Spin-off thread: do you tell your children about Santa?

[nonconformnmom]

The lying to your children thread touched on this topic but I've been curious about it for a while and thought it deserved its own thread. My toddler will be 3 this Christmas and it's time for me to get off the fence about this issue. I have mixed feelings about perpetuating the Santa myth in my family.

FOR:
I like the idea of helping my children believe in magic and altruism
I like the idea of giving them a sweet fantasy to indulge in
In our culture (United States, middle class) it's almost impossible to escape it

AGAINST:
In our culture (United States, middle class) it's almost impossible to escape it (so that brings out the rebel in me)
I am absolutely against telling kids that they'll get toys "if they are good"
It really does seem like lying; how can I tell my kids that lying is not allowed in our family if I have told them about Santa?
The idea of a jolly old man in a red suit sneaking into the house at night, far from being a happy fantasy, creeps me out
It focuses too much on greed

ALTERNATIVES?
What I'd like is to tell them that there IS magic in the world, and that it exists everyday but we can't always see it. December 25th is the one day in which magic manifests itself to the world in the form of special gifts on Christmas morning. Why not have the joy and the magic, without the creepy guy?

Has anyone been successful in identifying an alternative myth that keeps the positive aspects and eliminates the negative ones? And/or: am I the only one who sees it this way?

[UnschoolnMa]

I never went the whole "There is a real man named Santa Claus who will fly here with reindeer, come down the chimney, and leave you presents" route. It felt wrong to me. We did learn about the character of Santa, where it came from and how it evolved, etc. We never approached the Tooth Fairy, Easter Bunny, or any of those as actual physical people or creatures. The stories held magic on thier own without my fibbing to my kids.

[oldcrunchymom]

I feel very strongly that to tell my kids Santa is real would be lying. My kids know what Santa, the Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy, etc are, but we never pretended they were real. I taught my kids right from the start that those were stories that some parents like to pretend are real while their children are small. So although my kids have always known Santa is fake, they've never gone around "spoiling" it for other kids (an objection I've seen from lots of Santa-pushers).

Anyway, we celebrate Winter Solstice so it was easy to leave out the Santa stuff.

[UnschoolnMa]

Originally Posted by lckrause

Anyway, we celebrate Winter Solstice so it was easy to leave out the Santa stuff.

Yea, there is that whole is Santa a legitmate part of the Christian Christmas controversy. It came up a lot in my mom's church as a kid lol.

We do the solstice as well. My kids enjoyed Father Winter stories occasionally too.

[Starr]

I remember a kid in Kindergarten telling me that Santa was a fake, i went home and cried, so I do think its a good idea to mention that they should not spoil it for other children if they choose not to go along with it

Although me and DH haven't discussed this subject I am sure we will go along with Santa Clause and the tooth fairy. Most of it for us would be tradition. Putting out the plate of cookies, waiting to hear the reindeers bells, going to bed early. This was something we were both raised up with so for us it is quite normal. I can see where parents might have a hard time time though distinguishing it from a lie, but I think as they get older we will gradually explain that anyone can be "santa" and give presents anonymously to those in need. It also isn't the main focus on our Christmas so I don't see us going overboard and forgetting what it is really about for us.

[MomBirthmomStepmom]

I'm very against lying to my children, and for me the biggies were things like Santa, Easter Bunny, Toothfairy etc. My daughter knows what the stories are, and 'recognizes them' (again, Santa's everyfrickingwhere, can't avoid it), but she knows they are not real.

The only problem is, my 9yo step-son still believes Santa etc, are real. So, SO and I have some issues when it comes to that stuff...lol Also, SO is very happy with playing the Santa part etc, and is kinda sad that I do not want that for my dd, or future children...

Although, I am also an atheist. People have asked me what will happen when my dd is in school and tells other children Santa isn't real. I've explained (and will continue to explain to her), that it's the same as my being athesit. Some people believe, and some people do not. It's not up to her to tell someone else what is 'real' and what is not. What's 'real' for her in her life, might not be the same for other children... Does that make sense?

[littleaugustbaby]

Although, I am also an atheist. People have asked me what will happen when my dd is in school and tells other children Santa isn't real. I've explained (and will continue to explain to her), that it's the same as my being athesit. Some people believe, and some people do not. It's not up to her to tell someone else what is 'real' and what is not. What's 'real' for her in her life, might not be the same for other children... Does that make sense?

That makes perfect sense to me!

We will do Santa and the Tooth Fairy and the Easter Bunny in our house. I don't see it as that big of a deal. It was something that was really fun and magical for me when I was a kid, and when I found out the truth, I wasn't destroyed. I had a lot worse to worry about as a kid.

Even as adults, we always did Santa in our family. Obviously, we knew it wasn't real, but I really love the whole idea behind it. I also don't like the idea of telling kids that they'll only get toys if they're good, and that's something that I don't want to incorporate. Of course, if you think about it, a lot of parents use that as a bargaining tool other times too.

[Diane~Alena]

I don't tell my kids that these beings are real. We watch santa movies we love easter and all it's pastel prettiness but I tell my kids it just a make believe story parents tell their kids we don't practice any of it. My reason is I think that these practices were brought about for Commercial purposes and I won't lie to my kids to help the MAN make a buck. My sisters and even one of my brothers practice this make believe, I respect theirs and they respect the makebelieve I give my kids. I do pretent with my kids all the time, we create our own fantasy and often pretend we see fairies in the trees.

[4evermom]

I'm in the "it's just a story" camp. I wasn't raised believing in it so it's hard for me to remember that kids (pretty old sometimes) actually believe in it. My dh and my MIL were both very upset to discover the truth. Even if I could manage to, I wouldn't want to do that to ds. I have trouble lying in general. Also, I've spent all of ds's short life (4 yrs) teaching him about the world and how it works. It would just be weird to introduce this magic concept that breaks all rules in unpredictable ways.

[Potty Diva]

Telling Kailey there is a Santa Claus would be a lie. We don't lie to Kailey.

There is no such thing as magic or fairydust or luck.

BUT, we pretend, get excited about princesses and pretending we can fly. There is a difference and she is starting to understand that.

Last year in her preschool class one child tolf Kailey that if she wasn't good Santa would not come to her class. She told him there is no such thing as santa he is only in books and on TV. HA!

I agree with no spoiling something for other cihldren, but if they try to convince my child of a lie, she is free to debunk it for them.

[Willowrose]

Noah has never believed in the concept of Santa. We tell him who he is and what he did(aka St Nicholas) but as Christians, our main focus at Chirstmas is on the birth of Jesus. That is what my children think about when Christmas is here.
I didn't want to take away the *magic* of Santa, but now, I really don't think twice about it. For us Christmas is magical because of the meaning to our family. It doesn't have to be special or magical because of Santa.
I want our children to trust us and not eventually learned we lied to them.

[UnschoolnMa]

Originally Posted by Potty Diva

There is no such thing as magic or fairydust or luck.

See we believe in magic no problem lol.

[Potty Diva]

Oh, I believe in magic, as in that really cool, warm feeling I get around the holidays or birthdays. But not in abbra-cadabra type of magic

But that is cooler than cool if you do, fer reel tho

[Jade2561]

I still believe in Santa. :

[katebleu]

i have actually been thinking about this for months, since right after last christmas in fact. and dd is only seven months old.

i'm really conflicted. i was raised with santa, easter bunny, tooth fairy, et al. and i went through a stage where i really thought i would raise the child who had to be asked not to debunk santa in pre-school. more than an aversion to lying, it was about treating the holiday of christmas differently. i always suffered from christmas day let down. i always thought that spreading it out would take the pressure off the 25th. (i think this is the biggest reason for the "if you're not good, santa won't ring you presents" bit. no parents has ever used the santa threat in july. i always thought it was just to keep you in line on the 23rd when you just can't stand the excitement anymore.)

now we add the real complications. dp was raised in a certain non-holiday christian religion. he brings no chrristmas traditons, which is great. but he also, understandably avoids organized religion. while i was raised going to church i don't anymore (whole host of reasons, but not really out of any problem with organized religion). so we need something and santa fits the bill.

on the up side, his family would not presuure us into anything holiday related and my parents have always believed that christmas, mostly that day are for 'your' family and i think would let us come up with our own traditions. they don't even have to be horribly conventional as my mom's family really did most of their christmas on christmas eve because of my grampa's job.

also i loved the magic of christmas morning. the big reveal. and when my brother d-- and i were getting older, my parents started having us help with the santa activities (stuffing the stocking) for our younger brothers t-- and b--. we got be part of the making of the magic.

although i have never particularly worried about the greed aspect of christmas (it just never effected my family) one things i have thought of is making the stockings the santa present. i like that it follows the st. nicholas story and it would keep the bigness out of santa's gifts. this seems like a nice compremise. and we could add non-gift traditions too, like going to movies or baking or whatever.

what does everyone think?

(sorry if this got a bit long and rambly.)

[onlyzombiecat]

Santa in our family is not really connected to behavior. We never say "if you're good Santa will bring you presents"... we do say that you need to be asleep before Santa can come. lol
Santa fills stockings in our house and brings dd one gift besides that. We give a limited number of gifts anyway so I don't think Santa really promotes more greed for our family.
I was told at a young age the "truth" of Santa by my older siblings. I wasn't traumatized but from that day I set out with much determination to catch my parents in the act and I was never able to catch them! So maybe it was Santa... It still seemed pretty magical. We all went along with the Santa story into adulthood and it was just fun.
I just don't view it as a lie.

[trinity6232000]

Originally Posted by onlyzombiecat

Santa in our family is not really connected to behavior. We never say "if you're good Santa will bring you presents"... we do say that you need to be asleep before Santa can come. lol

I was told at a young age the "truth" of Santa by my older siblings. I wasn't traumatized but from that day I set out with much determination to catch my parents in the act and I was never able to catch them! So maybe it was Santa... It still seemed pretty magical. We all went along with the Santa story into adulthood and it was just fun.
I just don't view it as a lie.

In our home Santa brings presents to all the children, not just the
good ones. Sometimes Santa could use some help, so that is why
we need to give our time and donations to people. (But this is all
year round).
I was pretty sad when my older Sister told me there is no Santa,
but it doesn't take away from all the good memories I have.
My dd believes in it all. Tooth fairy, Santa, Easter Bunny. I have
magical memories as a child regarding the tooth fairy and Santa.
I remember once I was staying with my Grandparents and I lost a
tooth. I was very concerned that the tooth fairy would not be
able to find me, and that I wouldn't get to show my parents my
tooth if the tooth fairy did find me. So I asked my Grandma to help
me write a note. I asked the tooth fairy to please leave my tooth,
and I would put it under my pillow when I got home. The tooth fairy
left me a shinny silver dollar, AND left my tooth. I kept my promice
and gave her my tooth when I got home.
I have several Santa stories that tickle me as well. Some nights
my dd and I wish on stars. We search for fairies in our yard. A few
nights ago we went on a dragon search with flash lights at night.
Santa (a kind man from my church) visits us the week before
Christmas every year. He reads us a story and leaves a small present.
I allow my dd to make up most of the stories and then I join in the fun.

[wednesday]

We're practicing something like, "don't ask, don't tell." I wasn't raised with Santa and I'm uncomfortable promoting it to DS. DH on the other hand was raised with Santa and wants to share the "magic," but respects my POV as well. Further, DS's cousins and grandparents are a big part of his life so he will be exposed to lots of santa mythology.

Our compromise this past year, when DS was 15 months, was to not give any gifts "from Santa" but also not to do any naysaying either when the other kids talked about. I think it is a careful line we will tread over the years. When DS is a bit older I think we will just present it as a fun thing to pretend about, like pretending about scary things at Halloween or pretending about the Easter bunny bringing candy on Easter.

[ShadowMom]

Originally Posted by Potty Diva

I agree with no spoiling something for other cihldren, but if they try to convince my child of a lie, she is free to debunk it for them.

I have to admit that I am struggling with this concept a bit. It hasn't come up yet because DS is only 19 months old, but my plan is to tell him about the story of Santa (and other mythical characters) and how it's fun to pretend, etc. but in no way will I ever tell him that they're real.

What I struggle with is, why should I care if my DS tells other kids that Santa isn't real? If a parent chooses to tell their child something that isn't true, why do I have an obligation to try and keep their DC from finding out the truth?

[Potty Diva]

What I struggle with is, why should I care if my DS tells other kids that Santa isn't real? If a parent chooses to tell their child something that isn't true, why do I have an obligation to try and keep their DC from finding out the truth?

Exactly!
I sitll want to be respectful, yk? I't hard to explain. I say fine lie to your kinds and suffer the consequences later. Don't try and coerce my kid or you'll get a big ol' dose of reality.