Lying to your children.

[The Lucky One]

I know I'm not alone (that's why I love MDC ), but I'm really starting to get aggrevated IRL with people (dh included!) lying to my ds's.

I am by far a perfect parent, but I can count on one hand the number of times I've been dishonest with my ds's about ANYTHING. I just don't lie to them. Period. Yet it seems like everyone else does.

Example:

Ds1: (having fun at the park) I don't want to go home.
Dh: Well, it's time for dinner we have to go home.
Ds1: But, I am having fun and I don't want to leave. (starts tantrum)
Dh: Well, we have to go now, but we'll come back later. (absolutely no intentions on coming back)


Or:

Ds1: (outside in the yard) Look! A helicopter!!!
Grammie: Yes, that's a nice one.
(helicopter flies away)
Ds1: (crying and upset) I want it to come back! I want it to come back!
Grammie: Oh, it will later sweetie. It will. (how does she know that!!!???!!!)

See what I mean?

It's like they are just telling him things to get him to shut up. They aren't trying to be deceitful, I don't think they even look at it that way, but to me it is wrong. Why don't people think more before they say things?

Ugh.

[Proudmomoftwinsplusone]

I have been telling little lies to my boys (they are two years old) to make the day smoother For example, when they need to stop playing with something, I tell them the toy needs to go to sleep because its tired. When they try to play with the dirt in the potted plants I tell them the plant doesnt like little boys taking its dirt away because it likes the dirt.

but i always keep my promises if i tell them we will go somewhere again or play with something later.

[Proudmomoftwinsplusone]

Another time one of my boys found a box of candy and was very happy and wanted some. I said, thats not food (which is what i say when they put toys in thier mouths). he believed me and totally lost interest. :

[lilyka]

I don't know. have you talked to them about it? they may not think of it as lying. I mean you will eventually come back to the park right. or at least a park. and another helicopter is sure to fly by eventually or perhaps that is one that make regular rounds by your house (we live about 3 blocks from both hospital helicopter pads. I can tell you with much certanty that those helicopers will land and take off about every two hours on alternating days)

little things like that don't bother me although i do try to be either more specific or more vague when issuing statements like that. for example "we will come back to the park another time soon" or "we will come back to the park on tuesday" nd for the helicopter "Its so sad. but another one wil fly by soon I bet. lets watch for it" or that helicopter flys by every other day. we can look for it tomarrow."

if it bothers you I would ask them to be more specific or more open ended (either works) .

what does bother me is the "this present isn't for you" "santa clause is real" and lies of that nature. flat out lying, not open to interp[retation witht he intent to decieve lies. drives me crazy. And if theat is how you percieve your families statements I can see how that would drive you crazy. but I think those are small enough that alking to them about how your son might percieve those statements could easly change thier habits. one would hope anyway.

[its_our_family]

Yeah but that isn't the mean scarey little bald man that will steal you from your mommy if you aren't gppd in the store. Yeah that is what a lady at the store told my neighbors 3 yr old.

I;m guilty of the things LO said. Sometimes it is easier to say "later" than talk a screaming 2yr old to stay in their carseat.

Right now in our house it is about survival.

[UnschoolnMa]

It depends for me. The helicopter thing doesn't seem so bad to me, but instead I might have said "That helicopter had to fly away from us. Maybe we will see another one someday." I totally disagree with the saying "we will come back later" thing if they didn't mean it. Did your Dh mean that you'd come back to the park a different day? That would have been OK to say I think, but making the child think you'd come back that day/night when you actually have no intention of doing so isn't kind IMO.

I do not want people lying to my kids. Someone once tried to "joke" with Ds that if he ate watermelon seeds he'd grow a watermelon in his belly. That kind of stuff bothers me in a big way and I was quick to step in and clear things up for my then little Ds by saying, "He's just trying to be silly with you. People don't grow watermelons in their stomachs though."

[flyingspaghettimama]

Originally Posted by its_our_family

Yeah but that isn't the mean scarey little bald man that will steal you from your mommy if you aren't gppd in the store. Yeah that is what a lady at the store told my neighbors 3 yr old.

My babysitter once told me if I wasn't good like Jesus wanted me to be the witches behind trees were going to take me away. I never felt quite the same about trees again. Unfortunately, I grew up in the woods.

Proudmomoftwins, I totally also say what you say. I guess I've never really thought of it as lying per se, but as sort of anthropomorphizing the plant/animal/shovel's feelings in a creative way Now at five, my daughter will look at me funny and say, "but not really." And I say yes, it's a pretend story, and we sort of keep it going from there (i.e. what do shovels like to eat?). I think I've been guilty of the watermelon seeds growing watermelons too, mostly because we like being silly a lot.

Lilyka, we also struggled with santa etc. We told her that it was a story that some people really like to believe and if she wanted to as well she could. I'm not sure how that played out at preschool, other than I told her that some kids would be sad if they thought it wasn't real.

But yeah, I don't think I usually say "later" unless I mean it, or if they have no long-term memory skills, say before 2 or so . But it sounds like their statements are pretty innocent, they don't want to disappoint as other people said. Saying, "maybe tomorrow we'll see a helicopter" or "which day - tuesday or wednesday - do you want to come back"...because pretty soon they get wise to that business.

[Bearsmama]

You know, TLO, I've thought the same thing before. I am FAR from being a perfect parent (as my past posts will attest to!), but I do not lie to my son. I just don't. I'm not just saying that to sound holier-than-thou, or to make it seem like it was in my big, grand, parenting plan. But I just don't. No white lies, either. Of course, there have probably been some times that I've stopped short of telling the full truth about something to protect his little spirit, but I've never intentionally lied.

I think many people just don't respect their kids' intelligence and emotional capacity. It totally aggravates me, too. The kicker is, most people want their kids to grow up and feel comfortable sharing things with them. But how is this possible when the parents have not been honest from the start?

[Diane~Alena]

LMAO at this one I wouldn't call that lying at all.

One day you will go back to the park and reminding the child about that just eases the sadness about leaving.

The helicopter has left but hey it isn't a once in a lifetime thing you will keep an eye open for another one and share it with the child.

I play with my kids and tell them they will go to Jail if they are mean to me. " it illegal to be mean to mommies you know!" They laugh and say well how long do we have untill they get here mom?

I am more concerned about people who lie about fat men that come down Chimneys and rabbits that lay eggs then saying that you will go back to the park later.

[eilonwy]

I have major issues with this, too, as well as with the "You're going to ___." It drives me crazy when someone says this stuff to my kids! Especially when they think it's helpful, it's so totally not most of the time.

A few years ago at my brother's wedding, his soon-to-be SIL told my niece that "If you're good, I'll give you a cookie." She didn't have a cookie, and noone told my mom how long the whole morning shebang (pictures, Ketubah signing, rehearsal, setup, ceremony, etc) was going to be, or that there'd be no food there. My niece was asking for the cookie all morning and when someone finally told her that she wasn't getting a cookie (or anything else to eat for an age) she burst into tears. It was horrible, and unnecessary on so many levels.

I flat out tell people that it's unacceptable to lie to my children, regardless of how old they are. When a nurse starts to tell my 12 month old that the needle about to go into her arm won't hurt, I correct her (and have from the begining). I'd much rather deal with the fallout of the truth than the fallout of a "little white lie."

[littleaugustbaby]

I don't think the park and the helicopter are too bad, I do the same sorts of things with DD.

We were at the park not long ago, and there was a mama with a newborn and her 2 older kids. DD is fascinated by babies right now, and she kept going over and sitting next to the mama and the newborn. I must have picked her up and explained to her that the mama and the baby wanted to be alone attention a million times, but she just did not want to leave the baby alone. The mama was getting very annoyed with DD, so finally I picked her up and told her that the baby went night-night, and that's what finally sunk in with DD that it was time to leave the baby alone, because the baby was sleeping.

The one thing that I do that's really bad that I'd like to stop though, is telling DD that her medicine is candy. She frequently has to take medication, and it's really traumatic for her. She's had some really horrible experiences with doctors and nurses, to the point that if I even go near the medicine cabinet and she sees me, that she will start crying. So I was able to get her some chewable medicine, and she saw that it was in a medicine bottle, so she refused to take it. I told her that it was special candy, so she tried it. Now she'll actually take it because she doesn't think it's medicine, and she even knows when it's time to take it, and she'll ask for her candy. She actually didn't even know what candy was before this, but if I'd been honest and told her that it was medicine, there would have been a meltdown, and I'd never get her to take it. I always feel terrible whenever she gets her "candy", but I'm really not sure how to get out of it at this point. :

Re: Santa Claus, et al - I have no problem with all of that stuff, and we'll do Santa and the Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy with DD. But I do truly respect others' reasons for not doing it.

[AngelBee]

Originally Posted by littleaugustbaby

Re: Santa Claus, et al - I have no problem with all of that stuff, and we'll do Santa and the Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy with DD. But I do truly respect others' reasons for not doing it.

I was wondering if I was the only one... :

[oceanbaby]

I have had the same problem with some people (mainly my FIL) lying to ds. Telling him the chocolates are all gone when he asks for more. What I've done is just address ds directly by telling him the truth - "There are still some more chocolates, but we're not going to have any more right now."

The park thing would bother me, because not only is it a lie, but a broken promise, and I take promises to my kids very seriously.

The helicopter thing may bother me, but it could be semantics. If someone said this to ds, I would probably say "Well, we may see another helicopter soon."

I do not lie to my children. We joke around and play silly, sure, but ds knows the difference between that and a lie.

And I feel like Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny are totally different (although I admit to having a hard time telling ds that a man comes down the chimney to delivery presents). I can't explain why exactly, but they feel different to me. My parents did Santa Claus, and the Easter Bunny, and were also pretty careful never to lie to us.

think many people just don't respect their kids' intelligence and emotional capacity. It totally aggravates me, too. The kicker is, most people want their kids to grow up and feel comfortable sharing things with them. But how is this possible when the parents have not been honest from the start?

Exactly! (How are you two - long time no commiserate!)

[flapjack]

I had to go and walk away before I could formulate a response to this one.
First, my experiences (my family generally used gentle discipline tools, though they weren't really what you'd call an AP family.) From the ages of birth to 21, my family had a history of being secretive with me on almost every issue, and trying to raise me in a bubble, protected from the bad stuff that happened to my family. Lies came out, as they will do in a small community, and I didn't have the emotional tools to deal with them. That's probably what led to me using deceit and dishonesty as a coping strategy as a teenager.
What I'd say- sit down and talk to the adults involved. There is a big difference between anthropomorphizing a plants feelings so that a child understands that that plant is ALIVE, and one of the conditions for that plants growth is being taken away (it's NOT DIRT, btw. It's soil, or earth) and denying a child's feelings. How hard is it, when you and your 2yo have to leave the park and she's crying because she really doesn't want to, to say "honey, I can hear how sad you are" and acknowledge her feelings? Even slightly?
I think you're sending a more important message to your children here than lying- you're telling them that it's not OK to feel sad. That has long-term repercussions for their mental health.

[littleaugustbaby]

There is a big difference between anthropomorphizing a plants feelings so that a child understands that that plant is ALIVE, and one of the conditions for that plants growth is being taken away (it's NOT DIRT, btw. It's soil, or earth) and denying a child's feelings. How hard is it, when you and your 2yo have to leave the park and she's crying because she really doesn't want to, to say "honey, I can hear how sad you are" and acknowledge her feelings? Even slightly?
I think you're sending a more important message to your children here than lying- you're telling them that it's not OK to feel sad. That has long-term repercussions for their mental health.

I think that you made a really interesting point there.

When we leave the park, I'll generally tell DD "I know you don't want to go, but we'll try to come back tomorrow/later today/next week".

I don't think that anyone really is trying to be damaging to their children by lying. I think it's quite the opposite, that they're trying to protect them using the tools that they know how to use.

I think with toddlers, sometimes it's easier on them to put things in terms that they understand. My DD, for example, will get so hung up on something that she wants, that she'll repeat the word over and over again. For example, if the cat goes upstairs and DD can't get to her, DD will point up the stairs and say "kitty, kitty, kitty, kitty, kitty" over and over again, and she gets more and more desperate as she goes along. If I explain to her that kitty wanted to go upstairs because she wanted to be alone, it doesn't "click" for her, and she continues to be upset. If I put it in terms that she understands, like by saying "I'm sorry that you're sad that you can't play with kitty, but she's very tired and she had to go upstairs to sleep", then DD gets it, because she understands what sleep is. I can still acknowledge her feelings, but at the same time, she's able to process the situation and not be upset about it.

BTW, I do completely know what you mean about family keeping secrets from you to protect you. My family has done this to me all of my life, and to an extent, they still do. So it's something I really feel strongly about.

[onlyzombiecat]

It would bother me if someone was making promises to my dd that they had no intention of keeping. I would be really mad if someone offered my child a bribe to "be good" with no intention of giving what they offered should my child comply. I think that is cruel.
I try to only tell dd things I am prepared to follow through on. I try to be fairly honest with her. I hope others in her life will be too. I've caught my dh a few times telling her something not true just to keep her quiet and I've spoken up to correct it.
If I say "later" to dd for me it means the same day but not to everyone. "Later" is pretty vague... it could mean 15 minutes, an hour, or 2 weeks. Maybe talk to them about being more specific as a pp suggested.

I don't feel Santa or the Easter Bunny are lies. I know some people do feel that way but to me it is different.

[Willowrose]

Both DH and I do not tell lies to our boys. I have had a friend or family member say something far fetched and I've made it clear that I don't want my boys told fibs. Even if its to save us from a tantrum. I just don't believe in sugar coating things, even if it might be easier at times.

[maya44]

Originally Posted by Bearsmama

You know, TLO, I've thought the same thing before. I am FAR from being a perfect parent (as my past posts will attest to!), but I do not lie to my son. I just don't. I'm not just saying that to sound holier-than-thou, or to make it seem like it was in my big, grand, parenting plan. But I just don't. No white lies, either. Of course, there have probably been some times that I've stopped short of telling the full truth about something to protect his little spirit, but I've never intentionally lied.

I think many people just don't respect their kids' intelligence and emotional capacity. It totally aggravates me, too. The kicker is, most people want their kids to grow up and feel comfortable sharing things with them. But how is this possible when the parents have not been honest from the start?

And of course I am happy to be silly with my kids and play pretend. The tooth fairy visits but because my girls were late in their tooth loss, i was easily able to make a game of it.

When my oldest dd lost her first tooth she was almost 8. I said "Well i guess the "Tooth Fairy" will be visiting. I actually made quotation marks with my hands.

She cracked up!

[The Lucky One]

flapjack .

Bearsmama .

More later when I can...

LMAO at this one I wouldn't call that lying at all.

Oh, thanks for that. : I'm glad my concern gave you a nice laugh. :

[bleurae]

OT

flapjack...
are you a soil scientist?? I cracked up at the "it's NOT DIRT" comment. During my undergrad I had to take soil-science, a class I did not enjoy, and the teacher would go NUTS if anyone called it dirt. on my final on every question I didn't know I wrote "It's just dirt". But then, I was a punk-ass lil shit in my twenties.


bleu

mama to bliss