So - am I weird for this? - Page 2

[njeb]

No, you are not weird for this. Most women here in the U.S. have never seen an intact adult penis.
I have just come from a clothes-optional event, and all the adult men I saw were circ'ed. The good news is that all the babies I saw were intact. So, we are raising a whole new generation of intact men!
My sons were left intact, so in my mind what is "normal" is a circ'ed adult male and an intact male infant/toddler/child. Strange, I know. :LOL (To you Europeans, I'm sure the previous statement must sound ridiculous.)
What helped me overcome the "strangeness" of the intact state was to go to one of the websites in the sticky above which has a gallery of pictures of intact men. Once you see it, you will never regard a whole penis as strange again.
Found it! http://www.circumstitions.com. Scroll down to where it says a gallery of intact penises and click on it. It's just a bunch of pictures of nude men who are whole. Most of them are European.
You can also rent movies from the foreign section of your video/dvd store.
Your op raises a red flag with me, though. You don't have to answer this question here, but....do you have any abuse issues in your past that involve intact men? If viewing the gallery of intact men and watching foreign movies with intact actors doesn't decrease your revulsion for them, you might want to explore this idea more. I say this because your op was worded very strongly.

[Minky]

I guess I'll be the first to say that I have an abuse issue in my past with an intact man. To this day I can't stand the thought of looking at a non circumcised penis. I came here looking for information and while I'm sold on not circumcising any sons I might have in the future I now hope I never have a son because I don't think I could stand to look at his penis.

I am right there on the disgust expressed in the first post of this thread. I read it and it could have been me writing it.

This whole circumcision issue has actually made me not want to have another child. Our first is a girl. My partner is circed, is very pro circed and understands that I had a bad experience. If my daughter had been a boy, we would have had it done. Of course I've changed my mind now after someome pointed me here. But that doesn't change the disgust issue and trust me, looking at pictures/watching movies/reading lists of un circed movie stars doesn't help. It made it worse and just reminded me of what I do think is gross about uncirced penises, the ring of skin at the end, the kind of moist look of the head underneath. I got through one page of the gallery and could not do any more.

I really don't know if this is something that I can get over which is why I hope we never have any sons.

[Frankly Speaking]

Minky, I am truly sorry to hear of what happened to you. There is no excuse for that kind of behavior but I think you should consider something.

Would you have the same kind of disgust if the man who did this to you were circumcised? Would you have the same disgust for the circumcision scar and the permanently bared glans? Of course not! You see, not only are you a victim of this man, you are also a victim of our society that says mothers should hurt their babies and a society that says it is proper and acceptable to violate a man's body in an intensely personal and private way, just as you were violated by that man.

You are disgusted with this man, not his penis. You are using his penis and the presence of a foreskin as an identifying factor. The identifying factor you should be using is the man's brain that told him that it was acceptable to do this to you. Of course, that is not something that is visible so you transfer that to his penis that you saw as different and visible and identifiable. That's a normal reaction just as you might be disgusted with a whole race of men if his were a race different than yours. I'm sure you can see that this would not be a legitimate reaction but it would be a normal reaction. It wouldn't have been the race of the man but the sick things going on in his head just as the man's circumcision status had nothing to do with what happened to you, it was just his particular identifying feature so that's where you can hang the blame.

Some counseling may help you to isolate the two things and place the blame and disgust where it rightly belongs, not on innocent men who have done nothing.



Frank

[Minky]

I have been in therapy and in a support group. Im my support group I do have a friend who was molested by someone of another race who has been dealing with her feelings of negativity towards other members of that race. I really havent brought up the circumcision issue in the group because it has never been an issue util I happened on some anti-circ info on the net and investigated and ended up here.

I have tried to think thru it logically in the week or so since I have posted and I dont think I can get over the "eew gross' feeling by myself. I dont think it matters anyway as the hubby absolutely wont stand for an uncirced son. Its put me off wanting to have any more children and Ive been feeling terrible this whole week.

[njeb]

Dear Minky:
You have been through a lot. Now that you know what you know about circumcision, I would suggest that you bring it up in your support group. They might help you get past the revulsion you feel.
Also, I think it's smart of you to postpone having more children until you can resolve these issues. It's too bad that your dh is so closed-minded, though.
One thing to consider: a baby's intact penis looks very different from an adult male's. Have you ever seen an intact baby?
Good luck to you! I hope you can find some peace.

[Frankly Speaking]

I can truly commiserate with you. Part of the healing process is recognizing what it is that is the problem and working on that part of it. It seems that you have taken that step.

I have a similar problem that I have been working on more than 30 years and I can tell you from my experience that it will never completely go away but you can keep it from controlling your life and influencing your actions and decisions. People who have these experiences must make conscious decisions about the appropriate actions where people who do not have these experiences can make unconscious decisions to come to the appropriate action. This is a burden that we will have to bear for the rest of our lives but the result of not bearing that burden is making inappropriate decisions that will have adverse effects on us and those surrounding us. I can tell you from experience that it becomes easier the further you get away from the experience and the more you exercise that rational and logical thinking process.

One of the inappropriate actions you could take now would be to let your experience color your thinking about birthing and raising a child. Those are two totally different situations and one should not influence the other. Your son should not have to suffer because of what another man has done. Nor should your son suffer because of what his father has experienced. I think it is totally appropriate that you delay bearing children until you and your husband both work out these issues and can make rational and logical decisions based on sound medical research and information. That will be the decision that will be in the best interest of your children.

If you would like, I will discuss my personal issues privately with you and how I have addressed them through the Private Messaging System here at Mothering.



Frank

[fire_in_july]

Originally Posted by njeb

You can also rent movies from the foreign section of your video/dvd store.
Your op raises a red flag with me, though. You don't have to answer this question here, but....do you have any abuse issues in your past that involve intact men? If viewing the gallery of intact men and watching foreign movies with intact actors doesn't decrease your revulsion for them, you might want to explore this idea more. I say this because your op was worded very strongly.

I honestly have NO abuse issues in my past with intact men. I was never sexually abused as a child. I did experience some abusive men as an adolescent/young adult, but they were all circ-ed, as has been EVERY man and boy I have ever seen in real life who is over the age of 4.

I cannot say why I am so repulsed by it. It is a purely aesthetic thing. Without trying to get too graphic, when I try to imagine putting one that looks like *that* in my, ummmm...okay, let's just say that the idea of oral sex makes me want to hurl. I hope that's not too graphic. And I hated the thought of some woman feeling that way about my potential son's penis as an adult, even though LOGICALLY I know that is absolutely way less likely to be the case, given current circ rates.

*I realize that it is ridiculous to feel this way.* (my own revulsion) I don't like that I feel this way.

I cannot quote everyone who replied to me in this thread, but I do want to thank ALL of you. You gave me some great advice and great things to think about or try in getting over this personal hang-up of mine.

We recently actually found out that our baby-to-be is a girl. So none of your great advice will actually apply to a son of mine (this is our last child). While I am thrilled beyond belief that DD will have a sister (I wanted her to so badly) I am actually sad in a way that it won't be a boy that I can leave intact. That may sound odd, with all my "intact issues" but I really was looking forward to being able to leave a boy intact. I guess in a way to try and make up for the mistake I made in circ-ing my first son when I was uneducated, and in a way to try and set an example for my very pro-circ extended family.

But it was not meant to be, I guess. I will definitely still try to educate on anti-circ with my family - I just know that they will see it as ridiculous that I have a circ-ed son and no intact son, yet am trying to tell THEM not to circ. But I will try. And I will definitely still try to work on getting over my personal hang-up about intactness!!

Thanks again to everyone!

[LavenderMae]

Originally Posted by aira

Another voice of agreement with PPs.

I mourn my DH's foreskin now. I always hurt for the baby DH who was tortured, but now that I really see how a penis works, I actively miss what was taken from him/us. It's relevant to our marriage even now - not just something that happened years ago. I also can see now that his circ affects us not only sexually (though that's quite true), but also emotionally. I know that he quietly feels inadequate, or that vaguely that something's missing in him.

I think your repulsion will simply fade once once you see you new DS.

This is how I feel also. Well written!

[A&A]

Dear Minky,
I'm so sorry you were abused. I can't even begin to pretend to know how that feels. I have to say, though, that you shouldn't let your past abuse cause you to abuse any sons you might have-- and cutting their penis IS abuse.

[Minky]

I will bring up what I've been feeling with my group, maybe once I am past my won issues I will do a better job convincing the husband. We are going to wait on more children for now. It's funny though that the baby could end up being a girl when we finally decide to have one and all of this could be just theoretical.

Frank I may take you up on your offer later tonight if you don't mind talking to me about this kind of issue. It's so sad, I thought that the past abuse had no hold over me anymore, and now this!

[Acksiom]

I recommend these resources for decreasing such strong polarity responses as those being discussed here:

http://www.123eft.com , an easy step-by-step introduction, and http://www.emofree.com , the homesite.

Easy, fast, and usually works.