Should we find out the gender???

[sarahcecile]

Argh! I am driving myself batty.

DH and I always planned not to find out the sex of the baby. Before we were pregnant it was a given. We will not find out. Then, in early pregnancy I kept myself occupied thinking about the next milestone. Hearing the baby's heartbeat, getting a belly, feeling the baby move. But now I have 20 weeks left and there are really no more milestones. Yes, the kicks will get bigger, and so will my belly, but nothing else. And I am feeling sorely tempted to find out the sex of the baby at our ultrasound on the 18th.

We are planning a homebirth and DH was excited about the prospect of announcing the gender at the birth, and I don't want to take that away from him. But at the same time, I feel like I really want to know more about this wee bairn growing in my belly!

I am so conflicted!!!

So mamas, I need your guidance (again...) - opinions, thoughts, ideas, alternatives, feelings...

Help me make this decision!

Thank you

- Sarah

[MrsMoe]

I think on this, it should be up to you. Finding the gender is a very personal thing.

We decided to find out and I don't regret it at all. I like being able to plan ahead, and in a wierd way, I feel more bonded with the baby because I call her by her name now... I can picture her etc. With that said, I think it would eb equally as magical to find out on the day of your baby's birth, we just don't have that kind of self-control.

[Kavita]

I agree that it's a personal decision, and you have to decide what's right for you.

That said, you DID ask for other perspectives and advice! And since I LOVE giving advice . . . :LOL

We're not finding out. I think it's more fun to not find out, and not tell everyone else. Even if you don't feel like there are more "milestones" (although I disagree somewhat) guessing the gender is a fun way to pass the time!! Everybody gets to vote and offer an opinion, and you can try to tune in to your own intuition and the baby, and do fun "tricks" like using a pendulum, obsessively analyzing the heart rate, and even mixing some pee with Drano (although I don't know how safe that is or if it really ever works!!) There are all sorts of time honored traditions to this guessing game, which are sort of lost as almost everyone knows. Even as a midwife, I'm always a little bummed when I know what a couple's having and what the name is--it's like watching reality TV if you already know how it ends--takes some of the suprise and drama out of "the big reveal" as they call it on television!!

Everybody who finds out I'm pregnant asks if we know what we're having, and I've been suprised that a lot of people respond with something like, "Oh, good! I think that's best!" I think that there's an element of mystery, excitement and suspense in the pregnancy when you don't know.

I also have an issue (which is a big political reproductive rights thing) about the way that treating the fetus as a separate person, a patient, and a "public personality" (which a gender and a name add to in my opinion) and the way that tends to put the pregnant/birthing woman and her role in a less important position, sometimes even an oppositional one to the good of the baby. (Think forced c-secs, jail time for drug addicted pregnant ladies, etc.) It makes it seem like you can just deal with the baby and not as much with the care of the mom, which in my view of the midwifery/holistic model of care are inextricably linked. I think some of this is even reflected in how people are invited to baby showers these days--I've seen lots of invites not to a shower for the WOMAN, to celebrate her transition to motherhood, but put like it's a party the BABY--"a shower to welcome baby colin michael jones" etc. Ultrasound and imaging technologies have tremendously contributed to this personalization of the fetus and backgrounding of the mom.

It also makes me happy to think that at this moment at least, my baby gets to be pure spirit and pure possibility, unhampered by any expectations that we as his or her parents, or society in general have based on gender! There is research (Barbara Katz Rothman, I think) that pregnant mothers even perceive and report fetal movement differently when they know the gender--for example, they might describe movement from a girl as a gentle wave or the baby as a little ballerina , but describe a boy's kicks as punches and the baby as a little soccer player or boxer. There will be plenty of time (like it's whole life) for my baby to be gender stereotyped, I'd like it to at least be able to gestate unencumbered!!

All that said, this is part of the reason I generally object from a cultural perspective to routine ultrasound (that and there is research that shows that it has no value whatsoever in improving maternal or fetal outcomes) and I am declining a mid-term ultrasound for myself. (I did a HUGE medical/historical research project obstetric ultrasound in college and actually won an award for the research, so it's something I've spent a lot of time thinking about!) However, if I think it would be hard to have an ultrasound and know that SOMEONE out there has the information about my baby's sex, but that it's not me!! At that point it's not exactly a mystery, it's still more of a secret! Like you could accidentally come across an ultrasound report and find out . . . So I'd be tempted to at that point!

Good luck with your decision and let us know what you decide!

[BensMom]

Great post Kavita.

Sarah, I found out when I was pregnant with DS and it was pretty cool. But we are not finding out this time. This time we are also planning a HB and not getting an u/s is way for me to learn to trust my body and heal from my first birth. As we got closer to 20w, it was hard, but since I am not getting OB parallel care, there was little real temptation, only mental. But now that I have passed the 20w mark with no u/s, its no longer an issue. Its like I am home free to wait for the big day, KWIM?

But if I was seeing an OB for regular backup care and was getting an u/s, I admit that it would be hard to not find out the gender if we were right there looking.

And like Kavita said, I have gotten a lot of positive response from people, since not finding out is so rare these days. A few have grumbled at me, but most people are excited about the wait.

Good luck deciding!

[Starflower]

I don't post here very often because my DD is 2 years old and I am not TTC or preggers. But here's my 2 cents worth anyway. We found out at our 20 week U/S that we were going to have a girl. I still didn't quite trust it, but it definitely looked like a girl - she flashed us!

I was relieved to find out mostly because it made the baby seem more real to me. (But I had been through a lot of issues with infertility and feeling like I didn't deserve to be a parent - thanks to abusive alcoholic family of origin). So I felt like whole ultra-sound process helped me.

What I thought was funny was how DH reacted. He wanted to look into names that night. I had been trying to get him interested in researching names for several weeks and now he was finally interested. I guess he was intimidated by the prospect of naming and having half the possible names eliminated seemed to help him a lot. :LOL

I had only been able to come up with a boy's name before this, so it was still a challenge for me.

And as for the gender stereo-typing, ITA that it can be a problem before they are even born. Personally, I usually described my fetal movements as either kicking or "using my cervix as a trampoline" because she definitely was not gentle.

I also made a point of specifying that I didn't want a bunch of pink stuff at the baby shower when people asked. Now she has some pink stuff and she wears purple often (she often chooses it herself), but I think she looks weird in dresses because I so rarely put her in one. I think my MIL has finally figured that out. Heehee.

Congratulations on your pregnancy.

[snugglebutter]

It's really a personal choice for each family. We have done it both ways and so far we prefer finding out at the ultrasound for a variety of reasons. Mainly, we wanted to know the joy of having a son or daughter sooner than later! I also really like being able to say "she" (and her name when it is just Dh and I). The loss of our 1st daughter also guided our choice this time, though parents in our situation have certainly gone both ways.

However, I would never tell a woman that one way is superior over the other. I've heard too many stories of parents being criticized for either choice and I think that is just wrong.

Good luck on your decision!

[flyingspaghettimama]

Ask yourself this question: if the boxes are under the xmas tree, and one's got your name on it, do you want to shake the box or wait for the surprise? Are you not only tempted but compelled to peek inside the gold-and-red wrapping? Do you really want to know or is it good enough to wait for the magic of xmas morning?

Well, I am a peeker, shaker, and carefully-removing tape type of person, so I found out. But if you have something special in your heart for the waiting and the Big Day, then you will probably be happier with that choice.

[Spark]

Reasons that it's nice not to find out the gender:
1. It's your first baby, so that means you won't be SWAMPED with only pink or only blue blankets, clothes, socks, towels, washclothes, etc, etc, etc at your baby shower. You'll have a GN assortment of things that you can use for future babies.
2. This is the only time your child can be loved without gender stereotypes being forced upon it (maybe not by you, but by others).
3. If there's any tiny bit of preference for a boy or girl becomes a BIG deal sometimes if you find out you're having the opposite of what you wanted. Then, you have long months to think about what this all means. When you find out the sex when your DH catches the baby and announces, "It's a Boy/Girl" there is no regret or fear or confusion or loss, it's only joy.
4. When people ask you, "What are you having?" You can think of witty comebacks like, "A baby... we hope!"
5. Not so much pressure to name the baby so that people can start addressing your belly as "Hi, Sarah! Is your mama keeping you up with her gas?"

But of course, all of this doesn't matter, because you're the one to listen to. Your heart will lead the way! Whatever you choose is going to be the right decision for you, your Dh and your child.

(popping in from Dec EDDs, hope you didn't mind!)

[MrsMoe]

Originally Posted by loraeileen

Well, I am a peeker, shaker, and carefully-removing tape type of person, so I found out.

he he he... that's cute

[Kavita]

Originally Posted by snugglebutter

I also really like being able to say "she"

I'm sure that is a big improvement on calling the baby "he/she"!!! Why, oh why, can't the English language have gender-neutral pronouns???!!! (wringing of hands.) Life would be so much easier for pregnant ladies and closeted people with same-sex partners!!

Also, why do all these gender neutral clothes and things have to be either yellow or mint green?! Why not purple or orange or red or something? Luckily for us DH and I both really like little duckies, because that's what we're going to end up with--a whole bunch of yellow clothes with little ducks on them!

Okay, I'm done with my rant, back to the topic at hand . . . !

[trmpetplaya]

He/she is rather cumbersome... I've been using "they" which freaks everyone out and people ask me if I'm having more than one. I say no, and that it's more comfortable for me than calling my baby IT. Like the baby's just some thing in my stomach

As for whether to find out the gender... definitely a personal decision! Dh and I have agreed that we are not having an u/s unless it is deemed necessary by my midwife (who does not recommend them to everyone so if she does recommend one, it will be because it's necessary). If we do end up having one, we will find out the sex. If not, then we won't. I also know of several people who were told "you are definitely having a girl!" and the baby was actually a boy and they had painted the nursery pink and bought all kinds of pink frilly clothes, etc. based on the faulty u/s report of their baby's gender. Oops! So even if you do find out, there's always a slight chance that you didn't find out... Just some rambly pregnant thoughts Best wishes making your decision!

love and peace.

[Kirsten]

Have to preface by saying that the advice below does not apply to those who have suffered through infertility or pregnancy loss - you guys go ahead and do whatever makes you happy!

But I really, really do think everyone should (at least once) experience the incredible surprise of finding out - at or right after the moment of birth - who exactly was in there those nine months.

I used to stand on a chair in my parents' closet, with my sister standing watch, to see what was in the bags up there in mid-December. But I didn't find out the gender of my three kids pre-birth. For so many reasons....

I am not convinced that ultrasound is completely safe. I would have one if needed but not routinely.

It feels like messing with Mother Nature to find out something that we weren't meant to find out.

If you care AT ALL about which gender baby you are having, I think you should WAIT TIL THE BIRTH! I know of a friend whose dh really wanted a boy with their second pregnancy (had a dd already). Found out at the ultrasound that they were having another girl (and knew this was their last child) and her dh couldn't speak to her the 90 minute car ride home. She was devestated, and I was so mad at him. He now adores both his daughters (of course) but that day, and to some extent the rest of her pregnancy, were tainted by his disappointment that he'd never have a son.

My father really wanted a boy (I was his firstborn). Of course they didn't know who I'd be and in my baby book, at first thing father said when baby was born was "well, we can't name HER Ole." (his favorite grampa's name) But then I was there and he was holding me and I was the apple of his eye for the rest of his life. (He and Mom went on to have another dd and finally a ds.)

If you know the gender, you will get SO much pink, frilly crap - or royal blue and red with trucks or dinosaurs. If you don't know, people give you cool stuff - not a bunch of dorky outfits that you may not like at all. It is really practical to have all your baby stuff (clothes, toys, paraphenelia) be gender neutral so you can reuse for all future kids.

And, it gives you a little bit more incentive when you are tired of pushing - WHO the heck is in there???

It is hard to really put into words but to look down and see who your baby is - or to have your dh tell you, the sound of his voice, his amazement when he tells you whether you have a son or a daughter. Don't miss that.

A very good friend of mine was surprised with her first birth but knew ahead of time with the second. She tells everyone who will listen that being surprised is much better. When her dd was born, everyone was so excited to know which gender, what the name was, etc. It was so fun to tell each relative and friend that came to the hospital or called. When her ds was born (I was in the room), it was like.... he's here. We knew he was a boy; we knew his name. How much he weighed was not that exciting to tell people.

I know it is tempting to find out when they OFFER that info to you - "do you want to find out the gender, Mrs. Johnson?" It is hard to say no when they are dangling it in front of you. But I did (only had an ultrasound with my dd1) - say no to finding out. SO glad I did. Second and third pregnancies I didn't have any ultrasounds so no option to find out - or having the ultrasound tech accidentally say "his foot" or "her little hand" - I have had friends who had that happen too. I would be beyond furious...

So I obviously vote for NOT finding out before the birth. It is the best surprise we get in life!

[flapjack]

I normally think "he" for babies simply because mamas tend, normally, to be female- less confusion as to who you're talking about. Am I weird?
I'm up there with Kavita- I want to know, more or less solely because my hospital has a policy of not telling and that really really bugs me, the way that hospitals are completely patient-centred but every one in the area uses ultrasound as a way of getting people into the patient mentality- for instance, Colchester won't tell the sex but allow children and partners to be present for the whole scan, Chelmsford expect partners and children to wait outside until they can be sure everything is OK with bubs, Ipswich won't allow people to take their children to the scans... it's an opportunity that is rarely missed.
In your situation, I'd peek or not peek, but don't tell and CERTAINLY don't name. My boys names both changed after we saw them. It's nobody's business but yours what you're having.
Kavita, you rock.

[Slackermom]

Kavita, great post.

It's such a personal decision. But I think that if you're undecided, you shouldn't find out. You might feel like you'd peeked at the holiday gift early and then regretted it.

Personally, I like the surprise. I like not having gender expectations put on the baby from the time its in utero.

We didn't find out with DD, and we're not finding out with this baby. Even if we did find out, I wouldn't be sharing it with others. I find it really disappointing when a friend finds out the gender and then names the baby. It seems anti-climatic to me, but I guess I'm old fashioned! It was such a thrill to have DH tell me that we had a girl, and then to call all our family and friends and share the news.

It's your decision to make...but if you're hesistant, I'd say don't do it.

[snugglebutter]

Doing whatever makes one happy regarding this subject does not just apply to those of us who have been through infertility and/or loss. That's just rather silly.

And knowing ahead of time doesn't have to mean the announcement of the birth is less exciting. Of course, I come from a family of self-proclaimed baby-crazies. :LOL We just tend to melt at the mere mention of the little ones in our family. But the births of those whose gender or name was known ahead of time have been just as thrilling as the others.

[Gunter]

Originally Posted by Kavita

It also makes me happy to think that at this moment at least, my baby gets to be pure spirit and pure possibility, unhampered by any expectations that we as his or her parents, or society in general have based on gender! There will be plenty of time (like it's whole life) for my baby to be gender stereotyped, I'd like it to at least be able to gestate unencumbered!!

I fully agree with this. I am not finding out the sex of the babe in utero. DH and I try to not stereotype people based on their sex. I posted on another thread about stereotyping b/c it really upsets me. (I say "sex" b/c as someone pointed out to me, "gender" is a social construct.) Instead of hanging a banner that says, "it's a girl/boy" I really want a banner that says, "If you want to know what kind of genitalia my babe has, come change a diaper." Really, I think it's silly to want to know sex...it just lets us categorize and label instead of being open minded about what a person is capable of. We tend to expect certain things from a certain sex. Maybe I have read too much Marg. Mead!

Plus, with the whole planning thing based on color: why does one sex own pink or blue? Really, why? At this point, parents make decisions for the babe so we should pick colors that we like or colors that reflect the babe, if we have a sense of that. I have bought all of the clothes at thrift store so far so it's not too bad to buy dresses b/c they are only $1. (Two friends are having girls before me.) I bought a pink wrap thing that I will use regardless of the sex.

Hope this isn't too harsh, I have really strong feelings about the oppression of women and the labeling of sexes that limits expectations on their abilities. I just hate that it could start before birth. On a lighter note, DH and I call the babe "Emerson" so you could make up a name without knowing the gender. Emerson may just be it's utero name even.

[dancingmama]

This is an interesting topic for me. I'm generally of the prefer the surprise camp. We didn't have an U/S with dd, and of course didn't know, and it was fabulous. But this time, I'm not sure why, I'm feeling like I want an U/S -- not to find out the sex, just to "make sure" all is OK. I'm not sure why I want it this time (everything was fine and wonderful last time, and we have homebirths so it's not a routine option) --- I'm thinking that it might have something to do with my m/c in November. I'm feeling a bit less invincible -- more vulnerable I guess. Like, just because I'm really healthy and eat well and keep stress low and get sleep etc etc does not mean all will be fine.

So, on the sex question, I would still choose not to find out except for one thing.... DH and I CANNOT agree about circumcision. In fact, we still hadn't come to an agreement when dd was born, and we were just lucky we didn't have to deal with it. It's a very very volatile discussion in our house, and if it's another girl, we simply won't have to go there. If it's a boy, we need to figure it out. So I think we are going to find out. BUT, to avoid much of the problems mentioned in pp's, we are not going to tell anyone that we know! We wil still choose both names in case they are wrong, and it will be a surprise to everyone else, anyway.

[flyingspaghettimama]

I hafta agree with everyone about baby clothes and colors - why is it like that? I knew my first girl was a girl and asked for NO pink clothes, because I'm difficult like that. Also, I don't like frilly things. We know we're having a boy this time, and we are definitely buying not truck clothes. If he likes truck clothes when he grows up, fine - I'll buy them. My daughter's favorite color is red, she's not a big fan of pink either.

For gender-neutral clothing, I really like Zutano and Hanna Anderson. They're expensive though, so I either buy them at consignment, e-bay, or on sales.

We already had all our circ discussions too (not with family yet, but we're preparing) - we're definitely not doing it, we have no personal or medical reasons. A great convincer is to show the pics of babies strapped to the hospital board for the circ procedure. A picture's worth a thousand words...for us it was just too much.

[sarahcecile]

This is all very helpful, although I have not yet made a decision.

DH and I have already picked names, and we're not telling anyone, we're painting the "nursery" (which is not really a nursery as we are planning on co-sleeping, just a space for changing table, nursing chair, clothes, etc.) green and brown, and we both detest pink and blue.

I've made it clear to our parents that I hate pink and blue, frills, etc. and if we found out I would really not want anyone outside of our immediate family to know - but I am not sure that we can keep that secret.

I am bothered by the idea that the ultrasound tech will know the sex of the baby but we will not. I asked one of the midwives in our back-up group (we are planning a homebirth with a CPM, which is illegal in our state) if the tech could just not look at the baby's genitals, but she said "no, they have to check."

So - I just don't know.

But you all have fantastic thoughts and they really are making me think.

Kavita - your post was great. Very well put.

Keep 'em coming!


- Sarah

[Kirsten]

Originally Posted by sarahcecile

I am bothered by the idea that the ultrasound tech will know the sex of the baby but we will not. I asked one of the midwives in our back-up group (we are planning a homebirth with a CPM, which is illegal in our state) if the tech could just not look at the baby's genitals, but she said "no, they have to check."

Hmmm... not sure if it is differences state to state, or from '96 to now, or if your midwife is wrongly informed - but when we had our ultrasound (only had it with dd1, our second and third pregnancies I skipped US altogether), we told the US tech that we DID NOT want to know the gender so she skipped over that part. She said SHE didn't want to know and accidentally slip up while talking to us. She checked the heart and other organs, then went quickly down to measure the leg bone.