Do you allow your dd's to wear 2-piece swimsuits?? - Page 5

[DomesticOverlord]

I had a hard time finding a one piece for my ONE year old. I finally got her a rash guard and matching board shorts. My DH is the one who was well and truly offended by the bikinis on babies. I don't see it as that big a deal.

The "prosti-tot" clothes can get offensive and don't get me started on the Bratz but the bikini thing doesn't bug me as long as it's not like a tiny little thong on a 4 year old or something.

[talk de jour]

Originally Posted by Joan

I don't understand the connection being made between bathing suits and pedophiles.

I thought we stopped blaming rape victims for the clothing they wear decades ago.

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[Mami]

Interesting... It never occurred to me to put my dd in a 2 piece, but for different reasons than I've heard here. My dd has only ever gone in a swim diaper(no top) or naked, she's 21 months). I grew up in Europe though... I really think putting a 2 piece on a kid before they have boobs is a bit odd. What are they covering up? You don't cover boys nipples... and before they develop girls' are the same. It almost seems like you're making them aware of their sexuality before it's time.

However, if my dd wanted to wear a 2 piece I'd probably let her wear it, same with a one piece or just undies or nothing. I probably wouldn't let her go naked in a public pool, mainly because I'm sure that there's some rule against it in this country but in our apartment pool or at friends' I would if it were allowed of course. It definitely is a cultural thing because to me the whole 1 piece/ 2 piece dilemma is kind of prudish... sorry

I also agree with the pp's who said that what your dd(or any child for that matter) wears is not what attracts a pedophile - they are sick in the head people already.

[Storm Bride]

Originally Posted by mamapoppins

I am not trying to blame the victim-just reacting to a sexually violent society(something the Ladies of the feminist movement did not have to deal with-as said by my StepMom who is 53!!).

My mom is almost 62. She had a boy in elementary school threaten to grab her breasts when she tried to take a baseball from him...she was almost dragged into a car and raped by a group of guys when she was 15...her first husband cracked her ribs when she was pregnant...

I'm sorry - but the "ladies of the feminist movement" were also living in a sexually violent society - it was just hidden better than it is now. When a woman who is raped knows that her own parents will probably blame her, and everybody else definitely will...when no charges are going to be filed...when 90% of the men who know her will decide she's "easy" because it happened once...

Of course they didn't talk about it as much - that doesn't mean it didn't happen.

[Storm Bride]

With respect to children and modesty and sexuality in general...

My son didn't wear clothes by choice until he was about four. He ran around naked all the time. There was nothing sexual about it, and I found myself very wary around the few people (unfortunately including my neighbours fora while) who persisted in seeing my naked 3-year-old son in a sexual fashion. (The woman equated my son being naked in the front yard to herself sitting in the front yard with her vibrator masturbating!!!)

Children do not have that kind of sexuality. Nudity is a way of being comfortable and exploring their bodies. When dd reaches down and talks about "Emma's bits" during diaper changes, I see that as being exactly the same thing as when she identifies toes, elbows, ears or hair. She's just figuring out all her parts.

Modesty doesn't enter into it, imo - she's just a little girl...with bottoms on, you can't even tell if she's a girl or a boy (well, you can - she has a very feminine face...but that's the only way). So, who cares if her shirt's off???



re: Pedophiles. I did own a 2-piece suit when I was a little girl. But, neither of the pedophiles who picked me for a target ever saw me in it. One of them never saw me in anything but jeans (loose painter-pants) and shirts - sometimes t-shirts, sometimes long sleeves). I was a tomboy where clothes were concerned and was very self-conscious about my early development, so I didn't show anything off if I could help it. That doesn't matter to sexually mentally ill.

[luvmypoonchkie]

I was at a parade recently and there was a girl there (maybe 11 or 12) in a RIDICULOUSLY short skirt (BARELY covered her private parts) and her mom was there, standing right beside her. This seems to be commonplace now though. Pedophiles are going to be attracted to young children no matter what they are wearing, but what I don't understand is why would parents allow their young girls to dress in clothing that puts them out there as bait. I don't think women (or children) should ever be "blamed" for a sex crime being committed against them because of what they are wearing, but the cold hard fact is that men are visual creatures and putting a pretty, young girl out there in front of them in provacative clothing (regardless of whether or not the child realizes it's provacative) is like putting a juicy steak in front of a man who hasn't eaten in a week. Sexual offenders are sick people, they don't care about women's lib or what's politically correct, and they are EVERYWHERE, even in the nicest of neighborhoods. Would you leave for vacation with your house unlocked and a sign outside advertising what's inside because we should stop blaming ourselves for getting robbed because we have nice things and we should be able to choose to leave our doors unlocked without consequence because it's our right! Would you leave the keys to your beautiful new car in the ignition because we should stop blaming ourselves for getting our cars stolen just because we have nice cars and car thiefs need to respect that! No, you would take the logical steps to insure that your belongings were safe, be it locks or alarm systems or whatever. You would be aware that there are criminals out there who will take advantage of your inadequate security measures and that they will prey on your ignorance. Are your children not as important as your material belongings? There's a difference between blaming a victim of a sex crime and being a smart parent who doesn't want to set their innocent child out as bait in a world filled with malicious sex offenders.

[Storm Bride]

I don't consider that kind of thing to be "setting your child out as bait". Responsible men aren't going to behave in a sexual fashion toward a girl that young, no matter what she's wearing...and the men who will behave in that fashion will do so no matter what she's wearing. The clothes are irrelevant to that. I'd actually be more concerned about the boy who's only a couple of years older, as he's no more sexually mature than the girl is, and doesn't understand that she's still really just a kid.

I don't like overly sexy clothes on girls that young, though...because I believe dressing that way causes the girls to become confused. Preteen/teenage sexuality is fragile and complicated, and being allowed/encouraged to dress in a fashion that's beyond your own sexual "level" doesn't help. These girls really don't have a grasp of what sex is yet (I sure didn't at 12, and I was physically ahead of most of the girls I knew). I've watched some of the girls my son goes to school with (he's 12), and they're obviously playing with the "power" of sexual attractiveness, but they don't really understand what they're messing with. I can remember those days all too well. I think parents who allow it in the name of "fashion" are making a big mistake.


I've also seen several comments about "men being visual creatures" on this thread. This is a popular and accepted viewpoint, but I've also seen it debunked several times. I can assure you all that I get every bit as much of a charge out of the sight of a sexy man as my dh does out of the sight of a sexy woman. I think men receive more conditioning than women do about this - the whole "wolf whistle" aspect of guy culture. But, I don't believe it's really true that men are inherently more aroused by visuals than women are.

[the_lissa]

Originally Posted by Storm Bride

I don't consider that kind of thing to be "setting your child out as bait". Responsible men aren't going to behave in a sexual fashion toward a girl that young, no matter what she's wearing...and the men who will behave in that fashion will do so no matter what she's wearing. The clothes are irrelevant to that. I'd actually be more concerned about the boy who's only a couple of years older, as he's no more sexually mature than the girl is, and doesn't understand that she's still really just a kid.

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If that were the case, there would be a huge disproportionate amount of sexual assault victims who were wearing "provocative" clothes, but there aren't. (Recently, there was an 85 year old woman raped in my town.) Rape is about power. Agains, interviews with pedophiles show that they do not care what the child is wearing or prefer the child to be wearing more child like clothes.

[Storm Bride]

Originally Posted by the_lissa

Agains, interviews with pedophiles show that they do not care what the child is wearing or prefer the child to be wearing more child like clothes.

I didn't know that, but it doesn't surprise me. Their sexuality is skewed in an extremely abnormal direction, so why would we expect them to find the same things sexually attractive that a healthy adult does? Besides, what healthy adults find sexy varies wildly! I know men who love the more "sleazy" look, while others prefer something more demure...one guy told me he finds it sexier to have some mystery than to have it all hanging out. So, if normal men vary so wildly, why would we expect pedophiles, who we already know are screwed up, to be drawn to a "mainstream" adult kind of sexual attractiveness??

As I said earlier, I was abused by two different pedophiles at different points in my childhood. The first was a relative, so he saw me in a wide variety of clothes/settings...including naked, during baths and such. The other was my elementary school janitor - and he only ever saw me fully clothed...rarely even in shorts...in jeans and shirts. He was attracted to my age, not to my sexuality.