dal]

I hope you are right. The summaries though -- and that's all I was given to go by, and was meant to be helpful -- give a bad impression. Some people may read just the summary. It did say that AP parents tend to respond quickly to a crying baby and that sometimes a baby just needs to cry; the implication here is that we shouldn't always respond to a crying baby -- at least not quickly or in the same way that AP parents tend to do. At least that's the implication that I'm seeing. Her point seems to be more than the basic claim that sometimes we do all we can and a baby will just cry to release built up tensions. She was also blaming "over"attentiveness to baby's cries to pent up frustration that is unleashed as (in this case) violentesque aggression. To me this still sounds like a dangerous theory. Perhaps you can elaborate on it so that I can better see her point and how she means for it to be applied.

[starbarrett]

My 14mo has just started doing this, too. We have a dog (that is super tolerant) and when petting her, she'll suddenly grip her fur and pull with all her might, all the while bearing her teeth. It's so primal looking! I, of course, rush over and save the dog and tell her no. She also bites me. I just have to think that it's a stage. I agree with pp-- it seems to be a product of overwelming emotion.

[mamakay]

Originally Posted by Dal

I hope you are right. The summaries though -- and that's all I was given to go by, and was meant to be helpful -- give a bad impression. Some people may read just the summary. It did say that AP parents tend to respond quickly to a crying baby and that sometimes a baby just needs to cry; the implication here is that we shouldn't always respond to a crying baby -- at least not quickly or in the same way that AP parents tend to do. At least that's the implication that I'm seeing. Her point seems to be more than the basic claim that sometimes we do all we can and a baby will just cry to release built up tensions. She was also blaming "over"attentiveness to baby's cries to pent up frustration that is unleashed as (in this case) violentesque aggression. To me this still sounds like a dangerous theory. Perhaps you can elaborate on it so that I can better see her point and how she means for it to be applied.

I got that impression, too.

[Destinye]

Originally Posted by Dal

I hope you are right. The summaries though -- and that's all I was given to go by, and was meant to be helpful -- give a bad impression. Some people may read just the summary. It did say that AP parents tend to respond quickly to a crying baby and that sometimes a baby just needs to cry; the implication here is that we shouldn't always respond to a crying baby -- at least not quickly or in the same way that AP parents tend to do. At least that's the implication that I'm seeing. Her point seems to be more than the basic claim that sometimes we do all we can and a baby will just cry to release built up tensions. She was also blaming "over"attentiveness to baby's cries to pent up frustration that is unleashed as (in this case) violentesque aggression. To me this still sounds like a dangerous theory. Perhaps you can elaborate on it so that I can better see her point and how she means for it to be applied.

Well maybe the PP who has actually talked with her could explain it better. I did not get this impression (and certainly if that is the case it is not what I believe in either) but I do think she has some valid points.

Her book did make sense to me though as a reminder that sometimes babies do need to just vent or cry and to recognize when this is the case and not try to fix things. I know sometimes I need a good cry too!

But I understood it to mean that you hold your child and are right there for them, and certainly not to ignore their cries or needs. I still nurse DD for comfort a lot though and have never not responded to her!

[Tanibani]

Originally Posted by Destinye

Well maybe the PP who has actually talked with her could explain it better.

No, not really. I wish I could * explain it better. * I did the best I could and people are still going to be... appalled. The best anybody else can do is read her books if they wish. Or better yet, hear her in person. She makes way more sense in person than on paper.

Originally Posted by Destinye

I did not get this impression (and certainly if that is the case it is not what I believe in either) but I do think she has some valid points.

I did not get that impression either and I agree she has valid points.

Dal, which summary are you referring to? Mine?

"the implication here is that we shouldn't always respond to a crying baby"

I disagree. And AS flat out states that one should * always * respond to a crying baby. Comfort in arms. You just don't leave them there hysterical. You try to determine if there is a problem, obviously and fix it if you can.

But I (and many) just pacify with shoving boob into mouth. The need to cry (if there is a need to cry) according to Solter, does not go away. It will keep resurfacing... or later come up as aggression.

I think she is on to something.

I'm not really interested in defending AS online. Too tedious. I don't have the time.

Her articles explain her view pretty plainly.

http://www.awareparenting.com/articles.htm

If they don't answer your questions, you can always e-mail her directly and see if that helps.

And I disagree that her views are somewhat dangerous. I give parents more credit than that. Her first book is called "aware parenting" because I think it helps babies become more self-aware, especially when they are allowed to express their true emotions (rather than have them suppressed, over and over again, to the point where even they don't know what it is they want.) Dangerous? No. Worthy of attention? Yes. Mothering also published her articles. The editors of M also see her writings as worthy of attention, as I do. People are free to take it or leave it.

[mamakay]

Tanibani,
I'm not appaled or anything. Maybe it was just the way I read it...or misread it.
I can see that babies just need to cry sometimes. You can usually tell when that's the case when they *can't* really be comforted.
But I guess if mom kept trying to force nursing, maybe they'd just give up and nurse, with their need to just...vent?...going unmet?
Is that what you were meaning?
Kinda like the "crying in arms" thing?

[Dechen]

My dd cried all the time as a baby. There was no stopping her. She was colicky, and continued to be grumpy and opinionated.

She is now a toddler, and aggression comes very easily to her. The aggression is most certainly not pent-up emotion from babyhood. She's a firecracker, and always has been.

I don't think AP-d toddlers are more likely to be aggressive. I think AP parents are more likely to be alarmed by aggression, and so we talk about it. We're against hitting, and when our kids hit it upsets us in a very personal way.

[Destinye]

Originally Posted by Dechen

My dd cried all the time as a baby. There was no stopping her. She was colicky, and continued to be grumpy and opinionated.

She is now a toddler, and aggression comes very easily to her. The aggression is most certainly not pent-up emotion from babyhood. She's a firecracker, and always has been.

I don't think AP-d toddlers are more likely to be aggressive. I think AP parents are more likely to be alarmed by aggression, and so we talk about it. We're against hitting, and when our kids hit it upsets us in a very personal way.

I definitely think a lot of it is personality! I don't think AP toddlers are more likely to be aggressive either. The biggest thing I have to watch DD for is hugging the other toddlers and knocking them down as she is too enthusiastic! That and (luckily gently) pointing out their eyes!

But I do think AS has a point that most AP parents are already aware of and that is to make sure we are helping our DS/DD to express and learn about their emotions and in that context it is great. Plus its just one of many things to consider.

[Tanibani]

Originally Posted by mamakay

But I guess if mom kept trying to force nursing, maybe they'd just give up and nurse, with their need to just...vent?...going unmet? Is that what you were meaning?

Yes. That is exactly the point. After awhile, babies/toddlers DO welcome the comfort of nursing (most people have seen this with their own experience). It's a relief. Solter's point is that it can turn into a, her words, a comfort pattern.

Anything can be a comfort pattern- something to use to self-soothe when what someone really needs is to express underlying emotions and release them for healing.
- comfort nursing (and this is very contraversial because LLL encourages comfort nursing. This is what gets nursing mothers up in arms.)
- TV watching (many kids ask to watch TV. A question to ask yourself is WHY. Is something upsetting them? Wouldn't it be better to talk it out or work it out through play???)
- using a paci
- eating food (when they aren't hungry)
- there might be more.

And nursing for comfort doesn't even have to be forced. Solter's point is, the baby/child learns to suppress their crying by nursing (when they aren't hungry.)

Again, I can see how this would be upsetting to people

p. 75

When the stress-release function of crying is not well understood, it is easy to assume that nursing is an appropriate way to calm a fussy baby. Nursing does have a temporary calming effect, which serves a biological purpose. The pacifying effect of sucking is probaby a built-in mechanism designed to quiet infants temporarily when their stomachs are full, so they do not become too active and regurgitate their food. However, if you nurse your baby when she needs to cry, this will serve only to postpone the crying until a later time. Nursing babies frequently for "comfort" can cause them to be chronically fussy and demanding throughtout the day (and night), because they never have a chance to release pent-up stress through crying. Nursing can therefore easily become a control pattern that the baby learns to depend on to repress crying, just as some babies suck their thumbs or a pacifier (see Chapter 2).

and so... if a baby or child's needs are continually suppressed (in a well-meaning way) they are really not self-aware, are they?

Anyway I think Solter is on to something.

That being said, I still comfort nurse... I just gadge it... after some crying in arms, I offer my boob to see if that would help. I am not "perfect" or trying to follow Solter to a T. But I appreciate her POV and think it's something to consider and think about.

I don't think AP kids are more likely to be aggressive. Both AP'd and mainstream kids can be aggressive. It is possible that both groups needs are not being met. It is pretty obvious with the mainstream group, but not so obvious with the AP group (what? a need to cry?!?!?)

[Dechen]

Gotta run but wanted to say quickly - I don't think toddler aggression is always about unmet needs.